Classic & Vintage - Assistance, please, oh Northwest bike folks?
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11-16-10, 04:20 PM
I considered all sorts of goofy titles for this thread... things like: "Wrenchin' with the Pup," and "Wrench-Wan Kenobi, you are my only hope..." but went with something a bit less... stupid.
So I have this Shogun. And I want to take it apart next week, early in the week (or one of the weekends bookending next week) so I can polish things to then put the appropriate pieces back on, with new bits where necessary. The bike is a bit of a disaster, and needs the cleaning badly. The problem is... I have no tools and no experience. Zero. Zip. None. Nada. I mean, I can change a tire, and I recently adjusted my seatpost. My sense of accomplishment was very high.
My new colleague was supposed to help with this. He offered, without my asking. Then he's doing that whole ignoring-emails-being-busy-forgetting-to-respond passive/aggressive thing folks do when they have offered to help you, refused your attempts to let them out of it, and then realized they don't actually want to help you. So I'm moving on.
Is there anyone in the greater Seattle area who'd like to help me wrench apart my Shogun? Knowing full well I'm going to want help putting things back together too, of course. Right now, all I need is to disassemble, so I can take things home and scrub/soak/polish them. Then in a month or so, I'd like to put them back together with some new stuff where necessary, most of which I have already aquired. I am fully prepared to offer food and beer in exchange for help, as well as my sparkling company.
11-16-10, 04:28 PM
Bummer yer not in Portland..We could give that shogun the 'Khatful' treatment.
11-16-10, 04:29 PM
I might be able to help. Check your PMs
11-16-10, 06:27 PM
Bummer yer not in Portland..We could give that shogun the 'Khatful' treatment.
Oh so shiney! I like it! I want to do that!
11-16-10, 06:29 PM
Roger and I are working on whether or not we can coordinate. I should specify: on Monday and Tuesday evenings, I have custody of my young son, so those evenings are out. But I have the whole week off, so days are good. Wednesday evening is good, if folks aren't too busy making stuffing. Saturdays are good.
And of course, I can do Saturdays or Wednesday-Thursday-Friday evenings, if that week won't work for anyone. I just thought I'd take advantage of my vacation. Mostly, though, I'm itching to get going, as this bike is going to be SWEET when it's done and it is decidedly NOT SWEET now.
I am fully prepared to offer food and beer in exchange for help, as well as my sparkling company. Anyone? Bueller?
You're in luck, I just happen to be between jobs at the moment. How far is Seattle from St. Louis?
11-16-10, 08:27 PM
You can get a start on things with a very small tool kit. It's not ideal, but you can make due for a lot of it with an adjustable wrench and a set of metric allan wrenches. It's always best to buy good tools, but inexpensive tools can get you by in a pinch, but they sometimes break. You buy a good tool once, use it for life and pass it on to the next generation.
We can help support you here on the forum. State what you want to pull apart first, we'll chime in with what tools you'll need and some how-to. There is a wealth of info on Sheldons site, but don't forget the Park tools website, and my current favorite resource: Bicycle tutor www.bicycletutor.com (http://www.bicycletutor.com) The reason I mention bicycle tutor to folks so often is because they have really easy-to-follow videos that explain and show what to do. You can buy tools over time as you go along from task to task.
11-16-10, 08:38 PM
You might also want to check with Wright Brothers Cycles in Ballard - Charles is the proprietor and has an area in the back for whomever wants to come in and wrench on their own bikes. Full tool support, bike stand - the works. I'm sure he'd accomodate - great guy, great company. Just across the Freemont bridge, 219 N 36th St, phone: 206-633-5132.
Good luck - and please post the beautification results!
Seriously, check out the bikery (http://www.thebikery.org/) near the international district in Seattle. They have both work trade for stand time and/or a very low stand paid rates and all the tools you would need. If you don't know what you are doing, you just ask. The idea is people helping each other figure out how to fix bikes. It is super cool. I want to spend more time there, but haven't had a lot of time...
11-16-10, 11:17 PM
2 good ideas in the posts above -- Wright Brothers and The Bikery.
11-17-10, 12:32 AM
Thanks, guys! I'm going to call Wright Bros tomorrow to start. Roger and I are working on a good time to meet and give the Shogun a quick disassembly. I really want to get started, as I'm super excited. I figure after I've done it once, I'll know the right basic tools to get, and the right ones to borrow :). Right now I own a pedal wrench. But the Shogun will need new MKS Sylvans put on, so that will be something!
It needs such an overhaul... I was going over it, head to toe, in my head today and essentially the components are good (Deore tri-colors, I think they're called?), but the rest of the bike is a disaster. It needs new tape, brake levers/hoods, cables, pads, tires and accessories. The frame is filthy and scratched from the fact that, despite its touring geometry, it has no water bottle braze-ons, so a loosely clamped water bottle cage has left its mark. The gears are rough, the saddle is shot, and the pedals are inexplicable to me (they are rat traps, but only on one side... yet they have no cages or straps attached. Death traps, would be more accurate, as they seem to be perpetually upside down!). The stem is a terrible H2O replacement stem.
The good news is that I have a replacement stock Shogun stem, dia compe NOS levers/hoods, VO stainless cables for brakes and derailleur, new VO leather bar tape, new Panasonic Pasellas, new MKS Sylvans, and will grab tubes and pads at the lbs. Then I can do the stainless VO fenders, a brown leather Turbo saddle from Wiggle, add a Blackburn rack, get panners, lights and a bell, and I will be ready. For something I'm apparently not ready for now :).
My BF thinks he's getting this bike. And maybe he is. We have the same inseam (I'm 5'5.5" and he's 6'2"!), but we don't have the same torso length, obviously. We'll see who fits the bike better when it's done. If I do, the Shogun will become my home errand bike/touring bike/possible commuter, and my Raleigh Sports is going to go live in our motorhome and become an errand bike, since the hills around my house are too big to ride without modifications I don't want to spend money on. If it doesn't, the BF will ride it and have fun. Of course, if I fit it, I'll have to buy him a new bike. That would be terrible, to have to buy another vintage steed and fix it up... gosh, I'd hate that. :)
Shogun as it is now:
shogun4 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/53355278@N06/4957778363/) by snarkypup (http://www.flickr.com/people/53355278@N06/), on Flickr
11-17-10, 01:02 AM
the bike looks very good
the bike looks very good
+1 - that's a nice looking "disaster".
11-17-10, 10:05 AM
+1 - that's a nice looking "disaster".
Well, it's a fixable disaster :). One of those. Rather than one that isn't fixable. The bike itself is amazing. It just needs cleaning and every tiny thing fixed.
11-17-10, 10:16 AM
I love the paint job with the cream head tube.
A Nitto Dirtdrop stem would look nice on there.
If you're still thinking about commuting that would be a great bike for it.
11-17-10, 03:21 PM
I'm so thinking this will end up as MY commuter/grocery store bike. As a new vintage bike gal, it's been hard to wrap my head around the idea of owning multiple bikes for multiple purposes. Most people just don't look at bikes that way. I've always had one bike that sort of worked for everything, and didn't do anything very well. Now I own three bikes, assuming I keep this one as my own, which all would do different tasks. I'm not sure I'm into three bikes. I know that sounds like heresy here, but I'm not much of a collector. I like to have a few, very useful things, not lots of things, even if they are all useful.
If I like this bike, in terms of the fit (and I may not. It's a tad bigger than the Panasonic, which I feel fits me very well, frame-wise), I would have to rethink the Raleigh's utility. I can't ride it as it is around my house, as we moved to the top of a tall hill and the Raleigh doesn't like that. It doesn't even like the hill leading into my cul-de-saq. So it would need a new cog, at least, and possibly new rims. Or it can go be a motorhome bike, which might suit it better. We tend to RV at relatively small towns, where a bike with pannier baskets is really useful and saves us having to drive to get eggs or a loaf of bread. It's a nice toodle-around-with-the-kids bike.
So yeah, the Shogun may end up as my primary bike for distance rides and packing anything. It's got plenty of braze-ons for front and rear racks, and I can clamp on a waterbottle with the best of 'em. Then the Panasonic can be my fun, quick, ride-like-the-wind day ride bike. That's really all I need. At that point, if this is still a passion, bikes will become charitable projects. I don't want more than a couple bikes. Clutter makes me nervous.
I just bought the Shogun a Sella Italia brown leather Turbo 1980 from Wiggle. I debated a Brooks, but I love the Turbo Robbie sent me for the Panasonic, and don't really want to break in a Brooks and then protect it with that fierce Brooks-love one has to have. I think I just want something comfy and rideable. It will go nicely with the brown leather VO wrap, and those stainless cables. Perty! Plus then if it's the BF's bike, he doesn't need a Brooks anyway :). He wouldn't appreciate one. He just wants a nice bike to ride.
I have time on Friday. So if you still need help, then PM me.
I've got to say your 'disaster' bike looks a lot better than my 'pretty decent' ones a new saddle (maybe a stem if you're so inclined) and you're in good shape. Even have a triple! Nice bike
11-17-10, 03:40 PM
I think for the Raleigh Sports the biggest bang for the buck is going to be the cog. I was just out in the barn last night thinking about how I was going to fix my wife's old single-speed cruiser. The cones are worn with pits in them, so I need to replace the coaster-brake hub. Of course they don't make that one anymore, but I have one that is 36 hole currently on a 20-inch rim that I plan on lacing to a 26" rim providing it's in adequate shape when I open it up. Where I'm going with this rambling is that I picked up a potential donor alloy front wheel and compared it to the current steel wheel and I failed to see the big difference in weight. Stopping power is a whole different argument however, if this were a commuter to be used in wet weather I wouldn't even consider reusing the steel rims. I know every little bit of weight counts, but this bike is a 10-mile ride max bike, running round the neighborhood. It's not a ride fast with the club bike, nor would new rims make it into one. I suspect a rear cog designed to get you up that hill will be a cheaper and quicker upgrade then re-lacing wheels. It will also tell you if the Raleigh can cut it or if It should just pull motorhome duty. It seems though that you're already leaning toward that option. You are wise to tackle the Shogun first before tearing apart another bike, now if I could just learn from your example.
11-17-10, 03:46 PM
Sorry, folks, if I sound like I don't get that this is a nice bike: "disaster" in relative terms. It's just dirty and needs to be either upgraded or have things replaced, but the main bike is excellent. The paint is really, really bad on the down tube from that waterbottle holder. Totally scraped off in spots. The frame has many small rusty spots where there is missing paint. Most of the nuts/bolts are rusty. Everything's covered in grime. It won't shift properly right now. So it feels worse than it is, I know. The photos really give you the overall, but the details are not quite as nice. Still, when it's cleaned up and shiny, when the paint is either touched up or shined-up or at least clear-coated for protection, when it has the new cables and saddle and bar tape and stem... it will be an amazing bike, I think. My other bike is in pristine condition, so this one saddens me and calls to me when I walk by. Everything on it needs attention, but once that attention is paid, it will be sweet.
Wright Bros charges a $30 lifetime co-op membership, and then I can use their space (and bring a helper) and tools anytime I like. So that's a great deal, and I'm all over it. I'm so excited to get started! I've been thinking about this project every spare second for days. I can't wait!
11-17-10, 04:06 PM
If you're considering selling your sports that you love so dearly perhaps consider mothballing it and hanging it in the attic...out of sight out of mind...when the time comes that you move to a house that's no longer at the top of Mt. Everest you might wish you still had it.
I say this having moved from a house in a (almost) perfectly flat town to a house at the top of the only hill in the same town. I hung up my Single Speed about a month after moving in. I won't live here forever though...
11-17-10, 04:30 PM
Oh I won't sell it. I'll either fix it, or put it in the motorhome. I still love the Root Beer Bomber. It's a pretty bike, and I want to keep it. Sentimentally, it's why I like vintage bikes. It's comfy for long, flat rides like nobody's business, and make me happy when I look at it. But if it's not practical at my home, I need to figure something out about that. And I'd never get my money out of it.
I think I'll give it a new cog this winter, and see where that leaves me. The brakes on this particular Sports weren't great to begin with, even with new Kool-Stops, so maybe next summer I'll learn how to make up a wheel set with some aluminum rims, to get the better braking and to be able to ride it in the rain. I'd still probably end up using it as a motorhome bike, but then it's a great motorhome bike, rather than one I'm setting aside because it's not what I wanted.
11-17-10, 04:31 PM
Or the Shogun could be too big. That's always a possibility too, as I can't really ride it now to find out.
11-17-10, 11:48 PM
So this will make all you experienced wrenchers smile. I swear, right now everything is a trial. I decided tonight I was going to change the tires on the Shogun. Simplest thing, right? Then I could ride it around a tiny bit and see how the size was.
Ah, no. Get the new tubes home, move the chain all the way over, free the rear wheel and pry off the tire/tube. Of course, didn't consider the rim tape. It's dead meat. No wonder the tire is flat! Every single spoke head was poking through, and the rubbery stuff just broke apart as I took off the tire. So I have no rim tape. Duh.
I take the other tire off. That thing is easily as old as the bike. Totally bald, but the tube is still holding air after months of sitting there. Its rim tape falls apart too, though at least it was intact until I removed the tire. So now I'm going to put the bare rims back on the bike. Bike falls over on the carpet as I reach for it. Derailleur shifts slightly on the screw that holds it to the drop-out. When I go to put the wheel back on, I can't. It's all funky and I don't actually know enough about derailleurs to adjust it. So I turn it anyway, and ease the wheel back in, get the chain on, and try rolling the tire. It's rubbing somewhere, but I can't tell where. The gears are so built up with grease I can hardly see which gear the chain is on! Realize I'm a total NEWB.
Glad I'm asking for help. :)
11-18-10, 01:01 AM
Trial and Error - we've all been there, SP - welcome to the club!
11-18-10, 07:16 AM
Thats just standard operating procedure, pick up wrench, loosen front wheel, set down wrench, remove front wheel, where did the wrench go, look for wrench, look for wrench some more, stand up, find you were sitting on wrench, try to remove rear wheel, realize this is the wrong wrench, where did that wrench go?
11-18-10, 01:16 PM
Thank heaven it's not just me! I sort of picture all you guys standing around in totally kitted-out shops, manfully extracting seat posts and using cone wrenches while I stare at my derailleur and think: I will never understand how this thing works. Never.
11-18-10, 02:25 PM
I sort of picture all you guys standing around in totally kitted-out shops, manfully extracting seat posts and using cone wrenches while I stare at my derailleur and think: I will never understand how this thing works. Never.
:lol: this made me laugh out loud :lol:
My "Shop" is wherever I park my bike and drag my little tool box over to :)
For some reason the cats always decide they want to play when my hands are wrist deep in gunk...and if I don't stop to give them attention they'll just team up on me and run off with a brake wire or an important bolt and make things interesting
Honestly the only thing that I have that even remotely resembles something in a real shop is my Park bike stand. Its probably the best tool purchase I've made. It makes anything that involves removing the wheels on a bike infinitely easier. Also it brings the bike up to a level where you don't have to crouch down to work on it.
Jimmy, I'm so glad to hear someone else loses wrenches as often as I do. When it comes to Allen Keys I am hopelessly misplacing them.
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