Classic & Vintage - Need some help identifying a possible Cinelli frame please.

I was hoping for someone might be able to help me identify this frame for a bike I was given. A work friend gave me the bike after I mentioned I was looking for a 80's bike to turn into a single speed fixie. He thinks he bought the bike around 1979/1980 as new with the winnings from a card game!
There are no markings or badges at all on the frame. The columbus stickers don't really help me at all. The decals are for the Clement, the Italian Tyre company and have the flying Cinelli on. i have tried researching it on the web but I really don't have the knowledge to work this out.
I have fallen in love with the frame and would love to know if my workmate got the year right and if it is a Cinelli frame or not. Can't wait to get it road worthy!

Thanks in advance ......

Peel the Clement away very carefully, see if there's a logo underneath.

-Kurt

Definitely NOT a Cinelli (details and overall workmanship not right), but looks like a decent bike. Maybe a mid-range Bianchi?

SP
Bend, OR

Is there any identification on the dropouts of who made them? I would be suspicious about the claim that it is a 1979/80 bike, all the parts on it are definitly much newer than that. The plastic cable guide on bottom of the bottom bracket and the overall paint scheme are atypical for such an old bike. Aside from the columbus tube sticker, it looks more like a late 80's japanese sport bike that someone tried to disguise as a european racer.

I've not seen very many Cinelli's but I've never seen one with that fork crown. <-- totally useless comment, I know.

Certainly not Cinelli, but mid level Bianchi is a good guess if it is indeed Italian....
Domed rear stay ends are more common on French mid level bikes, but the rear dropouts are definitley not French (Simplex) looking, so could be Japanese too. Simple chainstay bridge with the big fender mounting hole says mid level or lower model too. Who knows, the Columbus sticker might be a later add-on too.

Chombi

Moggers,

I don't know what it is, but it's a great looking bike. I really like the color scheme and decals. I have a crazy idea for you, keep your one-of-a-kind bike the way it is, wax it, throw on some new tires and learn to ride it and shift gears. I have been where you are now, and I promise you I'm not trying to preach. It's great that you're interested in bikes, and that you found a cool bike. I hope you have fun riding it regardless of what you do to it. It's your bike. However, rather than turn it into one more generic fixie, how about just fixing it up? I think you'll find all the little details that make this bicycle original are what make it fun.

Also, if it's just about the cool factor, honestly fixies are played out, and I mean Played Out. Having an original 10 speed intact is about 100x cooler. Everyone has a fixie, but very few people actually have an interesting vintage bicycle. Remember Lao Tzu, he was always right: "He who follows a crowd is never followed by a crowd." Alright, I'm preaching ;)

devinfan,

Any advice at the moment is good advice! I've just got into cycling in a big way for the first time in my life and trying out as many different things as I can. Will do a fixie ...just to say I've done one, but really not sure what to do with this one. I love the way it looks and all the shimano 105 parts work beautifully. Might just keep hitting the car boots for my fixie and have a look at stripping down this one and investing in some eldow greese to make it shine! Would still love to know what it is though .... it's driving me crazy not knowing! Not sure if I can bring myself to try to peel off the Clement decal !!!!!!!

I think it's Japanese.

Moggers I'm with you on the decal - Don't Touch It! It really adds to the character of the bike (actually my favourite thing about it) and in my experience once you start peeling/messing with decals they never look the same. I've always been a fan of that era of Shimano 105, it looks great and shifts well. The Columbus decals look original to me. That plus the forged dropouts and decent lugs say nice bike to me. As to it's origins, I want to say Bianchi but somehow I can't see Bianchi doing a celeste-ish fade like that. It seems more like another company inspired by Bianchi. Could it be a Miele? I bought my friend a Miele badged as a Pinarello that was Columbus tubing and all 105, the only thing is the fork crown was different. Then I was thinking, what about Fiori? Japanese build with an Italian flavour, and I've seen several with colorful fades. This isn't a good example, but as good as I could get:

http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.mytenspeeds.com/My_TenSpeeds_1/Bicycles_Table/Japanese_Bicycles/Fiori_Bicycles/Fiori_Napoli/FioriNapoliRightFull.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.mytenspeeds.com/My_TenSpeeds_1/Bicycles_Table/Japanese_Bicycles/JapanesePageIntro/JapanesePage.htm&usg=__6-sv1Q8Si4vTFVx4lkTDKX03tiA=&h=693&w=1107&sz=114&hl=en&start=4&itbs=1&tbnid=gnu55wziT395AM:&tbnh=94&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dfiori%2Bbicycle%26hl%3Den%26gbv%3D2%26tbs%3Disch:1

Anyway, if you want to try a fixie, that's great, but if I were you I'd keep this one stock and find a beater/hi-ten bike to turn into a fixie. I will keep thinking. Something about that white/celeste fade looks very familiar to me.

Okay...... I had a couple of hours free time and had a real good look at the bike. I still can't find anything to suggest a company of country of origin! I looked up at the 105 Shimano parts and they all date to Oct / Nov 1988..... so not the early eighties. There is a faint number on the bottom bracket next to the plastic cable guides which I think reads F9F04981.

I have tried to scan different images to see if the frame paint scheme is on any other bikes but again no joy. Loving the mystery ....

Okay, I HAVE seen the paint scheme before. I remember now. It doesn't make it the same bike anyway, but it's killing me that I can't remember the actual name. It was an Italian bike, sold by that Hungarian ebay seller that was listing tons of frames with BIN's on ebay. But it was a smaller maker, not Bianchi or anything, Freschi? No, I don't think so, but something like that.

Certainly not a Cinelli. Probably not Italian either.
1. Eyelets on dropouts are rare on Italian frames
2. Rounded seat stay/dropout and chainstay/dropout joints. Italian bikes usually have the scalloped or wedge shaped joint. Rounded (bullet) joint is typical of Japanese or English bikes.
3. Anyone can get stickers and this bike has too many.
4. Cinelli lugs often have a series of round holes drilled on the points in decreasing diameter.
5. I have never seen a plastic cable guide on a top tier bike of any manufacture.

Wulf, I don't think anyone is debating the fact that this is not a Cinelli. I have a Cinelli and this ain't one, however my Cinelli DOES have eyelets for fenders. As to the plastic cable guide, no one said top tier either, I think the consensus is mid range. Your comment about the stickers? That's just mean. The only stickers this bike has are the two Cinelli ones. I would probably lose those as well, but the Clement wraparound is more of a decal, to my mind, and the Columbus ones don't count.

Wrong fork crown, wrong seat cluster, wrong fork end treatment, and wrong geometry (BB too high). Next.

Wrong fork crown, wrong seat cluster, wrong fork end treatment, and wrong geometry (BB too high). Next.

I guess no one is actually reading the post. It has been established that this bike is not in fact a Cinelli, I have no idea why each new post keeps trying to re-establish this same fact. Th OP is trying to figure out what it is.

The lugs (particularly the BB lug) look the same as on my Centurion, but I don't think the paint quite matches up with their turquoise/white design.

I guess no one is actually reading the post. . . . Th OP is trying to figure out what it is.
True, I wasn't getting past the the title which did hint at the possibility of Cinelli. My bad.

But 'struth, the cable guides indicate 80s vintage, the metalwork indicates non-Italian (most likely) origin, and the whole package indicates midrange but not extraordinary quality and workmanship typical of Japanese bikes of this period. Add to this the fact that by the 1980s companies like Schwinn, Raleigh, and Peugeot were (wisely) jobbing out their midranges to Japanese companies and you have to admit that the pedigree of this bike is anybody's guess.

True, I wasn't getting past the the title which did hint at the possibility of Cinelli. My bad.

But 'struth, the cable guides indicate 80s vintage, the metalwork indicates non-Italian (most likely) origin, and the whole package indicates midrange but not extraordinary quality and workmanship typical of Japanese bikes of this period. Add to this the fact that by the 1980s companies like Schwinn, Raleigh, and Peugeot were (wisely) jobbing out their midranges to Japanese companies and you have to admit that the pedigree of this bike is anybody's guess.

Hmm. This is all true. I guess it will remain a mystery without more information. Moggers, the bike obviously didn't look this way new, so if your work friend is telling the truth and that he bought it new, maybe he can shed some light.

Thanks for all your help on this one guys, I have it roadworthy after throwing on new tubes and tires ..... fast, fun and for a freebie bringing back a whole lot of teenage memories! Will leave it as is and just enjoy it for what it is!

I hate to resurrect this, but I stopped my bike today because I saw a Peugeot with EXACTLY the same paint and lugs as this bike, + Shimano 105. I was trying to remember the model on the way home, and then I forgot!! Not PGN 10, but something like that? I will get it.

I am going to make a guess on this frame. It isn't perfect in every detail but it is darn close to a Raleigh Record Aerospace frame. The fork and its fork crown are a perfect match. The rear dropouts are a perfect match, as is the rear derailleur cable stop underneath the chain stay. The erar brake bridge is perfect. The head tube lugs are a perfect match, as are the bottom bracket lugs. What is not a perfect match is the seat stay ends on the frame. On this frame they are flat ovals whereas, on the Raleigh frame I am looking at, they are cupped.

http://cgi.ebay.com/RALEIGH-RECORD-AEROSPACE-FRAME-25-NICE-/350358420336?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item5192fd3b70

I hate to resurrect this, but I stopped my bike today because I saw a Peugeot with EXACTLY the same paint and lugs as this bike, + Shimano 105. I was trying to remember the model on the way home, and then I forgot!! Not PGN 10, but something like that? I will get it.
The rear dropout detail does not look like the typical Simplex dropouts that Peugeot would have used on their bikes, although the plain looking lugs do look like what Peugeot would have used, plus the typical seat and chain stay domed tips. The BB cable guides are also a little different from what was used on most Peugeots (cable is captive on the guides while Peugeots usually have the guides fully open) in the early 80's which this bike was most likely made. Many Peugeots also had the same looking plain, unlugged chainstay bridge with the big hole in the middle. It looks like an unusual mix of stuff going on that still makes it a puzzler......It's still going to be real interesting to find out what this bike's all about!

Chombi