Road Cycling - Climbing a hill... what gears to use?

ok.. yesterday my friend and i rode in Coyote Hills in Fremont, CA. those hills are hard to climb. he went up there with his tarmac with ease.

here's my questions, on my sirrus, i have Front 48Sx38Sx28S/ rear 12x25t. i know i can ride with 28 & 25, but then i'll be pedaling like crazy and not really go anywhere. so what would be the recommended gearing to climb a semi steep hill? any tips on training my legs for the climb?

i did terrible on the climbs, but at least i was glad that on the flats i was keeping my speed between 18-20mph. i want to go faster!!! :mad:

rui

Yeah, I wish I could go faster on my Langster too. I go about 18-20m/h on flats, I can manage 30-31m/h going downhill but uphill I go from anywhere between 6-13m/h depending on how steep it is.

I especially hate it when some fatso on a mountain bike passes me uphill.

I'm getting a 2005 Allez Elite at the end of this month though (hopefully).

well, the good news was there wasn't any mt. bikers around that day... sigh good for me. but yeah my is around 6-8mph till i get all burnt out on the wrong setting and have to get off the bike. but downhill parts is fun... i hit 35mph easily riding on my aero bar. my friend on his tarmac blew by a hiker doing close to 40mph... and while i was pretty far behind him, i hear the hiker said... WTF! and that's when i started breaking cuz i know there is someone there on the turn.

By the way Ruirui, what made you decide on a Sirrus instead of something like the Allez or Allez Sport?

I like the aero bars, they must have been pretty expensive.

There is no set gear for climbing certain hills. Just keep your RPMs at a decent level and shift or stand as needed to stay at that level.

so what would be the recommended gearing to climb a semi steep hill?
uhh, like pretty much everything else, it's what works for YOU!

I can't hammer for very long or I burn out, so I prefer to spin as much as possible. That said, I use the hardest gear that keeps me ~80-85rpms on the climbs. Are you experimenting with different gears?

Your friend blew by a hiker? Were you on the road or in the wrong forum? :)

ultra... it was budget at the time. i started out with an old rockhopper, then as i was looking into getting another hardrock, i saw the sirrus. it was nice and comfortable. i like the allez too, but comparing $850 vs. $499 for the sirrus, i chose the sirrus instead. so even with the mods that i've done to my sirrus i'm still below the cost for a 04 allez, which is ok by me. also, the allez's geo is a bit too aggressive for me.. i test rode it around the block... felt good.. but afterwards.. my back was hurting (from an old car accident injury). so sirrus was the choice for me. just kinda wished it could be lighter... my sirrus now weighs in at 23lbs. :(

uhh, like pretty much everything else, it's what works for YOU!

I can't hammer for very long or I burn out, so I prefer to spin as much as possible. That said, I use the hardest gear that keeps me ~80-85rpms on the climbs. Are you experimenting with different gears?

Your friend blew by a hiker? Were you on the road or in the wrong forum? :)

i tried out different gears.. but the thing was, by the time i did find the one that was good for me.. i was burnt out. :(

yeah my friend blew buy a hiker... my friend should have called out, and afterwards i told him that was sooo wrong of him to do that, cuz i could tell that guys got freaked out. btw.. we were coming down from the hills....

I try to climb at 75-80% max perceived effort. The key, as mentioned, is to find a gearing combination and cadence that allows you to pace for as long as possible. This is for both climbing in and out of the saddle. Too fast or hard and you burn out in the middle of the hill. It takes practice and a lot of hard work to find the right mix for each individual, but the process will teach you a lot and make you a much better cyclist.

55/Rad

ok..so what would be the recommended gearing to climb a semi steep hill? rui

The recommended gearing for you for the time being would be whatever cadence you can comfortably sustain on a given climb, irregardless of speed.

Those aero bars won't help much on the hills. If you want to get better at hills you need to climb more of them. I used to suck at hills and would always get passed up by people who I passed on the flats. Now that I focus on hills I have become super strong. As far as gearing goes that depends on many different factors; how much you have in your legs, if your standing or sitting, or how steep the grade is.

i tried out different gears.. but the thing was, by the time i did find the one that was good for me.. i was burnt out. :(

yeah my friend blew buy a hiker... my friend should have called out, and afterwards i told him that was sooo wrong of him to do that, cuz i could tell that guys got freaked out. btw.. we were coming down from the hills....

You should go ahead and climb in the biggest gear you can hold a good 70-80 cadence, when you start to bog, flip it into the small chainring...each hill try and stay out of the small ring for a little longer each time...one day you'll roll right up and find yourself not needing the triple anymore...and BTW, 38-25 is a pretty small gear and should be good for climbing...

Z

I go with the small gear and a decent cadence . I try and stay seated for as long as I can . I really have no problems with any hills . I live in a mountain area and thats all there are . My only advise is to increase your effort by 5 or 10 percent every week .
Peace
Jar

i tried out different gears.. but the thing was, by the time i did find the one that was good for me.. i was burnt out. :(

yeah my friend blew buy a hiker... my friend should have called out, and afterwards i told him that was sooo wrong of him to do that, cuz i could tell that guys got freaked out. btw.. we were coming down from the hills....


It's a good thing the Ranger wasn't out there with his radar gun. Yes, they use them in Coyote Hills and on the Alameda Creek Trail. A cyclist was ticketed for coming down Nike Hill at over 15 mph, which is the speed limit on those trails. You also are required to have a bell on your bike, which could also get you a ticket.
Keep your rpm at whatever level is comfortable for you. Shift at the bottom of the hill before you start climbing. If you want to get better at hills, just go out and ride them over and over.

I read somewhere that you should stay in the saddle as long as you can.
When you come out of the saddle, bump UP a gear to make it a little tougher.

alternate your position and style... after spinning, bump it up a gear and mash from the back of the seat... or, if you have the power, stand up and grind... then go back to spinning

Well, when it comes to hills, myself a couple other guys in the club drop everyone. We are all light (135-140) but very strong, that's the combo you need. And we all are of the opinion that your better off hammering on the biggest gear you can and really get it on, rather than than sitting there spinning on a small gear and spending more time climbing. Just before I get out of the saddle to hammer I go into a bigger gear sometimes two bigger depending how I'm feeling. At home work out on a long steep hill and climb it then coast down, and I do it over and over till I throw up! Honest, when I often feel like I'm starting to puke that's when I stop; call it a day. Dude, you want to get strong You Have to Hurt!, or else,,,, just settle for being average. :(

Veganrider,

Unfortunately, not all of us can get that light! I agree, though, that you have to work at it.

Please define "long and steep". On my ride today, it was basically uphill for the first 6.5 miles only 500 ft. The next 1.4 miles goes up 710 ft. followed by 3.1 miles climbing 1100 ft. That's 1,800 ft. in 4.5 miles. Sorry, but I can't hammer that long. 'Course I'm an old guy.

I agree with VeganRider, to get faster up hills you have to train faster up them. I'm light too (approx 60kg) but in races I used to still get dropped up hills.

Then I started doing hill sprints up hills and now I am the one dropping riders :)

Dont worry about pacing yourself up the hill in training, just go as hard as you can until you feel like your about to die, then ride slowly to recover and then go hard again.

Do that for a couple months and you will be much stronger up hills.

Veganrider,

Unfortunately, not all of us can get that light! I agree, though, that you have to work at it.

Please define "long and steep". On my ride today, it was basically uphill for the first 6.5 miles only 500 ft. The next 1.4 miles goes up 710 ft. followed by 3.1 miles climbing 1100 ft. That's 1,800 ft. in 4.5 miles. Sorry, but I can't hammer that long. 'Course I'm an old guy.
I have no idea, I never understood how you guys come up with those numbers or how they relate to anything I'm use to seeing and doing on a ride. It's only about a mile, that's why I do it over and over. When at the base it looks like, I don't know, like I have to tilt my head back to look up at the top. 30*? 40*? 60*? beats me. I have no numbers, it's just a mother F'er, lol, the kind guys call "a wall"; I have no technical info to offer. I know on some hills like that one I see rodies walking their bikes. I use a double with a 12/24. You sound so defensive here, almost offended; this isn't about YOU, it's about helping out a guy that wanted advice on hill climbing.

It's a good thing the Ranger wasn't out there with his radar gun. Yes, they use them in Coyote Hills and on the Alameda Creek Trail. A cyclist was ticketed for coming down Nike Hill at over 15 mph, which is the speed limit on those trails. You also are required to have a bell on your bike, which could also get you a ticket.
Keep your rpm at whatever level is comfortable for you. Shift at the bottom of the hill before you start climbing. If you want to get better at hills, just go out and ride them over and over.

good thing to know, cuz that's my first time there in a long long time. last time i was there.. i was going downhills in my rollerblades 10 yrs ago. ;) thanks for the tip!

rui

VeganRider, AimHigh, i'll keep that in mind and start hitting the hills.. i guess that's one way to attack it. i'm currently 148lbs.. my target is 140 or less.. so hopefully during the workout, my belly will eventually be flat.

but for sure, redfooj, 55/rad, fixer.. i will definitely start doing the hills with your suggestions, and hopefully soon i can build up my leg muscles to be stronger.

I have no idea, I never understood how you guys come up with those numbers or how they relate to anything I'm use to seeing and doing on a ride. It's only about a mile, that's why I do it over and over. When at the base it looks like, I don't know, like I have to tilt my head back to look at the top. 30*? 40*? beats me. I know on some hills like that one I see rodies walking their bikes up as I ride past them. (but I am suffering) I use a double with a 12/24. Old? :eek: you don't sound old to me by what your doing! but I'm only 50.VG,

We have a great computer program at our disposal in the SF Bay area called KLIMB. It is basically has a network of all major cycling roads overlaid on a topographic map. You pick a starting point and click on each intersection of your route, in turn. When you're done, you can view a route sheet or an elevation profile of the course.

Dude, it's not a climb if you can see the top! :D I generally don't have a problem for the first mile if the gradient is at 5% or so. I just can't sustain that level of effort for 3.5 miles at 7.5% which is the shortest major climb around here. I just have to get into my rhythm and get up the hill as best I can.

BTW, I'm older than you! :D

SteveE

VG,

We have a great computer program at our disposal in the SF Bay area called KLIMB. It is basically has a network of all major cycling roads overlaid on a topographic map. You pick a starting point and click on each intersection of your route, in turn. When you're done, you can view a route sheet or an elevation profile of the course.

Dude, it's not a climb if you can see the top! :D I generally don't have a problem for the first mile if the gradient is at 5% or so. I just can't sustain that level of effort for 3.5 miles at 7.5% which is the shortest major climb around here. I just have to get into my rhythm and get up the hill as best I can.

BTW, I'm older than you! :D

SteveE
This wasn't about YOU, it was about trying to help a guy that asked for help on hill climbing? Your so defensive and sound offended, where did your name come into the conversation? whats this got to do with you anyhow? geesh! I'm going to bed now. My bed is 16.33 feet from here, I have to walk 4.78 paces, turn 46* to the left then then 24* right, and go north 6*;lay down 180* from my present position. My estimated sleep time is 5 hours 45 min, 18 sec. But I'm sure you have to walk farther to get to your bed! You guys sound like a whole lotta fun! :rolleyes:

This wasn't about YOU, it was about trying to help a guy that asked for help on hill climbing? Your so defensive and sound offended, where did your name come into the conversation? whats this got to do with you anyhow? geesh! I'm going to bed now. My bed is 16.33 feet from here, I have to walk 4.78 paces, turn 46* to the left then then 24* right, and go north 6*;lay down 180* from my present position. My estimated sleep time is 5 hours 45 min, 18 sec. But I'm sure you have to walk farther to get to your bed! You guys sound like a whole lotta fun! :rolleyes:Sorry, Ididn't mean to come across as defensive or sound offended. I wasn't offended.

boy arent you the caustic one... btw if you drop people on 30*/40* hills please share whatever clifbar it is that you munch on :)

SteveE, where can i get the KLIMB program? now that i have a stable bike rack, i'm going to make it my goal to go out riding in other cities. this way i can ditch all my frustration from work behind while enjoying the scenary. please let me know where to find them? thanks.

rui

SteveE, where can i get the KLIMB program? now that i have a stable bike rack, i'm going to make it my goal to go out riding in other cities. this way i can ditch all my frustration from work behind while enjoying the scenary. please let me know where to find them? thanks.

ruiRuirui,

Go to this (http://www.klimb.org/klimb.html) website.

Enjoy! SteveE

SteveE...beautiful! can't wait to start using the Klimb.

One thing to remember about training to ride hills: you have to keep doing it just to maintain proficiency. I recently found this out the hard way. I unfortunately hit a bought of out-of-town travel that kept me off the bike for about three weeks. Last Friday, I had returned and went out for a quick 20-mile ride with some folks from my bike shop. Spinning in the flats, I was okay... easily maintaining a 23MPH pace. At one point we decided to check out a new road and I found myself going up a mild hill (~4%-5% for about a mile). I was a bit overzealous I guess. I attacked the hill in the big ring (53x17 originally and then downshifted to the small ring halfway through though) and a quick glance at my computer told me I was maintaining 20MPH all the way up. I was feeling good until we got to the top. At the start of the descent, I decided I was going to continue hammering to build up speed. But halfway down I started getting lightheaded and even began yawning. I was out of breath and panting hard. I got really scared and hoped I wouldn't pass out in the middle of the downhill. I'm not sure exactly what happened to me but I know that normally, I would have been fine that day. I was wiped out for the next 15 mins and was glad we stopped to give me some time to recover.

Go to this (http://www.klimb.org/klimb.html) website.

Enjoy! SteveE

Rock on! This is great. Too bad there are no zones for the Seattle area yet. I'm really liking that it's portable/cross-platform since I primarily run unix and unix-like OSes. Kudos to the author.

Ruirui,

Go to this (http://www.klimb.org/klimb.html) website.

Enjoy! SteveE

SteveE, how come when i click on the Overview Map, it only shows the Pennisula area only. i can't seem to see anything in south SJ area? am I missing something? cuz i just downloaded the SF bay program.

SteveE, how come when i click on the Overview Map, it only shows the Pennisula area only. i can't seem to see anything in south SJ area? am I missing something? cuz i just downloaded the SF bay program.

I think the Penninsula zone is what you get by default. The webpage says you need to download and install other zones seperately.

http://www.klimb.org/zones/sfbay.zone/index.html

Rui,

Try looking at the Zone Page. There's a link to it near the bottom of the Klimb homepage.

SteveE

SteveE.. thanks man! it working now!

rui

I'm a Mac OS X user; downloaded everything, and can't get one thing to run correctly... this sucks, help.

I'm a Mac OS X user; downloaded everything, and can't get one thing to run correctly... this sucks, help.

Did you read the special release notes for Mac OSX support (http://www.klimb.org/macosx.html)? You will probably need to install Tcl/Tk if you haven't done so already.

For those interested, I'm going to try my hand at making a Seattle zoneset.

yeah, what everyone has said. people psych themselves out of climbs. embrace the uphills. don't dismiss the mental aspect. if your goal is to climb without getting out of breath them don't shift all the way down to spin 120+ rpm. stand, sit, grind, spin....trial and error to do whatever it takes to get up and over that hill as fast as the next guy....because the ride continues after that hill. some like to ride in the front and stand to mentally crush their opponent. some like to be in back and zoom past another rider (talk about a mental crusher!)

find your voice and try every little combination. if possible train those same hills before your official rides so you will know what gear to be in. **being in the right gear to start is so important.

Did you read the special release notes for Mac OSX support (http://www.klimb.org/macosx.html)? You will probably need to install Tcl/Tk if you haven't done so already.

I tried everything the website suggests. Unfortunately, I get error messages and blank windows... Not much of a techie, any body get similar results?

...But halfway down I started getting lightheaded and even began yawning. I was out of breath and panting hard. I got really scared and hoped I wouldn't pass out in the middle of the downhill. I'm not sure exactly what happened to me but I know that normally, I would have been fine that day. I was wiped out for the next 15 mins and was glad we stopped to give me some time to recover.
Sounds like a nutrition issue might be the cause as much as taking 3 weeks off. Maybe you weren't properly "loaded" that morning.....

Glad it all worked out.

55/Rad

The recommended gearing for you for the time being would be whatever cadence you can comfortably sustain on a given climb, irregardless of speed.


"irregardless' is not a word. Try 'regardless of speed'. Otherwise, a sound post

Sounds like a nutrition issue might be the cause as much as taking 3 weeks off. Maybe you weren't properly "loaded" that morning.....

That's another possibility. No breakfast and I punted on lunch with just a cookie... plus I just got off a cross-country flight so I might have been dehydrated too. At anyrate I did overstep my energy reserves one way or another and I think the lapse in riding played a role. To borrow the Paul sherwin analogy, "bridge to engine room: more power; engine room to bridge: okay" but then the reactor shut down. So this is a warning that even though you should listen to your body, sometimes the sounds can fool you. I felt fine going up that climb and I was doing pretty well but then I paid for it shortly afterwards.

If you were yawning-maybe your body was in need of oxygen.

As far as climbing, my experience has been:
It all starts in your mind. You have to love climbing hills. If you can imagine it, you can accomplish it.
One of the hardest things to learn in climbing is breathing. If your cadence is too high you will be out of breath quicker. If it is too low, your legs will give out and you won't recover before reaching the top. Change your gears to maintain just beyond conversation-level breathing.

Part of being able to climb well is genetic also, but you can always improve. Listen to your body.

I train mostly on the road bike. Climb longer hills on the road than the MTB; you will get in shape faster.
Try sitting forward on the seat on the MTB, then back (especially for better traction on steep sections), then grab the bar ends and then the grips for variety and to use different upper body muscles, and stand sometimes briefly to relieve your legs.

Also, don't forget your abdominals. Do stomach crunches, bent-leg raises and hyper extensions for strengthening your lower back and stomach. They support your upper body and legs.
Don't worry about your weight-I weigh 165 lbs. (5' 8") but can still climb extremely well. Just go by how you feel.

To me climbing is like life. It is a challenge, but I look forward to it. And you can go up the same road/trail and eveytime it's different.

If you were yawning-maybe your body was in need of oxygen.

I guess the other explanation is that I simply wasn't breathing properly. that would explain the light-headedness too.

I guess the other explanation is that I simply wasn't breathing properly. that would explain the light-headedness too.

ok... i tried climbing the hills again today. did much better, was able to climb up with a decent pace, speed and tempo. however, half way up.. i experience the same thing as you. i got sooo lightheaded and and almost wanted to throw up. but i started my ride 2 hrs after dinner... so perhaps that's part of the problem too?

anyway.. i tried hard today... just tried to keep my spinning cadance the same and started feeling the burn. next time, i'll take a photo of the hill i'm practicing on. It's actually a hill/driveway up toward the brand new homes on the hills.

rui

Did you read the special release notes for Mac OSX support (http://www.klimb.org/macosx.html)? You will probably need to install Tcl/Tk if you haven't done so already.

Doesn't the USGS have vector maps of all roads, and 50-foot spaced elevation grids? It seems like everything should already be there, if a serious programmer took a look..

For practice, do nothing but hills, as often as you can. Rest when you get to the top; the hill is your goal. I switch around, but if you want to go fast you have to push it. Keep focused; after a mile of 10% grade it is easy to lose heart -- I try not to let my physical limits become mental limits. (I'm sure that doesn't help. :) )

For practice, do nothing but hills, as often as you can. Rest when you get to the top; the hill is your goal. I switch around, but if you want to go fast you have to push it. Keep focused; after a mile of 10% grade it is easy to lose heart -- I try not to let my physical limits become mental limits. (I'm sure that doesn't help. :) )

yup! good tip! i'm going to start training to climb the hills. my friend told me that even though my bike 23lbs may be heavy to climb hills.. but he said it's all about the motor; which i think it's right. but he has a 16.5lbs tarmac.. so it's pretty easy for him to say.. hehe.

When I ride, I remind myself of a motto:
'Conservation of energy and efficiency of motion'
That means that as you are riding, you are not wasting your energy, saving it for the opportune time, when it's time for you to go...it's rather difficult to practice riding solo (but can be simulated), better in a group, best in a race.
It's a similar idea in martial arts.
Experience will tell you when to save energy and when to use use what energy you have to your advantage. And experience will allow you to best put that energy into motion.
Remember also, positive attitude can be energetic. Hills can be inspiring.
You will find as you get fitter that you will recover quicker once you are over the hill. You may expend as much going up, but as you get fitter you will go faster with the same amount of energy expended. That is why beginners waste so much energy-they aren't as efficient in their riding; their pedeling, body/hips swaying. Always remind yourself of style. How do I look on the bike: is my position right, am I pedaling smoothly, are my elbows bent slightly, am I looking up? Practice form first, and speed will follow.

When I ride, I remind myself of a motto:
'Conservation of energy and efficiency of motion'
That means that as you are riding, you are not wasting your energy, saving it for the opportune time, when it's time for you to go...it's rather difficult to practice riding solo (but can be simulated), better in a group, best in a race.
It's a similar idea in martial arts.
Experience will tell you when to save energy and when to use use what energy you have to your advantage. And experience will allow you to best put that energy into motion.
Remember also, positive attitude can be energetic. Hills can be inspiring.
You will find as you get fitter that you will recover quicker once you are over the hill. You may expend as much going up, but as you get fitter you will go faster with the same amount of energy expended. That is why beginners waste so much energy-they aren't as efficient in their riding; their pedeling, body/hips swaying. Always remind yourself of style. How do I look on the bike: is my position right, am I pedaling smoothly, are my elbows bent slightly, am I looking up? Practice form first, and speed will follow.

You hit the nail on the head...I climb a ton better when I imagine myself steady and calm, legs moving, everything else just floating. I actually love the feeling of gridning out a long, gradual climb with only the needed energy...and thrashing does nothing to get you up there...better to go low gear and focus..