Electric Bikes - eplus electic bikes

Has anyone tried the eplus electric bike yet? What's intriguing to me is:

-The motor and battery are all contained in the wheel
-They come pre-built (no need to think, because frankly I'm not ready for that yet)
-They are local to my area (I'm in Washington DC)
-They have a conversion that works with the BigDummy:

http://epluselectricbike.com/

That being said, they express their systems in units of Watts and I'm used to seeing things expressed in Amps and Volts. So specifically I was wondering:

1) Has anyone here used them (eplus Bikes) and how was your experience?
2) What do you think of a 1000 watt Big Dummy?
3) What might I expect from a 1000watt bike?
4) What is your impression, in general, of eplus bikes (yes I know many will not like the idea of "pre-built", but after years of following ebikes on and off, I just don't have the time or interest in building my own right now)

Thank you!

It's going to be hard to find an Eplus user because they are relatively new and expensive. From what I understand, the 1000 watt bike goes about 30 mph. Hmm, I wonder how they sell the bike though that goes beyond legal speed limit. If you say they are selling them in the USA. They have a kit for about $2000, though where you can put it on yourself. That's what I would do if I was going to get that. Save yourself about $800. All you do is throw 2 wheels on and a throttle.

As far as pre-built bikes go, they are probably one of the best if not the best bike to get because of the speed, power, and good design. You can park it, just lock up both wheels with a good chain and that's it. That would make it ideal for so many things. I'd buy an Onguard 5018 chain and lock up the bike with that. Maybe an Onguard 5018 and then a cable lock for the 2nd wheel. I have the Onguard 5018 chain and it's pretty good.

Another one to look at would be the A2B bike. Like I said, just make sure you get a thick enough chain to lock it up with. someone on Endless sphere forum had his stolen recently. Get the immobiliser chain or a Onguard chain. Something that is at least 14 mm thick. The immobiliser is 16 mm thick.

I'm rather surprised that E+ isn't getting some flak from Federal regulators since they sell models with 1000W kits, which, pursuant to US law must meet the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration's safety standards for mopeds/motorcycles. See Public Law 107-319, which was enacted at the request of big bicycle manufacturers who make rather anemic e-bikes to clarify that the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration could not set safety standards for all e-bikes. This law established the definition of "low-speed electric bicycle" and essentially established it as a consumer product that only needs to meet safety standards of regular non-powered bicycles set by the Consumer Product Safety Administration. The term "low-speed electric bike" in the statute is defined as "a two- or three-wheeled vehicle with fully operable pedals and an electric motor of less than 750 watts (1 h.p.), whose maximum speed on a paved level surface, when powered solely by such a motor while ridden by an operator who weighs 170 pounds, is less than 20 mph." Ready-made e-bikes more powerful than these must meet the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration's safety regulation for mopeds/motorcycles. FYI, at this point in time, conversion kits aren't covered by these safety regulations, but I expect that to change as ever more powerful hub motors are imported from China.

I'm rather surprised that E+ isn't getting some flak from Federal regulators since they sell models with 1000W kits,

Its my understanding that all you really have to do is market as an offroad only bike to get around those regulations. Much like racecars don't have to meet DMV specs.

Its my understanding that all you really have to do is market as an offroad only bike to get around those regulations. Much like racecars don't have to meet DMV specs.

The problem is they really don't market them that way, they're marketing them as a form of transportation (which is good--North Americans need to begin viewing the bicycle primarily as a mode of transportation rather than a piece of sporting equipment). I remember looking at the first bikes they sold and as I recall, they seemed to use frames that were made for them that were beefier. They now seem to be converting a variety of bikes that anyone can buy, such as the Big Dummy, etc.

Sure, but all they really need is "Makes great transportation*"


*for off road use only.

Unless you get plates and registration for ebikes, using non-legal models on the road will be nearly impossible to police.

first of all E+ is descendand of Tidal Force, say improved version of Tidal Force bike - one of the best in the world.
It is USA -made bike which makes all the difference.
I am Canadian BTW .
They have all the right to write on TF frame: proudly made in USA.
Motor/controller is the best in the world no doubt.
My TF has 16500 km on the clock and counting.
Construction and quality of materials , also design of electronics is what makes this ebike so unique.
If E+ is even 15% more efficient - that's fantastic.
E+ has one drawback - it does not accept any 36V battery like old TF and manufacturer promised to change it next year.
Mc

Thanks for the all the replies - so what's the advantage of a 36Volt battery over what the e+ is compatible with? I seem to recall from my researching days that higher volts = higher top speed, is that right?

Thanks for the all the replies - so what's the advantage of a 36Volt battery over what the e+ is compatible with? I seem to recall from my researching days that higher volts = higher top speed, is that right?

BTW, this is one of the things that piques my curiousity, because again from my researching days I recall that most kits and bikes are expressed in Volts and not Watts. What's the significance of 1000 Watts VERSUS 36 or 24 Volts? The physics behind this is interesting, but frankly, I just want to know how the end user experience is affected and why would an e-bike be expressed in Watts instead of Volts (which is what I'm used to seeing)

They do seem to get rave reviews here, so there must be something to them, I'm just thrown off my the different unit of measure.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Watts is volts x amps. My bike at 36v uses 1500 watts peak and it goes about 29 mph. At 48v, my peak wattage is almost 2000 watts and goes 35 mph. So a bike at 1000 watts should probably go around 26 - 27 mph or more if it's very efficient.

Thanks all for the replies. I test drove one recently. It worked out so well that I took the plunge and then ordered one. Fantastic ride, fantastic design. I got it up to and sustained 33 mph with by giving the electric motor a bit of pedal power, and that was with a bike that wasn't even set to a seat height that accomodated me. So I couldn't fully extend my leg to apply even more leg power. I can't wait to get the one I ordered.

I think this bike will easily let me easily sustain 25 or so for my commute to work, which is what I'm looking for. Anyway, thanks again. Will follow-up a few weeks after actually receiving the unit in hand.

paverman,
have you get your E+ yet?
tell us
MC

PMmiro13car - not yet, I'm aching for it though. Should be late next week unless it arrives early. Really looking forward to it, and will post some initial impressions when it arrives.

Also plan to get the Green Down Low Glow kit once version 2 becomes available and plan to lock it up with something along the lines of these:

-Kryptonite New York Fahgettaboudit U-Lock
-Kryptonite New York 3 foot Chain with EV Disc Lock

Slate Magazine rated them as best of class locks for bike.

Chains are more versatile than u-locks.

on a higher volted system you likely will have less loss due to resistance in wiring.

paverman,
you will enoy every minute of ride,
as I wrote before:
E+ do not accept any 36V battery like its predecessor Tidal Force.
Because they changed console with LCD one .
battery electronics must make handshake with processor inside motor for main battery leads to be connected to controller.
But what is fantastic about E+ is that apparently is at least 10% more efficient than old TForce. Just read E+ forum and experience of folk bill von his thread clearly show this.
On my TF quiiet, silence, smooth ride,
no cogging, no jerking, no overheating, no water damage from rain.
And mine is Canadian TF restricted to 19m/hour max speed.
MC

MC....a shame you've got a non X bike based on your silly Canadian laws, though you can send your hub & LEVT (Idaho), with a simple, but a $250 bill, software program change they can unlock your hubs potential to around 33 mph (52.8kh) downhill pumping hard with the pedals! Otherwise the bike will go 25mph unassisted or around 26.5mph with light pedaling. You will also want to change your front 44t gear to a 48t +.

Yes, the E+ are great bikes, but for the money, just buy a used in excellent condition '05 TF bike in a different model than yours for a little change. Then again you can also just buy a complete NOS X hub, for around $350 US, to put on your bike. Bingo, a new bike with the added horsepower!

Kit
S.CA USA

I tried many kinds of electric bikes, but I am not really impressed... I prefer to ride usual bikes... that is the fun

<Moderator edit>
And since you are trying to sell hard on drugs in your signature line, I prefer that you be banned.
And don't come back.

since thread is about E+.
paverman ,
you will enjoy your E+ for about 3 seasons only , sad but it is how long will Nickel battery last.
E + is the best ebike in the world as EMS manufacturer claims EXCEPT battery..
And unlike tIDAL fORCE it will NOT power up on any 36V battery.
Many Chinese ebikes have longer lasting batteries.
I called and sent emails to EMS that they should keep promise and deliver UBC Universal Battery Connector implemented in E+ but they say is low demand, comm on low demand?
Nickel battery on " the most advanced ebike in the world"?????
Thats the shame.
The best motor/controller in the world for sure, but NOT the best ebike.
Anybody interested in E+ , PLEASE CALL ems TOLL FREE NUMBER TO TELL THEM - INTRODUCE UBC .
MC

I tried many kinds of electric bikes, but I am not really impressed... I prefer to ride usual bikes... that is the fun

Maybe best if you keep your unsolicited opinions to yourself, as your talking out of your ******** ass....as you've NEVER ridden a TF or E+ bike @ 30+ mph.

Go troll somewhere else you loser.

crica888,
you are on ebike subforum
what's the sense of coming here with your opinion.
Here are the people who accepted and ride ebikes.
CM

Guys, when you see spammers selling crap like circa888, would y'all be so kind as to report him?
Thanks,

--Allen

I had a couple of concerns, or maybe three. 1. the bike is heavy. We frequently carry our bikes on a rack and it would have to be lifted up a foot or so to get it onto the rack, 2. what would it take to replace a broken spoke or are they so heavy duty that they won't ever break?, 3 what is the cost to replace the wheel when the battery goes bad in a few years and 4. since we ride on bike trails would it be so obvious that it was an electric bike that the gendarmes would chase us off the path?
Richard

Well I've had mine for about 8 months now, although I have the Surly Big Dummy with eplus motor/battery/etc installed (as opposed to Tidal Force).

I had a couple of concerns, or maybe three.

1. the bike is heavy. We frequently carry our bikes on a rack and it would have to be lifted up a foot or so to get it onto the rack,

Yes it's heavier than a regular bike so lifting can get interesting. I suppose this would depend on the strength of the lifter. I'm 40 years old male and don't have issues lifting it, but perhaps someone else would.



2. what would it take to replace a broken spoke or are they so heavy duty that they won't ever break?,

Never happened to me, but from the looks of the bike any bike store could do it, or you could if you know how.


3 what is the cost to replace the wheel when the battery goes bad in a few years and

http://epluselectricbike.com/buy-bikes-online/electric-bike-accessories

They also have an annual maintenance program that'll let you get the battery much cheaper if you keep up with the program. I'm not sure how you participate in it if you're out of town (i live local to eplus), but there is a way.


4. since we ride on bike trails would it be so obvious that it was an electric bike that the gendarmes would chase us off the path?

I get a comment from time to time on the trail (about once every 5 or 6 weeks), but honestly if you're on an eplus you can run circles around anybody actually trying to "chase you off the path." Ironically, I get comments from people who themselves don't warn when passing. I know this because I'll follow behind them a bit before passing. I get positive comments far far more often. Just be respectful of others, don't go zipping past people at dangerous speeds, warn when passing and you shouldn't have too many problems (at least not where I live). Even when the comments have been negative, there was only one case where it was beligerant and the guy was screaming at the top of his lungs. The only times I've every gotten negative comments were when passing someone. When I'm stationary, I've always gotten positive comments. Since I don't pass at dangerous speeds, and since I'm religious about sounding the warning bell, I have to wonder if part of their negativity is that they just don't like getting passed.

Richard, paverman,
I already in process of ordering my 1000W E+ kit.
question # 3 is by far the MOST IMPORTANT TO owning E+.
I called EMS factory twice and told them my opinion asking about opportunity to power E= on battery of my choice.
They seem to be paranoid about safety?
Tens of Tidal Force users connected all kind of Lipos to TF and waht happened - they happily rides their TF today. as technical person EE myself I am puzzled that EMS would not develop Universal Battt Connector as they promised themselves year or so ago.
Tidial Force have it they say themselves they built on the legend of TF but still they would not develop UBC .
I am in the process of developing of way how to power E+ on any 36V battery.
I don't know anything about E+ BMS electronics even what chips they use.
One thing is certain BMS MUST MAINTAIN COMMUNICATION WITH CONSOLE ALL THE TIME.
hOW TO CHEAT bms INTO THINKING IT IS STILL CONNECTED TO nmh why in reality is connected to Lithium ?
Is there a way ?
I think it is .
Rebuilding battery every 3 years is NONSENSE from economical point of view.
With LiFePO BATTERIES LASTING MINIMUM 10 YEARS it is even bigger nonsense.
If one cell is even only 15 dollars times 30 that's 450 dollars for cells alone, add labour and shipping and you have over 600 dollars?
remember wheel is heavy and very few people are close to EMS factory.
Thaty's why I encourage you to call them and ask about promised Universal Connector , they promised it themself .
cm

everybody who considers E+ should call EMS manufacturing first and ask what abou
Universal Batt Connecor they promised.
No demand?
All those people on TF Google forum want this, every logical person would like to have it on close to 4000dollars ebike, right?
on my 2005 TF I had been using LiFePo battery for almost 4 years, 4 summers, 4 winters of riding, bike still performs like when this battery was new
max speed acceleration the same , try this with NMH battery.
No way E+ 1000W will go 30miles/hour after 3 summers of use.
My original NMH on my TF was SAFT cells - the best in the world at that time and they lasted to the specks only for 2 years in third year I got so many cut outs , cells become high resistance over the time slowely.
Service company for Tidal Force LEVT charges 650dollars to rebuild hub battery right now, how much cheaper EMS manufacturing would charge? 100dollars less?
CM

I received the glide+ @7 days ago. so far 100% satisfied....pretty impressive that it can carry me (240 lbs) up steep hills.
what I like is that I can pedal as hard or easy I want.

jjmj,
Thank you for resurrecting this thread.
All E+ owners,
read on there is good news for you below....
I have mine E+ 1000W for almost 7 month and cannot get enough of it.
I always look for occasion to ride somewhere on E+.
To appreciate E+ you must ride other ebikes, because like with everthing comparison must be done to evaluate technical stuff.
And I rode so called ebikes from department stores Wallmart and Canadian Tire when I got so excited about ebikes.
You must go there to ride one of the LEad Acid battery-powered, primitive, clunking, noisy bricks to appreciate sophistication of E+ or Tidal Force.
Because if you don't have this comparison you might think that E+ is just normal ebike. Far from this.
E+ motor/controller must be the one of the best in the world in terms of efficiency , construction and quality of assembly.
No undersized wires entering motor through axle here /true 10AWGwires/ , no whine, groan on the acceleration, no shoddy, cheap bearings , no water entering motor,just USA-made quality.
It must cost money.
Riding E+ is a pleasure for the reasons-very well modulated, linear throttle,pleasure to operate/no on-off feelling of cheap China throttle here/ , complete silence even under heavy acceleration, 9 power levels really well implemented, EVERY press of the button really change power delivered.
Display shows battery SOC with good accuracy, no 3 light cheap useless voltage based battery indicator here.
So all this must cost money.
In my personal opinion as EE you cannot really take advantage of wonderful motor/controller design while powered on Nickel batteries.
GOOD NEWS
I must correct what I wrote before.
I finally made experiment with throbbing heart,
I disconnected hub battery power connector and plug another 36V battery to motor side of battery power wires and viola my E+ powered up as usual, I checked throttle and functions of display, most work but power drawn is not shown for example.
However I still didn't ride E+ with that battery. I still cannot figure out how to safely attach this battery pack to my E+ frame to take test ride which is not easy task considering how fast I can travel.

So every E+ can be powered on any 36V battery as long as front data cable is connected to front hub.
It would mean that at the very least you can use third party 36V battery with original hub battery not removed.
It means after hub battery slowely dies and become really weak like every NMH battery you have to haul it in front wheel.... unless there is a way to get rid of 30 NMH cells which becomes dead weight after like 4 summers. They NMH don't drop dead just suddenly, they deteriorate slowely over the time.
MIRO13CAR

so far so good, I just reached 300 mike mark on my glide e+ I average about 10 miles day
on very hilly terrain, and I do a fair amount of biking in the woods with rough in manicured trails.

I am surprised at how well tihis bike can carry me up a steep hill. I weigh 240 lbs...actually have lost 5 lbs since riding over the past 6 weeks.....

this is quite remarkable for a 49 yo guy who RARELY biked until I got the e+ bike.

they way I ride I know I will have a flat tire at some point, and I am anxious about changing the back tire
given the electrical components...but I guess I will learn when the time comes

e+ web site has dramatically lowered the costs of most of their bikes since Sept 2011 (that's why I bought the bike in October)

Miguel

Yes,
I visited EMS E+ maker web site and was stunned how deep they discounted Cruser, Glide and 1000W kit is only 1300 DOLLARS???
I am seriously thinking about buying another 1000W kit.
I never thought that I would have so much exercise on my E+ .
Simple fact that E+ can keep up with traffic on 50km/h roads if I pedal moderetely gives me tremendous motivation to pedal hard and it means only thing = EXERCISE. And I use maximum level 8 to take traffic lane.
I can easly realize health benefits from heavy pedalling.
I am short of breath when I reach my company entrance door.
However such sprints on 50km/h roads I can do on warm mornings only.
NMH deteriorates quite fast with cold.
Congatulation on loosing 2,5 kg!!
Keep pedalling on.

I forgot to mention low center of gravity on E+ due to battery in front hub, very low center of gravity which makes E+ incredably stable at high speeds.
E+ just begs rider to stand up on its pedal for insane acceleration, cars left behind only later catching up with me.
Just opposite of ebikes with batteries on luggage racks - the worst place to mount batery but so often used , because it is so lazy easy for manufacturer like
PRODECO bikes.
MIRO13CAR