Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - Diabetic Thread.

I thought I would start a Diabetes Thread here and see where is goes. Clydesdales and Athenas, being big might be a little likely to be dealing with this problem. So I felt this forum might be good place to post it.

I know not all folks in the C&A forum are overweight, but face it, most of us seem to be wanting to loose weight, and so I deduce, overweight. I am. And being overweight that is a real big trigger for diabetic problems.

I'm hoping we can talk about how cope with bicycling and diabetes. You certainly want to take the advice of your doctor as the word regarding your treatment, but knowing others are dealing with what you are dealing with, and taking about it here, might make it a little easier. And maybe we can become better bicyclists.

I also hope this doesn't turn into some skinny guy telling us to loose weight and eat better thread. I think that's what we are all trying to do here anyway.

So here it goes...
Type 1 or Type 2, tell us how you handle yourself on a ride.

I'm a long term type 2. I'm a new rider, I started last summer. I rode before but it was just toodling around on a cruiser. I'm serious now. Bicycling is what I do.

About 10 days ago I was on a MUP, with two friends. I went the first 15 miles just fine. We stopped and had a slice of pizza. I had 2 and a sugared drink. Man did I hit the wall with about 7 miles to go. I kept it on, but was a deadman when I rolled back to the cars.

I've taken the pills for years, but really need to pay attention to what I am doing if I want to go on longer rides. I did some 30's last year with ease, so I might just be outta shape. btw, I'm 55 and just clocked in at 248.

Anyway I've set some hard goals for myself this year, bicycling wise, I'm hoping for good results.

Type 2 here...

Fairly new to cycling. Started in June of last year, and this year I also have some big goals for myself. Recently had a change in medication and the other day went out for a ride and ended up doing 30 miles. Normally that would have be no problem, but about 20 miles into my ride my sugar started to drop. Luckily because of the medication change, ive been bringing more than enough to get it back up. Anyone here have any tips how to keep fueled up on longer rides? I know 30 miles isnt really that far, but I am going to be getting myself ready for longer rides as I am going to be riding the century route this year in the Tour de Cure..and im not that sure right now how to prepare.

Are type 1 and 2 related in any way? I've always thought of type 2 as "fat guy diabetes" and a propensity for it in my family is a huge part of what got me started trying to thin down (still a long way to go). My understanding was that type 1 was an immune system malfunction, and that treatment and management were also completely different from type 2. Do they share more than I know?

In general you are correct.
Type 1 here.
Type 1 diabetes is insulin dependent. My Pancreas secretes NO insulin. So mine all has to be supplied from the outside. In my case an insulin pump.
Type 2 can range from diet controlled to oral meds to insulin dependent. I understand it to mean that many Type 2 secrete insulin, but either not in sufficient quantities OR your body develops an insensitivity to the insulin.
So many type 2's are diet controlled by limiting their carbs and therefore limiting the amount of insulin needed. TBH I don't understand type 2 too well because I am type 1.

I take my glucometer with me. I check after an hour or so just to make sure where I am. I usually then have a fast acting carb. Raisins, juice, etc. I guess a gel would fit in here too. I also have something a little longer acting as well like a cliff bar.
I am lucky in that I basically turn my pump's settings to 25% so it only gives me a quarter of what I usually get. This helps to keep my BS from going way low unless I ride for a long time or it is really hot.

Gitarzan - any chance your lack of energy was due to High Blood Sugar? That is a lot of carbs. If I ate that much it would put my BS way up. When my BS is high I get lethargic and basically see the symptoms you describe. It also could be that you worked really hard and were legitimately tired. That part of diabetes kind of stinks. You never really know how hard you can push without eating.
I am not a doctor, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Are type 1 and 2 related in any way?

I've been a type 2 for 22 years. I am pretty much totally insulin dependent. Without it my blood glucose pretty much just keeps going up, even if I don't eat. So no significant difference from a type 1.

In the early stages type 2s don't have to use insulin, although it probably is a good idea. Maybe that's where you got the idea they were different? They are a bit but not all that much.The best book about diabetes is Richard K Bernstein's 'The Diabetes Solution.' In my opinion of course but it is the only one I ever recommend.

I've detailed my notes about avoiding hypoglycemia at avoid hypoglycemia (http://diabeticnotes.com/hypoglycemia.html).

The main point on that page related to this thread would be to avoid exercise when your mealtime shot of insulin is still active. You can wind up unconscious, that sort of stuff.

The site also has a page that I'd consider really important for anyone reusing syringes.

Gitarzan - any chance your lack of energy was due to High Blood Sugar? That is a lot of carbs. If I ate that much it would put my BS way up. When my BS is high I get lethargic and basically see the symptoms you describe. It also could be that you worked really hard and were legitimately tired. That part of diabetes kind of stinks. You never really know how hard you can push without eating.

Good point. It prob was high. My wife loses her glucometers and steals mine. So I've not checked in a long time. I tend to eat a little more than I should when I'm out on the ride. Exercise makes me hungry so I tend to ever eat when I am out. Before we stopped I was getting a little low, I could feel it getting ever so breezy in my head.

I see a new Pri care doctor tomorrow. Maybe I can con a new meter. I hate them meters.


BTW, I got the Secteur Elite as well. Nice bike but my hands still ache. Got find some better padded gloves. I'm not used to drop bars.

Pretty much an insulin dependent type 2 diabetic here. Usually 2-4 injections per day (closer to 2 lately with a low carb diet.) My weight, 220 lbs, has a greater affect on my cycling than the diabetes. I'm in my late 40's and completed the 200 mile Seattle-to-Portland (STP) ride in one day back in 2008. So, I don't think that diabetics need to allow the disease to limit their goals in cycling. Diet is the most important factor in controlling type 2 diabetes. To the poster above... pizza and pop!! For me... I might as well have taken up smoking and alcohol on the same ride!

Exercise (cycling and running for me) seem to jump start the effectiveness of insulin. I try to take as little insulin as possible. If you study the issue, insulin spikes are just as, if not more, dangerous to the the long term health of your body as high blood sugars. To keep my blood sugars at normal levels (80-120) with minimal insulin injections, I found that I need to keep my carbohydrate consumption to less than 40 grams per day. If it's an extremely active day (40+ mile bike ride) then I could maybe add another 15-25 grams of carbohydrate.

Staying fueled for long rides:

Your body can be retrained to use fat as it's main source of fuel rather than carbohydrates. I'm not a doctor either, and I haven't slept at many holiday inn's. However, I can't say that following my doctor's advice has had the effect that I had hoped for in controlling my diabetes. The best method I have found is following a low carb diet. For those that are interested in researching how well this can work, I would recommend reading some of the posts and research on the website "zeroinginonhealth.com" The founder of the website runs marathons and fuels his lifestyle and activity with zero carbs. While I can't say that I am able to go on zero carbs, I can function just fine on days with less than 20 grams of carbohydrate... and that keeps my blood sugars in check also with very little, if any, insulin.

Staying fueled for long rides:

Your body can be retrained to use fat as it's main source of fuel rather than carbohydrates. I'm not a doctor either, and I haven't slept at many holiday inn's. However, I can't say that following my doctor's advice has had the effect that I had hoped for in controlling my diabetes. The best method I have found is following a low carb diet. For those that are interested in researching how well this can work, I would recommend reading some of the posts and research on the website "zeroinginonhealth.com" The founder of the website runs marathons and fuels his lifestyle and activity with zero carbs. While I can't say that I am able to go on zero carbs, I can function just fine on days with less than 20 grams of carbohydrate... and that keeps my blood sugars in check also with very little, if any, insulin.

I agree with this theory somewhat. Different things work for different people and I could never live on 20g of carbs a day and wouldn't want to, but it works for you and that is great. Where I agree with you is I have found through my Endocrinologist is that having protein, about 20g 30-45 min before exercise with a small amount of carbs will keep my BS stable throughout my exercise. I will need to fuel up after an hour or so, but the fluctuations to blood sugar will be less dramatic. By you reducing your carbs so drastically, you have to be increasing your protein to compensate so we are essentially doing the same thing. I am just not doing it as intensive as you are.
Of course remember that I am type 1 and on a pump so I have the luxury of dialing down my pump to compensate for the increased level of exertion.

I'm neither, but I did get to hear some very inspirational advice from a member of Team Type 1's Elite Squad at our Tour de Cure kickoff meeting last week. They're all Type 1, and broke the team record for RAAM (Race Across AMerica) twice.

Only being familiar with some of the older pump tech from when my ex was investigating getting one, I was really amazed with the wireless programmable arm-patch mounted unit this guy had, and corresponding constant-read glucometer. Apparently he's programmed profiles for all his different race days based on average times from previous events, so he's got a sprint-tri profile, an olympic-tri profile, 10mi TT profile, etc. All custom tailored.

Type 1. I've been using an insulin pump for 25 years and recently added a continuous glucose monitoring system (CGMS) to the mix. I find that I have much better control with the CGMS and that cycling, in particular, becomes much easier to manage with the CGMS.

Handling rides varies quite a bit depending on the length of the ride and the amount of effort involved. When I rode from San Francisco to Los Angeles, I found that I could cut my pump's basal rate to 25% of normal and snack on M&M's pretty continuously and still have to worry about low blood sugars! Of course, my loaded touring bike weighed in at 51lbs and I was climbing 4000-5000 feet/day.

On short (~1hr) rides, I might eat 20-30g of carbs before leaving and not bother to reprogram the pump. Intermediate length rides usually mean eating/drinking a bit more regularly along with reducing the pump's basal rate. Hammer Gel is currently my favorite long-acting carb source while on the bike.

I've been a type 1 for about 14 years and just recently switched to a pump. Monday I go back to my doc and am going to get set up w/ the CGMS. At this point I'm just doing short rides (15-18 miles that I can do w/in an hour) so I just disconnect my pump grab a banana and some H2O and wing it. Not the best, but I once I get home and check my sugar, it's usually around 90 or so. This is going to be a work in progress....

Type 2 for three years now, under control with diet and exercise.
I eat around 300 mg carbs a day i have lost 96 lbs and now weight 191

My new doctor just stuck me on a 1900 cal per day diet. I'd been eating about 1000 more than that. It's going to be tough especially since my wife refuses to buy groceries that support this. My wide did finally hand over one of my glucometers she'd been using. Still can't find the "good" one.

......I see a new Pri care doctor tomorrow. Maybe I can con a new meter. I hate them meters..........

Get used to it - your pancreas does not have a feedback AND does NOT wor!!.

If you ignore the high/low BS you have a MUCH higher chance of dying. THAT is a FAAAATAL event.

I have been a Type 1 since 1964. Only real issue for me is diabetic neuropathy in my feet. I test my BS 5 or 6 times a day and there are still ups and downs.

In 2006 I rode over 2000 km between Cairns and Darwin, totally self-supported on a bike pulling an IBEX, and taking 6 weeks basically on dirt roads. I lowered my insulin doses by 20% and still tested at least 5 times a day - sometimes more.

Do your body a favour - get a glucose meter and use it a LOT, especially while bicycling. Otherwise, you WILL suffer....

PM me if necessary.

Get used to it - your pancreas does not have a feedback AND does NOT wor!!.

If you ignore the high/low BS you have a MUCH higher chance of dying. THAT is a FAAAATAL event.

I have been a Type 1 since 1964. Only real issue for me is diabetic neuropathy in my feet. I test my BS 5 or 6 times a day and there are still ups and downs.

In 2006 I rode over 2000 km between Cairns and Darwin, totally self-supported on a bike pulling an IBEX, and taking 6 weeks basically on dirt roads. I lowered my insulin doses by 20% and still tested at least 5 times a day - sometimes more.

Do your body a favour - get a glucose meter and use it a LOT, especially while bicycling. Otherwise, you WILL suffer....

PM me if necessary.

AGEED! prior to getting the pump last summer I tested 3 times a day. It was OK, but now I test 5+ AND use the CGMS. It has allowed me to give such specific information to the DR that we are really fine tuning things. Last week my a1c came back at 6.8. First time under 7 in longer than I can remember.

Sstorkel - thanks for the recommendation of Hammer Gel. I am going to give that a shot on some longer rides this summer.

Type 2 diabetic here.

I have my ups and downs when it comes to my numbers, but I'm getting better at staying within an acceptable range.

Will be doing the Chicago Tour de Cure for the first time this year. Time to help others while I help myself. :)

Sstorkel - thanks for the recommendation of Hammer Gel. I am going to give that a shot on some longer rides this summer.

I like the fact that it tastes good and doesn't spike my blood sugar like many products. To start, I'd recommend ordering Hammer Nutrition (http://www.hammernutrition.com)'s Sample Pack (http://www.hammernutrition.com/products/gel-sampler-kit.9sam.html) so you can try all the flavors and figure out if you like any of them. I generally buy the 26-serving jugs and pour them into a Hammer Flask (http://www.hammernutrition.com/products/hammer-flask.hf.html). The Hammer Flask holds six measured servings and the opening is sized to deliver gel easily; much easier to use than the single-serving pouches or the other containers I've tried. I bought one flask for each of the flavors I like so I don't have to clean them out every time I decide I want a different flavor...

My new doctor just stuck me on a 1900 cal per day diet. I'd been eating about 1000 more than that. It's going to be tough especially since my wife refuses to buy groceries that support this. My wide did finally hand over one of my glucometers she'd been using. Still can't find the "good" one.

So your wife is diabetic too? But she won't buy foods that diabetics should be eating? I'm the only one in my family with diabetes and the others don't always want to eat low carb meals. That's fine. I'm responsible for my own food. However, I do find that once I start grilling the chicken and steaming the broccoli that the others just go along with the meal I'm preparing. My wife will still make spaghetti, potato casseroles, lasagna, and other pasta based dishes... but, she is used to the fact now, that I won't eat those meals and that I'll just cook up my own low carb meal.

So your wife is diabetic too? But she won't buy foods that diabetics should be eating? I'm the only one in my family with diabetes and the others don't always want to eat low carb meals. That's fine. I'm responsible for my own food. However, I do find that once I start grilling the chicken and steaming the broccoli that the others just go along with the meal I'm preparing. My wife will still make spaghetti, potato casseroles, lasagna, and other pasta based dishes... but, she is used to the fact now, that I won't eat those meals and that I'll just cook up my own low carb meal.

Have you guys tried Dreamfields Pasta? Its quite good and very low carbs.... even my wife eats it and she likes her pasta

Yes she is diabetic, she don't care. She eat anything and tell you it's healthy. My plan is to do my thing and let her eat hamburgers and pizza and tell everyone it's healthy. When she's in a wheelchair she can sit home alone while I'm out being active. It's been decades of this crap. Last time I got POed at her for this, about 18 years ago, I managed to loose 40 pounds from 285 to 245. I was 245 for years until the prednisone. That crap makes you hungry.

Anyway, my sugars are better, been doing the finger stick thing and taking intake and number in my IPhone. Diet has been in line with 1900 calories give or take a few one way or another over the last few days.

This weekend I'll find out how this affects me on the bike.

Yes she is diabetic, she don't care. She eat anything and tell you it's healthy. My plan is to do my thing and let her eat hamburgers and pizza and tell everyone it's healthy. When she's in a wheelchair she can sit home alone while I'm out being active. It's been decades of this crap. Last time I got POed at her for this, about 18 years ago, I managed to loose 40 pounds from 285 to 245. I was 245 for years until the prednisone. That crap makes you hungry.

Anyway, my sugars are better, been doing the finger stick thing and taking intake and number in my IPhone. Diet has been in line with 1900 calories give or take a few one way or another over the last few days.

This weekend I'll find out how this affects me on the bike.

You're doing the right thing. You will be much more effective in getting your message across to your wife by being an example than by getting "POed" at her. Good luck on the ride!

Yes she is diabetic, she don't care. She eat anything and tell you it's healthy. My plan is to do my thing and let her eat hamburgers and pizza and tell everyone it's healthy. When she's in a wheelchair she can sit home alone while I'm out being active. It's been decades of this crap. Last time I got POed at her for this, about 18 years ago, I managed to loose 40 pounds from 285 to 245. I was 245 for years until the prednisone. That crap makes you hungry.

Anyway, my sugars are better, been doing the finger stick thing and taking intake and number in my IPhone. Diet has been in line with 1900 calories give or take a few one way or another over the last few days.

This weekend I'll find out how this affects me on the bike.

I'm sorry for this. It has to be tough when not all parties involved are on the same page. Tends to hurt the motivation, but it looks like you are dealing with it quite well.