Classic & Vintage - Is this a Suntour Ultra 6 freewheel?

I'm trying to figure out if I can use this freewheel on the '66 Schwinn Paramount that I'm restoring. The NR hubs are spaced at 120 OLD. I know, I know... I should buy a Regina but I'm not made of money. The images below are of a Suntour Winner Pro but there are no other identification marks such as the model. The only text: SUNTOUR, Winner Pro, Japan, CR, VIA. Can anyone tell me if this is an Ultra 6 model that can fit on a 120 spaced hub?

Thanks

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v413/brettrobison/DSCN7908.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v413/brettrobison/DSCN7909.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v413/brettrobison/DSCN7910.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v413/brettrobison/dscn7911.jpg

If you have a caliper, measure the height of the sprocket stack, from outside to outside surface of large and small cogs. And post back.

I don't know, I thought Ultra 6 has only 2 notch on the freewheel body and not 4 notch.

I don't know, I thought Ultra 6 has only 2 notch on the freewheel body and not 4 notch.

Actually 4 notch gives it a better chance of being an Ultra.

Correction: That info applies to 7 speed, not a six speed.

I'm trying to figure out if I can use this freewheel on the '66 Schwinn Paramount that I'm restoring. The NR hubs are spaced at 120 OLD. I know, I know... I should buy a Regina but I'm not made of money. The images below are of a Suntour Winner Pro but there are no other identification marks such as the model. The only text: SUNTOUR, Winner Pro, Japan, CR, VIA. Can anyone tell me if this is an Ultra 6 model that can fit on a 120 spaced hub?

Thanks


I'm almost certain it's an Ultra-6, since there's 6 cogs and the outermost cog is flush with the end of the freewheel body. If it were a "regular 6", the outer cog would be above the end of the freewheel body. I think this is a "Winner Pro" freewheel, which preceded the "New Winner Pro". The NWP is recognizable by the cone-and-locknut bearing adjustment, which this freewheel lacks.

I'm almost certain it's an Ultra-6, since there's 6 cogs and the outermost cog is flush with the end of the freewheel body. If it were a "regular 6", the outer cog would be above the end of the freewheel body. I think this is a "Winner Pro" freewheel, which preceded the "New Winner Pro". The NWP is recognizable by the cone-and-locknut bearing adjustment, which this freewheel lacks.

I guess you are right. The mid 80's Winner Pro Ultra-6 has 4 notch.

I am pretty sure that winner pro FW body can be built up as eithor a 6 or 7 speed. For 7 speed, the smallest cog is threaded onto a special 6th cog w/ outboard threads. The 7-speed spacer rings would be same as ultra-6 space, but there might also be wider non-ultra 6 spacers available?

FWIW- back when I was racing 20 years ago, I resisted the upgrade trend toward casettes and used 7-speed winner pro freewheels long after they were cutting edge. With a bit of work juggleing the spacers, they worked fine for me with 7-speed shimano SIS drivetrain. The winner pro freewheel has a nice low-friction labryth seal to keep dirt out and they are very well made.

Looks like a six to me. Measure the out-to-out on the cogs. An ultra six should be about 25mm (I cannot remember exactly). A standard six should be about 30mm.

As pointed out above, an Ultra-6 has its small cog flush faced. As opposed to the standard 6 which has a 'lip'.
The 4-prong Winner Pro was released after the 2-prong New Winner.

From outside to outside the width is very slightly over an inch. I would say about 26mm. Since a standard 6 is 30mm according to balindamood I suppose this is in fact an ultra. Now I just need a chain...

I'm trying to figure out if I can use this freewheel on the '66 Schwinn Paramount that I'm restoring. The NR hubs are spaced at 120 OLD. I know, I know... I should buy a Regina but I'm not made of money...

Actually, you've made a good choice. The Suntour shifts nicely. I use an Ultra 6 on my '66 Paramont. Try using a SRAM 7 speed chain. I believe you will have good results and the ease of removal for cleaning is exceptional.

Best of luck on your restoration.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Paramounts/P-13RecordRallyDrivetrain.jpg

As pointed out above, an Ultra-6 has its small cog flush faced. As opposed to the standard 6 which has a 'lip'.
The 4-prong Winner Pro was released after the 2-prong New Winner.

You are correct. The New Winner and Winner/Winner Pro are simply freewheel body styles. Defying common logic, New Winner actually preceded Winner/Winner Pro. Both could be configured as regular 5 or 6 speeds and ultra (narrow) 6 or 7 speeds. Winner/Winner Pro accepted all the cogs/spacers used on New Winner, but also splined cogs in the middle stage, which made assembly/disassembly much easier. The difference between Winner and Winner pro was in the quality of the bearing races, which were machined on the Winner Pro, and were noticeably smoother. They could be distinguished by a silver outer lockring on the Winner and a gold one on the Winner Pro.