Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - What's the problem with threaded headsets?

I'm buying my first singlespeed and on various other Forums people seem to throw ridicule at threaded headsets. I've got my shortlist down to the Specialized Langster Steel and the Bianchi Pista Via Brera (which I'll convert to drop bar)... both with threaded steerers / quill stems.

My view on threaded headsets is that:

a) I like them because quill stems are more traditional, retro and beautiful - ie. Cinelli XE
b) I like them because I think they give you more control over geometry - ie. you can effectively lengthen the steerer tube/raise the bars - impossible if you had a cut steerer... unless you flip the stem :eek:

So why are people so anti? Is it just youthful ignorance? Maybe I'll find a different - more intelligent ;) - view here.

I think the argument is that threadless is more rigid than threaded?

Also, people are elitists and will tell you that what they have is better than what you have regardless if they have any facts to back it up.

There's no problem with them, really. Threadless is just a more modern design. Sure there's plenty of reasons that pro cyclists don't use threaded anymore, but that doesn't mean you can't.

Threaded forks are traditionally weaker because the steerer tube is both smaller and it's integrity is compromised by the threads and the keyway....plus I don't think you can have an aluminum threaded fork if that's your thing

Most people can't keep them tight or get them "perfect". Not the headset's fault. Second, they weigh more. The simplicity of threadless is apparent.

Invent a better mousetrap and the flaws of the old mousetrap become apparent even though you did fine with said mousetrap for 90+years.

There are a lot of small differences, that may not matter much in your specific build.

Threaded forks are weaker, softer,generally are only available in steel, and in limited shapes.

Threaded headsets are heavier, harder to adjust, and require more matainences.

Quil stems are heavier, harder to adjust, dont come in modern materials, limit your bar choices, arent as stiff, and move around more.

Like I said maybe none of the issues matter in your build, but those are all the reasons a threadless system is better.

unless you have a frame that uses a fisher evolution headset. That's a pretty sturdy and stiff interface, as good as 1-1/8 threadless.

What is "modern materials" ?

In before carleton.

Another problem with quill stems is that they must a perfect fit with the steerer tube or they will creak and deflect under load. Then there's the problem of the expander bolt deforming the steerer tube. All in all, there are many technical flaws in the design, which are eliminated with the threadless design. Unfortunately, most threadless stems are bulky looking and ugly as sin.

Wasnt the evolution the first try at 1 1/4" threadless headset, that is now the standard for downhill bikes?

I am not sure how quills are harder to adjust. I think the main advantage of the quill is how easy it is to adjust. With threadless, you have to take it apart, and either flip the stem, move the spacers or get a whole new stem. Then you have to make sure you get everything put back together correctly, using a torque wrench. The main advantage of threadless is it is lighter and easier to change bars with. I am fairly hefty and have never had a problem with the strength or rigidity of quill stems on a road bike.

By modern materials I mean quality aluminium and Ti, and any carbon.

I mistyped when I said quils are harder to adjust, I ment harder to replace. And while track sprinting I have had issues with the softness of a quill stem.

I am not sure how quills are harder to adjust. I think the main advantage of the quill is how easy it is to adjust. With threadless, you have to take it apart, and either flip the stem, move the spacers or get a whole new stem. Then you have to make sure you get everything put back together correctly, using a torque wrench. The main advantage of threadless is it is lighter and easier to change bars with. I am fairly hefty and have never had a problem with the strength or rigidity of quill stems on a road bike.


:) Guess I have been doing it wrong all along.

You might George Hincapie it if you overtighten your stem on your steerer.

I've snapped cheap slider bolts in quill stems. Good luck finding one of those in a pinch. New stem it is.
I've had to hit quill stems with a hammer to get it to release. Adjusting headset preload and wheel alignment is just so dead easy.
I'd be hard pressed to go back to quills.

[You] can do whatever you want.

I like the threadless headset too, anything to make the whole process easier. I took a load of heat for throwing on a pair of track end chain tensioners, but at the end of the day, it made rear wheel alignment and chain tension on a problematic and inexpensive bike a one time shot. No hand required to hold a wheel in place, no slippage while tightening down axle nuts. Anyways, whatever you can find to make the maintenance aspect of a bike easier and quicker, I'm all for. I like being a "diy'er", but only to a certain extent, before turning wrenches can become tediously frustrating when it doesn't go together the first time and every time.

I don't know much but i ****ing hate them i took 3 hours yesterday re greasing it.

Another problem with quill stems is that they must a perfect fit with the steerer tube or they will creak and deflect under load. Then there's the problem of the expander bolt deforming the steerer tube. ......

I guess if that turns out to be the case I'll take it back and let Bianchi/Specialized take care of it.

Damn this thread is making me second guess my frame purchase that's coming with a threaded fork

I don't know much but i ****ing hate them i took 3 hours yesterday re greasing it.

Hmmm, I recently repacked my FSA Orbit threadless HS and Campagnolo threaded HS bearings. Took about the same amount of time for each.

Luckily fewer than 3 hours apiece, however.

threadless is better in every way except one: looks

Damn this thread is making me second guess my frame purchase that's coming with a threaded fork

Some of the best frames in the world have threaded forks. Threaded isn't obsolete. To be honest I am somewhat sketched about threadless stems. I feel that threaded quill stems are more solid.

There isn't a problem with threaded headsets, if your forks need threaded headsets, and most vintage forks do. They do what threadless headsets do, i.e. enable stem to go from forks to handlebars. However, they don't grip quite as well as other solutions, hence mtb's use another solution. Oh and they make it much easier to change things if you want to detatch the handlebars, like changing the handlebars, which of course you don't do that often. Mtb's changes the market, as did carbon later on, so threaded is old, threadless new. If you can find good NOS threaded, then good as anything on a road bike, nice...

By modern materials I mean quality aluminium and Ti, and any carbon.

I mistyped when I said quils are harder to adjust, I ment harder to replace. And while track sprinting I have had issues with the softness of a quill stem.
There are a lot of quill stems made with quality materials. I would bet here are a lot of threadless stems made with medicore materials.

Do quill stems/threaded fork setups really require that much more maintenance than a threadless setup? Does quality of the stem and headset play any role? I want to know cuz I've only been riding threadless.

I've had to hit quill stems with a hammer to get it to release.


I've had to do that. But I've also had to hit threadless forks do get the upper bearing race to let loose. IMO either one is fine as long as it's properly setup. Anything can be setup wrong, leading to a bad failure no matter what design is used.

A modern frame is going to be designed around a 1 1/8" headset. Threaded components, at least the good stuff like your Cinelli stem, are likely to be 1". It's certainly possible to work around that but, if beautiful is part of your objective, you might think that it makes your bike look funny.

Aside from that, I think that it's real easy to make tiny technical differences into unclimbable mountains. More rigid? Stronger? Give me a break.

Some of the best frames in the world have threaded forks. Threaded isn't obsolete. To be honest I am somewhat sketched about threadless stems. I feel that threaded quill stems are more solid.

Can you name one high quality modern bikes that come with a threaded set up?


There are a lot of quill stems made with quality materials. I would bet here are a lot of threadless stems made with medicore materials.
There are lots of mediocre disk brakes too, but to use that as an argument that they have less stopping power than a single pivot is ridiculous(this an extreme example, but fitting).

No problem with either or, just stuck in my ways. All are threaded.

Don't see much incentive to make the change.

It's just easier to change your handle bars/set/fork with threadless. Good enough reason for me, but I do like the height adjustment of quil stems

Can you name one high quality modern bikes that come with a threaded set up?


There are lots of mediocre disk brakes too, but to use that as an argument that they have less stopping power than a single pivot is ridiculous(this an extreme example, but fitting).

By modern do you mean built recently or designed recently?

I think one of the biggest advantages for people of this forum would be the ability to change bars easily with a threadless setup. People who may want track drops on for track racing and then bullhorns or risers on for street riding. I guess you could have two stems and two bars which were always paired up but...

Yes, designed and manufactured recently with performance in mind, not cost or classic aesthetic.

Yes, well someone who is focused on building a performance oriented bike is probably going to have a good idea already of the performance advantages of threadless setups. For almost any purpose besides professional racing, threaded setups are just as good.

Damn this thread is making me second guess my frame purchase that's coming with a threaded fork

If you have one coming, then everything is new, lubed and properly adjusted (hopefully), there shouldn't be any issues. But often times older bikes (recycled from a dumpster dive or purchased) have them and they are rusted and whatever else could be wrong with one.

I remember back in the day as a child riding a 20" bike with grease fittings on the hubs, like they have on automobile steering ball joints. Just hook up the old grease gun and pump the clean stuff in.

http://media.photobucket.com/image/bike%20wheel%20hub%20grease%20fitting/barninestephens/People/Elgin3.jpg

They both have their place... thread less is far more user friendly and quicker to install but there is nothing inherently wrong with a threaded system either.

Overhauling a threaded headset does not take long of you have the tools and know what you are doing... and I have been doing this for a long time.

Yes, well someone who is focused on building a performance oriented bike is probably going to have a good idea already of the performance advantages of threadless setups. For almost any purpose besides professional racing, threaded setups are just as good.

For commuters threaded set ups work fine, which is very different that just as good.

Sixty Fiver said "Overhauling a threaded headset does not take long if you have the tools and know what you are doing... and I have been doing this for a long time."

That's the point. For most people, threadless is much easier to maintain and adjust. I too have this experience, and own many vintage bikes with threaded headsets and quill stems. However, all my modern recently built and purchased bikes use current technology such as threadless headsets and stems.

Overhauling a threaded headset does not take long of you have the tools and know what you are doing

This is where the LBS comes into play, for me at least.

Overhauling a threaded headset does not take long of you have the tools

I guess that's the toughest part - having a 32mm, 36mm, etc. headseat wrench and a big ol' crescent around. Anyone that can adjust hub bearings can adjust headset bearings just as well.

I like threaded headset and quill stems. But i think i prefer threadless. I like to change my bars, and it is just so much easier to do so with a threadless stem.

Also just to point out when I change my handlebars on my threadless bikes I don't go anywhere near the headset. Changing handlebars does not always equal changing the stem.

There are a handful of removable faceplate quill stems out there. I don't recall any of them being all that attractive, however, nullifying a major plus of quill stems.

threadless doesn't look ugly if the tubing of the frame is also oversized.
Threadless stems don't really look too good on 1" steerers or older lugged bikes because it's like sticking the head of a pitbull on a body of a greyhound. The opposite is also true.

For commuters threaded set ups work fine, which is very different that just as good.

A quill stem will hold your handlebars and attach them to your frame. So will a threadless stem. This whole argument is overblown. If you're into the aesthetic of a quill stem and want a nice looking commuter, there is no good reason to shy away from it because of performance or maintenance as both will hold up just fine under the relatively mellow conditions.

threadless is better in every way except one: looks

Bingo!

My Surly has a threadless (obviously). That's a utility bike, I don't much care how it looks.

My upcoming single-speed project is meant to be the "pretty bike". So it's 80s lugged steel, and yes, threaded headset.

There's nothing wrong with either. Build what you want.

I think the question at hand should not be "what is the problem with threaded headsets," but rather "how are threadless systems an improvement."

It just makes structural sense to have the handlebars in a direct connection with the steering tube. It's more rigid, you don't run the risk of damaging your head/steerer tube by over tightening the expander bolt, and it's easier to change out bars etc. Plus I think they look much better on modern bikes.

That being said, all of the bikes I've owned have had threaded headsets, and I've never encountered a problem.

Thanks to everyone for chipping in.

The level of debate - and respect for fellow cyclists and their opposing views - is so much better here than on other Forums I've come across. :thumb:

Thanks to everyone for chipping in.

The level of debate - and respect for fellow cyclists and their opposing views - is so much better here than on other Forums I've come across. :thumb:

actually, I find it unusually civilized in here. It's strange, it's supposed to be ricocheting testosterones off the wall here. Was everyone neutered or something?

Was everyone neutered or something?

No, just you a-hole. :)


J/K.

One little thing that I did was have threaded stem/bar combos that I would swap out instead of just the bars. I ended up with a bunch of extra stems a while back, made it easy to swap without having to remove tape/take off brakes/grips/etc.