Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - Easier climbing in drops? Or my imagination?

I've had my fixed gear for few weeks now. I commute to work on it a couple times a week, alternating with my road bike, (around 13 miles one way). I'm enjoying it a lot.

One thing I noticed, is it 'seems' like climbing hills is easier when i'm down in the drops, (track drops, same height as top of tire). I'm trying to figure out if it's just me thinking about it too much, or if it's normal/common.

edit: I should also note the head tube on my bike isn't very tall, it's a small bike, so the saddle/bar drop isn't as extreme as it might seem from the text above.

I've lowered the bars by one spacer since this pic was taken
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bhop73/4722669637/in/set-72157612225719186/

If you think that's awesome, try it with brake hoods.

http://www.bicycle.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/corvos_schleck_liege.jpg

You are probably feeling great because your base position (in track drops even with the tire) is so bad for street riding. The incline of the road actually brings you to an upright position.

Hoods are the best for climbing :thumb: But I use bullhorns. Just as good imo.

If you think that's awesome, try it with brake hoods.

...

You are probably feeling great because your base position (in track drops even with the tire) is so bad for street riding. The incline of the road actually brings you to an upright position.

Well, on my Aurora, I do climb on the hoods. On my fixie, i'm riding on the top of the bar for most of the commute, so i'm in more of an upright position when cruising. The drops are low, so I don't cruise in them, but one day I tried dropping down to climb a big hill and it seemed easier...

edit: now that I think about it.. maybe it's the lack of hoods on the track bar that makes the nearly horizontal drops feel easier..

anyways, being new to riding with one gear and these types of bars, I was just curious about it. My other bike has such a different feel.

Hoods are the best for climbing :thumb: But I use bullhorns. Just as good imo.
+1

Yea hoods work but I personally prefer drops for a more aggressive position. Up hill with chopped risers on fixed donesnt feel normal at all for me at all.

I find climbing in the drops on a fix gear is easier because fixed geared climbing is more power based. You use your lower back muscles more in the drops. On a geared bike you can drop to a lower gear and spin your way up. When spinning at higher revs for longer periods of time it is easier to stretch out and hold the hoods of your brake levers.

Hoods are the best for climbing :thumb: But I use bullhorns. Just as good imo.


+1

Plus two.

Yea, I think I get you. I always climb in the drops. It is better. But, my setup is much more normal than yours. You could fit a small, 3rd world country between the bottom of my drops and my tire. There is no way, regardless of body makeup, experience or fitness having drops that ridiculously low is appropriate for the road. Actually, same goes for track drops on a street bike. No way it's appropriate. Sad.

The general thinking is that going in the drops gives you an aero benefit (which is basically meaningless on a climb) at the expense of being able to take deeper breaths (which is critically important when climbing). But as has been noted here, the higher gear ratio and the opportunity to engage your low back in the climbing action might mean that the story is different for fixed gears.

But I kinda doubt it.

For me, nothing makes as big a difference when climbing as state of mind. If you feel like joe racer in the drops, you very well might climb better.

Just do whatever is most fun and enjoy it. :)

Just do whatever is most fun and enjoy it. :)

Sounds good to me.

If you like the drops then good for you. There are discussion about this on the road cycling forum, it's just preference

edit: I should also note the head tube on my bike isn't very tall, it's a small bike, so the saddle/bar drop isn't as extreme as it might seem from the text above.

i dont think its "easier" but i climb in my drops most of the time.(i find it comfortable) this includes while standing and on my road bike with hoods.

saddle to bar drop:
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk177/thirdgenbird/yokota%20build/DSC00910.jpghttp://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk177/thirdgenbird/fixed/img1268599038581.jpg

The general thinking is that going in the drops gives you an aero benefit (which is basically meaningless on a climb) at the expense of being able to take deeper breaths (which is critically important when climbing). But as has been noted here, the higher gear ratio and the opportunity to engage your low back in the climbing action might mean that the story is different for fixed gears.

But I kinda doubt it.

For me, nothing makes as big a difference when climbing as state of mind. If you feel like joe racer in the drops, you very well might climb better.

Just do whatever is most fun and enjoy it. :)

Being in the drops absolutely does not come at the expense of taking deeper breaths. I mean, think about that for a second. So, every track rider in the history of track cycling has ridden in a position that "costs them". Road pros live in their drops. Apparently, this is clearly at the expense of performance. Being in the drops on climbs has nothing to do with being fixed. No change. Frame of mind matters with everything. Going to the toilet in the correct frame of mind is a good thing. Basically, the post is utter balderdash

I climb in the drops, but only when I'm STANDING and mashing up a hill. If I'm going up a smooth, steady ascent, I will typically stay seated and just ride the tops of my bars.

This goes for road and fixed riding.

I tend to rotate through the positions on rides with longer, more laborious climbs. Hands on the hoods is the default position, concentrating on the full circle. I'll sit up with my hands on the flats and concentrate on the kick through the top of the circle, or get down in the drops and focus on kneeing myself in the chest.
I generally won't bother standing up on anything longer than a quarter mile, unless the grade gets really severe.

All the positions use different muscles in different capacities, and so it helps to distribute the load.

If you find climbing in the drops easier, it may just be because you're using a muscle group that has been resting more during the other parts of your ride, and so it has the most in the tank to get you up the hill.

On my fixie, i'm riding on the top of the bar for most of the commute, so i'm in more of an upright position when cruising. The drops are low, so I don't cruise in them, but one day I tried dropping down to climb a big hill and it seemed easier...

If you're comparing the tops of track bars to the drops then yes, it is not just your imagination. You get more leverage from the drops, since they are further from the center-line of the bike than the tops, which are pretty narrow on track drops.

I've tried drops on both my fixed rigs. I still find, for me, that bullhorns work better for climbing. I like to grab the bull by the horns, pun intended, when I hit a hill. But kinda sucks, when I'm riding really long rides I wish I had my drops back....

Would it be Moronic to put long aero bars on a fixed fear with bullhorns? I've really contemplated it but I've never seen it before...

Regardless. It's good to rode what you feel comfortable with. Now if we can figure out which bars are better for steep Downhills then I'm set.

Socks

Being in the drops absolutely does not come at the expense of taking deeper breaths. I mean, think about that for a second. So, every track rider in the history of track cycling has ridden in a position that "costs them". Road pros live in their drops. Apparently, this is clearly at the expense of performance. Being in the drops on climbs has nothing to do with being fixed. No change. Frame of mind matters with everything. Going to the toilet in the correct frame of mind is a good thing. Basically, the post is utter balderdash

News flash, guys - according to oldfixguy you're doing it wrong:

http://cdn.media.cyclingnews.com/2009/07/22/2/bettiniphoto_0041636_1_full_600.jpg

I'm inclined to believe that people still ride in drops because the greater aerodynamic advantage outweighs the loss of maximum lung capacity.

I'm inclined to believe that people still ride in drops because the greater aerodynamic advantage outweighs the loss of maximum lung capacity.

Aero benefit only kicks in at like 30MPH and above...which is why these guys climb in the least aero position possible at 5-20mph. Wind resistance increases exponentially with speed and vice-versa with lack therof when climbing.

http://cdn.media.cyclingnews.com/2009/07/22/2/bettiniphoto_0041636_1_full_600.jpg

its really nice to be comfortable in the drops. i spend much more time there than i did in the past.

Would it be Moronic to put long aero bars on a fixed fear with bullhorns? I've really contemplated it but I've never seen it before...
Socks
That's how I have mine setup, the reason I built myself a fixed gear was to train for triathlons. The constant spinning has taken my training to the next level. Since I'm training for tris I put some clip on aero bars on my fixed so I could work on m positioning while spinning. Its definitely fun to train with, but I only ever drop into them when I have very long stretches of country roads. Even with wide open spaces I feel that these are very dangerous. Its hard to switch in and out of their positioning while spinning and luckily Ive never had to do it in a bad situation(i.e. stopping suddenly for a car or what not). Anywho it can be done and it is excellent to train with, but it is very dangerous imo.

That's how I have mine setup, the reason I built myself a fixed gear was to train for triathlons. The constant spinning has taken my training to the next level. Since I'm training for tris I put some clip on aero bars on my fixed so I could work on m positioning while spinning. Its definitely fun to train with, but I only ever drop into them when I have very long stretches of country roads. Even with wide open spaces I feel that these are very dangerous. Its hard to switch in and out of their positioning while spinning and luckily Ive never had to do it in a bad situation(i.e. stopping suddenly for a car or what not). Anywho it can be done and it is excellent to train with, but it is very dangerous imo.

Like this, maybe?

Would it be Moronic to put long aero bars on a fixed fear with bullhorns? I've really contemplated it but I've never seen it before...
I gave it very serious consideration in order to have another position on longer rides - in particular to take weight off of the wrists and hands. I held off because I couldn't bear to spend the bucks on nice ones OR to put something cheap and/or heavy on my pretty bike.

Next year I'm planning to do an 8-day, 750km ride on my Sputnik so I think I will probably add the aero bars for that trip.

Anywho it can be done and it is excellent to train with, but it is very dangerous imo.
What would make it more dangerous on a FG bike than on a road or TT bike?

What would make it more dangerous on a FG bike than on a road or TT bike?

TT bars give you less control of the bike and he said it is difficult for him to get out of TT position while pedaling

Would it be Moronic to put long aero bars on a fixed fear with bullhorns? I've really contemplated it but I've never seen it before..Socks

Not in the least. I use them. While I'm not taking shots, I believe you do not see this more often because most folks don't use their fixed for longer rides. While there are some that would consider a 100k round trip a warm-up, I ride 100k (round trip) every Sunday to my Mother-In-Law's for dinner. She lives in the mountains so I climb up and glide back. The bolt-on aero-bar helps. I get in the drops when grunt time comes but the aero-bar is great for undulating terrain. The only drawback is that it's not really possible to have the saddle in a position where both riding on the drop bar and in the aero-bar is truly comfortable. Get one of the bars with retractable (snap-up) supports. You'll love it.

Depending on how far in you have bar tape wrapped you might have to redo that. Also, if your cockpit is busy with a cycling computer, light, ashtray, etc. you'll need to make some changes to that. But, grain of salt.

Syscrush,
Oh, I forgot. This is FG forum. Everyone lives with 3 hour long, 14 degree climbs to get both to and from their house. My bad. You're right. road drops are restrictive breath takers that certainly do not allow you to properly stand and grunt out that last 75 minutes to your house on top of the Dolomites. I do it wrong for sure. Hell, I don't even have brake hoods. I'm such a Fred.

aerobars that high are funny.

aerobars that high are funny.

oh you don't even know

syscrush,

I want to expand on my reply a bit. The initial response I wrote was directed at your statement that being in the drops results in inability to take a full, expansive breath (my words). This simply is not true. I never stated that climbing on hoods was somehow an inappropriate thing or implied that it was not very efficient. In my case, the drops are the place I grunt because I do not have hoods. I could put them on and that would be good if I felt the need. I seem to do well in the drops. On and on. My position on the matter is simple - being in the drops does not in anyway prevent or inhibit a full, efficient and expansive breath. If it does then either you have a physical anomaly creating the situation or bike setup is wrong for your physique. I guess it's now time for another snapshot of pro riders climbing some near impossible grade while in the performance of their paid job.

oh you don't even know

continue.

Did someone say aerobars?

I used mine today:
http://web18.twitpic.com/img/130702626-706efcdff8bf7c7ef8935472d03bd242.4c412ac0-full.jpg

syscrush,

I want to expand on my reply a bit. The initial response I wrote was directed at your statement that being in the drops results in inability to take a full, expansive breath (my words). This simply is not true. I never stated that climbing on hoods was somehow an inappropriate thing or implied that it was not very efficient. In my case, the drops are the place I grunt because I do not have hoods. I could put them on and that would be good if I felt the need. I seem to do well in the drops. On and on. My position on the matter is simple - being in the drops does not in anyway prevent or inhibit a full, efficient and expansive breath. If it does then either you have a physical anomaly creating the situation or bike setup is wrong for your physique. I guess it's now time for another snapshot of pro riders climbing some near impossible grade while in the performance of their paid job.
I never tried to say that I was authoritatively right - I said that the most common thinking on the mater is blah blah blah...

What I see when I watch racing suggests that the "common wisdom" you read in books about cycling about being in the drops vs. on the hoods seems correct, but every body is different, and state of mind counts for SO MUCH, and when we're a bunch of amateur dilletantes, one person's "epic climb" is another's "light incline", so it's hard to compare one person's experience to another's... So you should prolly just do what feels good for you.

But do post those pics of pros climbing in the drops, they will look awesome. :)

Not too many people make it a habit to climb from the drops although this guy named Pantani did very well climbing from this position...

Sixty-Fiver stole my thunder. :cry:

Did someone say aerobars?

I used mine today:
http://web18.twitpic.com/img/130702626-706efcdff8bf7c7ef8935472d03bd242.4c412ac0-full.jpg

Apparently hotlinking to twitpic doesn't work.

http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=160138&d=1279347226

For your viewing um, pleasure

http://i457.photobucket.com/albums/qq299/bleedthrough20/193138265401_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

Note in that picture that Pantani seems to have a shallower drop and slightly higher bar position... this favoured his climbing style and technique and when he broke away on a climb he'd leave the peloton like they were parked.

He was also a very small guy and doped to the nuts... but so was everyone else.

Sixty Fiver,

I never seen the man in person but I think I have shoes that weigh as much as he does. The dope thing is so very sad to me. Incredibly dedicated, talented, blessed athletes and they reduce themselves to being common cheats.

Sixty Fiver,

I never seen the man in person but I think I have shoes that weigh as much as he does. The dope thing is so very sad to me. Incredibly dedicated, talented, blessed athletes and they reduce themselves to being common cheats.

It is part and parcel of the sport... for as gifted as one may be when everyone is on the juice all the talent in the world won't be enough to keep you up front.

Just another note... Pantani had a bike specially made for him by Bianchi with a longer steerer tube to raise his handlebars.

Until I fragged my back I was one of those people who would climb from the drops and used a similar bar set up and was considered to be a hell of a climber.

It's my understanding that some have to do it to keep up.

For example:

If rider A is the best clean athlete (with regards to strength and recovery).
Rider B is the next best guy. With some sort of doping, Rider B is now able to beat Rider A.
Rider A now must dope to reclaim his status.

Keep in mind that a many of these guys have nothing to lose. If they aren't racing bikes, they'd be "digging ditches". In the US, cycling is a "rich guy" sport where folks are sort of well-off already. I don't that that's the case in Europe.

Carelton,

That sounds right. I don't care. No points given. They choose to be dishonest. Professional integrity matters in every walk. I want to be proud to be a cyclist and point to our icons and say to my children "that is what you can do if you really want to and are willing to work." People who cheat are losers. Plain and simple. They are not to be admired in the least and there should be no excuses made for them. I hope that one day soon that we as the consumers of these sporting activities choose to turn our backs on any and all professional events until the situation is completely cleared up.

Only 2 pages to turn into a doping discussion.

How many pages to turn into a discussion of running aero wheels on an aero frame with a non-aero post?

And how long after THAT before it becomes a discussion about how a bunch of SSFG tarktards have no right to accuse a real racer of riding a tark bike?

:)

C, I f'n love your bike!

http://wine-scamp.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/helenlovejoy.jpg

I think I'm at the stage I'm willing to be as faux-offensive, nit-picky and pretend-angry as I need to be to prevent another thread reaching the top about how to upgrade another $250 new bike as I need to be. I absolutely enjoy this forum but my stomach cannot handle another one of those right now. I'll fight about anything. I'll argue over the necessity of sunlight, potable water, Playboy magazine - you name it.

Sunlight... over rated.

At least when I want to go out and test my new old lights.

:)

That... and I am having a Cheezie craving.

shallow drop rocks.