"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - Encountering cars on a closed course

I just read about some women that got run down by a SUV at the Phillipsburg Crit (http://www.lehighvalleylive.com/phillipsburg/index.ssf/2010/09/phillipsburg_criterium_riders.html)

which makes me wonder if anyone else has had a vehicle wander onto a closed race course.

My teammate was in that race. Scary.

yeah. cops often don't do their jobs.

case 1. grant's tomb this year, somehow a USPS truck got onto the course. the dumbass driver apparently didn't notice that there were cop cars parked, blocking the road, and that there are cars parked on to roadway. i had to run over & explain to the driver that he needed to back out before something terrible would happen.

case 2. during this year's yale itt, a car got onto a supposedly closed course despite people telling it not to go on the road. i had to swerve & dodge. real effing scary for my first ever race

That happened today at the Tour of Austin. Closed track on private property (Austin State Hospital) and somehow a car ends up on the course. Everyone from riders to spectators to race marshals were yelling at them to get off the road. At first they parked the car but they did it right on a narrow section of the course... Then the driver panicked, obviously didn't check their mirrors and just gunned it and ALMOST ran over a racer! Scary few moments.

I've never been racing while one has been on the course, but I've been at races where it has happened. Too many races.

It's amazing how stupid people can be.

You should assume it'll happen. Even at Harlem Crit, where they have metal or wood police barriers on both sides all the way around the course, a cab got onto the course. Lots of joke of "Taxi! Taxi!". Luckily no one was hurt.

One year in the defunct Danbury Crit in CT, a driver went through or around 3 sets of road blocks (saw horses, detour signs, etc) and past 2 sets of marshals who were yelling and chasing this slow moving vehicle. Went backwards around the course, in a section with 4 hard turns in about 200 meters (i.e. no line of sight) one of the riders plowed into the car, bounced off the hood. Driver was surprisingly not drunk, just old.

rant/
Which, if I may rant for a bit, is kind of scary. A lot of customers where I work are retired and well into their 80s. They have a hard time walking to the counter. They can barely pick up 10 pound things, forget about 20s. One uses a flashlight and puts his extremely thick glasses about 2 inches away from the LCD signing pad - otherwise he can't see what's happening. I read a lot of packages to these customers because they cannot read some of the larger fonts on a package.

Yet, somehow, the government expects these people to be able to, say, brake quickly if a kid runs out in front of them. Or an out of control dump truck comes at them.

I was waiting at a DMV office once, forget what I was doing, maybe getting a new-to-me car registered. A slow car with two elderly ladies pulled into the parking lot, kind of went at a weird angle. Kind of wandered across the main "drive" area until the front wheels went up onto the sidewalk next to the DMV (curb is literally about 5 feet away from wall). I thought for sure the car was going to go right into the wall. The driver turned the wheel, but not quick enough, and hit a sign about "driver's test here" or something. Sign was in concrete block, almost toppled over. Driver slowly backed up, slowly thump-thumped off the sidewalk, parked kind of crooked in a spot.

Guy next to me in line and I look at each other. I say "I hope they aren't here to renew their licenses." Guy laughs.

When DMV opens up, we go in. The old ladies get in line to renew their license.

So, during the day, when I see someone driving slowly, I don't tailgate or get on the horn. I wait, because this may be a panic-inducing speed for the typical resident around here (if they were younger, like under 60, their typical speed is 1.5x the speed limit with a minimum speed of 40 mph). I don't want to scare them any more than they already are.

At night, when someone is creeping along with their high beams on, I flash my high beams once. If they don't respond, I try and work my way past without seeing too many blue spots. The driver may be, once again, as scared as they'll ever be, and they don't need me to help them along.

And although I tend to trust drivers on the road when I ride, I still keep an eye out for cars. Imagine a stereotypical cyclist's (at least according to the masses) reaction to a stop sign or red light. Ignore them, right? Ditto with the drivers around here. It's quite incredible how fast drivers will go right through a stop sign or a no-turn-on-red - on a bike it'd be a semi-race situation, going through intersections or around turns at 30-40 mph.

This is a rant because I have no idea how to fix the problem. Old people need independence, and no one cares about them enough that they can have others drive them around. They also have a lot of voting influence so no one's going to make it required to have a re-test when renewing a license, even though there are editorials about it regularly (one writer suggested bonus points for exceeding a posted speed limit (http://articles.courant.com/2010-08-04/features/hc-shea-baby-boomers0804-20100804_1_test-for-older-drivers-night-vision-limit)).

/rant
cdr

I did a crit in Montreal a few years ago where they managed to do a very good job of dealing with people getting into/through the course. During the race, residents inside the course needed emergency vehicles to get in for some medical emergency, so the officials were alerted, they stopped all the riders, let the emergency vehicles in, then restarted the race, maintaining the gaps as they were. to let them out they did the same thing.

You should assume it'll happen. Even at Harlem Crit, where they have metal or wood police barriers on both sides all the way around the course, a cab got onto the course. Lots of joke of "Taxi! Taxi!". Luckily no one was hurt.

One year in the defunct Danbury Crit in CT, a driver went through or around 3 sets of road blocks (saw horses, detour signs, etc) and past 2 sets of marshals who were yelling and chasing this slow moving vehicle. Went backwards around the course, in a section with 4 hard turns in about 200 meters (i.e. no line of sight) one of the riders plowed into the car, bounced off the hood. Driver was surprisingly not drunk, just old.

...
cdr

I hear there was a similar incident here once, an old driver got on the course, and I think it resulted in her license being revoked..

rant/
Which, if I may rant for a bit, is kind of scary. A lot of customers where I work are retired and well into their 80s. They have a hard time walking to the counter. They can barely pick up 10 pound things, forget about 20s. One uses a flashlight and puts his extremely thick glasses about 2 inches away from the LCD signing pad - otherwise he can't see what's happening. I read a lot of packages to these customers because they cannot read some of the larger fonts on a package.

Yet, somehow, the government expects these people to be able to, say, brake quickly if a kid runs out in front of them. Or an out of control dump truck comes at them.

I was waiting at a DMV office once, forget what I was doing, maybe getting a new-to-me car registered. A slow car with two elderly ladies pulled into the parking lot, kind of went at a weird angle. Kind of wandered across the main "drive" area until the front wheels went up onto the sidewalk next to the DMV (curb is literally about 5 feet away from wall). I thought for sure the car was going to go right into the wall. The driver turned the wheel, but not quick enough, and hit a sign about "driver's test here" or something. Sign was in concrete block, almost toppled over. Driver slowly backed up, slowly thump-thumped off the sidewalk, parked kind of crooked in a spot.

Guy next to me in line and I look at each other. I say "I hope they aren't here to renew their licenses." Guy laughs.

When DMV opens up, we go in. The old ladies get in line to renew their license.

So, during the day, when I see someone driving slowly, I don't tailgate or get on the horn. I wait, because this may be a panic-inducing speed for the typical resident around here (if they were younger, like under 60, their typical speed is 1.5x the speed limit with a minimum speed of 40 mph). I don't want to scare them any more than they already are.

At night, when someone is creeping along with their high beams on, I flash my high beams once. If they don't respond, I try and work my way past without seeing too many blue spots. The driver may be, once again, as scared as they'll ever be, and they don't need me to help them along.

And although I tend to trust drivers on the road when I ride, I still keep an eye out for cars. Imagine a stereotypical cyclist's (at least according to the masses) reaction to a stop sign or red light. Ignore them, right? Ditto with the drivers around here. It's quite incredible how fast drivers will go right through a stop sign or a no-turn-on-red - on a bike it'd be a semi-race situation, going through intersections or around turns at 30-40 mph.

This is a rant because I have no idea how to fix the problem. Old people need independence, and no one cares about them enough that they can have others drive them around. They also have a lot of voting influence so no one's going to make it required to have a re-test when renewing a license, even though there are editorials about it regularly (one writer suggested bonus points for exceeding a posted speed limit (http://articles.courant.com/2010-08-04/features/hc-shea-baby-boomers0804-20100804_1_test-for-older-drivers-night-vision-limit)).

/rant
cdr

solutions include: having old people live in city-like places (e.g. NY & Boston) as driving won't be required, but this ain't gonna fly very well. having old people who can't drive live in retirement homes can't hurt, either. it's a damn shame that everyone under 50 can't band together in a plebiscite and decide to mandate driving tests for old people

I was a course marshal at the CHIN criterium a few years ago. This is held on a fairground in Toronto that is not generally used as a thoroughfare.

During the women's 1/2 race, this car snakes its way around the police barriers and tries to get onto the course. Meanwhile, the pack is bearing down on a straight. All my yelling and waving does nothing, and it is not until i stand in front of the car and thump the hood that the guy stop. It's like the guy wakes up; his head shoots up and he looks indignant.

A police man then runs up and yells the crap out of the guy and he backs out of the course. He would have taken out the whole pack if he had ended up on the course.

there're also the tragedies in Tour of Argentine and the race in mexico last year.

yeah. cops often don't do their jobs.

case 1. grant's tomb this year, somehow a USPS truck got onto the course. the dumbass driver apparently didn't notice that there were cop cars parked, blocking the road, and that there are cars parked on to roadway. i had to run over & explain to the driver that he needed to back out before something terrible would happen.

case 2. during this year's yale itt, a car got onto a supposedly closed course despite people telling it not to go on the road. i had to swerve & dodge. real effing scary for my first ever race


You should've seen the Easterns Road Race last year at Penn. Yeah, it wasn't a closed course, but oh my god that last corner was scary. Riders were coming off a fast descent into a hard left to the finishing straight. Since all of the starting packs of racers had splintered on the climb, the riders had all sorts of gaps between them. It was amazing how many people/police it took to get the traffic that was trying to turn off of the finishing straight onto the road that the riders were descending on to move out of the way. A lot of them didn't seem to understand why 20+ people were screaming and shouting at them. It also didn't help that we couldn't tell when the next rider was coming down the hill.

You should've seen the Easterns Road Race last year at Penn. Yeah, it wasn't a closed course, but oh my god that last corner was scary. Riders were coming off a fast descent into a hard left to the finishing straight. Since all of the starting packs of racers had splintered on the climb, the riders had all sorts of gaps between them. It was amazing how many people/police it took to get the traffic that was trying to turn off of the finishing straight onto the road that the riders were descending on to move out of the way. A lot of them didn't seem to understand why 20+ people were screaming and shouting at them. It also didn't help that we couldn't tell when the next rider was coming down the hill.

omg...

btw, you racing this year?

When it happens (and if you race long enough, it will happen):
1. Make sure everyone in the field knows there's a hazard. Don't keep it a secret.
Try to neutralize the race if you can. Don't pick this moment to attack.
2. Don't scream at the driver. They're already disoriented. They're more likely to react WRONGLY to what you're yelling.
3. ONE person should take the lead and calmly lead them off the course.

Remember, to EVERYONE else, it's just another day in their town. To EVERYONE else, it's just a road that they use every day.

How many times have you gone around a barricade on a construction site hoping that you could get through? That's what they're doing. No one believes a sign that says "road closed".

Wow... the weekend before at marlton too, the volunteers on the corners let them thru when the major group passes, but when the driver is an idiot and there are multiple breaks it causes some chaos... I can't imagine some one getting hit though. Do you know if they turned out ok?

My understanding, all from second-hand reports, is that both women are very banged up but ok. Nothing's broken and no head injuries.

I find marshalling to be more exhausting and stressfull than racing. You need to be vigilant the entire time you're out there, and in some cases willing to put yourself in harm's way to avoid something like what happened in Phillipsburg.

I think race officials need to do a better job at explaining this to the marshalls. I am always told the basics of what to do, but I've seen marshalls just hanging out in a chair watching the race, not the road and access points to the road. My first few times marshalling I wasn't paying as much attention as I should have, until a car got on the course, going the wrong way, somewhere further up the course out of my range. I had my back to the car and was watching the racers coming around. Luckily nothing bad happened, but now I know better.

I also had a hostile pedestrian once. She ignored me completely and walked across the street right in front of the peloton. I was yelling at her to stop but she just said something like "don't tell me what to do". The official on the motorcycle saw this, and when I asked what to do should this happen in the future, he said I could physically stop the person if I needed to.

This is why I hate marshalling.

I had a car try to push its way past me when I was road marshaling - two parked cars, a traffic cone, and a sling chair (initially with me in it) were blocking a gap in the median - the other side of which was the course - the guy tried to snake through and I had to stand in front of him (with me then in the course) and yell at him. Fortunately there weren't racers nearby at the time.

On that same course, we had a problem with armored cars - there was an armored car company in the commercial park and apparently they are forbidden from deviating from their predetermined route without special authorization. Fortunately there aren't many armored cars going out on the weekend. A learning experience for next year I guess.

I've encountered cars on the MUP. Yet another reason to avoid it.

I had a car try to push its way past me when I was road marshaling - two parked cars, a traffic cone, and a sling chair (initially with me in it) were blocking a gap in the median - the other side of which was the course - the guy tried to snake through and I had to stand in front of him (with me then in the course) and yell at him. Fortunately there weren't racers nearby at the time.

On that same course, we had a problem with armored cars - there was an armored car company in the commercial park and apparently they are forbidden from deviating from their predetermined route without special authorization. Fortunately there aren't many armored cars going out on the weekend. A learning experience for next year I guess.


They should probably plan better then. What if they get to a wreck in the road and the cops have them detour because it's closed? Do they tell the cops to get out of their way because they can't deviate from their route?

My favorite car story was in Belgium. It was one of my last kermessen and I was in a good-sized break of about 20 guys and we were chasing down an equal-sized break even further up the road. On a 2 mile long tailwind section, there is an old, old woman driving a Ford Fiesta driving at us in the opposing lane. There were some hardcore guys in the group and they started yelling and when she got close enough, gesticulating. One threw his water bottle at her, and I, getting caught up in the moment, reached over and lo-and-behold, knocked her sideview mirror back into her window. The funny thing is that she didn't even slow down or try to steer away from us.

Seen marshal literally put the foot on the hood of the car and stand in front of it so I wouldn't pull out in front of racers in SF. Heard few cars getting on a course in UC Irvine sprint Tri. Yeah being Marshal is very exhausting job. You have to be polite, none confrontational and keep the imbeciles from killing themselves and racers by walking right in front of the pack. :bang::notamused:

Oh yeah Old people driving, **** that's scarry. :twitchy:

In the Opus Industrial park Criterium series here in the Minneapolis area earlier this year, we had a paint truck make its way onto the one-way traffic course, and start repainting the white lane lines. Coming down the hill to the back straight which averages about 27mph for cat5's, we ecountered orange cones placed in the middle of the road. Some of us were quick enough to veer out of the way, but somoene's veering clipped the wheel of the rider behind them, and sent that person square into the pavement breaking their collar-bone. It was easily the most unecessary accident of the year I had the displeasure of hearing. I think the whole peleton swore at the truck to GTFO the road as we passed by.

omg...

btw, you racing this year?

Probably not. I'm taking a break from cycling. I did 20-30 hour weeks of cycling all last fall, winter, and spring, which really burnt me out. I was in great physical condition, but I had no real training structure. It showed during the races. I could do 4 hour centuries no problem. But as soon as I was thrown in a pack of racers...

Anyways, I'm just running the team this year. It's been rather aggravating so far. All of our vets who know the roads are juniors/seniors this year. None of them have any time to show the new guys the local routes because of school work. It also doesn't help that I'm commuting this year. I've been getting a lot of emails from the new guys, and hearing nothing from our vets. Oh well. The saving grace is that our coach has more free time, so he's doing some structured training for those that decide to show up for his rides. It'll be interesting to see how race season goes.