Advocacy & Safety - Lady almost killed me today.

I was signaling for a right turn, And behind me is a green honda. She has followed me patiently and when i start to turn right she speeds up, Side by me while i already was in the turn i was forced to take the most inner route. Almost getting smashed cause the parked bus on the street, she proceeds to horn at me and she ran the red light. What i learned today.

Take right turns alonneeeee!! well take Turns alonneeeee!!!

Don't let 'em get around you, take that lane!

I second that. ^

^^I second that, that is, I third the statement above the above seconded statement. The statement above seconds a statement that I third.

It's even worse when you are riding along next to a driver and there don't look when they make a right turn and you plow into them

happened to me twice, nothing bad though.

Hell on my commute Friday I had car start to go around me as I approached a stop sign... I took the lane, but they kept coming all the over into the oncoming lane.. During this I kept looking back and just WTFing under my breathe. The passenger rolls down the window "what did you say" I said "you're an idiot" and then they ran the stop sign.
:rolleyes:

As far as taking the lane, just do your best to protect you.

Don't let 'em get around you, take that lane!
+1 this.

My city has gotten religion with "traffic circles" lately. I always take the lane in the circle for the same reason.

If you don't own your position on the road, someone will take it from you. Ride strong, ride aggressively, make people give you the space you need.

shoulda ulocked that *****'s mirror on her way past.

^^^^^^That would be really, really stupid.

do not put your life in the hands of someone else's peripheral vision. TAKE THE ****ING LANE

I don't see why someone would even bother posting about this. Is this the first time someone as almost hit you? I see motorists (and cyclists) doing stupid things every time I leave the house. Nothing surprises me any more. Although the latest seems to be the guy on the phone directing traffic at four-way stops. Twice yesterday. They both waved cars to go ahead, kinda like "Yo, I'm gonna finish up this call at the stop sign here, you go ahead".

Idiots are everywhere. Ride aware.

shoulda ulocked that *****'s mirror on her way past.

seems pretty risky... intentional or otherwise, that's gonna cause an accident, and you're gonna end up hurt.

One of the biggest things I can't stand in this world are aggressive, arrogant drivers. Also drivers who don't know what they're doing!
F*ck, and it's not even just how they treat cyclists. I drive too, but they think them and their big metal coffins, own the ******** world. They don't care for anyone else on the road but themselves. They're just the scum of the earth.

Here's my advice: do ride aggressively, as someone has already suggested, but this by no means, means you should be unsafe. You should still follow the rules of the road, but you should make your presence on the road obvious at all times.
Because if you don't make yourself stand out, idiot drivers will be the ******** they are, with their aggressive BS.
Take a full lane if you have to, and always ride with the mentality that you have equal rights as any car/driver on the road. Hand signals help too, and not only for turning.
Also, think, "If you ******** dare touch me, I will unleash hell on your fat ass, and you will be legally liable."

I've seen so many mofo drivers, it's not even funny. They don't seem to give a sh*t what they do, because hurting you and getting you off the road is very close to their minds.
However, I am not suggesting you go Rambo like Mr. Forte here (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/psycho_cycler_revenge_ldcv38M2qbZUHVU5MXvSPJ), but having something to protect yourself might actually help.
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/images/kryptonite%20new%20york%20forg%2006.jpg
Plus, the main point of any kind of "defensive tool" is to intimidate anyhow, so maybe something like
http://unrealitymag.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/brassknucklesp.jpg
(illegal in some states) ;)
and use it when you really, absolutely have to. Although I really don't think you should cross that line.
I hear some NYC messenger carry knives. :lol:

Oh great, another thread where the hardcore killas start posturing about beating up motorists.

Take the lane, ride defensively, and skip the big talk online.

Holy ****, what a hardass that bike messenger is. Busting windshields with his bare hands, do not mess with that dude.

Post 14 = fail.

the best defense is a good offense. also a great way to turn a legitimate lawsuit against a driver into a legitimate lawsuit against a biker.

Post 14 = fail.

Speak for yourself. It's too bad you haven't been in a situation where an ******* driver was bent on killing you.


the best defense is a good offense. also a great way to turn a legitimate lawsuit against a driver into a legitimate lawsuit against a biker.


... use it when you really, absolutely have to. Although I really don't think you should cross that line.

Just be glad you're okay and wear a helmet. I do agree that you should ride aggressively but do so while still following the traffic rules and without putting yourself in danger.

Speak for yourself. It's too bad you haven't been in a situation where an ******* driver was bent on killing you.

Incorrect. Much like this statement:


Plus, the main point of any kind of "defensive tool" is to intimidate anyhow

If someone wanted to kill you with their car, it wouldn't be too difficult. And a bike lock or brass knuckles isn't going to intimidate them in the least.

Incorrect. Much like this statement:



If someone wanted to kill you with their car, it wouldn't be too difficult. And a bike lock or brass knuckles isn't going to intimidate them in the least.

He's got a point man... and by the time you're all squared off with your (illegal) brass knuckles, you're probably way beyond your rights. dude with a car hits you hard, you're not going to get up and hit him with a chain, lock, brass knuckles, crazy ninja skills or anything else, you're gonna be on the ground.

If someone wanted to kill you with their car, it wouldn't be too difficult. And a bike lock or brass knuckles isn't going to intimidate them in the least.

I'm going to assume that someone would only go there after some kind of physical contact between the car and cyclist, which would typically lead to both parties exiting to confront each other to"talk" and "exchange insurance information" to demonstrate one's superiority.
Like so:
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/item_irK6W3egAoNqKgPlt1TZ4O

Try to not imagine any Quiksilver
;)

He's got a point man... and by the time you're all squared off with your (illegal) brass knuckles, you're probably way beyond your rights. dude with a car hits you hard, you're not going to get up and hit him with a chain, lock, brass knuckles, crazy ninja skills or anything else, you're gonna be on the ground.

Except they'd have to be real ballsy to hit you so hard you can't get up. Most walk a fine line between hurting you and still abiding by the law.

OMG give it up spcializdspksman...your advice was ********.

EDIT: apparently this forum censors for the derogatory use of mental disorder labels.

He's got a point man... and by the time you're all squared off with your (illegal) brass knuckles, you're probably way beyond your rights. dude with a car hits you hard, you're not going to get up and hit him with a chain, lock, brass knuckles, crazy ninja skills or anything else, you're gonna be on the ground.

whatever man, speak for yourself, i would totally just backflip off my bike onto the roof of their car then rip the driver out of the car through the window and spinning suplex their ass onto the concrete

:D

http://gadgets.boingboing.net/whitebarsweb.jpg

I'm going to assume that someone would only go there after some kind of physical contact between the car and cyclist, which would typically lead to both parties exiting to confront each other to"talk" and "exchange insurance information" to demonstrate one's superiority.
Like so:
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/item_irK6W3egAoNqKgPlt1TZ4O

Try to not imagine any Quiksilver
;)

Is that the clip where that whiny pedicab guy got his ass kicked, then took off screaming like a girl? I hope they caught him and charged him. That guy's a wuss.


Except they'd have to be real ballsy to hit you so hard you can't get up. Most walk a fine line between hurting you and still abiding by the law.

According to your posts, they were trying to kill you, not hurt you.

Quit now, while you're behind.

Defend yourself if you have to, sure, but don't carry brass knuckles or anything like that. You'll get yourself in more trouble than you're already in. You may get yourself beat up. You may get yourself arrested. Or worse. Who knows if the ******* in the truck that's ****ing with you also has a gun. U-lock justice doesn't work so well when you're looking at a 9mm and it's pointed at you.

OMG give it up spcializdspksman...your advice was ********.

It's not like I told him to go shoot someone. I said that he should have something to protect himself.
The brass knuckles thing was a joke, hence the : ;)

I also said he really should not cross that line to violence unless he really absolutely had to to protect himself.
So idk what to say to you. Maybe learn how to read?
Here it is for the second time:

and use it when you really, absolutely have to. Although I really don't think you should cross that line.


According to your posts, they were trying to kill you, not hurt you.

Quit now, while you're behind.

Allow me to clarify then.
I've seen a good share of stupid divers:
-Those who clearly did not care if they hurt anyone, or to what extent (that's why I said that they were bent on killing me.)
-I've also seen drivers who were aggressive, but to a lesser extent that they were willing to back off.

My guess is that not all drivers are psycho murderers. But if you do encounter one, isn't knowing you can defend yourself a safer idea?
Maybe you do get hit hard by a psycho, even if you can or can't get up, will having something to protect you hurt your chances of surviving?
Again, the brass knuckles thing was a joke, and obviously none of you got it. I don't condone doing anything illegal or using senseless violence, but I do suggest being able to defend yourself.

So your argument that carrying nothing would actually help, or having something 100% legal wouldn't help, doesn't make a bit of sense to me.

At a critical mass that happened last month here in Austin, a truck swerved through the crowd of cyclists in a threatening way. Anyways, the cyclists got mad and pulled their U-locks (what you're recommending). So, what did the truck driver do in response? He pulled out a gun. Thank god nobody was killed...that's all I have to say.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-x1AhjHMY8

EDIT: The story that is told in this video isn't completely accurate. They pulled out their u-locks before he pulled out his gun (I heard this from a reliable eye-witness source).

Plus, the main point of any kind of "defensive tool" is to intimidate anyhow, so maybe something like
http://unrealitymag.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/brassknucklesp.jpg
(illegal in some states) ;)
and use it when you really, absolutely have to. Although I really don't think you should cross that line.
I hear some NYC messenger carry knives. :lol:


awful advice.
just watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rWu9rMPj7o
getting hit by a car will put a person out for minutes.

Chances are if you live in a big city (NYC) people drive like they are over caffeinated, cracked out, and late somewhere 24/7. Taking a whole lane isn't always possible. I ride with the mindset that if a car CAN hit me, it WILL, try to avoid coming close enough to get hit.

My guess is that not all drivers are psycho murderers. But if you do encounter one, isn't knowing you can defend yourself a safer idea?
Maybe you do get hit hard by a psycho, even if you can or can't get up, will having something to protect you hurt your chances of surviving?

Here's the problem: A lock or a pair of brass knuckles or what have you isn't going to help you defend yourself. A lock isn't going to stop a car. A lock could stop a person, but to get to that point you would have to get off your bike and engage, whereas you could just ride away. At best a lock might intimidate someone who is still driving, at worst it will make a situation worse and cause someone to **** you up; but to think you can use it to defend yourself against a car is simply ridiculous. There are better ways to get by. I would suggest a love tap to a car, just a friendly "here I am don't run me over" type of thing. That's less likely to escalate to the point where you need to get off your bike to "defend" yourself, or make someone insanely angry enough to run you down.

If you don't own your position on the road, someone will take it from you. Ride strong, ride aggressively, make people give you the space you need.

+1. The riders I know who get into the most accidents are the ones who ride too submissively, especially in trafficy places like NYC. Follow all car rules, NEVER ride against traffic or on the sidewalk. Whenever cars get too close or blatantly invade my area I give them a little slam on the hood. And when drivers open their windows and start screaming or get aggressive its better to just ignore them instead of instigating a potentially deadly game. Whatever little u locks or knives you have, cars will always be the dominant player and can unintentionally kill you pretty damn easily. Better not to piss them off.

+1. The riders I know who get into the most accidents are the ones who ride too submissively, especially in trafficy places like NYC. Follow all car rules, NEVER ride against traffic or on the sidewalk. Whenever cars get too close or blatantly invade my area I give them a little slam on the hood. And when drivers open their windows and start screaming or get aggressive its better to just ignore them instead of instigating a potentially deadly game. Whatever little u locks or knives you have, cars will always be the dominated player and can unintentionally kill you pretty damn easily. Better not to piss them off.

:thumb: when you are riding next to cars you can only trust one person in the world.

Allow me to clarify then.
I've seen a good share of stupid divers:
-Those who clearly did not care if they hurt anyone, or to what extent (that's why I said that they were bent on killing me.)
-I've also seen drivers who were aggressive, but to a lesser extent that they were willing to back off.

My guess is that not all drivers are psycho murderers. But if you do encounter one, isn't knowing you can defend yourself a safer idea?
Maybe you do get hit hard by a psycho, even if you can or can't get up, will having something to protect you hurt your chances of surviving?
Again, the brass knuckles thing was a joke, and obviously none of you got it. I don't condone doing anything illegal or using senseless violence, but I do suggest being able to defend yourself.

So your argument that carrying nothing would actually help, or having something 100% legal wouldn't help, doesn't make a bit of sense to me.

I'd say that 90% of drivers that are a cause for concern are neither stupid nor aggressive, but rather oblivious. They don't realize that the law requires them to share the road, and they don't realize you're there, because they are on the phone, eating, shaving, talking with a passenger, playing with their iPod, or engaged in some other distraction. It's very rare for a cyclist to end up in a serious altercation, unless they're looking for one. Yes, ride aware. Ride aggressively. Take the lane. But if there is some jackass in a car that is obviously not going to recognize your right to the road, back off and let them get in front of you. There is nothing you can carry on a bicycle that is going to defend you from an automobile, other than using your head.

I never made any argument against carrying some sort of weapon, as I exercise my right to carry every day. But I would also never use a weapon to "intimidate", as you suggested. And there is no weapon that is 100% legal. Police officers end up in court for using theirs.

Moving to Advocacy and Safety. Really does not have anything to do with SS&FG.

Moving to Advocacy and Safety. Really does not have anything to do with SS&FG.

They rarely mention brass knuckles in A&S.

:D

http://gadgets.boingboing.net/whitebarsweb.jpg

A great way to lose your fingers.

They rarely mention brass knuckles in A&S.

Naw, we go straight to firearms.



You still have to be careful when taking the lane. I've had drivers go into the next lane to get around me when I took the lane for a right turn. They still cut me off by turning right.

Naw, we go straight to firearms.


You're not allowed to have guns in California.

I was signaling for a right turn, And behind me is a green honda. She has followed me patiently and when i start to turn right she speeds up, Side by me while i already was in the turn i was forced to take the most inner route. Almost getting smashed cause the parked bus on the street, she proceeds to horn at me and she ran the red light. What i learned today.

Take right turns alonneeeee!! well take Turns alonneeeee!!!
Not quite sure what happened? Did you signal your desire to turn when you were far right in lane, but didn't account that you needed to move left to make a less tight turn?

Oh great, another thread where the hardcore killas start posturing about beating up motorists.

Take the lane, ride defensively, and skip the big talk online.

No, no, no. You have to understand that when a driver is getting ready to pass a cyclist, they first Google that person and see whether they can get away with buzzing you dangerously, or passing you safely in the next lane. So, the more you posture online about beating drivers up, the safer you'll be on the road. Or something. :thumb:

You're not allowed to have guns in California.

You're not? Uh oh!

I was signaling for a right turn, And behind me is a green honda. She has followed me patiently and when i start to turn right she speeds up, Side by me while i already was in the turn i was forced to take the most inner route. Almost getting smashed cause the parked bus on the street, she proceeds to horn at me and she ran the red light. What i learned today.

Take right turns alonneeeee!! well take Turns alonneeeee!!!

Take the lane and 'DO NOT GIVE IN'!!!!

You're not? Uh oh!

Well, not real ones. At least two of mine are illegal there. And there is certainly none of this allowed:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5haeqoVWn5E

A great way to lose your fingers.

My immediate reaction, too, and and vividly imagined. Ow.

I carry a D-lock in my back pocket or an external pocket of my bag, easily accessible. For, you know, locking my bike. However, as I live in a country with restrictive firearms laws and aggressive drivers, I'm quite happy to have something with me that doubles as a decent self-defence tool. It's not going to help me against a car - but if I slap a car that cuts me off with my knuckles, and the driver stops to confront me, it might help deter a road rage attack or at least end it faster and harder.

I'd probably never use it. I haven't been in any kind of fight since my teens, though have broken them up several times in the last five years. But I'd lie if I said I didn't find it comforting to have a hefty steel lock in my pocket.