Fifty Plus (50+) - More bad news involving cyclist/SUV encounter

From the local paper:

An off-duty Louisville Metro Police officer — described by colleagues as a man devoted to his family — was killed Thursday while cycling near his home in Spencer County.

Officer Paul Pegram, 40, was an eight-year veteran of the department and served in the former Jefferson County Police before city-county merger, according to officers who knew him.

Pegram was struck about 9:45 a.m. by a vehicle on Briar Ridge Road roughly five miles east of Taylorsville and about a mile from the entrance to Taylorsville Lake State Park, said police spokesman Dwight Mitchell.

He had stopped and was off his bicycle when a westbound Hyundai SUV driven by Daryl M. Fogle, 37, of Mount Eden, struck him from behind, according to Mitchell and the Kentucky State Police.

The entire article may be found here: http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20100930/NEWS01/309300048/1008/Off-duty+Louisville+police+officer+killed+while+cycling

If I've identified the location correctly, this might have been on the course of this year's Masters Natz TTs.

Every time I got passed today I cringed, although no one came within five feet of me. It has gotten a lot of local attention, partly because he apparently was a very nice guy (even though I don't guess it should have made a difference if he were a jerk), and partly because it involved a policeman.

I suspect if the driver was impaired or negligent she will not get the usual slap on the wrist. One can always hope.

... It has gotten a lot of local attention, partly because he apparently was a very nice guy (even though I don't guess it should have made a difference if he were a jerk), and partly because it involved a policeman.

I suspect if the driver was impaired or negligent she will not get the usual slap on the wrist. One can always hope.

Don't get your hopes up. About 10 years ago a popular 43-year-old deputy DA and mother of two died from injuries sustained when she was out jogging and an 18-year-old kid fell asleep at the wheel, crossed the centerline, and pnned her to against a tree. The kid had been up all night for a grad night party and was obviously in no condition to drive himself home. No fine, no penalty ...

RIP and prayers for his family.

So sad. RIP Officer Pegram.

When will it end?
RIP.

Sad indeed...

When will it end?
RIP.

Sadly to say, there is no end in sight. Unless, and that is a big unless too, the police start STRICT ENFORCEMENT of safety rules towards bicycles, and dishing out TOUGH SENTENCES for drivers that break bike safety rules.

Until they start those two, the end is nowhere in sight. We will have to live with it, or stop riding. The latter is not an option for me.

Again, RIP to a brave young officer.

Sadly to say, there is no end in sight. Unless, and that is a big unless too, the police start STRICT ENFORCEMENT of safety rules towards bicycles, and dishing out TOUGH SENTENCES for drivers that break bike safety rules.

Until they start those two, the end is nowhere in sight. We will have to live with it, or stop riding. The latter is not an option for me.

Again, RIP to a brave young officer.

The police don't "dish out" the sentences. The courts do, supposedly in compliance with the applicable laws. That is where the change has to come, with the enforcement of current laws and with the law makers with new laws - as a start. Once the laws are in place, then we need to get the police and DA's to bring charges and prosecute.

Accomplishing the above is an almost impossible task.

I have stopped riding some of the routes that I was riding from close calls with people on cell phones and some just will not move over.here we have a 3 foot law but that is a joke.I have never heard of any one getting ticked for not obeying it.:(

How sad. The officer was not cycling when he was hit - he was off his bike and a pedestrian.

Highway deaths are a bigger problem than cycling. I wanted to approach it as a cycling problem, but if you take a look at the number of deaths each year on the highways you will find that cycling injuries/deaths are hardly noticeable.

In our small rural state we have 600 highway deaths per year. SIX HUNDRED. Each Monday morning I check the newspaper to find 3 or 4 or 5 or more persons were killed in auto accidents. It seems to never end and these deaths are written up in a small section of the paper and never heard of again.

We can try to make changes concerning cycling deaths, but we are fighting a whole army with a pea shooter.

We don't need special laws just for cyclists, we need laws enforced that hold people accountable across the board, no matter what the form of transportation. There are people hit and killed while in motor vehicles that brings no charges.

The article does not say whether the rider was on the roadway or a shoulder. When you stop, get off the road. I see cyclists do this a lot. Drivers need to pay attention, but let's reduce our chances.

Highway deaths are a bigger problem than cycling. I wanted to approach it as a cycling problem, but if you take a look at the number of deaths each year on the highways you will find that cycling injuries/deaths are hardly noticeable.

In our small rural state we have 600 highway deaths per year. SIX HUNDRED. Each Monday morning I check the newspaper to find 3 or 4 or 5 or more persons were killed in auto accidents. It seems to never end and these deaths are written up in a small section of the paper and never heard of again.

We can try to make changes concerning cycling deaths, but we are fighting a whole army with a pea shooter.

Well, we changed some laws here in CO. Will these reduce deaths/injuries? I don't know - the changes are relatively new. The 3 foot rule; allowing a car to cross a double yellow line to pass, restricting double bicycling.

Interestingly enough, every year we have massive campaigns about lightning safety in Colorado - TV, newspaper, etc., etc. Yet, there are only a few folks killed by lightning each year (both in CO and the US of A) - far, far less than the number of bicyclists killed by cars, the number of pedestrians killed by cars, or the number of motorists killed by cars. Why is that? Why does lightning get so much attention from the press, but right hooks are never mentioned, nor tail gaiting, hardly even drunken driving?

Summer is the peak season for severe weather. In the United States, on average, approximately 60 people are killed each year by lightning.

http://cbs4denver.com/weatherupdates/weather.denver.colorado.2.1056281.html

Well, we changed some laws here in CO. Will these reduce deaths/injuries? I don't know -

Listening to NPR program (Wait Wait Don't Tell Me, I think) and heard a some one citing a study that "texting-while-driving" laws are having the opposite effect of what was intended. Instead of texting at steering wheel level where there is some chance of watching the road now it's being done in the lap.

This is an entertainment program and no source was mentioned as I recall. May be incorrect but it sounds about right.

I met a guy at a neighborhood party and I had seen this individual riding his bike past my house on several occasions. Always helmet-less.

I asked him why he didn't wear one. His reply (which I found to miss the point) was that he felt all safety equipment did was promote riskier behavior.

When I asked for an example he cited air bags in cars as a prime example. He thought that if you really wanted to make people drive cautiously there would be a spike that came out of the steering wheel rather than an air pillow.

No this was not chipcom.

The police don't "dish out" the sentences. The courts do, supposedly in compliance with the applicable laws.

The courts don't do anything unless the police bring them something.

We recently passed a three-foot passing/no-harassment of cyclists law here in Louisiana. I'm willing to bet that most motorists don't know about the law, so I wonder what good does it really do? Shortly after passage of the law a motorist driving an SUV struck a cyclist from behind on River Road and left him unconscious in a water-filled ditch. The cyclist was a PhD student and member of the LSU Cycling Team. Thankfully, he was discovered (by other cyclists) and the motorist (a local sports bar/restaurant manager who was driving with a suspended license) was eventually arrested. The cyclist will recover - that's the most important part. I don't know if the motorist is free on bail or not. If he's free, he may still be driving - and menacing other cyclists.

Until motorists take laws seriously and stop driving while texting, drunk or otherwise impaired/distracted, I don't expect the situation to improve. The cops and the courts can only do so much.

The courts don't do anything unless the police bring them something.

Absolutely agree, which is why I stated in my post:


Once the laws are in place, then we need to get the police and DA's to bring charges and prosecute.

UIntil the country as a whole gets serious about outlawing cell phones etc while driving deaths cause by negligent drivers will keep increasing. The reason there is no out cry is simple. Everyone does it and thinks it doesn't effect their driving. Wrong same as drinking while driving . Next time you are on the road just watch and see the number of jerks using a cell phone while driving. Epademic to say the least.

I don't think the cell phone and texting laws are going to do much to solve the problem. It is a problem caused by misuse of technology and I think it will require a technological solution. Make the phones incapable of being operated by someone driving a car.

We recently passed a three-foot passing/no-harassment of cyclists law here in Louisiana. I'm willing to bet that most motorists don't know about the law, so I wonder what good does it really do? Shortly after passage of the law a motorist driving an SUV struck a cyclist from behind on River Road and left him unconscious in a water-filled ditch. The cyclist was a PhD student and member of the LSU Cycling Team. Thankfully, he was discovered (by other cyclists) and the motorist (a local sports bar/restaurant manager who was driving with a suspended license) was eventually arrested. The cyclist will recover - that's the most important part. I don't know if the motorist is free on bail or not. If he's free, he may still be driving - and menacing other cyclists.

Until motorists take laws seriously and stop driving while texting, drunk or otherwise impaired/distracted, I don't expect the situation to improve. The cops and the courts can only do so much.

Well, I hope the driver also has to pay civil damages to the cyclist. Driving with a suspended license and all I would think a jury would be willing to award substantial damages even if the criminal justice system lets him off easy.

It is a problem caused by misuse of technology

No, it's a problem of an uncaring attitude toward the damage a car can cause. There are still plenty of drivers out there distracted by food, shaving, etc.

What we need is a much tougher driving test, and a court system that's willing to actually take the license away and require that the entire test be retaken at the end of the suspension period. If people had to demonstrate such skills as panic stopping on wet pavement, skid control, and dealing with unexpected obstacles at highway speeds, a lot of them wouldn't pass at all, and most would be terrified of doing anything that might result in them having to do it again.

No, it's a problem of an uncaring attitude toward the damage a car can cause. There are still plenty of drivers out there distracted by food, shaving, etc.

What we need is a much tougher driving test, and a court system that's willing to actually take the license away and require that the entire test be retaken at the end of the suspension period. If people had to demonstrate such skills as panic stopping on wet pavement, skid control, and dealing with unexpected obstacles at highway speeds, a lot of them wouldn't pass at all, and most would be terrified of doing anything that might result in them having to do it again.

I don't disagree with what you said, but the electronic devices are a special subset of distracted driving. They will be abused as long as they are capable of being abused. Changing people's attitudes is a worthwhile goal, but changing the devices can happen much quicker.

I do believe the number of highway deaths per year in the USA were hgiher a few decades ago when there were no cell phones. It is just the excuse of the day for poor driving.

I have stopped riding some of the routes that I was riding from close calls with people on cell phones and some just will not move over.here we have a 3 foot law but that is a joke.I have never heard of any one getting ticked for not obeying it.:(

In my town, they just passed the 3 foot rule, and the cell phone ban.. Will see what happens..

From the local paper:

An off-duty Louisville Metro Police officer — described by colleagues as a man devoted to his family — was killed Thursday while cycling near his home in Spencer County.

Officer Paul Pegram, 40, was an eight-year veteran of the department and served in the former Jefferson County Police before city-county merger, according to officers who knew him.

Pegram was struck about 9:45 a.m. by a vehicle on Briar Ridge Road roughly five miles east of Taylorsville and about a mile from the entrance to Taylorsville Lake State Park, said police spokesman Dwight Mitchell.

He had stopped and was off his bicycle when a westbound Hyundai SUV driven by Daryl M. Fogle, 37, of Mount Eden, struck him from behind, according to Mitchell and the Kentucky State Police.

The entire article may be found here: http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20100930/NEWS01/309300048/1008/Off-duty+Louisville+police+officer+killed+while+cycling

If I've identified the location correctly, this might have been on the course of this year's Masters Natz TTs.

Every time I got passed today I cringed, although no one came within five feet of me. It has gotten a lot of local attention, partly because he apparently was a very nice guy (even though I don't guess it should have made a difference if he were a jerk), and partly because it involved a policeman.

I suspect if the driver was impaired or negligent she will not get the usual slap on the wrist. One can always hope.

I've been to Taylorsville and the surrounding area a time or two messing around with the terriers. It's beautiful country well suited to biking. But those roads, they are not good. Very sad story, but aren't they all.

I don't disagree with what you said, but the electronic devices are a special subset of distracted driving. They will be abused as long as they are capable of being abused. Changing people's attitudes is a worthwhile goal, but changing the devices can happen much quicker.

It would be bypassed within a week of putting it in place. Besides, how are you going to force people to change out their phones, palmtops, portable DVD players, etc. for more expensive models with some sort of special technology that can detect whether they're in the driver's seat or the back seat?

The US transportation safety statistics show that alcohol is a majority cause of traffic deaths in the US. Driving while under the influence is already illegal. The penalties are pretty severe. Enforcement is pretty high. Doesn't seem to have helped much. Why expect more laws to make much of a difference.

It would be bypassed within a week of putting it in place. Besides, how are you going to force people to change out their phones, palmtops, portable DVD players, etc. for more expensive models with some sort of special technology that can detect whether they're in the driver's seat or the back seat?

Nah, cell phones already are GPS'd. And there are apps available that disable them (cell phones) while moving. Make it the law and that would take care of >90% of the problem in one swell foop. The problem is we don't have the will to say it's worth it and to accept the sacrifice that the passenger can't use his phone either. Convenience > Lives.

We should get rid of radios in cars too...and cup holders because they encourage people to drive with Big Gulp...all forms of distracted driving. Let's not forget that car radios were almost banned when they were introduced for the same reasons you all are talking about.

We should get rid of radios in cars too...and cup holders because they encourage people to drive with Big Gulp...all forms of distracted driving. Let's not forget that car radios were almost banned when they were introduced for the same reasons you all are talking about.
Every time one of those cars with the massive sub-woofers goes by I still think a ban on radios in cars might not be a bad idea... :)

I wonder how we managed to survive in those dark days without cellphones?

We should get rid of radios in cars too...and cup holders because they encourage people to drive with Big Gulp...all forms of distracted driving. Let's not forget that car radios were almost banned when they were introduced for the same reasons you all are talking about.
I'm at my dangerous when I go through the Taco Bell drive-through and try to eat it on the roll. I'm better now about pulling over in the parking lot and scarfing it down there.

I'm at my dangerous when I go through the Taco Bell drive-through and try to eat it on the roll. I'm better now about pulling over in the parking lot and scarfing it down there.

As long as you don't pick up your cell phone you're good...wait, how are you posting this????:eek::eek::eek:

And here is a tragic reminder that on a MUP, the bike is the SUV. (not suggesting blame)
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/100410dnmetjogger.156702d91.html

We should get rid of radios in cars too...and cup holders because they encourage people to drive with Big Gulp...all forms of distracted driving. Let's not forget that car radios were almost banned when they were introduced for the same reasons you all are talking about.

I agree that listening to the radio and drinking a cup of coffee while driving are every bit as distracting as reading and composing messages. I live in world of black and white that is free of nuance and reasoned response to varying degrees of problems. Now that I think about it, a pair of handcuffs at the wheel would really help with all of these problems. What do you think?

I agree that listening to the radio and drinking a cup of coffee while driving are every bit as distracting as reading and composing messages. I live in world of black and white that is free of nuance and reasoned response to varying degrees of problems. Now that I think about it, a pair of handcuffs at the wheel would really help with all of these problems. What do you think?

The cuffs would only make things worse...they might get all tangled up with the wheel while I'm trying to eat that burrito. Taking it another step though, we could outlaw day dreaming as well.

Nah, cell phones already are GPS'd. And there are apps available that disable them (cell phones) while moving. Make it the law and that would take care of >90% of the problem in one swell foop.

Google the name of any cell phone + jailbreak. If an app can be put on, it can be taken off just as easily. Heck, give 'em a couple hours, and they'll have another app with a "cop" button that puts the blocking app back in place and hides itself in case the cop wants to check the phone.

I do believe the number of highway deaths per year in the USA were hgiher a few decades ago when there were no cell phones. It is just the excuse of the day for poor driving.

You are correct about the long term trends toward fewer fatalities, but dismissing cell phone/texting as safety factors in favor of "poor driving" seems a bit simplistic. At any rate, evidence seems to show that "behavioral and vehicle improvements" do have a significant impact on safety. Here's a link and I especially recommend page 18 of the document.

Brief Excerpt:
"The long-term declining trend observed in fatalities since reaching a high in the early 1970s has
occurred while significant vehicle and occupant safety regulations and programs were being
enacted by NHTSA and the States. NHTSA-administered behavioral and vehicle safety
programs, both in the crashworthiness and crash avoidance areas, and through the issuing of
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards has contributed tremendously to the long-term
downward trend seen in motor vehicle traffic crash fatalities."

Motor Vehicle Traffic Fatalities Report
(http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/811346.pdf)