"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - Maintainable/target CTL levels....

Would be interesting to see what you guys target (or can maintain) before you are ready to race or in "top shape" and what CAT you race in.

Right now my CTL is 84 but im off a rest week (and been sick for a few days). Now that I am starting to turn the screws a bit with more SST and threshold work im guessing ill be in the mid 90s by the end of Feb and in the lower 100s by the first real race of the year in mid March. Comparing the last three years of winter training to this one, my CTL right now is 20+ points higher....... I considered 80-90 CTL a "peak" :innocent: :lol:

What cat are you?

Last year I peaked at about ~85 TSS/d CTL, wasn't riding enough to push it up there too much. (went from 5->3 tho)

This (training) season I started at CTL of 35 in October, it was at about 70 during Base 3(?) when I was hit by a car in late December.

Probably sitting back around 50 at the moment, I'm scared to look as I haven't touched the bike in three weeks.

As for what is maintainable for me, I think I could go higher than 85 during the season, and was planning on doing that before the injury.

Would be interesting to see what you guys target (or can maintain) before you are ready to race or in "top shape" and what CAT you race in.
This post seems particularly apropos http://forum.slowtwitch.com/cgi-bin/gforum.cgi?post=3165170;search_string=target%20ctl%20for%20triathlon;#3165170

My ctl is just under 100, my ramp rate from 50 back on October 15th was ~5 per week. But I have zero top end, I'm currently a one pump Chuck when it comes to red-lining. Racing started last Saturday, but for me, while I am showing up to play, it doesn't really start for another month.

My ctl is just under 100, my ramp rate from 50 back on October 15th was ~5 per week. But I have zero top end, I'm currently a one pump Chuck when it comes to red-lining. Racing started last Saturday, but for me, while I am showing up to play, it doesn't really start for another month.

Interesting thread. I got up around 80 CTL in the middle of the season, but dropped down to 11 during the winter at one point. Are you guys saying your CTL never dips below 40-50 during the offseason?

Interesting thread. I got up around 80 CTL in the middle of the season, but dropped down to 11 during the winter at one point. Are you guys saying your CTL never dips below 40-50 during the offseason?

I stepped off the bike on September 30th with a CTL of 75. Two weeks later when I got back on the bike it was 50. I did nothing but read, hike, swim, and drink beer during the two weeks off. As of this morning, it's 98.

http://www.astro.ufl.edu/~ken/pmc_end_jan.png

I have more upside down shark fins than you in my CTL. I suck.

I can get up to 120 for a month or so. Any higher and I'm digging a hole instead of improving. 80-100 is normal during the season.

But I don't do much intensity and I do a lot of 5 hour climbing rides that score well over 300 TSS. If your training has a lot of intensity (because you're training for crits instead of long road races) then the CTL you'd aim for would be lower.

I feel inadequate

interesting topic. last year, my first with power and first racing, i topped out around 70ish. i dabbled in a little running and downtime in Oct & Nov dropping it in the 50s. by the looks of things i will finish up base near last years peak CTL. later.

This post seems particularly apropos http://forum.slowtwitch.com/cgi-bin/gforum.cgi?post=3165170;search_string=target%20ctl%20for%20triathlon;#3165170

Made me giggle.

I peaked at 70 in September. (I am a Cat 3) It was just based on HR. I'll be curious to see what improvements can be made with power monitoring now.

I peaked at 70 in September. (I am a Cat 3) It was just based on HR. I'll be curious to see what improvements can be made with power monitoring now.

was this trimp points? What program did you use to calculate stress?

was this trimp points? What program did you use to calculate stress?

hrTSS:

http://support.trainingpeaks.com/personal-edition/training-stress-scores.aspx#hrTSS

hrTSS:

http://support.trainingpeaks.com/personal-edition/training-stress-scores.aspx#hrTSS
thanks for the reply

i take it that you have to pay for wko+ in order to use it?

The paid version of Training Peaks. I'm not sure what more I'd be getting in using WKO+. More charts and graphs maybe?

i usually run a CTL of about 12.3

I'm only vaguely aware of what this means.

I'm only vaguely aware of what this means.

Don't go to Europe.

thanks for the reply

i take it that you have to pay for wko+ in order to use it?

Golden Cheetah gives you similar functions for free. I ended up going with WKO more out of herd mentality. Golden Cheetah has a really cool CdA calculator that's fun to play with.

So, if I'm already logging a year's worth of diet and HR data into trainingpeaks.com, do I have to go with WKO+ to build on that or can it talk to Golden Cheetah?

Golden Cheetah gives you similar functions for free. I ended up going with WKO more out of herd mentality. Golden Cheetah has a really cool CdA calculator that's fun to play with.

it does, but trimp is somehow not working for me at the present and just crashed GC... I also wonder if the WKO HR stress is more comparable to stress scores based on power186882

So, if I'm already logging a year's worth of diet and HR data into trainingpeaks.com, do I have to go with WKO+ to build on that or can it talk to Golden Cheetah?

the paid online version is really just as good as WKO+, unless you are a coach or doing multi file quadrant this and thats. you get all the goodies online now; TSS, hrTSS, PMC, NP, ect....

you could upgrade, then go back and calculate hrTSS for those workouts. later.

it does, but trimp is somehow not working for me at the present and just crashed GC..


report the bug: http://goldencheetah.org/bug-tracker.html

the paid online version is really just as good as WKO+, unless you are a coach or doing multi file quadrant this and thats. you get all the goodies online now; TSS, hrTSS, PMC, NP, ect....

you could upgrade, then go back and calculate hrTSS for those workouts. later.

Perfect. That's exactly what I wanted to know. Thanks.

Gonna install the Quarq tonight and collect my first power data on tomorrow's group ride.

remember how I jokes about CTL being 12 something...

I started in December with a CTL of 11.9...that's what taking 2 months off will do to you...

i am up to like 36 right now with a peak last year of high 50's...it's going to be a rough start to the year..good new though, first race is a little over a week from now.

much better...forgot about some rides without power to put into Golden Cheetah...I now have a CTL of 53, much better, the 36 was depressing

Perfect. That's exactly what I wanted to know. Thanks.

Gonna install the Quarq tonight and collect my first power data on tomorrow's group ride.

Sorry to hijack, but I'd love to get my hands on a Quarq... Lucky you. What's the head unit?

it does, but trimp is somehow not working for me at the present and just crashed GC... I also wonder if the WKO HR stress is more comparable to stress scores based on power[/ATTACH]

Grr, I'm having the same problem. I changed it from Bikescore to trimp just out of curiosity and now any time I click on the PM tab it makes my whole computer stop working. I can't even change it back. Any thoughts?

What i'd suggest is to force the thing to close. When it opens up again, you'll be on the "ride summary" tab of your last ride. Delete all the rides, go over to performance manager. Change from trimp back to bikescore, and re-import all of your rides.

Sorry to hijack, but I'd love to get my hands on a Quarq... Lucky you. What's the head unit?

Garmin 500. It's funny, I got it for a song at the silent auction at the ToC presentation dinner last May. Finally scraped up enough scratch to make an order from our brother Psimet. The Quarq installed easily -- it was time for a new BB anyway. Fired up the Garmin, and the Quarq talked to it immediately. Easy peasy.

I started with a baseline of 50 in September and got up to 80 a couple of weeks ago. Backing down now for the last few weeks of Base. Can someone explain why there are no big jagged movements in my CTL graph? It's a relatively smooth ramp up with a rounding top. Is there a way to exaggerate the vertical scale?

I started with a baseline of 50 in September and got up to 80 a couple of weeks ago. Backing down now for the last few weeks of Base. Can someone explain why there are no big jagged movements in my CTL graph? It's a relatively smooth ramp up with a rounding top. Is there a way to exaggerate the vertical scale?

CTL is an exponential moving average, where the time constant is 42 days. Each new data point has a weight of 2.35% while the old average value has a weight of 97.65% (exp(-1/42)).
ATL, on the other hand, has a time constant of 7 days. Each new data point has a weight of 13.31% while the old value has a weight of 86.69%.

much better...forgot about some rides without power to put into Golden Cheetah...I now have a CTL of 53, much better, the 36 was depressing

I was at 36 before today's session. And I have all of my rides in :(

I was at 36 before today's session. And I have all of my rides in :(

but you just got a ptap, right? if so, CTL is meaningless unless you give it 50 days, with 84 days preferred.

but you just got a ptap, right? if so, CTL is meaningless unless you give it 50 days, with 84 days preferred.

how does that make sense? LTS is the past 40 or 42 days by default and lts is the past 7 days by default.

but you just got a ptap, right? if so, CTL is meaningless unless you give it 50 days, with 84 days preferred.

Oh no...I seeded the information a long ways back. 36 is my real number (actually 38 after today's workout). However I dropped from 64 on 10/31 to 32 on 1/2 due to knee surgery. So I'm slowly clawing my way back up.

how does that make sense? LTS is the past 40 or 42 days by default and lts is the past 7 days by default.

Say you start using a powertap, say on November 1st. You started training in mid-September. Your LTS on November 2nd should not be ~2-3, but if you don't have the data, it'll show up as 2-3, alas the need for "seeding" as mentioned by JohnKScott

102 after todays throwdown.

Not only is that my CTL, that's also my temp.

102 after todays throwdown.

Not only is that my CTL, that's also my temp.

What kind for weekly TSS are you hitting on your non-recovery weeks?

I broke the 900 barrier twice (940 and 960), but typically 750-800 is my target.

Get well soon, kensuf.

Ctl is somewhat individualistic in terms of sustainability and also is dependent upon how it was built. I tend to perform best at ctl between 85 and low 90s and tsb btwn -10 and 5. Last year I was in high 90s and felt good (late may) but then started suffering from chronic cramping and even if wattages were good, I felt like I was fighting my bike. Reducing ctl to low 80s then maintaing a little higher and I was good again.

Getting ctl over 100 while properly adjusting ftp and integrating vo2 and awc work sent me backward last year. Coach friend of mine told me it does most of his athletes except those who can build much of that # with big volume.

Ctl is somewhat individualistic in terms of sustainability and also is dependent upon how it was built. I tend to perform best at ctl between 85 and low 90s and tsb btwn -10 and 5. Last year I was in high 90s and felt good (late may) but then started suffering from chronic cramping and even if wattages were good, I felt like I was fighting my bike. Reducing ctl to low 80s then maintaing a little higher and I was good again.

Getting ctl over 100 while properly adjusting ftp and integrating vo2 and awc work sent me backward last year. Coach friend of mine told me it does most of his athletes except those who can build much of that # with big volume.

That make a lot of sense compared to my limited knowledge.

I had hopes this year of maintaining a fairly high ctl (for me) like in the 60's through the fall and then build up to never before seen heights during next season (anything above 70-75). 6+ weeks of reduced load due to knee surgery squelched that dream :D.

I have a question...is it useless if I am not riding with the PT for a few weeks to keep tracking miles vs time into Golden cheetah? My CTL and SB should be effected correctly based on miles and time right?

or since I am not using power is it useless to load the data?

I have a question...is it useless if I am not riding with the PT for a few weeks to keep tracking miles vs time into Golden cheetah? My CTL and SB should be effected correctly based on miles and time right?

or since I am not using power is it useless to load the data?

you should enter your data.