Classic & Vintage - Help Me Choose Racks and Panniers For My Touring Bike

I could have my Voyageur on the road very soon, but I have been putting off choosing racks for it. I'm not really sure how much actual touring I'll do on it, but I would like to ride it from my home in Louisville to my childhood home in western Kentucky (approx. 210 miles) via US Hwy 60. Despite the fact that I may only use the racks on occasion, I want it to be ready when I am. I already have a rando type bike.

I currently only have the VO Pass Hunter rack with integrated decaleur.
http://store.velo-orange.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/530x530/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/p/a/pass_hunter_with_integrated_decaleur_1.jpg
The front fork also has lowrider bosses and double eyelets at the dropout.

Yesterday's blog post (http://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2011/01/new-camper-racks.html) from VO got me thinking about racks again and I'd like some input from all of you here, especially those with experience using any of the racks I may consider.

I'd be all over that rear VO Camper rack, but it's just a prototype at this point. I had also considered the Dajia Expedition rack, but it is out of stock and I'm ready to order a rack.

I understand that carrying the weight as low as possible is best, and I'm assuming if I have panniers only at the front OR rear, the rear would be best.

The bike is looking pretty dang good and I want a quality, classic looking rack. I'm considering the following:


Nitto Mt Campee: standard shaped rear rack that mounts to the dropout eyelets and, I guess, my choice of the canti studs or seat stay braze ons. (no fender mount - WTF, Nitto?)
Nitto Campee 27: this looks like it holds the panniers lower than the Mt Campee and offers more support for them
Surly Rear Rack: I think I could mount a Spanninga Plateo light (which I have) to the Surly, but not to either Nitto rack


Are there others I'm overlooking? Should I consider a front lowrider rack as well?

And I'm completely ignorant regarding panniers. What features should I be looking for in panniers?

Nitto Mt. Campee
http://img1.qbp.com/6SPsvm45//prodl/RK1003.jpg

Nitto Campee 27
http://img1.qbp.com/6SPsvm45/prodl/RK1004.jpg

Surly Rear Rack
http://img1.qbp.com/6SPsvm45//prodl/RK0103.jpg

What about a stainless steel Tubus?

I could be mistaken, but I believe the Campy 27 does not hold the panniers lower. It just has removal pieces that keep the panniers from going into the spokes. You can remove those pieces when not touring and still have a rear top platform for small things or a large saddle bag. On the front rack the pieces that attach are indeed low rider mounts, but I don't think that is the case with the rear Campy rack.

For panniers I'd never use anything other than Ortlieb or Arkels. Both are water proof and pretty bomb proof. Neither will look vintage, but in situations like touring you should be less concerned with looks than function, and nothing vintage will stack up to the new stuff when it comes to panniers.

Unfortunately you just missed a great sale on Ortlieb stuff at half price at Best Buy of all places...

oh and RE: rack's - the nitto touring racks hands down. Maybe the VO ones will be just as nice if you can wait.

I might know where there is a good deal on a nitto front campee rack at my LBS. He's had it sitting there for 3 years and said he'd give me a killer price. I dont need it so let me know..

you would be very pleased with a tubus.

also, nitto r15.

bruce gordon low-riders or rear rack pc'ed by him to match frame.

caradice, ortlieb, acorn, berthoud luggage.

What about a stainless steel Tubus?

Like the Cosmo? Sure, I'd consider that.

http://www.thetouringstore.com/TUBUS/Cosmo/Tubus-Cosmo-1.jpg


For panniers I'd never use anything other than Ortlieb or Arkels. Both are water proof and pretty bomb proof. Neither will look vintage, but in situations like touring you should be less concerned with looks than function, and nothing vintage will stack up to the new stuff when it comes to panniers.

Unfortunately you just missed a great sale on Ortlieb stuff at half price at Best Buy of all places...

oh and RE: rack's - the nitto touring racks hands down. Maybe the VO ones will be just as nice if you can wait.

I might know where there is a good deal on a nitto front campee rack at my LBS. He's had it sitting there for 3 years and said he'd give me a killer price. I dont need it so let me know..

Thanks for info, Brian. A front Nitto Campee would have to replace the Pass Hunter, which I would consider had I not already drilled a hole in my powdercoated fender corresponding to the Pass Hunter's boss.

Like the Cosmo? Sure, I'd consider that.

http://www.thetouringstore.com/TUBUS/Cosmo/Tubus-Cosmo-1.jpg

I run stainless steel Tubus racks front and rear on my commuter and I couldn't be happier with them (and my Ortlieb panniers).

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4113/5172222625_b455c5bac0_z.jpg

Sweet commuter, sloping TT and all.

I think one of the nitto campees (32R) has at least a single hole in which you could mount a tail light. if you need two holes horizontal, there are adapters for this sort of thing.

"Unfortunately you just missed a great sale on Ortlieb stuff at half price at Best Buy of all places..."

Haha, I think they raised their prices back up because so many people from this forum were snagging up all of that cheap stuff and practically putting them out of business. I managed to order 2 Ortlieb racks (each for cheaper than an entry-level Blackburn rack) at the discounted price. I'm probably going to put them on my touring/commuting bike, we'll see how that goes.

As for Panniers, I just bought a set of Ortlieb Sport Packer Plus and Ortlieb Bike Packer Plus from thetouringstore.com at the suggestion of members of this forum, I've been pleased with them so far. I use the former for daily use, the latter for grocery store runs, and for touring (one of these years when I get back around to that). I just brought home about 40 lbs of groceries the other day (the girl working as a bagger at HEB seemed to be having a good time trying to get all of my groceries in the two panniers).

Once you do the initial adjustment and get it right, they slip on and off in seconds, and stay secure on the rack once they are on without bouncing off.

The Ortliebs are also VERY durable. Not long ago, my knucklehead didn't put the panniers on right, and one of them got jammed up in my wheel; grinding my bike to a halt. While I snapped two spokes in that wheel at the nipples in the process, the pannier had only a few scratches in the durable plastic frame. Just make sure, when you put the pannier on, that the inside of the panner is all resting completely against the side of the rack frame, and not hanging out behind the rack frame and the chainstays. Better to bump your heels against the pannier from time to time than to risk jamming one in your rear wheel and possibly eating an asphalt and blood sandwich.

As said: Ortlieb. When I did my first tour 25 some years ago they were the ones to have. That's still the case today.

Just playing devil's advocate here please don't take offense.

High quality touring setup with racks & bags can easily run $500+. Wouldn't you really want to try touring first to see if you will actually enjoy it before you buy all this pricey equipment? You can do the small tour you are planning with nashbar racks and bike buckets (http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/Buckets) it just won't look as fancy, but you can figure out what works for you.

^ That's a completely valid point and I'm not offended. For this purpose, though, let's imagine that someone gave me $300-350 with the stipulation that I only use it for a rear and/or front rack and panniers.

To be completely honest with you, function is my number one priority, but that doesn't mean aesthetics have to suffer. I think anyone would balk at putting the money and effort I have into this bike and then hanging a cheap aluminum rack and plastic buckets on it. Granted, I understand they may work as well as anything else.

In terms of being both useful and good-looking, I don't think anyone beats Frost River (http://www.frostriver.com/bike_bags/hwy1_panniers.html). Waxed canvas, but a bit of a pain to mount/remove from the rack. Dunno much about these Basil panniers, but they certainly look awesome as well (and appear to be a joint collab w/Brooks?) http://www.flickr.com/photos/huggerindustries/1464712064/.

Aesthetically, Minnehaha panniers are fantastic, and I think would match the uniform, simple color scheme of your Voyageur. http://www.minnehahabags.com/canvas-utility-pannier/. Unlike a lot of other nice looking panniers, they are easy to mount/remove. Big downside: not waterproof. These are not true touring panniers, more classy around-towners.

I personally use the Axiom Seymour panniers - don't look as classy, but 2 of them were less than 1 Minnehaha pannier, and they are fairly water resistant. If price isn't an issue, +1 for performance points on the Arkel and Ortliebs. Those things are the most durable and waterproof bags you can find!

I wish I knew more about good racks. In terms of hardware, I've only bought what is "good for the money" - I have an Axiom Streamliner rack on my Voyageur - under $25.

Colonel: I am currently facing the same decision as you for a new set of racks. I've narrowed it down to two choices:

1. Surly Nice in silver (front and rear racks)
2. Tubus Nova & Tubus Cosmo stainless steel

Price differential is almost $150 less for the Surly set of racks (about $220 total). Tubus stainless steel won't corrode, but $365 for both racks makes me wonder if it's worth it. The big difference between you and I is that you've put major effort and money into a nice bike remodel. I just bought my touring bike ('84 Miyata 610) for $100. So, I'm leaning toward the Surlys.

I have owned both surly and tubus racks on a commuter and touring bikes. I sold off both of the surly racks and kept the tubus racks. The mounting of the front surly is a flaw and prone to breaking ( mounting tabs and not the actual rack). The other downside to surly racks are the weight. Switching my LHT from surly to tubus racks dropped 2.5 lbs! I agree with the others as well for panniers, Arkel or Ortlieb. I choose Ortlieb and couldn't be happier with that choice.

I would check out the bike bag shop for your tubus and ortlieb needs. I bought my rear rack and front roller from them. They had some of the best prices I found, and include free shipping for orders over $99.
http://www.bikebagshop.com/

One thought on panniers. Both the Ortlieb and the Arkel are superior quality. One difference (and I'm not sure whether it is still true) -- Arkels are more likely to scratch the rack or wear off the paint/powder coat. This would be more of a problem with the Surly or the non-stainless Tubus. Axiom makes nice low cost in-town racks, but I think that Tubus, Nitto and Surly are better for heavier use. You might look at the prices of Tubus racks at British online shops. There are occasionally deals to be had there (and they have the silver versions of the Cargo, Vega etc. if you prefer silver and don't want the cost and strength reduction of stainless).

I have owned both surly and tubus racks on a commuter and touring bikes. I sold off both of the surly racks and kept the tubus racks. The mounting of the front surly is a flaw and prone to breaking ( mounting tabs and not the actual rack). The other downside to surly racks are the weight. Switching my LHT from surly to tubus racks dropped 2.5 lbs!

This is very good info to take into account! Thx!

^ Agreed!

Jesse, those Frost River panniers are fantastic looking. The Minnehaha panniers are a candidate; too bad they're not waterproof. I wonder if you could treat them with a water repellant.

Very good suggestions and advice, everyone. It is much appreciated. Keep it coming!

^ Agreed!

Jesse, those Frost River panniers are fantastic looking. The Minnehaha panniers are a candidate; too bad they're not waterproof. I wonder if you could treat them with a water repellant.

Very good suggestions and advice, everyone. It is much appreciated. Keep it coming!

Probably - either a spray or a waxing. I doubt either would be permanent, however. The Frost Rivers are very neat - and I'm not sure if you caught it, but the rod that ties the top down is actually an uncut tree branch. I thought that was a neat touch.

i would never tour with anything that is a pain to get on or off the bike, or that wasnt waterproof without treatment. Actually I have done both, and it sucked.

But it was a good point, if you're only going to tour one weekend a year or whatever, maybe you can go with something functionally inferior/cheaper.

Jesse, they're very cool, but I'd prefer to have a matching front bag (box) and they don't offer one. Pretty expensive, too.

Brian, as much as I'd like to, my responsibilities at work, home and with my band aren't going to allow touring for more than a week. Actually, when I do the 210 miles to western Kentucky, my wife will probably bring me back in the car after visiting with my family for a few days. I realize I could get away with doing this on my rando bike, but I'm going to see this bike build through to the end. It's what I want and that's reason enough for me. These bike builds are going to be few and far between when kids enter the picture.

tubus racks are very nice and strong. if the stainless models are prohibitively expensive, consider the cargo with a tara up front. i know they're black, and y'all elegant types require silver stuff, but they're too classic for that to matter, imo.

-rob

ps-got mine at www.thetouringstore.com ; price is right, shipping's included, and Wayne is a nice guy.

Cool site. Thanks, Rob. I'm not sure if I'm elegant, but I don't mind my bike to be. The front rack is stainless, so I'd much prefer the rear rack to be. I'm not considering black racks.

Cool site. Thanks, Rob. I'm not sure if I'm elegant, but I don't mind my bike to be. The front rack is stainless, so I'd much prefer the rear rack to be. I'm not considering black racks.

totally understandable, but undeniably "elegant".

=D

-rob

Cool site. Thanks, Rob. I'm not sure if I'm elegant, but I don't mind my bike to be. The front rack is stainless, so I'd much prefer the rear rack to be. I'm not considering black racks.

I'm with rob here. I got my ortlieb bags from the same place and they are pretty fantastic (Classy gray was the direction I took it). I have them on a black Jandd Extreme Front rack, which doesn't look classic, but works well for touring and my all black Fuji. However, I can't recommend it because the coating started coming off immediately after using it. I would also recommend going with a Tubus or Nitto rack, as everything I've heard about the Surly racks leads me to believe that they are insanely heavy and built for the apocalypse. (if i'm commuting across Mongolia, i'd probably go all steel all Surly, but, well, I'm not)

Here's another resource: http://nordicgroup.us/bicycleluggageracks/rear/#REI_736-733-0011_
I got the REI rack mentioned here, and for the REALLY cheap price of twenty something bucks, I can't complain, and it's silver in color, which obviously counts for something.

lastly, even though you're not looking for a black rack, here's the Planet Bike knock off from the Tubus style rack, which I'm quite happy with: http://ecom1.planetbike.com/4005.html

I'd like to repeat what one other poster said about trying it out on the cheap before investing a ton of money. then again, I don't know what there isn't to like about touring, and you can always sell the gear to one of us if you really dislike it! Let us know what you end up with!

geoff

Jesse, they're very cool, but I'd prefer to have a matching front bag (box) and they don't offer one. Pretty expensive, too.

Brian, as much as I'd like to, my responsibilities at work, home and with my band aren't going to allow touring for more than a week. Actually, when I do the 210 miles to western Kentucky, my wife will probably bring me back in the car after visiting with my family for a few days. I realize I could get away with doing this on my rando bike, but I'm going to see this bike build through to the end. It's what I want and that's reason enough for me. These bike builds are going to be few and far between when kids enter the picture.

kids? Bah!
no you're right, my wrenching time def aint the same since kids...

Anyway, I'm not telling you to to cut corners or that the number of days you tour matter. See it through to the end. All I'm sayin' is that if you're going to tour, forget the vintage stuff when it comes to bags and you'll be happy 1 or 7 days into your tour. IMO if you want to do it right that's the way to go.
I love vintage as much as the next guy, except when I get to camp and my crap is wet.

Now Im going to sound like a know-it-all/braggart but I've been on probably 12-15 one to four week long tours in in all conditions and with all kinds of gear, so I'm just telling you what's worked for me. If someone made a vintage looking pannier that performed as well as an Ortlieb or Arkel I'd be the first ****** to buy it.

Anyhow, what do I know. Your results may vary, and if you're like me, you'll need to learn on your own anyway.

You've sold me, dude. I make plenty of mistakes on my own. I could stand to get it right the first time every now and then. Any particular style or model you'd recommend?

Thanks again for all the help here. I appreciate it.

These bike builds are going to be few and far between when kids enter the picture.

Can't advise you a single bit about touring, :o although I will be engaged in a similar build with my '88 Cannondale ST400 in a few weeks. This thread has been very helpful.
:thumb:

But kids, well since I've only had one and she is 18 and will graduate HS in June and head off to college (UK is her top choice), now I can tell you about how one changes your life.

In my case, both me and my wife are employed. But since she works for this BIG computer company, she has traveled with her job for at least 25 of her 28 years. When my wife was gone it is just Dad and Daughter. :innocent:

So, I taught myself how to french braid my her hair :p, coach soccer, film basket ball games, assist in Ken and Barbie weddings, learn all the characters and history of Thomas the Tank Engine, not get too paranoid that girls don't wear helmets when they play lacrosse, organize sleepovers for a dozen girls, shop at Gap Kids, Areopostal, and now Victoria Secret, and then eventually there were Boys in the picture. :eek: Etc., etc., etc.

Now with all that said, it was worth every second, but your time becomes your child's (or children's) time, and there is no way around this.

I finally started regaining some of my own time back about 3 years ago and it has now gradually increased, to where I'm going nuts (in a good way) with the bikes! :lol:

Last week in NH-CL there was an LBS for sale near where Tugrul lives, and I could actually afford to purchase it. What was I thinking!?! I'm finally regaining time and I wanted to fill it up by becoming a small business owner!?! I quickly came to my senses! :twitchy:

I'd go Ortliebs or Arkels.

http://www.arkel-od.com/

http://www.bikebagshop.com/ortlieb-panniers-c-32.html?gclid=CMLDjsawy6YCFUdrKgodxU9sIg

Here's a potential good deal on a set of Ortliebs:

http://forums.serotta.com/showthread.php?t=84501

I've used these for twenty+ years, and have done a little distance riding in Europe and America.

Never let me down.

As for the the Surly racks being heavy, yes they are.

I have front and rear Nice racks, and they are, shall we say, overbuilt.

For my new John Hollands, I will have a custom rack for the front, built by:

http://capricornbicycles.blogspot.com/

My front mount Ortliebs will hang on the JH on a 700+ mile journey this summer.

You've sold me, dude. I make plenty of mistakes on my own. I could stand to get it right the first time every now and then. Any particular style or model you'd recommend?

Thanks again for all the help here. I appreciate it.

just look up the Ortliebs and pick one, you can't go wrong. I've used older style back and front rollers. I also have an Ortlieb office bag for commuting and it's awesome. I could probably float it down a river with my laptop in it and not worry about it getting wet.

My son is only 18 months old and I'm already thinking about doing a build for him.

My son is only 18 months old and I'm already thinking about doing a build for him.

I don't even have kids yet and I'm thinking about multiple builds. No bun in the oven yet, Pastor Bob. My wife is type A and thinks about things well in advance. I love kids so I'm ready anytime but am plenty content to just keep practicing. ;)

I've ruled the Surly racks out. They look pretty good, but I don't need anything to survive the apocalypse.

Re: kids. You have NO idea. But it is worth it.

I'm curious why Blackburn racks are not even worth a mention?

I'm no longer doing long distance touring, but I've done my share of multi-country tours. Many, many people have toured long distance with Blackburn racks. Are they just now too passé to be considered?

I still love Blackburn racks, because of the look (to which I'm long accustomed, of course). Finding a nice silver one is tough, tho. I'm in search of a rear in silver, myself.

For bags, I have a number of smaller, one-offs picked up for daily use. But for the long-haul it is basically Ortliebs. Or Ortliebs. For daily use, however, they're often too much bag.

The Tubus racks also attract me, but I don't like those models with the upturn points ending just behind the saddle. I just see something snagging on one of those during a dismount or somesuch. Not all of their models have this "feature", thankfully.

Re: kids. You have NO idea. But it is worth it.

I'm curious why Blackburn racks are not even worth a mention?

I'm no longer doing long distance touring, but I've done my share of multi-country tours. Many, many people have toured long distance with Blackburn racks. Are they just now too passé to be considered?

I still love Blackburn racks, because of the look (to which I'm long accustomed, of course). Finding a nice silver one is tough, tho. I'm in search of a rear in silver, myself.

For bags, I have a number of smaller, one-offs picked up for daily use. But for the long-haul it is basically Ortliebs. Or Ortliebs. For daily use, however, they're often too much bag.

The Tubus racks also attract me, but I don't like those models with the upturn points ending just behind the saddle. I just see something snagging on one of those during a dismount or somesuch. Not all of their models have this "feature", thankfully.

When I began this build, I had intended to use a rear Jim Blackburn rack and a front Blackburn CL-1. I had them both. I've powdercoated the frame and the bars, saddle, brakes, brake levers, wheelset, etc are not original and decidedly more modern (though still pretty classic looking). Blackburns would work just dandy, I've just decided I want something different. I still have the rear rack (brake bridge mount). Email me if you're interested.

The Ortlieb Back-Roller Plus is a good looking set. I dig this color too. As of now I'm leaning toward the Nitto Mt Campee rear rack.

http://www.ortliebusa.com/cartgenie/images/large/F518.jpg

Nice. Subtle and classy colors. They'll last forever, too.

(oh, and an email sent about that rack...!)

LL

But kids, well since I've only had one and she is 18 and will graduate HS in June and head off to college (UK is her top choice), now I can tell you about how one changes your life.

In my case, both me and my wife are employed. But since she works for this BIG computer company, she has traveled with her job for at least 25 of her 28 years. When my wife was gone it is just Dad and Daughter. :innocent:

So, I taught myself how to french braid my her hair :p, coach soccer, film basket ball games, assist in Ken and Barbie weddings, learn all the characters and history of Thomas the Tank Engine, not get too paranoid that girls don't wear helmets when they play lacrosse, organize sleepovers for a dozen girls, shop at Gap Kids, Areopostal, and now Victoria Secret, and then eventually there were Boys in the picture. :eek: Etc., etc., etc.

Now with all that said, it was worth every second, but your time becomes your child's (or children's) time, and there is no way around this.

I finally started regaining some of my own time back about 3 years ago and it has now gradually increased, to where I'm going nuts (in a good way) with the bikes! :lol:


My daughter is 5.

186916

My wife works late much of the time, so I've had to learn some of the same skills. It really changes your life. Good heads up for what's ahead.

I just wanted to quickly chime in to say that this is one hell of a valuable thread, especially for those of us who are considering or have just purchased touring/rando bikes and are beginning the search for racks/panniers. Sorry I'm not adding much to the overall post, but I'm certain this thread will be critical information for those who choose to utilize the search feature in the future.

Kids love bike touring. You just have to pick your tours with them in mind. 3 kids here ages 8, 5, & 1. We do a rail trail bike tour/camping a year. This will be my first year with all 3 kids along. Photo from last year along the New River trail in VA. BTW my cheap bags & racks work fine ;)

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm26/mparker326/IMG_0086.jpg

I believe that Nitto rack is intended to take low rider front panniers on the rear. I realize that is less stuff than you may want to take on tour. Maybe add a saddlebag to increase capacity? If you're ok with front panniers reduced capacity, I've found the VO constructeur to be a wonderful rack that is surprisingly strong. I haven't toured with it but I've done some overnight camping trips with a fair amount of weight.

Aesthetically the Nitto Campee is by far and away the most beautiful rear rack made.

I have a mismash of panniers. Two Jandd Mini Mtn's for the front. They are well made. I like Jandd, have a few of their under seat packs as well. I also have an Arkel rear Utility Basket which I have toured with which is really well made. Lots of thought seems to go into them, they have lots of pockets and have held up well. Recently, I picked up an Ortlieb rear pannier (from CL) with the rollup top. I am impressed with it too. The way Ortlieb does seams is impressive to me and you can see why they are waterproof. The Ortliebs have no outside pockets, but if you are concerned about riding in the rain, they would seem to be the best of the three. I also like the way the Ortlieb attaches to the rack, very easy on an off and by far the easiest of the three.

I believe that Nitto rack is intended to take low rider front panniers on the rear. I realize that is less stuff than you may want to take on tour. Maybe add a saddlebag to increase capacity?
Aesthetically the Nitto Campee is by far and away the most beautiful rear rack made.

Are you referring to the Nitto Campee 27? If so, I think you're right, which is why I'm leaning toward the Nitto Mt Campee. It looks like it is made for large rear panniers.

I have a mismash of panniers. Two Jandd Mini Mtn's for the front. They are well made. I like Jandd, have a few of their under seat packs as well. ..

I had some jandd bags for a long time commuting, i guess i got mine around the turn of the century. good, sturdy bags, yes, but not actually waterproof. The fabric was waterproof, and the seams seemed waterproof, too. But the zippers were not. These were mini mountains. The zippers had rain flaps, which i used diligently, but i always found a teaspoon of water in the bottom after a downpour. I took to wrapping anything susceptible to water damage in plastic bags...

hth
-=rob

^ Agreed!

Jesse, those Frost River panniers are fantastic looking. The Minnehaha panniers are a candidate; too bad they're not waterproof. I wonder if you could treat them with a water repellant.

Very good suggestions and advice, everyone. It is much appreciated. Keep it coming!

I've bought two Minnehaha bags. The nicest thing I can say is: I'm glad I got both at a deep discount. They are very poorly made. The medium saddlebag was on my bicycle for a week and the lining started to pull out. The small one really does not close securely.

I had some jandd bags for a long time commuting, i guess i got mine around the turn of the century. good, sturdy bags, yes, but not actually waterproof. The fabric was waterproof, and the seams seemed waterproof, too. But the zippers were not. These were mini mountains. The zippers had rain flaps, which i used diligently, but i always found a teaspoon of water in the bottom after a downpour. I took to wrapping anything susceptible to water damage in plastic bags...

hth
-=rob

I have never tried any of my panniers in the rain, but would not trust any of the ones I own but the Ortliebs to keep stuff inside dry in the rain.
Orliebs not only are made of waterproof material, but waterproof seams. When I bought it (used) I decided to clean it, so I filled it up with soapy water and scrubbed away.
I did not see any water leak. I assume they would be as good in the opposite direction, but never tried this out. Maybe one day I will pack it and leave it outside in the rain. The beauty of Ortliebs is no zippers!

I rode a touring bike made for me by Roger Jansen in 1979 evey day for 19 years untill the frame cracked and now I'm on its clone every day. Jansen's design incorporated a lowered rear rack similar to the one you have illustrated. The lowered center of gravity this design offers really increases stability during hard cornering or braking. Get the lowered rear rack. Jansen also built lowered front racks. Togather they make for a stable ride inspite of the load. Carry bulky, light items; your tent poles and sleeping bag wrapped in the tent fly on the rear platform. Heavy items go in the bottoms of the bags.

I put some Blackburns I had hanging in the basement on my Carlton. I don't know, might be something better, but these seem perfect to me. I have some bags here somewhere...

Now has a trunk on the bag so I can carry my wife's stuff...

My advice for touring: you need a lot less stuff than you think you need. My one big bike tour was 2 weeks with only a Plessier with a bungie corded backpack and sewups. Lots of weekends with even less.

I've bought two Minnehaha bags. The nicest thing I can say is: I'm glad I got both at a deep discount. They are very poorly made. The medium saddlebag was on my bicycle for a week and the lining started to pull out. The small one really does not close securely.

Yikes! thanks for the tip. They looked good; I had never tried them out though.


I rode a touring bike made for me by Roger Jansen in 1979 evey day for 19 years untill the frame cracked and now I'm on its clone every day. Jansen's design incorporated a lowered rear rack similar to the one you have illustrated. The lowered center of gravity this design offers really increases stability during hard cornering or braking. Get the lowered rear rack. Jansen also built lowered front racks. Togather they make for a stable ride inspite of the load. Carry bulky, light items; your tent poles and sleeping bag wrapped in the tent fly on the rear platform. Heavy items go in the bottoms of the bags.

Agreed. Justin - I just tried my friend's bike, which sported the Nitto Campee set (front and rear removable lowriders) and the difference that low-to-the-ground weight makes is very noticable. Not so much on the rear, but with front lowriders, the handling and cornering is much more stable (though I doubt you'll ever really need to corner on a true tour). I asked him to send me a pic, and I'll try to post it here - he put Ostrich panniers on it (pricey, but very nice - and actually fairly easy to use!) and it looks fantastic.

All things considered though, I'm all +1 for the "cheap touring trial" first though. I've found in my experiments that I probably won't want to do too many full unsupported tours, and it's saved me from buying four $100+ Ostrich panniers :P.

Does anyone know if the Nitto Mt Campee is designed for 26" or 700c wheels? I'm not finding any definitive answer.

Edit: I think the model is "Mt Campee R20" and it is indeed designed for 26" wheels. Damnit.