Fifty Plus (50+) - It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do nor enjoy any wrenching

There - it is official!!

Sure!! That's what I did when I started riding in 2000. I always took my bike to the shop for repairs. I learned how to change a flat at an Effective Cycling class (now called Traffic Skills 101, 201, and Commuting (http://www.bikeleague.org/programs/education/courses.php)) in 2000.
In 2003 I took a Park Tool class at an LBS. In 2007 I got a p/t job at a bike shop. Started selling but after a few months I was trained (on the job) to repair bikes - everything from low end 80s bikes to new road, mtn, and hybrids. Its fun. :beer:

I repeat

It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do nor enjoy any wrenching

My spouse agrees with you.

Yeah, it's ok. However, doing your own wrenching has many benefits, one of which is getting the job done right. bk

Can't see the relationship between turning a wrench and turning one's cranks. When you have 3 bikes you always have a spare.. Nothing against wrenching, but if you take up lots of time riding, don't you abandon your family enough . Then find yourself spending hours on end each night in the garage tooling around with your bike. Besides, I've found a very dedicated , reasonable shop owner who I trust . Why go through the aggravation.

Yeah, it's ok. However, doing your own wrenching has many benefits, one of which is getting the job done right. bk


Speak for yourself. That's no guarantee when I do my own.

I repeat

It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do nor enjoy any wrenching

Yes.

It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do nor enjoy any wrenching There - it is official!!

If a cyclist won't fix a flat or install a water bottle cage, it's certainly OK, officially, ... but it's also a little silly.

My spouse agrees with you.

+1

If a cyclist won't fix a flat or install a water bottle cage, it's certainly OK, officially, ... but it's also a little silly.

Who said anything about fixing a flat or installing a water-bottle-cage? I am talking about wrenching.

Wrenching, for me, does not include fixing a flat or installing a water bottle cage. I do those things all the time. Wrenching, as I define it, would include replacing the bottom bracket, changing and adjustung ders, installing stems, rebuilding bikes and other things requiring more advanced skills and knowledge.

However, it is also perfectly OK to define wrenching in any way one likes.

Since way back in Grade School I've always done some repairs to my bikes. As time permits and the spirit moves me I slowly venture further into the magical, mystical world of Wrenching. That's just me. I'm the same with Auto repairs and home repairs...some I'll tackle and some I won't, the hard part is predetermining where my personal limitations lie.

I'll add these two thoughts.....

First: I would be hard pressed though to draw a line in the sand between just riding and riding and wrenching.

Second: This thread reminds me that as a society the less independent we are, the more robust our service industry will become.

There is nothing wrong with not wanting to work on your bike. But for all us technical brained folks - we will continue to wrench.

I would qualify that by saying: If you are wealthy, it is OK...

If you like paying $50 or more every time you fly your bike somewhere, it's also OK. Otherwise, who are you going to get to take your S&S-coupled bike apart into small enough pieces to fit into the 26x26x10 case, and then put it all back together again at your destination?

I would suggest reading Robert Pirsig's Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. I have way more respect for people who can wrench bicycles than those who can't (or choose not to). Wrenching motorcycles is another level altogether, so wrenching bikes should be a no-brainer!

My personal line of demarcation of what separates dedicated cyclists from casual bike riders is whether or not they build their own wheels. But that aside, when I wrench my bike, I have no doubts about anything not being sound mechanically. When someone else does it, there is always some doubt...

The above might sound arrogant, and it is at odds with what everyone else is posting, but realize that I am not disparaging those who can't or choose not to wrench, and I hope I am upholding the other side of the argument. The top pros don't do their own wrenching when they are in a stage race, so who am I to disparage those who choose not to?

- Luis

I have way more respect for people who can wrench bicycles than those who can't (or choose not to).


I don't understand this, and I guess I have little of your respect. Too bad.

It is this whole guilt thing that "wrenchers" seem to want to lay on "non-wrenchers" that sort of drives me nuts!!

I don't understand this, and I guess I have little of your respsect. Too bad.

It is this whole guilt thing that "wrenchers" seem to want to lay on "non-wrenchers" that sort of drives me nuts!!

That was one of those comments you should just ignore - it's not worth even the energy to exercise the synapses enough to try to formulate the response.
There are those of us who recognize it takes all types - most all deserve respect.

Is it OK to trade messages on the internet but to need a child (or grandchild) to show how to post a photograph?
Who here does their own colonoscopies? (I'll bet you're limber.)
What about auto maintenance and repairs?
Plumbing, electrical work, heating and air conditioning service?
Anybody here grow or raise all of their own food?

Nobody knows everything about everything and nobody has the ability and interest to do everything. We all make choices about what we to do for ourself and what we choose to pay others to do for us. Why should bicycles be any different than these other things.

I repeat

It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do nor enjoy any wrenching


Thank you. I do just a little bit of wrenching and there is an impulse to feel guilty about not doing more. But I have limited time for my hobbies, and I want to spend that time riding rather than wrenching. I can afford to pay the shop, so I do.

Wrenching a bike is nothing - NOTHING - compared to prepping your skis for cross-country ski racing and training. Talk about time-consuming!

I must say I am surprised by the tone of responses to my post. I just said I have way more respect for people who do their own wrenching. Yes, they deserve more respect, just like I had way more respect for camera-bugs who did their own developing (I never got that much into it). This does not mean that I disrespect those who don't do their own wrenching, or who can't bother to Photoshop their digital phiotos. I have way more respect - perhaps I should have said "awe" - for people who service their own cars. I do not, and I certainly don't disrespect myself!

Why are people so darned defensive, so ready to attribute the basest of motives to my post?

L.

What's so tough about replacing a chain, BB or cassette? Nothing, that's what. Recabling and servicing hubs aren't a problem either. Tune ups, brake pads? A snap. The labor savings pay for the tools. I enjoy it because I like my ride to be in tip top shape ALL the time.

However, I do know people who should not be allowed to own tools. They wreck anything they touch with a tool. My Dad was like this. Fortunately, he had two sons who are toolheads. So, YES, you do not have to wrench to get with biking. Do so, secure in the knowledge that us toolheads are not laughing behind your backs. We may scratch our heads in wonder. But laughing? No. bk

I guess one could write a scale

Respect a lot ............... Some Respect.............. A little Respect ................No respect...................Absolutely No Respect

And one could place themselves somewhere upon your line based on how they did their wrenching - or didn't do it.

If someone says they have "way more respect" then I would guess it would be two or three degrees to the left of what is thought about those who don't wrench.

I guess it may have to do with the definition of the word "respect.' Personally, I base my respect or not on a whole lot of other life factors, attitudes and accomplishments than wrenching or not.

However, I do know people who should not be allowed to own tools. They wreck anything they touch with a tool. My Dad was like this. Fortunately, he had two sons who are toolheads. So, YES, you do not have to wrench to get with biking. Do so, secure in the knowledge that us toolheads are not laughing behind your backs. We may scratch our heads in wonder. But laughing? No. bk

I'm OK owning tools (I like tools) I just shouldn't be allowed to use them. One of my favorite saying is " I wouldn't ride a bike that I worked on and neither should you".

People have different comfort evels when working on bikes. If you're not comfortable and fairly confident doing the work don't do it.

My personal line of demarcation of what separates dedicated cyclists from casual bike riders is whether or not they build their own wheels.

Huh. Must be I'm not dedicated enough for you.

My personal line of demarcation is whether or not you own or use a motor vehicle. By that scale, I'm dedicated.

Willing to junk all your cars, trucks, motorcycles and riding lawnmowers and join me?

Dnvr,

I seriously doubt Lance (or any other top rider) spends a lot of time wrenching so I'm guessing you are in pretty good company.

Though they're not 50+ (i.e. not good enough for this forum), I suspect that Lance, Levi, and Alberto don't do their own wrenching. Assuming, for sake of conversation, that statement is true, are they respected as cyclists?

Huh. Must be I'm not dedicated enough for you.

My personal line of demarcation is whether or not you own or use a motor vehicle. By that scale, I'm dedicated.

Willing to junk all your cars, trucks, motorcycles and riding lawnmowers and join me?

+1

Now, YOU I respect. But, I always have, for a variety of reasons, not just your bicycling.

In my own way, given my life and circumstance (wife - and me - with medical problems, child with a disability, etc.), I have done my best to limit car use and do chores, shopping, etc., without using a car.

Now, YOU I respect. But, I always have, for a variety of reasons, not just your bicycling.

Thanks DF. Coming from you that means a lot to me.

In retrospect, that prior post of mine seems a little on the snarky side. Apologies for that.

Where I wanted to go with it was that the dictionary definition of "dedicated" (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dedicated) says, wholly committed to something, as to an ideal, political cause, or personal goal. Thus, a dedicated cyclist would be "wholly committed" to cycling.

It seems to me that a car owner or driver would be less than "wholly committed" to cycling. They could be very committed, or even extremely committed, just not wholly committed, and so, not dedicated.

Though they're not 50+ (i.e. not good enough for this forum), I suspect that Lance, Levi, and Alberto don't do their own wrenching. Assuming, for sake of conversation, that statement is true, are they respected as cyclists?

Depends on if they're doping or not, or using hidden electric motors or not.

If I was to give up the cars I think my wife would be wholly dedicated to having me committed! :D

Just sayin....

I would qualify that by saying: If you are wealthy, it is OK...

If you like paying $50 or more every time you fly your bike somewhere, it's also OK. Otherwise, who are you going to get to take your S&S-coupled bike apart into small enough pieces to fit into the 26x26x10 case, and then put it all back together again at your destination?

I would suggest reading Robert Pirsig's Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. I have way more respect for people who can wrench bicycles than those who can't (or choose not to). Wrenching motorcycles is another level altogether, so wrenching bikes should be a no-brainer!

My personal line of demarcation of what separates dedicated cyclists from casual bike riders is whether or not they build their own wheels. But that aside, when I wrench my bike, I have no doubts about anything not being sound mechanically. When someone else does it, there is always some doubt...

The above might sound arrogant, and it is at odds with what everyone else is posting, but realize that I am not disparaging those who can't or choose not to wrench, and I hope I am upholding the other side of the argument. The top pros don't do their own wrenching when they are in a stage race, so who am I to disparage those who choose not to?

- Luis


Wrenching a bike is nothing - NOTHING - compared to prepping your skis for cross-country ski racing and training. Talk about time-consuming!

I must say I am surprised by the tone of responses to my post. I just said I have way more respect for people who do their own wrenching. Yes, they deserve more respect, just like I had way more respect for camera-bugs who did their own developing (I never got that much into it). This does not mean that I disrespect those who don't do their own wrenching, or who can't bother to Photoshop their digital phiotos. I have way more respect - perhaps I should have said "awe" - for people who service their own cars. I do not, and I certainly don't disrespect myself!

Why are people so darned defensive, so ready to attribute the basest of motives to my post?

L.

I can't speak for others, and am trusting that when you ask for feedback, you really want it. For my part your post is a bit more judgemental than I appreciate. You tend to state things in absolute terms. As I read through your posts, I see that you attempt to moderate your response, but it's hard to get past opening slavos such as, "Yes, they do deserve more respect..." Don't know if you intend it, but my knee jerk reaction is to wonder who made you the judge of what is worthy of respect. Then again, I'm a child of the sixties and don't like anyone telling me what's what.

Well, lets see. Since I got rid of my vintage Raleigh Sport 3,
1) I have not changed a tire, nor have
2) I adjusted a cable (nor have I had a flat, or needed to adjust anything).
3)I have swapped seats in the last couple of weeks and
4) swapped my Torker North Road bars for a bit higher set of Dimension WIDE Cruiser bars.
5)I haven't needed to change brake pads, nor have I needed to adjust my front roller brake or my rear coaster brake either. The most I do is pretty much like a computer repair man, swapping parts.

I can of course put together a local area network, tell you why you should or should NOT use a particular form of network security, I can program in COBOL 68, Fortran IV/ 77, C, LISP, RPG II and Java, and I can wire up a serial connection for a terminal in about 5 minutes from a standing start. I can prove that my programs are correct, that my local area network is functional and secure, and that my terminal is wired correctly. I can run a UNIX system, Linux, or Windows 3, Windows 95, Windows NT, Windows XP, well enough for a bunch of professional scientists to use it, and the same for a bunch of professional programmers.

And I find worrying about getting respect or not is pretty damned USELESS, if you can't go to bed and get to sleep at night, or if you can't wake up in the morning and look at your face in the mirror. That's a bit more important, and you know what? It's ALL self-contained, you need no-one else to cause you to have self-respect, and no-one can take it away. And what I think of you should have no bearing on your sleep at night nor looking in the mirror in the morning.

Okay?

This thread is circling the drain

Of course it is OK not to wrench if you don't want to. It is also OK to wrench if you like. I guess it is even OK to be overly sensitive to what others think about what you like to do, but it sure doesn't seem like fun to me.

Thus, a dedicated cyclist would be "wholly committed" to cycling.



I agree about "wholly committed" but suggest you substitute "Bellevue" for "cycling" in the above. ;)

I repeat

It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do nor enjoy any wrenching

I agree yes it is okay. I trust my LBS. Besides about the only thing I can do is change tires pedals and seats. Like my car it goes to the Pros.

I remember riding to San Diego from the bay area when I was a kid in the back of a 49' chevy P/U. I'm sure glad Dad knew how to break down a split rim and hot patch a tube. AAA and cell phones have made life much easier. It's a good thing. Really, most area's with a lot of riders you'd never need more than a puzzled look to get some help.

Yeah, it's ok. However, doing your own wrenching has many benefits, one of which is getting the job done right. bk


Speak for yourself. That's no guarantee when I do my own.

I can guarantee any wrenching I did on my bike would result in a disaster:o I can change flats, saddles and pedals, clean and lube it and some minor adjustments but that's my limit. I'm not interested in doing anymore.

Its called cycling not mechanics, so if you want to have the pros do it for ya have at it. Just need to do the basics in order to get home like change a tire or repair a chain. Heck just make sure the bike is in good shape you shouldn't have too much trouble riding around. If something feels out of whack it probably is so have it looked and and don't worry when you ride.

That's what keeps the LBS' service department humming.

'Cause they HATE me!

Local service manager suggested that, when I received the new spring for my fork, that I have the fork serviced; would have, but the weather was too nice to be without the bike for a week. So I just swapped out the spring, checked what I could check, and reassembled. That was 15 months ago. No problems.

I can't speak for others, and am trusting that when you ask for feedback, you really want it. For my part your post is a bit more judgemental than I appreciate. You tend to state things in absolute terms. As I read through your posts, I see that you attempt to moderate your response, but it's hard to get past opening slavos such as, "Yes, they do deserve more respect..." Don't know if you intend it, but my knee jerk reaction is to wonder who made you the judge of what is worthy of respect. Then again, I'm a child of the sixties and don't like anyone telling me what's what.

Amen

I guess one could write a scale

Respect a lot ............... Some Respect.............. A little Respect ................No respect...................Absolutely No Respect


You left out a space for "Non Issue". Whether or not somebody tunes his own bike, changes the oil on his car, or reshingles his house has very little, if any, effect on the amount of respect that I have for him.

I've been tinkering with my bikes ever since the Schwinn Racer I got for my 12th birthday. I've always liked it and for me the fixing/overhauling/maintaining is just another facet of the hobby. Lots of the folks I ride with have no desire to pick up a tool. Sometimes I do it for them, most of the time, they use their favorite LBS. But, I'll guarantee they have at least as much fun and get every bit of the enjoyment out of their bikes as I do mine.

I like stargazing too, but if anything goes wrong with my telescope, (like the stinking motor drive - again :notamused:), I ain't touchin' it. No interest, no skill for it, and would rather pay to get it fixed.

It is this whole guilt thing that "wrenchers" seem to want to lay on "non-wrenchers" that sort of drives me nuts!!

This guilt thing isn't making any sense to me. Some people enjoy mowing grass and do it themselves. We have landscapers. Should I feel guilty about making a contribution to their wages? Or, on the other hand, should I feel guilty about working on our bikes and thus depriving our local shops of income? The technical term for this is, I think, mind **** (starts with a "f" and is disallowed here).

All in favor of allowing Dnvrfox to say the following statement; "It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do, nor enjoy, any wrenching", Say Aye...

All in favor of allowing Dnvrfox to say the following statement; "It is OK to ride a bicycle and not do, nor enjoy, any wrenching", Say Aye...

Aye :D:lol::):thumb:

Man this went into the dumper as fast as some of the stuff on road cycling. Must be all the rain we are going through.

As to Lance and Levi doing their own work. It is a pretty safe bet that a paid professional team mechanic does it for them.

Some of the best 50+ riders I know take crap care of their bikes. So the link between being a good rider and a good wrench is a no starter. As for me the only thing I have not done with a bike is face a bottom bracket and build a wheelset. Planning to learn how to build up a wheel when the snow fly's again. It has nothing to do with the LBS not doing it just my choice.

I think building bikes is a fine hobby just don't ask my wife for an opinion on that hobby.

I think building bikes is a fine hobby...

IMO, wrenching on/building bikes is a fine hobby as long as one doesn't endanger themselves and others as a result. If important bits are gonna be falling off while one rides, by all means, have a pro do it for you. :)

DnvrFox, you don't know what you're missing.

http://i46.tinypic.com/2l87ojm.jpg

Under each grease spot is a deep hole left by the tooth in a chainring (wrench slipped while removing a stuck pedal).

DnvrFox, you don't know what you're missing.

Under each grease spot is a deep hole left by the tooth in a chainring (wrench slipped while removing a stuck pedal).

+1