Bicycle Mechanics - Keep getting flats... bad tires?

I know I often hit small potholes and stuff because I do my rides at 4am, so there are times when I don't see the obstruction in the road until I'm almost on it. This morning, I hit a few obstructions, and I really thought that I was ok because I didn't get a flat. Then when I got back from my ride, I was sitting around watching BBC News, and all of a sudden, I heard a pop and a psssssssssstttt as all the air flowed out of my tire, just minutes before I was to leave to go to my gym for lifting. I just changed out my pedals and ride my beater bike.

I have the Michelin Pro Light tires, and I wonder if the tires are just so fragile or something that they are just not made for all the bumps and obstructions I come across. These are new tires, and I've checked the rim tape, and I've also checked inside the tire, so it's not a problem of spokes or some kind of loose glass. It comes from all the bumps- usually I hit a couple of bumps, then the tire flats and I have to stop and change it. Today, I just got lucky enough to make it home.

Any suggestions? I'm thinking about just investing in a new pair of tires. Of course, they would need to match my bike colors (powder/baby blue). Price is not a problem. I like to go fast, and performance is manditory. I'm really working on building up speed and I'd like to have all the help I can get!

Thanks!

Koffee

Tire liners? Or a pair of armadillo's?

Sometimes if the tube is not seated well, or over inflated, a tire will pop like that. I stopped using the Michelin Pro 'cuz of flats every 40 miles or so.

Older tires tend to get thin...How many miles are on those tires?

In my experience, Pro Lites (and Pro Races) really can't handle bumps and such too well. I train solely on Michelin Axial Carbons and have almost no flats. I've done quite a bit of riding on new chip seal as well as long stretches of gravel and haven't had a flat since probably March. The only problem is that they're yellow, not baby blue.

What did the hole in the tube look like?

Dave

I liked a quote in this thread (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=53907&highlight=armadillo), where a poster references the Armadillo tires and says something like "Its amazing how little I miss changing flats." Heavier tires might be worth their weight.

I know this is been said time and time again, but get yourself a pair of Specialized Armadillo tires 700 x 23 or the 700 x 25 and we WILL not want to use any other type of tires.

I understand about the Specialized Armadillo tires. BUT do they have increased rolling resistance? If so, I'd rather change a flat every other day than have to struggle with tires that won't allow me to work with building speed. Like I said, I need all the help I can get. Once winter sets in, I can get the ugliest, knobbiest, nastiest, heavy tires I can find, but for now... I really would like to work on my goal for the summer!

I checked the hole. It's a very very very small slit-type hole.

*sigh* Could I be putting too much air in the tire? I've put too much air in tires before (not these, so I thought), and when it bursts, there's a big slit-type gash in the tube. I pump my tires to 120 psi. The front is fine, but the rear tire always is the one to get the flat.

Koffee

Whoops, as far as mileage on the tires, I don't think there's a lot. Maybe a couple of thousand miles tops. I've divvied up my time between my folding bike, my beater bike and this one, so I'd think these tires are still new-ish, right? Or how long do the Michelin Pro Light tires last? How many miles should I have on them before I change them out? And if I change them out, is there any way to recycle them rather than contribute to our environmental wasteland?

Koffee

My min criteria is one flat for every thousand miles for the bike.
Basically, I want to slap new tires on in the spring, and ride all year without a flat. I can understand the desire for speed, but that is a hell of a lot of flats. There must be a tire that's almost as light that could let you go a few weeks between flats. I'd imagine every company has a fast training tire that's a bit heavy for racing, but has a moderate degree of durability.Have an acqauintance that likes the Conti GP 3000, something like that. Performance has the Courier on sale, you might take a look at those. I don't know anything about it, but I looked for a non-wimpy blue tire. Found a Open Corsa at Supergo... http://www.supergo.com/profile.cfm?LPROD_ID=24164&lsubcat_id=7566&lcat_id=7604&referpage=

Did some more poking around, and I found something you might like

http://www.supergo.com/profile.cfm?LPROD_ID=25471&hotdeal=true#

>My min criteria is one flat for every thousand miles for the bike.

Mine is 2000/flat but I have yet to reach it! ;)

I understand about the Specialized Armadillo tires. BUT do they have increased rolling resistance? If so, I'd rather change a flat every other day than have to struggle with tires that won't allow me to work with building speed. Like I said, I need all the help I can get. Once winter sets in, I can get the ugliest, knobbiest, nastiest, heavy tires I can find, but for now... I really would like to work on my goal for the summer!

I checked the hole. It's a very very very small slit-type hole.

*sigh* Could I be putting too much air in the tire? I've put too much air in tires before (not these, so I thought), and when it bursts, there's a big slit-type gash in the tube. I pump my tires to 120 psi. The front is fine, but the rear tire always is the one to get the flat.

Koffee

Sounds like glass on the road. Armadillo's add resistance but it's more like losing 5-6 psi. I mean, it's not THAT dramatic. I have 1.95 semislicks using specialized's light version of armadillo with my mtb and I can easily reach 25mph, 30 if I'm behind a car, in the city, even over broken pavement and glass.

I don't think it was glass, seriously. There are a few craters out there in the road. In the past and on my old bike, I could roll over them no big deal, but every single time I hit a bad bump, I immediately flat, and if I hit several bad bumps, then I flat within 30 min to an hour. There are no holes in the tire when I match up the tube hole to the corresponding section of the tire. There are no glass shards or thorns or anything inside the rims or inside the tire itself. It's just that something is up with the tire, and I am just getting ready to chuck the whole tire. At this point, I just want a good, strong tire that has reduced rolling resistance and will allow me to keep a higher speed and pump those tires to the maximum psi. I really don't like to have my tires less than 110 psi... I can feel some drag when I get to 80- 100 psi. :(

I may look intothe Armadillo's. Tomorrow, I also have to go to Mission Bay to get my barrel adjuster fixed for my front derailleur, so I will probably enquire while I'm up there about the different kinds of tires, and tonight, I'll jump online and do a quick and dirty search on the different tires out there.

Bah, Michelin Pro Lights... who needs 'em anyways? :p

Thanks to everyone for their responses.

Koffee

Function over fashion. They do sell armadillos with a red sidewall, maybe a red bike? :)

I really don't like to have my tires less than 110 psi... I can feel some drag when I get to 80- 100 psi. :(


Gatorskins go to 120 psi.

a slit type hole, ok......... was it on the inner portion of the tube (the part which faces the rim) or the outer facing portion? Also, did you check the corresponding area of the tire?

A good way to orient your tire/tube combo is to put the tire's label directly over the valve stem-- that way you can more quickly zoom in on the suspect area.

Dave

I just spoke to the dudes at Supergo- the guy said the Pro Lights are not made for everyday useage, especially in the dark where I can't see the potholes in the road. He gave me a couple of recommendations- recommended against the Armidillos based on what my preferences were for performance.

Koffee

So what are the best kind of tires to use without them popping frequently.

For your BMX, I wouldn't know.

The guy recommended the Michelin Pro Race tires. I'm still arching my eyebrow at that one, so we'll see... the search continues in the meantime...

Koffee

I got a pair of Bontrager X Lite 700 C 28 for my birthday a year ago. and replaced my Armadillos. The reduced rolling resistance allowed me to increase my cruising speed by 10%. They are less than half the weight of the Armadillos, which gives makes the steering seem a lot more nimble. I have read that the silicon material doesnt have the grip in the wet, but I havent really tested it. I havent had a flat yet.

So what are the best kind of tires to use without them popping frequently.


I put on a set of Bontrager RaceLite HardCases on mine. the tread is a bit different and is smoother in the center, so I guess there's less rolling resistance. That was about 400 miles ago (so good so far).. and they go up to 120psi, don't know specifically if they are lighter than armadillos

michelin pro race are fine tires. i like my rubino pros, which are half-training/half-racing tires. michelin also has carbon/megamium for training. training tires will last longer and are tougher. no need to get armadillos, that's overkill, especially for a gal probably. and personally i think armadillos are a PITA to get on and off, while these folding tires are beauts and ride really well.

what are your tubes? maybe you should change tubes. michelin's A1 Butyl tubes are nice.

finally, you sure your rim tape is fine? if the tire's in good shape without cuts, and it's just bumps, the only thing sharp that could cause those little slits are the holes in the rim. use electrical tape to double up, or take off that rim tape and put on a new strip.

sd

I suspect that you're right about the potholes being the cause of your frequent flats.

One bit of information that I haven't noticed is the width of the tires that you are using. If it was my bike, whatever tire I decided to try, I think that I'd go up a width size and maybe keep the air pressure the same. That'll give you more impact flat protection.

I'm an advocate for Specialized Armadillos, but not in your case. They are just too stiff and heavy for high performance use.

Yep, if I remeber right, the thinner the tire, the more likely you are to bust a flat during road riding. I run a 700cx25, and Still wish i went up to a 27 or 28 (if I can still find one)...those tires felt far nicer on the road as well.

As far as speed, it's like running an under-aired tire...it's a bit slower than you might be used to , but give it a couple moneths and you prolly wont know the difference.

if you can, check out Serfas, their entire line have kevlar puncture liners built in to the tread. Their tires are very hard tread though...so I'm not sure if it's grippy enough for anyhting you would do. I just used them on my diamondback for urban riding with extra liners and thorn-resistant tubes and glass, metsal, thorn, whatever...I had no fears about riding over...that combo is like having a steel tire...but they were very heavy, slow in turns, and very hard tread (about a low medium on the grip scale). Wasn't bad for $20 a wheel though.

I'd keep the pros for messin around on the track, and just get a heavier, armored tire for street. With how bad the streets are here, my moto is SO going to have some armored tires....my commuter will soon too :)

Homer Simpson-style "DOH!"

I figured out the problem. I went for a quick ride a while ago. Actually, it was supposed to be quick. I'd gotten about 4 blocks, and I heard the "POP" and "psssssst" sound I've become so familiar with. "What the..?", I said as I pulled over. Yet another flat! But I wasn't surprised either, and I thought for some reason, God was telling me something, so I'd better listen to the wind and figure out what was being said!

I pulled the tire off again, and this time, I really checked inside the tire. Nothing. I checked the rim tape. Nothing again. I rechecked the tire and ran my fingertips over the tire for a few minutes. Nothing. Then I rechecked the rim tape one more time. Not a tear or anything. I rechecked the tube itself, and I saw a large puncture. Then I realized it was in the exact same spot as the last puncture, but this time, it was a large-ish round hole instead of a little slit. I had my Park Tool glueless patch so I patched it up. Then I put the tire back on the wheel and I was good to go, so I thought.

I used my CO2 pump to get the air in the tire, and then I rechecked the actual tire. There it was- the tube bulging out of the tire. THERE'S A HOLE IN THE TIRE! And not only that, it's not a hole like I imagined, it's a slit that bulges open when I blow up the tire. But you can't really see it unless the tire is fully blown up. So I pulled out my emergency tire patch (courtesy of Park Tool) and let the air out of the tire, and I pulled off the tire again. I patched the tire with the emergency patch, then finished my ride. It rides well, but I'm at home now (obviously! :) ), and I'll be putting on the tire that I planned to use for my trainer/roller rides this winter until I can find a good, strong tire that I can depend on and performs well. So problem solved... just took a little extra detective work and reading your responses to realize that something really wasn't quite right. So thanks to everyone! Now I just need to find a good tire to replace my Michelins!

Koffee

aww geez. well, I'm glad you found out what the problem was. it was probably dry-rotted tires. thats my guess. that would make it possible to split the tire like that.

i have a pair of michelin carbons. I love them. they aren't as fast as the GP3000s, aren't as good in the wet as the GP3000s, but they have not gone flat on me yet. I put them on at 1800 miles, its now 3300 miles. do the math. I'm jinxed now, but I've had a REALLY REALLY good run with these tires.

as for them not having the same ride characteristics of the GP3000s, they aren't quite there, but they are very close. like maybe 95% of the gp3000s ride quality and lack of friction, and probably 75% of the GP3000s wet weather performance. I'll admit, they are a bit sketchy in the wet (i've broken the back free by sprinting hard in the wet) but they are very good tires. and the back is just starting to show wear after 1500 miles. I love these tires.

Michelin Carbons.

Pro Lights are not made for everyday useage,
Koffee

So What the..Hello-kitty ARE they good for?

He said they were good for races, not for the wear and tear of long training rides day in and day out.

Koffee

race use and training/everyday use tires are usually totally different. It's like how a ferrari driver would not use his race slicks to go out and get groceries, since htey only last a few hundred miles and cost significant amounts of cash...instead he would have a semi-comp grade or aggressive street tire for that kind of use. Given driving a ferrari to get groceries is ********, but that's just another one of my bad analogies, mmkay? :)

The now-defunct Michelin Axial Bi-Sports I used to use were fairly delicate in the casing. I lost two when they split the casing after riding over some large pieces of gravel that I didn't see at night (in a place they were not expected to be). One of the tyres was less than a fortnight old. The splits weren't very big -- about half and inch. A boot of sorts helped extend the new tyre's life a little, but I wasn't confident riding it and retired it to the wall in the garage. I whacked it on the experimental fixie last weekend, but even the boot had worn through and resulted in yet another hole in the tube when I went for a test ride.

I've been using 28mm Michelin Dynamics for brevets and commuting on my other bike. The rear lasted about 4000km. They are not so delicate in the casing, have a tiny amount of tread with a slick crown, are reasonably light, and they're available in 23mm size (which would sound to be the minimum for the road conditions you are encountering). They're also pretty cheap. Only available in black or brown sidewall. No powder/baby blue that I am aware of.

The Continental Duraskins also seem to be OK, judging from a friend who used the 23mm version. But they didn't last as long as he had hoped before wearing down the tread.

He said they were good for races, not for the wear and tear of long training rides day in and day out.

Koffee

If its a race tire... for races. :)

Handy woman. :P Good Job!