Touring - Purchasing my first Brooks Saddle

I've decided to get a Brooks B17 Imperial standard. The price is a bit prohibitive, but from what I've heard it is well worth it. But with such a cost, I am worried that I won't like it and be able to return it. I've heard great things about Wallingford, but they are currently out of stock, so is REI which has an excellent return policy. Rivendell has them in stock, but I don't know if I want to jump the gun incase I don't like the saddle. Should I wait it out for Wallingford?

Brooks don't work for everyone.

Brooks don't work for everyone.

Actually that's funny. I absolutely agree! However, I tried a Brooks B17 and for whatever reason, it didn't work/fit. I also tried a Conquest (Brooks B17 w/springs) and it didn't work (or fit my anatomy...which is really the case).

Being a little persistent AND getting a great deal (trade) on a B72, I won't ever ride with anything else. THIS Brooks is awesome!

The B72 is a lot wider and has a shorter nose than the B17. NOS can still be found. You can also have your B17 custom cut to help with pressure points.

They are durable. They can be comfortable. But I agree, for some reason (anatomy) they just don't fit everyone.

My .02.......find a reputable company with a good return policy. I think I heard someone on BF say you need to give it 500 miles before you know if it fits you or not.

Jerry H

I am with jharte. I tried B17, and did not like it. Then got a used B72, and it worked. Now I use B68's and B67's with cutouts (think Selle Anatomica), and would NOT ride anything else. As always, YMMV, and like 10 Wheels says, they do not work for everybody.

I emailed Wallingford and they got right back to me in about 15 min. They said that they will have more stock sometime this summer. SO it will look like I will have to be patient.

I've had a B17 and a Swift and they both got broken tension bolts. The B17 last year and the Swift this year. They had about 2500 miles on them. I wrote to Brooks and I never received an answer. Hope you have better luck, but I'll never own another one.

I've had a B17 and a Swift and they both got broken tension bolts. The B17 last year and the Swift this year. They had about 2500 miles on them. I wrote to Brooks and I never received an answer. Hope you have better luck, but I'll never own another one.

Were you able to replace the bolts?

Were you able to replace the bolts?

I did on that one I sold Bob and I just sent the other one in to Chain Reaction. Chain Reaction said they sent it to there supplier and the turn around is 3 weeks. That bolt is a bear to change out. I really like the Fizik Aliante. The reason Wallingford can do that return policy is because he's sells his saddles at an inflated price.

That is good to hear.

How do you like the Arione?

Wallabike may be what you need.

OTOH, the Brooks saddles are at a good price at places like ChainReactionCycles (http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=35176).

I have a B17 pre-aged. Those have laces like the Imperial. The come with a matted finish which polishes quite readily under your butt. :D
The B17 is for people who like to ride in a fairly upright position. Since I like to ride low into the wind it became quite uncomfortable. Which I did the was to cut out the shape of the relief the Imperial has at the center and that was a good move.

Moreover, I started to use three laces for the front, middle ans back of the rows of holes. This allows me to tune up the shape and firmness of the saddle just right. Since then I rode consecutive centuries, 200 km and 300 km brevets practices and everyday 50 km rides, all wearing a simple chamois underwear with shorts over them. No pain, not a thought for the saddle, no soreness or numbness afterward.

I am confident that an Imperial saddle can suit 90% of the persons who want to take the time to adjust them to their... needs. :)

Good luck.

I've had a B17 and a Swift and they both got broken tension bolts. The B17 last year and the Swift this year. They had about 2500 miles on them. I wrote to Brooks and I never received an answer. Hope you have better luck, but I'll never own another one.

Do you have pictures of this damaged bolt? Could be a design problem or bad alloy.

I've had a B17 and a Swift and they both got broken tension bolts. The B17 last year and the Swift this year. They had about 2500 miles on them. I wrote to Brooks and I never received an answer. Hope you have better luck, but I'll never own another one.

Very very surprised to hear that, both because of the broken bolts and because Brooks have a good reputation for responding to complaints. Bad luck.

OP, I have both a Swift with Ti rails on a road bike and a B17 on my tourer. I'm lucky with Brooks, both saddles were pretty much OK from the outset and now, broken in, are superbly comfortable. it's true, they don't work for everyone, but give yours time. I reckon 500 miles is a bare minimum to break one in*, and the lighter you are the longer it'll take.

*(Unless you soak them, impregnate them with neatsfoot oil etc. Some do that and say it works, but I doubt you'd be able to return it to the shop afterwards...)

Do you have pictures of this damaged bolt? Could be a design problem or bad alloy.

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t184/GeorgeM-photo/HPIM0621.jpg

How do you like the Arione?

Love It.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/MiniPump.jpg

Love It.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/MiniPump.jpg

I thought you only had the Felt. Looks good:thumb:

I talked to Wallingford, when the first bolt broke and he says that Brooks doesn't answer his calls or e-mails either. So I really didn't expect to hear from them, but wanted to try anyhow to see if things changed. They didn't.

600 miles on a 10 day camping tour in May this year.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/Birth%20Place%20of%20Texas%20Ride/BirthPlaceofTexasRideApril2010001.jpg

I got my Brooks here: http://www.totalcycling.com/index.php/product/SD_BROOKS_B17_STD.html?action=currency&id=USD

Not sure what the return policy is but for under $70 thats a nice saddle and seems like a similar price to other quality non-leather saddles. They are popular as well. IF you don't like it you can sell it easily for close to what you bought it for on CR or the BF touring marketplace.

Here is another site for $65: http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/product.asp?pf_id=2867&src=froogleUS&currency=USD

These prices just do not seem all that high to me so I am not sure what the problem is. If you do not like your current saddle you are going to have to spend at least that amount to get something decent.

Just checking www.wiggle.co.uk

They have an excellent return policy and very good customer service, from personal experience and from other posters. The price is $72.

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t184/GeorgeM-photo/HPIM0621.jpg


Thanks for the picture! The run-of-the-mill 5/16" bolt on my Flyer shows no obvious external defect. It appears from your picture that the bolt snapped at the threaded section, about 1" from the head.

The torque preload on my Flyer is less than 2 ft-lb. That's way below the rated capability of any 5/16" steel bolt. Suspect there's a material issue.

Thanks for the picture! The run-of-the-mill 5/16" bolt on my Flyer shows no obvious external defect. It appears from your picture that the bolt snapped at the threaded section, about 1" from the head.

The torque preload on my Flyer is less than 2 ft-lb. That's way below the rated capability of any 5/16" steel bolt. Suspect there's a material issue.

I thought that myself,but then it happened on my next Brooks as well. That's when I wrote to Brooks, but Like I said they don't reply to anything. When I talked to Bill at Wallingford, he told me that's the way it is. Good PR huh.

ps, what I think they have to do is put a #8 case harden bolt in there.

That bolt should be stronger that the three rivets at the horn. The leather will rip before the bolt snap. There has to be a material issue with those bolts...cheap Chinese sweat shop alloy? On the plus side, I could always purchase a better bolt, and turn it on the lathe to fit the Brooks.

That bolt should be stronger that the three rivets at the horn. The leather will rip before the bolt snap. There has to be a material issue with those bolts...cheap Chinese sweat shop alloy? On the plus side, I could always purchase a better bolt, and turn it on the lathe to fit the Brooks.

That's what I was going to do. Screw the bolt and leave the head facing the rear with 3 locking nuts. I was thinking about putting one nut at the cup up front and one in front and back of the little saddle that's suppose to be a guide and lock it in.
I'm waiting to see what Chain Reaction comes up with. It really a shame that Brooks doesn't stand behind there products. For the money that they make on a saddle, you would think I would hear something.
I can ride on the Aliante for up to 4 hours with no issues. Oh well live and learn. I know a lot of people like there Brooks, but having this happen every year is a pain in the butt, literally.

Yeah...reversing a high-grade bolt will also work if you don't have access to a lathe...one nut at the horn (use Loctite or equivalent to secure nut to bolt), and the other nut at the tensioning bracket to stretch the leather.

George, sorry to hear about your saddles, but everyone reading should know that this is the exception, rather than the rule. Been riding brooks for 10 years plus now (2x team pro,3xb171xchampion flyer, 1xb66, and the cool sprung mtb saddles witht eh Judy-yellow springs) and never had a problem. I imagine if we did a BF poll, you would be the only poster amongst hundreds here to have that problem... So, again, I understand your frustration, but readers should take it with a grain of salt...

PS: OP, look for a used b17, I see them on CL pretty regularly for ~50 bucks. I bought a Used B17 special in green for 25... something might pop up before wallingford gets their stock in.

Love It.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/10wheels/MiniPump.jpg

Nice! I have a bike almost exactly like that one, except for the saddle and various other accouterments. What front rack are you using?

Regarding saddles, I have the Selle An-Atomica (like a Brooks Imperial with the cut-out) on the Cannondale and I absolutely love it. Actually I have two of them, one on another bike. I am not 100% sure what Selle An-Atomica's return policy is, but there is no way I would return that saddle. I did not like the Fizik Rondine that came with the Cannondale when I had it on that bike, but actually I really like the Rondine on some other bikes, I had it on a Jamis Sputnik fixed for a while, and now have it on an old Fuji Saratoga touring bike that I'm using as my everyday commuter. Feels great.

I tried a Brooks Swift once, it only had a couple of hundred miles on it at most, and I rode it for about twenty miles before I decided I could not stand it. IMO, buy from a place with a good return policy, unless you can get it so cheaply that you can sell it for close to what you paid (or more!)

OP, look for a used b17, I see them on CL pretty regularly for ~50 bucks. I bought a Used B17 special in green for 25... something might pop up before wallingford gets their stock in.

I agree, go for used unless you're really certain. Also, it's a bonus if the saddle is already broken in. I know it will be broken in to someone else's rear, but that's better than it not being broken in at all.

(What front rack are you using)

The rack came with the bike.
Was told it came from Adventure Cycling $40.00

I could never comfortable after around 80 miles. B17 special and a B17 Champion Flyer. Sold both and got Selle Anatomica's and love them. I like the shape on the rear of the saddle over the B17's, they just fit my sit bones better.

I wouldn't worry to much about not liking them or return policy although it is nice. A good used Brooks should sell on eBay for close to what you paid for it... at least mine did.

I picked up the b17 special from wiggle.co.uk for ~$70. If you sign up for their newsletter, you get a 5 pound voucher (~$7.50 coupon). And they have free shipping to the states for orders over ~$70

(What front rack are you using)

The rack came with the bike.
Was told it came from Adventure Cycling $40.00

Oof, mine didn't come with a front rack. Thanks, I'll have to check the one out from Adventure, though it looks like it's around $90, rather than $40.

I picked up the b17 special from wiggle.co.uk for ~$70. If you sign up for their newsletter, you get a 5 pound voucher (~$7.50 coupon). And they have free shipping to the states for orders over ~$70

Is there a special code for free shipping to the US? I added more than $70 to the cart but still see a shipping charge.

BTW, currency exchange rate has bumped B17 north of $75.

TIA

There is a drop down thingy on the far right of the screen where can select your currency and country for shipping.

There is a drop down thingy on the far right of the screen where can select your currency and country for shipping.

Thanks.

I have been buying Ortlieb dry bags from wiggle, and mine was free for orders over $79. Good prices too!

I've had a B17 and a Swift and they both got broken tension bolts. The B17 last year and the Swift this year. They had about 2500 miles on them. I wrote to Brooks and I never received an answer. Hope you have better luck, but I'll never own another one.

Did you send email? Brooks has a contact page (Getting in Touch) on their web site http://www.brooksengland.com/en/Contacts_GettingInTouch.aspx with sections on Warrentee, repairs, spare parts, etc. I have not used it but it looks like they are trying to offer customer support.

If you still have them they should be under warrentee. Or if you want to get rid of them I would take them and so would others.

Did you send email? Brooks has a contact page (Getting in Touch) on their web site http://www.brooksengland.com/en/Contacts_GettingInTouch.aspx with sections on Warrentee, repairs, spare parts, etc. I have not used it but it looks like they are trying to offer customer support.

If you still have them they should be under warrentee. Or if you want to get rid of them I would take them and so would others.

I wrote to both of those e-mail addresses and no reply. Thanks anyhow.

I wrote to both of those e-mail addresses and no reply. Thanks anyhow.

As it happens, Brooks were on Annual Holiday from close of business on 4th. June, until 21st. June. I understand that George's email was sent on 5th.June.
You'll appreciate that a large number of emails were received whilst the factory was closed, and George's was not responded to (by Dave Lowe) until the 23rd. (if you've 'lost' his reply, George, I'll forward a copy).
Knowing Bill Laine as well as I do, I think it unlikely that he'd have said that Brooks never respond to him - if he did, then I'm sure he's not telling the truth!
Brooks' response to George, I thought, was very generous, and it's clear that they were not aware of the previous history in this matter: George's previous 'problem', with his B.17 saddle (not 'last year', but late 2008 - if that matters), was well aired in Bike Forums at the time (and elsewhere, probably?) and it seemed perfectly clear to me at the time that the tension bolt on that saddle broke because the tension on the saddle was far too slack - maybe compounded by poor riding position and 'weight issues'? The recently posted picture of the current failure (Swift?) indicates to me that the same curcumstances probably apply - certainly as far as slack tension is concerned.

PS: OP, look for a used b17, I see them on CL pretty regularly for ~50 bucks. I bought a Used B17 special in green for 25... something might pop up before wallingford gets their stock in.
Flies in the face of what the OP wants.... a good return policy as insurance. I'm like others, Brooks doesn't work for me. I'd want a good return policy too.

I guess I'm in the 10 Wheels camp, find the Arione works perfectly and the Brooks is an ass hatchet. .

As it happens, Brooks were on Annual Holiday from close of business on 4th. June, until 21st. June. I understand that George's email was sent on 5th.June.
You'll appreciate that a large number of emails were received whilst the factory was closed, and George's was not responded to (by Dave Lowe) until the 23rd. (if you've 'lost' his reply, George, I'll forward a copy).
Knowing Bill Laine as well as I do, I think it unlikely that he'd have said that Brooks never respond to him - if he did, then I'm sure he's not telling the truth!
Brooks' response to George, I thought, was very generous, and it's clear that they were not aware of the previous history in this matter: George's previous 'problem', with his B.17 saddle (not 'last year', but late 2008 - if that matters), was well aired in Bike Forums at the time (and elsewhere, probably?) and it seemed perfectly clear to me at the time that the tension bolt on that saddle broke because the tension on the saddle was far too slack - maybe compounded by poor riding position and 'weight issues'? The recently posted picture of the current failure (Swift?) indicates to me that the same curcumstances probably apply - certainly as far as slack tension is concerned.

Here's the e-mail I received from Tony,Testing, testing, 1234.....(you fill in the rest).

Thanks for the reply Tony. I did get a e-mail form you and all it said was testing 1234. I would like you to forward the message, because I didn't receive it. At the time I posted the picture of the B17 it still didn't have much of a sag if any in it at all.If I do have a bad riding position and a weight problem at 190 pounds, I guess I should look elsewhere, for a different saddle. I have about 3500 miles on a Aliante and I don't have any issues at all. Also I asked Bill if anybody else was having this problem and he said yes. He did not know why. He told me to contact Brooks and I did then, as I did now and did not get a reply.

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t184/GeorgeM-photo/HPIM0874.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t184/GeorgeM-photo/HPIM0616.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t184/GeorgeM-photo/HPIM0621.jpg

These pictures were taken JUST before the the bolt broke and they really looked abused:rolleyes:

You may not get the lowest price on the planet but Amazon has a good return policy.

for what it is worth, I finally decided to get a Brooks saddle about a month ago, looked at them in stores, had some conflicting information from diff store employees of diff stores. As my sister lives in the UK, and I call her often at very cheap long distance costs, I decided to call the Brooks Saddle company directly. Explained I was calling from Canada, was passed to someone who answered all my questions and concerns about models vs my riding style, all very polite and informative, had a nice chat in fact.

Have been very happy with this saddle, B17 is shaped very similiarly to the old gel saddle that I have done lots of month long fully loaded tours sitting on--and so had some confidence in its overall shape for me. I was pleasantly surprised that after only about 150km (1 hour rides of 20-25 km for the first 6-7 hours) the saddle became much more comfortable--I should mention, was always quite comfortable from the get go, only after an hour it would give me sore sitbones. It is now the most comfortable saddle I have ridden on, in hot humid weather it is very enjoyable.

all in all, I wanted to relate my first hand experience with Brooks, yes, admittedly not a complaint about a problem, but good PR nonetheless and frankly, just plain helpful and nice. The previous comment of hundreds of other postings with positive experiences should be taken into account. One would wonder what are the factors with this fellows bolts, as it is unlikely that two diff saddles would have the same defect.

ps, a friend of mine borrowing my wifes bike once managed to snap the bolt holding a regular seat onto a seatpost once, the allen keyed one that faces up to the sky--I am certain that this happened because he is a lot heavier than my wife , and that this bolt had been getting loose and his weight and the rocking back and forth, and/or power in pedalling hard while probably not downshifting often enough, put too much rocking motion on this bolt, which then ended up breaking. Loose things always get more torque/force on them than something properly snug--sounds like this could have been very well the case with these saddles.