Commuting - Help! Best under? $500 bike

I bought a 7 speed Schwinn Lakeshore cruiser about a month ago and have decided to upgrade to something lighter and that handles better with more gears. I commute about 3 miles each way to work, every other day while building up my muscles and stamana. To work in mornings is all down hill, home in evening is all up hill and a good workout. I now only have to stop one time from 12 stops the first trip!
I looked at a Raleigh 3.5 Detour today and liked the feel of it. $360 + fenders and rack and Kstand will end up about $420 The Detour 4.5 for $460 is similar, but better quality parts and would end up about $520 after adding the fenders, rack, kstand.
I am 5'-11" 195 lb I want a bike with tires wide enough for ocasional dirt road rideing, but comfortable with more upright bars, 7 speeds minimum, fenders, rack, pants chain guard, and good handling.
Any suggestions?
Thanks,

If you have any Kona dealers in your area see if you can look at a Smoke: http://www.konaworld.co/bike.cfm?content=smoke

It's discontinued for 2011 so you might be able to get a "Smoke-in" hot deal on one. ;) It's already got fat tires and fenders so all you'd have to add is your rack and chain guard. The combination of a steel frameset with 47 mm tires should make a nice-riding bike. Plus, it's a Kona!

For the money, its hard to beat the KHS Urban X as an all-around, everyday commuter. I wish I had bought one instead of my Giant FRC3 :(

http://www.khsbicycles.com/06_urban_x_10.htm

For the money, its hard to beat the KHS Urban X as an all-around, everyday commuter. I wish I had bought one instead of my Giant FRC3 :(

http://www.khsbicycles.com/06_urban_x_10.htm

I don't know if I they even sell KHS in this area, but what are the advantages of it over the Giant, which they do sell here locally?

And any comments about Giant vrs. Raleigh in similar price ranges?

I also looked at a Globe internal 8 speed that is on sale for $650 marked down from $800, but it would still need the addition of fenders, rack, kstand and it's just way above my budget anyway.. but the internal gearing really works nicely and not having a derailer on the side to get banged up and dirty is nice too... nah, just too much $$ I noticed on line Raleigh makes one, the Calispell I8 with a Shimano Nexus 8 internal speed for about $550, but again, no fenders or rack. And.. is an 8 speed enough for hills?


Thanks,

What brands are in the dealers in your area?

Realistically if you go to a bike shop or several, at the $500 price point,
the bikes will be similar, only the brand name differs.
the component picks will be on average similar,
as the makers of the component parts have their several price points..
and so the bits chosen , pre-dominantly shimano's, will match the price level.

shop the dealer for service after the sale then ride the bike.. :50:

a good bike shop would fit you on a well sized bike,
and fit a few accessories to make the commute go well..

I bought a Torker Graduate not too long ago, and it might be worth a look. Its been a smooth ride so far, and it looks great in person. Internal Hub, Front & Rear drum breaks, fenders, rack mounts, and 700x32C wheels. Only a 5 speed Sturmey Archer, but its a great bike for about 450. http://www.torkerusa.com/bikes/commuter-life/2011-graduate (The Graduate)

I'll admit that I normally would pimp Kona- especially the Smoke*. I've also thrown out the KHS Urban X from time to time as well. But if I were in the market for a decent entry level again, I'd would have to put the Giant Escape right at the top. The top of the model line "City (http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-US/bikes/model/escape.city.2011/6963/43123/)" goes for right at $500 around here.



*was not a good day the first time I viewed the 2011 Kona line- My beloved Smoke and my lusted after Dew Drop were both dropped. Then the World gets an aluminum frame instead of steel...

Norco City-glide
http://www.norco.com/bikes/urban/city-glide/city-glide/
Jamis Commuter 1 and 2
http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/thebikes/street/commuter/11_commuter1.html
http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/thebikes/street/commuter/11_commuter1.html

That Giant Escape City looks really well thought out. Has everything a commuter would want sans pannies: wide range of gears, fenders, kickstand, bell, rear rack. Another big plus in my book is the long chainstay for better heel clearance 17.9inches. It's hard to find bikes with really long chainstays. The Surly Long Haul Trucker has 18.1inches so the Giant comes really close.

There is a 2009 Jamis Commuter 3 at bicycle bananas for $500. If it is really hilly where you are then an 8 speed IGH might not be enough for you, but if the hills are not too bad it should be more than enough. The sizes are very deceptive with them though. Pay close attention to the frame geometry. I am 6'1 and my 2008 20.5in commuter 4 is pretty much perfect. It is really weird because my girlfriend also has a 20.5 that is somehow much smaller. The only downside to the commuter is that it Alu, which for some isn't a downside, but I would have preferred steel. The IGH and disc breaks were too much to pass up where I live compared to the Coda comp. If I had to do it again I may have gone with the 2009 coda comp, but I'm pretty thrilled with my choice, and the wet winter season is coming, and I think I will appreciate the discs and IGH.

Well after reading the original post again and looking at the Raleigh models the OP is looking at, I think my CX suggestion is plain wrong. Sorry about that.

There is another bike at Nashbar that might be closer to the mark -- Even if you factor in having a bike shop do the final assembly you should be well under the Detour 4.5 price with similar running gear.
http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product_10053_10052_516483_-1_202039_10000_200348

What part of the country are you in?

I don't know if I they even sell KHS in this area, but what are the advantages of it over the Giant, which they do sell here locally?

And any comments about Giant vrs. Raleigh in similar price ranges?

I also looked at a Globe internal 8 speed that is on sale for $650 marked down from $800, but it would still need the addition of fenders, rack, kstand and it's just way above my budget anyway.. but the internal gearing really works nicely and not having a derailer on the side to get banged up and dirty is nice too... nah, just too much $$ I noticed on line Raleigh makes one, the Calispell I8 with a Shimano Nexus 8 internal speed for about $550, but again, no fenders or rack. And.. is an 8 speed enough for hills?


Thanks,

Nothing was wrong with my Giant FRC3 but it was more like a flat bar road bike than a commuter. It was hard to put on fenders and when I loaded it up with much weight it got a little squirlly. I would have rather had a steel frame with lots of tire clearance. If you dont' have a KHS around the Giant Escape looks nice too. Did you enter your zip code in on their website?

If you have any Kona dealers in your area see if you can look at a Smoke: http://www.konaworld.co/bike.cfm?content=smoke

It's discontinued for 2011 so you might be able to get a "Smoke-in" hot deal on one. ;) It's already got fat tires and fenders so all you'd have to add is your rack and chain guard. The combination of a steel frameset with 47 mm tires should make a nice-riding bike. Plus, it's a Kona!

Ditto on the Smoke. A buddy of mine bought one two years ago and I am supremely irritated that Kona has discontinued it. Plus my local Kona dealer is out of stock. I like the suggestion by no1mad and zeppinger of the KHS Urban-X. It will likely be my new commuter in the near future.

Thanks everyhone for all your comments and advice.

The KHS Urban-X is apparently available at a dealer here. Will be looking this Saturday as I have off from work!


The KHS Urban-X $440 rack, fenders, "CRMO" frame, "hi tensil" forks, Shimano Rivo shifters, CO51 front derailer and Altus rear, alloy rims with "black"? spokes and 26x1.5" tires.


Giant Escape city with fenders and rack for $540 Aluxx Aluminum frame, alloy forks, SRAM Via shifters, SRAM VIA front and rear derailers, alloy rims with stainless spokes, 700x32 tires


Raleigh Detour 4.5 for $460 + fenders, rack and kstand = about $520 aluminum frame, alloy forks, Shimano EF51 EZ fire shifters, Shimano TX51 front, Alivio rear derailers, Weinmann double wall rims? and stainless spokes, 700x40 tires.

Any advice from those familiar with these materials, brands and models, or is there not too much difference?

Thanks again

Looking at the KHS website the MSRP of Urban-X is:
MSRP: $329• COLORS: Gray • SIZES: S, M, L

The picture shows it with fenders and a rack:
http://www.khsbicycles.com/Images/Bike_Images/Full06/full-urban-X-06.jpg

From the look of the bike, it appears to be an old school rigid mountain bike with slick tires. Not a bad setup, (heck I have been using an early 90's Raleigh M-60 with a similar setup for the past 3 years) but the Giant Escape looks like a nicer bike.

I'm not finding that.. I went to the KHM site and it shows the Urban-X for $439 here (http://www.khsbicycles.com/06_urban_x_10.htm)

All three bikes have their strengths and weaknesses. If I were choosing it would come down to ride quality, warranty, and the reputation of the LBS (assuming the bikes are from different shops). On paper I like the Raleigh's components, but the other bikes already have fenders and racks so there are no fitment issues or added cost. I would assume that the KHS steel frameset and fatter 26" tires would translate into a smoother ride, but it may come at the cost of handling and performance. As I said, the ride will tell the tale. Good luck and happy hunting!

I bought a 7 speed Schwinn Lakeshore cruiser about a month ago and have decided to upgrade to something lighter and that handles better with more gears.

I am 5'-11" 195 lb I want a bike with tires wide enough for ocasional dirt road rideing, but comfortable with more upright bars, 7 speeds minimum, fenders, rack, pants chain guard, and good handling.
Any suggestions?
Thanks,

26" wheels, fenders, more gears, chain guard that is lighter than the 40lb Schwinn but under $500. You aren't going to get much lighter but you can get more gears but not too sure about the chain guard with a double or triple crankset.

Ha -- I found it via a google search and the top returned link is KHS website and points to the 2008 listing. Did not catch that --

Interesting how much the price jumped on that model a few years ago and that the frame went from AL to CroMO with the 2010 version.


I'm not finding that.. I went to the KHM site and it shows the Urban-X for $439 here (http://www.khsbicycles.com/06_urban_x_10.htm)

Get a Voodoo Agwe from Airbomb for $599.00. You can run either 700C or 29er tires on it. Its only one speed but with a double butted cro moly frame, at that price, its a heck of a good deal. If you want to run monstercross with it, its a good choice.

Voodoo, sad to say, discontinued it in favor of the Nakisi. They call it a dirt townie.

I like the KHS better than the other two because of the steel frame and 26inch wheels. In my opinion they will make the bike a better all around bike rather than dedicated road machine. You can put fatties on it if you decided to later on or you can even go on a long bike tour (its got front fork braze ons for a front rack!) It will probably handle a load better and the slightly smaller wheels should be stronger than equivalent 700cc. The other bikes are a little bit more roadish.

Two things about the Giant:

1. The rack does not have a "sweep back" (I think that's the term), meaning if you're not careful (depending on mounting hardware) a bag could slide forward...

2. Giant uses the Average Retail Price, not MSRP. Two different Giant shops in town here. One marks it at $540, but then "sweetens the deal" by lowering the price to $500. The other one just marks it at $500. So look around.

Something else to consider as well- the cnainstay length. The longer it is, the less heel strike issues you will have in the future. The KHS measures 16.7", the Giant 17.9".

That being said, go ride 'em all. Buy the one you want.

26" wheels, fenders, more gears, chain guard that is lighter than the 40lb Schwinn but under $500. You aren't going to get much lighter but you can get more gears but not too sure about the chain guard with a double or triple crankset.

I was immediately impressed with how much lighter both the Raleigh detaour and the Giant felt that I tested last Saturday. I am going to actually weigh the Schwinn Lakeshore to see what it weighs, I'm really curious now. A full jchan guard isn't that important, I can always use pants clips, but fenders are a must, along with a rack to carry my lunch, and other things.

Incidentally, the Lakeshore has 26 x 2-1/4" tires, they have worked fine in loose dirt on dirt roads and this evening I even drove home and part way went over a loose bark mulch trail with no problems, though I had to peddal a lot harder. So, what would you people say is the minimum width of tires I should consider in order to occasionally drive over dirt roads with loose dirt areas but at a leasurly speed?

Ha -- I found it via a google search and the top returned link is KHS website and points to the 2008 listing. Did not catch that --

Interesting how much the price jumped on that model a few years ago and that the frame went from AL to CroMO with the 2010 version.

Is aluminum or CroMo better, and what is CroMo? Any advantages to one over the other?

Thanks,

Get a Voodoo Agwe from Airbomb for $599.00. You can run either 700C or 29er tires on it. Its only one speed but with a double butted cro moly frame, at that price, its a heck of a good deal. If you want to run monstercross with it, its a good choice.

Voodoo, sad to say, discontinued it in favor of the Nakisi. They call it a dirt townie.

That seems out of my $$ range and not in the direction I'm going as I would have to add fenders, rack, kstand, etc., but thanks for the suggestion.

CroMo refers to an alloy of chromium and molybdenum and is often referred to as "chromoly", hence the shortened version. It is stronger than standard 1020 steel. As to it being better that aluminum that is very subjective; I just prefer the "feel" of steel. Aluminum is lighter but requires more material to maintain structural integrity, which is why aluminum-framed bikes have thicker tubes.

I do find my MTB with 26" tires more stable on rougher surfaces, but it also has a longer wheelbase than my other bikes and is therefore inherently more stable at lower speeds. That being said I won't hesitate to traverse rougher surfaces with my narrower-tired bikes, but if I want to ride trails exclusively, I'll choose my MTB.

I like the KHS better than the other two because of the steel frame and 26inch wheels. In my opinion they will make the bike a better all around bike rather than dedicated road machine. You can put fatties on it if you decided to later on or you can even go on a long bike tour (its got front fork braze ons for a front rack!) It will probably handle a load better and the slightly smaller wheels should be stronger than equivalent 700cc. The other bikes are a little bit more roadish.


Thanks, so what are the differences between steel frames (cromo?) and aluminum.. vibration, road shocks, weight, streength?

Also, sorry, but I'm not familiar with all these terms.. "700cc"?

Thanks,

OK, thanks, IEClean, disregard my last post question.

These things always happen.

I know, I sound like a dunce, but I'm really interested in learning as much as I can this time so I don't buy on an impulse like I did with the Schwinn.. it isn't a bad bike, especially for $200, it's just that I didn't know what I was doing when I bought it and should have spent time here like I'm doing now. Now I've got to also find some one to buy it as our front porch isn't even big enough for two bikes!

I'm really interested in learning as much as I can this time so I don't buy on an impulse like I did with the Schwinn..

Two things:

1. Buy or borrow a copy of Todd Downs' The Bicycling Guide to Complete Bicycle Maintenance and Repair. Over the life of a bike, this will save you a lot more cash than anything else IMO.
2. Do a google search, and a search of bikeforums, on bike fitting. Cheap or expensive, no bike will ever feel good if you don't do this right.

I will second the statement that fit is very important.

If you pick up the maintenance book and few tools you could pick up an old rigid mountain bike (RMB) on Craigslist for cheap, tune it up and install slick tires, fenders and rack and essentially have the KHS bike. Used is almost always much cheaper than buying new, and you can end up with some really phenomenal bikes (high end rigid mountain bikes sell as cheap or almost as cheap as low end ones). Old mountain bikes are incredibly undervalued right now, since everyone seems to want road bikes now -- and they make very nice all rounder bikes when set up right.

Thanks, so what are the differences between steel frames (cromo?) and aluminum.. vibration, road shocks, weight, streength?

Also, sorry, but I'm not familiar with all these terms.. "700cc"?

Thanks,

Your criteria is price and something lighter with more gears than what you've got. The frame material really doesn't matter. Geometry, tire size, type and pressure will make more of a difference than frame material. 700C tires are regular skinny road tires that supplanted 27" tires as the regular "10speed" road bike tire. 26" tires are your regular mtn. bike tire. In the last decade 700c tires and rims have been made in wider sizes like mtn. bike sizes so you can have 700c mtn bikes , that are called "29er".

Until you get some tools and proficiency in repair you're going to be more interested the service of the shop you buy the bike as it will need regular maintenance and you're going to be spending a significant amount of money maintaining it. You'd be better off buying a $750 bike where you do all the trouble shooting and maintenance than a $500 bike where you have to pay for basic repairs and maintenance.

Or finding a deal in the trash or craigslist and fixing it up.

Geometry, tire size, type and pressure will make more of a difference than frame material.
Concur. I will also add to this list the quality of components on your drivetrain (derailleurs, shifters, brakes, crankset, etc.) You can have a "so-so" frame, but add to the mix a set of nice components and you'll notice a huge difference in the quality of your ride.


Or finding a deal in the trash or craigslist and fixing it up.

+1 about finding a used bike on Craigslist. At $500 budget, such bike will most likely be ready to go with nice components. Or buy something around $350 (you'll be amazed at some great deals on craigslist ) and spend $150 on accessorizing it to your needs. Do your homework (take your time) and it will pay off.

Is aluminum or CroMo better, and what is CroMo? Any advantages to one over the other?

Thanks,

CroMo= Chrome Molybdenum alloy of steel (roll cage steel- good stuff strengthwise)

I'm too much of a newb to comment on ride quality, but I know alloys and such (being an auto technician).

Update: After looking over several forum opinions on bikes in this range, I setteled on a KHS Urban-X 2010 for $440. Here's a link to it: http://www.khsbicycles.com/06_urban_x_10.htm I had scouted out the several, excellent, local bike shops and decided on Joselin's in Monterey; good help, very knowledgable and they worked with me on getting the bike and getting it set up. Picked it up yesterday and after a few final adjustments to the shifting, got it all working fine. I had them add a Mirrycle end of bar mirror and it works beautifully.. stays in place where you put it and gives an excellent rear view, but easily folds back when I put the bike in the back of my SUV. I went on a long ride yesterday down the Monterey bay bike trail and this bike is excellent, has a solid feel, smooth shifts with excellent gear choices and the ride is non jarring. The Brooks knock off seat is going to take awhile to get used to.. well see, but it feels comfortable when you first mount it and the springs work well. I put the 2 month old Schwinn cruizer on Craigs list and sold it the same morning for $150... about $80 less then I had in it, but I got 2 months of good rideing out of it and it got me back into bike rideing again, so was well worth it.

Thanks everyone for your suggestions and answers.

Time to ride! Upgrade whatever you don't like as finances allow and learn about what is best for YOU for future reference. If you really like it you'll end up like many of us, owning a bunch for special purposes. Enjoy.

Is aluminum or CroMo better, and what is CroMo? Any advantages to one over the other?

Thanks,

CroMo= Chrome molybdenum steel, a very strong alloy for it's weight. The testimate to CroMo is that every dragster roll cage is built out of it by rule.

Is aluminum or CroMo better, and what is CroMo? Any advantages to one over the other?

Thanks,

[edit: oops... he's already upgraded...]

Doane, you bought a bike a month ago and are now upgrading? If I were you, I'd be in window shopping mode. Kick the tires on many, many bikes. Your current commute of 3 miles is easily do-able on your current bike... at least it will clearly last a few more months while you figure out all the options.

I may be a grinch here, but new bikes under $500 are often specd such that wheels, particularly, and other components, generally, are not too durable. You might want to think about how many miles per year you would put on a commuter and purchase accordingly.

Haste makes waste.

Doane, that is an incredible value.

I may be a grinch here, but new bikes under $500 are often specd such that wheels, particularly, and other components, generally, are not too durable. You might want to think about how many miles per year you would put on a commuter and purchase accordingly.


+1
At that price point, carefully shopping for a used bike makes the most sense. And being p-a-t-i-e-n-t pays...

[edit: oops... he's already upgraded...]

Doane, you bought a bike a month ago and are now upgrading? If I were you, I'd be in window shopping mode. Kick the tires on many, many bikes. Your current commute of 3 miles is easily do-able on your current bike... at least it will clearly last a few more months while you figure out all the options.

I may be a grinch here, but new bikes under $500 are often specd such that wheels, particularly, and other components, generally, are not too durable. You might want to think about how many miles per year you would put on a commuter and purchase accordingly.


Haste makes waste.

As I said, I started out with a less expensive bike to get a feel for whether I was going to want to stick with it, and after giving it a few monthis, I decided that , yes, I love rideing a bike again. My reason for upgrading was to move up to a better quality bike, with better handling, more gears, etc. I don't feel like any of this was done in "haste" and for me, I was "patient" in my own way, but maybe I'm different then some of you. Anyway, I have no regrets, I feel like I sold the Schwinn for a good price and did not suffer that big a loss for what I gained; the guy that bought it is very happy, and I got a bike that is a big step up for me over the Schwinn and I'm very happy with it and the price I paid for it. Maybe, down the road, I'll upgrade again, who knows?

The Schwinn was half the price of the KHS, but they are very different, the Schwinn, a cruiser, with only seven speeds. I first discovered that the reason for the constant derailer problems with the Schwinn was that they had used a brake cable instead of a shift cable for the rear derailer. Once that was fixed I had no more shift problems, but it cost me several trips to bike shops and about $50 in repair costs. The 2-1/4" tires on the Schwinn were really not a good choice for a commuting bike and I notice the difference with the KHS with 1.5" tires along with the higher and lower gear ratios available, the lighter frame and lower bars, etc., all make for a more enjoyable ride overall.
Still not sure why ones needs that many gears though.. 21? Maybe I'll start a seperate post on this. Going home for the first time tonight on it, the hills are easier with the extra gears, but you end up peddling so much faster and going so much slower you get about the same workout? Maybe I'm missing somthing. The most elaborate bike I had back in the 80's ony had 10 gears, five in back, two in front, and it got me everywhere I needed to go, I thought.

The Schwinn was half the price of the KHS, but they are very different, the Schwinn, a cruiser, with only seven speeds. I first discovered that the reason for the constant derailer problems with the Schwinn was that they had used a brake cable instead of a shift cable for the rear derailer. Once that was fixed I had no more shift problems, but it cost me several trips to bike shops and about $50 in repair costs. The 2-1/4" tires on the Schwinn were really not a good choice for a commuting bike and I notice the difference with the KHS with 1.5" tires along with the higher and lower gear ratios available, the lighter frame and lower bars, etc., all make for a more enjoyable ride overall.
Still not sure why ones needs that many gears though.. 21? Maybe I'll start a seperate post on this. Going home for the first time tonight on it, the hills are easier with the extra gears, but you end up peddling so much faster and going so much slower you get about the same workout? Maybe I'm missing somthing. The most elaborate bike I had back in the 80's ony had 10 gears, five in back, two in front, and it got me everywhere I needed to go, I thought.

Holly crap, someone bought the bike that I recommended to them! Something I did on the internet had a repercussion in real life! ;)

Glad you like your new bike. Like I said, I wish I had bought that one. If you do eventually upgrade to something else that KHS will make a great back up bike in case the new one is in the shop or you can just use it as a shopping, beater bike.

Zeppinger, yes it did! I did read your recommendation and several others for this bike, thanks for that, I'm very happy with it and I think it was a better deal then several others that were $100 more!

I just created a riding group, "Monterey Bay Easy Riders," on this forum and am looking for adult members for weekend rides on the California Monterey Bay Recreational Trail. Down the coast South as far as Pebble Beach and North as far as Marina. Adults with Hybreds and Cruisers looking for relaxed, rides to explore Lover's Point, The Cannary, Fishermans Warf, Fort Ord trails, etc.