Fifty Plus (50+) - gettin cranky

ok, I'm gettin old, I admit it. I'm 61, been biking in Washington, DC since 1974. Seen a lot of changes since then, some great, some good, some, well, not so much.

Heat advisory here, but went out for about 4 hours on Saturday on my folder and it wasn't so bad, little warm (103), but I kept moving and it was fun. So yesterday I figured I'll take the Trek Soho to Herndon from NW DC. Gonna be cooler (99). Got up early and headed out. Roughly a 45 mile round trip.

Guess it was somewhere between 8 and 8:30 when I hit Vienna and started noticing more people out, probably trying to beat the heat.
Between Vienna and Herndon and a few "real" bikers started passing me. I'm used to it; years of basketball and tennis have done their job on my knees so I'm steady but ain't settin no records. However this was different. These people were buzzing me. These people were haulin past me literally inches away from me. And all of them would wait til they were next to me to give that muffled "on your left" they call a warning.

I was startled more than once. Then it hit me - they have a whole lane to pass me in. There's nobody out here! What the hail! Why were they passing so close?

Closing in on Herndon and a guy buzzed me while yelling "move over", followed by 3 of his friends.

Move over? Ok, you fly up on me and give no warning and I'm supposed to leap a foot to my right so you won't have to be bothered with going into that big empty lane over there? Sorry pumpkin, that is not gonna happen.

For all you wannabe's out there trying real hard to set some kinda personal record, remember this; Your pace means nothing to me. Nothing at all. And I'm sure not going to change my line and break my pace so you can maintain yours. Ever.

Some changes... not so much.

I share your disdain for the 'hotrod' type rider that can not be bothered to move over to pass you. Just be glad they are not driving pickups with wide mirrors!

I'm not sure (with the exception of a few) any one that posts here could do this. I don't think any of us would.

Nothing wrong with getting cranky once in a bit. We all need to vent. I have noticed that today's young riders, in their "full kits", just don't have the same level of respect
that most of use had when we were young and on our "ten speeds" back in the 70's. I've had a few "On yer left!!!" types this season, do the very same thing yours did:
blast up behind me, yell "on yer left", then pass with inches to spare.

If this helps: We have had a lot of hot, humid days this season. Here in Boston, we are having a break from the humidity, but it's on tap to return on Wednesday. Thus, I've been doing most of my riding
in the evening. Evening rides are great. You get the pleasure of riding in the hot weather, and you don't have to worry about sun screen. You do need bug repellent though.....

I'm not sure (with the exception of a few) any one that posts here could do this. I don't think any of us would.

Well, I could never catch you for starters....

Well, I could never catch you for starters....

You never know until we share the road. This is the internet. I could be a really cute but lonely and misunderstood 14 YO girl looking for a father figure.

You never know until we share the road. This is the internet. I could be a really cute but lonely and misunderstood 14 YO girl looking for a father figure.


So you were the girl on the trail for our first annual 50+ forum ride in Glenwood Springs last year!! Well, I never . . . .

DF: If you have kids, then you can't get away with that "Well I never...".:roflmao2:

A friend and I were passed fairly closely by a couple of cyclists on TT bikes about three weeks ago. My friend could have and wanted to catch up with them and pass them, but he bit the bullet and stayed with me. Anyway, when the two fit young females passed us, one of them looked over and said, "Hi guys", and I thoroughly loved it!!!!!!

So I guess a nudge with your foot was out of the question Huh? LOL Seriously because they ride doesn't make them nice people. It takes all kinds.

You could always try the Mark Cavendish head butt routine. ;)

You could always try the Mark Cavendish head butt routine. ;)

You mean Renshaw, right?

You mean Renshaw, right?

Yes, jet lag has not yet abated.

I have noticed more (but not all) of the fast paceline riders on organized rides lately being less likely to announce their approach or give sufficient clearance when overtaking slower riders. I guess they are so caught up in an exaggerated sense of the importance of what they are doing that they don't realize what jerks they are being.
I sometimes loudly call "on my left" as they pass. Other times a well-placed loogie or snot rocket helps get the message across.

Seriously because they ride doesn't make them nice people. It takes all kinds.
Alert: set rant shields on high.

I just figured this out. Some of you fellers are dry drunks.

Our Saturday morning ride attracts around 50-75 riders so parking spots can be at a premium. I got to the parking lot early and wanted to park next to another guy with my energy efficient sustainable sub-compact in order to make it easier for latecomers to find a decent space. I was in no hurry and was content to listen to the Velocast as I waited for the gentleman to do nothing more than take three steps to the side so I could pull my car in.

The guy went into a rage that would have been appropriate had I run over his dog and then put the car into reverse to make sure I had finished the job, as he sputtered "There are 20 Godd@mn parking spots in this lot and you have to be a d!ck about parking here!" Gently delivered words to assure the guy that I wasn't impatient, that I was simply trying to be considerate to others only enraged him more. I was afraid he was going to get violent.

Now this fellow may think he's sustainable, environmentally conscious, friend of the Earth but the truth is he was only a dry drunk jerk.

And I think a lot of cyclists fall into this category.

So I guess a nudge with your foot was out of the question Huh? LOL Seriously because they ride doesn't make them nice people. It takes all kinds.

+1

And it could have been worse. Wait until someone passes you on your right doing the same thing.

Other times a well-placed loogie or snot rocket helps get the message across.

Hey Dawg, I have VERY active sinuses ! Sometimes a guy just has to let one fly! Ha! Courtesy CAN be taught! It just ain't pretty!

I sometimes loudly call "on my left" as they pass. Other times a well-placed loogie or snot rocket helps get the message across.

Yeah, I'm not shy. I mockingly say "on your left" all the time.
I don't ride out on the W&OD much so maybe it's their way but it don't settle well. The problem I have is that I'm deaf in my left ear so an early warning is pretty much the only way I can really hear them. Yes, I use a mirror for that very reason but if you're enjoying the day it can get forgotten. Especially when it's almost 90 by 8 am and there's few people venturing out.
When they're muttering "oyeweft" as I'm looking them in the eye, well, kinda defeats the purpose.

Good points discussed.

I'll admit to being one of those who might pass other riders closer than folks are comfortable with from time to time. However I'm not one of those who might shout "move over". I try and use good judgement when passing. If there is room to safely move over several bike widths and even into an oncoming lane I try to do so. Oncoming traffic, road conditions or sight lines might dictate how far over I can move. I've also startled some riders announcing when coming upon them to the point they instinctly jerk their bikes to one side or the other so I try and judge if that's going to be a problem. I'd hate to cause an issue with them unnecessarily. I'm comfortable with other riders passing me, even very closely but then again I'm comfortable riding in larger groups-rubbing shoulders, elbows, etc. I intentionally avoid cutting back in very quickly after passing as well. The main thing I try to do is pass safely-both for the other rider and myself.

We had a really bad situation similar to what the OP described a couple weekends ago on a large organized ride. There were 800 riders total and I was in the lead group of about 30. We missed a turn at about 20 miles into the ride, and went 12 miles off the route before coming back to the turn and getting back on the route. By that time there were hundreds of riders on the route in front of us. To make it worse we were on 2 lane rural roads that were pretty rough and narrow but fortunately not heavily traveled-but there was still traffic to contend with. Our group was riding significantly faster than the other riders (23-25mph vs 17-19 mph). Our group went from riding in a "bunch" to pretty much riding single file. We wound up eventually passing all the other riders and I'm sure some might not have been happy when we rode by. I think we did the best we could but at times there was oncoming traffic or other issues where passes might have been tighter than folks would have preferred. I avoided being out front and was riding in the middle of the group so I don't know what kind of communications was going on to alert other riders. I certainly hope the folks out front were pleasant as they came upon other riders-but am willing to guess that our more aggressive riding style probably didn't please everyone.

Was there any thought given by your group to simply riding along with others at 17-19 mph?

@OP: +1 on all counts.

Round here, same nonsense appears to be on the rise, both in the streets and on the MUP. So-called "serious cyclists" (legends in their own minds, doubtless) who ride as if conditions (the riding environment, including other cyclists) should -- indeed, are under a positive obligation to -- morph themselves so as to maximize said "serious cyclists'" convenience. In reality, of course, they are not "serious cyclists" at all, but idiots.

As to the exhortation "move over" you cite, there is really only one possible response -- a two-word phrase which consists of a word which cannot be repeated on this site followed by either "you" or "off" (user preference).

Was there any thought given by your group to simply riding along with others at 17-19 mph?

That definitely took care of itself as the miles went on. By mile 80 it was down to 4........

I can agree with a lot of the observations posted, and I would agree that it makes no sense to be flying along a narrow MUP. I see a lot of this on the Galloping Goose in Victoria, BC during rush hour. Just today I was cruising along at about 32 kmh when this older guy comes flying past, tucked down, hands in the drops, and just hammering. I spun up behind him just to see how fast he was going - 38 kmh. I thought it was a bit fast for the conditions, but I just sucked his wheel for a while. He eventually slowed to about 31 kmh, which is typical. I'm sure he had never been a bike racer, but was probably some insecure old guy with something to prove. I find the old guys are the worst.

But I think it is helpful to examine your own behavior, whether you are a passer or a passee. What I find irritating when I am passing people are guys who speed up when they're about to be passed, so now you are two abreast and racing down the path. Or, two riding abreast and occupying the entire lane. I usually give a piercing whistle when I'm about to pass. This "on your left" is so passe, arrogant, and patronizing. Usually they don't move at all, so I figure this gives me the right to buzz them. But if they do make an effort to give way, then I make sure to give them more than enough room as I pass. When I come upon peds, I usually ring a bell attached to my frame pump. The worst peds to pass are three females walking together and blocking the MUP. These I always buzz, as they tend to be very self-righteous and very much in your face with their right to use the whole width of the MUP, go figure... Peds or cyclists who ride far to the right and allow plenty of room to pass always get plenty of room from me.

The other irritation is guys who ride down the center of the road, especially when they are approaching. I think of space as a matter of respect, so if I think a rider is taking more than their share of roadway, I will purposely try to brush them, or give a slight hook to move them over.

One word of warning: usually, if two riders make contact going in the same direction, it's usually the rider being overtaken who will go down, so don't think you can crash an overtaking rider! But a last-second hook can be very effective, but just be sure he doesn't actually hit you.The hook should make him swerve in the direction of the hook. I've had over 35 years of racing experience, so you may not want to try this stuff at home unless you've had serious pack-riding experience!

Luis

We don't all have the same abilities and priorities when we ride, but there doesn't have to be conflict. The key is cooperation and appreciating the other person's situation. I have been passed by many riders and I have passed many. Sometimes solo, sometimes in groups. Often all of the above on the same ride.

Riders who are being overtaken shouldn't make it difficult for someone to get past them and shouldn't worry about why someone wants to ride faster than they do. Try not to be offended by how the overtaking riders announce their presence, just be glad they did (though yelling "move over" is pretty a-holish). Sometimes it can be hard to use a pleasant and friendly voice when you are riding hard and getting tired.

Riders who are overtaking should make sure the riders they are passing know they are coming and they shouldn't pass unnecessarily closely. A ring of a bell, calling out "on your left", saying "good morning" or just carrying on a conversation are all good ways to announce your approach. Ordering them to get out of your way is not. The front rider of a long train of passing riders is not the only one who needs to warn the riders being overtaken. It isn't easy to judge how many riders are coming by if they don't make some noise. Be safe. :)

Sounds like a mirror is in order, or maybe a better one.

[QUOTE=BluesDawg;11188612The front rider of a long train of passing riders is not the only one who needs to warn the riders being overtaken. It isn't easy to judge how many riders are coming by if they don't make some noise. Be safe. :)[/QUOTE]

I have noticed this when riding my MTB at one of the local single tracks near me. Mostly when going the opposite direction and rider will say" I am one of three" or "two more behind me" as we pass. It is a good habit one that I dd not know but now do. I just say 'I'm solo" and keep on keepin on.

Sounds like a mirror is in order, or maybe a better one.

did ya miss the part about the mirror and hearing? just curious...

I ride the middle and I need to pay attention to those in front of me. I need to yield when necessary to them. I need to make sure they know I'm there. The people behind me? They are not my responsibility. They need to yield to me and others in front of them. There's no gray area here.

Odd how many bikers constantly complain about cars yet can't seem to extend the most basic of courtesies to other bikers. I'd put money on them driving the same way.

did ya miss the part about the mirror and hearing? just curious...

I ride the middle and I need to pay attention to those in front of me. I need to yield when necessary to them. I need to make sure they know I'm there. The people behind me? They are not my responsibility. They need to yield to me and others in front of them. There's no gray area here.

Odd how many bikers constantly complain about cars yet can't seem to extend the most basic of courtesies to other bikers. I'd put money on them driving the same way.

It's interesting that is all boils down to common courtesy-whether it's related to auto's and bikes or bikes and bikes. Heck, if we can't figure out a way to handle bikes and bikes on the roads no wonder there are growing issues with auto's and bikes!!

Interesting thread. When this kind of thing first started happening to me I thought as a newbie I was somehow violating one of cycling's unwritten rules. Then I realized these folks are jerks.

In the past few weeks cycling here at home and down south in Metro Denver I've had a couple incidents that reinforce the self-absorbed nature of some cyclists. The "On your left" when the person is abeam is too common. Now I no longer jump and almost swerve into the person, scaring us both.

Had a person who almost hit me while passing and ringing a bell. At home we don't use bells. At that moment I hadn't a clue what the bell meant until I remembered, later, that Denver uses a bell to warn people he is about. As I passed him a bit later I yelled "On Your Left" when I was about two bike lengths back and again when nearly abeam. Both time he blithely kept going left and into my path. As I passed I saw he had ear buds in and a dreamy look on his face. Whatever he was listening to must have been really good to distract him so much.

But, rather dwell on the foibles of others I'm going to do my best to realize I screw up too. Hopefully from being a fallable human and not because I think the rest of the world sucks. That keeps my blood pressure down and my attitude not too, too cranky.

did ya miss the part about the mirror and hearing? just curious...

Yes I did, my apologies.


The people behind me? They are not my responsibility. They need to yield to me and others in front of them. There's no gray area here.

Since I work urban traffic daily, I need to make everybody in front and behind me my responsibility, that way my chances of getting caught off guard, and being a recipient of a dumb maneuver by others, are low.


Odd how many bikers constantly complain about cars yet can't seem to extend the most basic of courtesies to other bikers. I'd put money on them driving the same way.

I make sure that I give wide berth to other cyclists when passing, not so much on courtesy, but more for allowance of a possible unpredicted movement on their part.

.... Seriously because they ride doesn't make them nice people. It takes all kinds.

Very good point. If told to "move over" by another rider, I think I would tend to respond fairly aggressively verbally. If they are riding that fast they are likely to be skinny and not good fighters! :)

I must live in a cycling paradise or something because people are by-and-large very cooperative around here, with the occasional exception of the three females talking to each other. (Our newspapers are, after all, constantly assuring us that Nebraskans are superior to all others in sportsmanship and politeness!) ;)