Touring - New camping stove

I just bought my very first camping stove...a Coleman Multi-Fuel. http://www.coleman.com/coleman/colemancom/detail.asp?product_id=550B725
I plan on using kerosene instead of Coleman Fuel because it seems to be more efficient. I have absolutely no experience with this kind of thing and was wondering if anyone has any experience using this kind of stove, using kerosene in it, or any advice about this....

I do have a couple questions.....

Is the generator pre-heating paste always necessary when using kerosene?
The instructions say to use 'white kerosene'. Is there a reason I shouldn't use a lower quality?


I'm pretty stuck on kerosene, but if there are reasons to not use it, I'm willing to hear them. (I'm ok with the smell)

I'm also open to general advice about using a camping stove.....as I said, I have absolutely no experience.:rolleyes:

BTW, I do cook at home, and on a gas stove, if that counts for anything.....

just guessing that it will flame up more with sooty flame until it's fully pre-heated. Those are good stoves. I had one in the garage for five years unused and filled with white gas, pulled it out for a tailgate party and it fired up with a dirty and yellow flame then settled down to a nice blue simmer for a pot of chili.

Kerosene used to be the fuel of choice for mountaineering expeditions, partly because a given quantity of the stuff contained more energy.

AIUI, kerosene doesn't ignite as easily as white gas, so yes, the pre-heating paste or alcohol or something will be necessary to get the stove going.

You might find white gas easier to obtain of than kerosene, so it might be worth your while to be a little more flexible in your fuel choice.

Kerosene does not evaporate as quickly as white gas and the odor of kerosene will be harder to get rid of if your fuel container leaks inside your luggage.
If you're planning on flying anywhere with your stove it will have to be absolutely clean and odor free or you will not be allowed to keep it in your baggage, checked or carry-on. It will be harder to remove the odor of kerosene from a stove than the odor of white gas.

I thought kerosene would be easier to find..and cheaper...than white gas, because most gas stations would carry kerosene.

If I use alcohol to pre-heat the generator, what alcohol would I use? Would I just pour it in the trough-like thing beneath the generator?
What would my options be?

I suspect that the relative availability of white gas or kerosene would vary in different parts of the country. I've never seen kerosene available in gas stations around here, but the local Wal-Mart sells Coleman fuel for around $12/gallon. If gas stations where you plan on touring carry kerosene, and if it's easy to buy the small quantities you need for a cycle tour then that would be the way to go. If you end up in an area where white gas is the easier option, switch to white gas.

I would use denatured alcohol,in the trough under the generator. Paste might be easier to deal with.

We used an earlier version of this stove crossing the country. I would just go with the Coleman Fuel/MSR Super Fuel, which is what they are calling White Gas these days. Sounds like less hastle. You can find the MSR brand in 32 oz. cans.

Before you come to depend on gas stations for kerosene try filling a 1 liter fuel bottle from a gas station nozzle/pump without getting it all over the outside of the bottle. Not so easy.

We used an earlier version of this stove crossing the country. I would just go with the Coleman Fuel/MSR Super Fuel, which is what they are calling White Gas these days. Sounds like less hastle. You can find the MSR brand in 32 oz. cans.

A quart of MSR Super Fuel in the local climbing shop retails for a touch more than a gallon of Coleman fuel at the local Wal-Mart. Can somebody please explain that to me?

I agree, white gas/Coleman fuel/call it what you want is probably less aggravation than kerosene. But if the OP is happy with kerosene, who are we to complain?

How long will your tours be? If you need to buy fuel along the way (most likely if touring more than a week or so) ease of restocking will be one of the biggest factors.

Regular unleaded gas is available just about anywhere you go, but a hassle to dispense into your stove or fuel bottle. You can likely drain enough to top up from the hoses on the pumps of a gas station that is not open.

White gas is most often only available in gallons in the places I have seen it while on tour in the rural US. No way I want to haul a gallon of fuel.

Kerosene seems like it would be less available.

Diesel will probably work in the stove, but will smoke and soot up the pots more. It is pretty available. But a hassle to dispense like gasoline.

I will likely need to restock fuel on tour.
One reason I was going with kerosene and not Coleman fuel is I am assuming kerosene would be less expensive. I have never bought either, but my parents have bought kerosene for lanterns, and it just seems like the less refined, and more used product would be cheaper.

The reason I'm not considering gasoline is because it is incredibly flammable. I know kerosene and white gas are flammable too, but gasoline is scarily explosive. Also, it smells horrible.:eek:

Isn't white gas a kind of specialty fuel - only sold at camping supply stores (and Walmart, but I avoid Walmart like the plague ;))

I haven't traveled much in southern and western states.....and have never traveled when I needed to buy fuel (other than gasoline). :rolleyes: I just assumed most gas stations would have a kerosene dispenser. That is how my Dad got kerosene for lamps....from gas stations.
Maybe it is different in other parts of the country....

How long will your tours be? If you need to buy fuel along the way (most likely if touring more than a week or so) ease of restocking will be one of the biggest factors.

Regular unleaded gas is available just about anywhere you go, but a hassle to dispense into your stove or fuel bottle. You can likely drain enough to top up from the hoses on the pumps of a gas station that is not open.

White gas is most often only available in gallons in the places I have seen it while on tour in the rural US. No way I want to haul a gallon of fuel.

Kerosene seems like it would be less available.

Diesel will probably work in the stove, but will smoke and soot up the pots more. It is pretty available. But a hassle to dispense like gasoline.

HellMart sells white gas (Coleman brand) in quarts at a lot of locations

I remember seeing kerosene pumps at gas stations in the northeastern US, but that was a long time ago. The pumps looked like gasoline pumps, not something you would use to fill the 1 quart (or less) container that a cycle tourist would carry.

White gas is mostly available at camping/backpacking stores or the camping section of big box stores like Wal-Mart, but I've seen it at the local supermarket around here. The trend in camping fuels seems to be toward various compressed gas cylinders, either little disposable ones that are a good size for cycle tourists or great big refillable ones for the motor home crowd. I can understand wanting to avoid Wal-Mart, and I can understand not wanting to carry a gallon of fuel around, but a gallon can of white gas/Coleman fuel from Wal-Mart (or REI, or any other big store) will last you a long, long time and you won't have to worry about where to find fuel for a while. If you're touring with a group, you could buy a gallon can of Coleman fuel and four 1-quart or 1-liter fuel bottles, and divide the fuel bottles among the group. If you're doing repeated tours from your home, buy a gallon can of Coleman fuel (or kerosene) and a quart or liter fuel bottle, stash the gallon can at home, and bring the fuel bottle with your stove. Depending on how carefully you cook, a quart fuel bottle and a full fuel tank on your stove could keep you supplied for a week or two, maybe longer. The fuel tank on your stove looks big enough for you to cook meals for 2-3 days if you're careful. I think you can still buy kerosene in hardware stores, that's another source.

A quart of MSR Super Fuel in the local climbing shop retails for a touch more than a gallon of Coleman fuel at the local Wal-Mart. Can somebody please explain that to me?

I agree, white gas/Coleman fuel/call it what you want is probably less aggravation than kerosene. But if the OP is happy with kerosene, who are we to complain?

The price difference is most likely attributable primarily to marketing. I am sure many people associate MSR with higher quality products and are willing to pay more. Indeed, read MSR's claims:

MSR® SuperFuel is the highest-performance white gas on the market, more refined and cleaner-burning than any comparable fuel and unmatched for reducing clogs and maintenance.

Superior Performance: Designed to improve stove performance, with fewer cleanings and less maintenance.
Clean-Burning: Tested to be 100% pure.
Reduced Clogging: No dyes or additives to solidify and cause clogs.
Made in USA


OP: I have found 32 oz. cans of Super Fuel in bike shops, outdoor stores and general sporting goods stores. There is a similar product called "Camp Fuel" that I have gotten in 32 oz. cans. I had one store offer to open a lgallon of Coleman Fuel for me and fill up my bottle for a charge, although I think this offer was extended, at least in part, because I was in an area popular with cycle tourists and backpackers. Only once have I felt concerned enough about my fuel supply to buy a gallon of Coleman Fuel. I filled up my bottle and left the rest at a campground for others.

And I think the points about availability (if you see kerosene in my neck of the woods it's only during winter) and having to fill up your stove and/or a fuel bottle using a gas station pump is a good one. The similar Coleman stoves we used were hard enough to fill from a fuel bottle using a funnel. There was frequent spillage in part because the tank opening is on an angle.


No complaints. Just my two cents.

My stoves choice has been MSR and those whisperlight international, over the white gas WL, as I can run unleaded auto petrol

white gas , yes comes in Gallons , not metered out by the penny worth, so my 22oz fuel bottle
cost a buck, half Guilder , a few P, at most to fill .

Not much kerosene lamp use, for a long time, so distribution has become containerized, tins .
in hardware stores..

MSR dragonfly will also burn unleaded, and with its on-burner needle valve you can simmer
and such, so actually cook on it.

The small section of stainless cable can be removed.
so fuel tube around the preheat loop can be cleaned as can the jet.

I've seen one outdoor shop that was willing to open gallon Coleman cans and sell enough to fill a fuel bottle (Pinedale, WY), and yes, that was in an area with lots of hikers/climbers/cyclists.

Dragonflys are great, simmering ability and temperature control are the wave of the future in cooking!:innocent:. Mine came with a jet that lets me use kerosene (or diesel), and it will run on unleaded if I have to.

I've had my current Coleman 'Peak-1' stove for 30 years and it still fires up like new with no need for any maintenance other than a drop of oil on the pump plunger every few years. Mine is white gas only so I have no experience with using kerosene. Cooking on it is pretty easy. Takes less than a minute for the generator to heat up and let the flame settle down and after that it's about the same as using a gas stove at home. It is unfortunate that the fuel is often only available in gallon containers. I carry a quart bottle plus the tank on the stove, and can go quite awhile between needing to buy fuel. It's frequently possible to spot car campers using Coleman white gas stoves or lanterns and arrange to either buy a quart from them or give them a good deal on the unused portion of a gallon that I've bought.

T
MSR® SuperFuel is the highest-performance white gas on the market, more refined and cleaner-burning than any comparable fuel and unmatched for reducing clogs and maintenance.

Superior Performance: Designed to improve stove performance, with fewer cleanings and less maintenance.
Clean-Burning: Tested to be 100% pure.
Reduced Clogging: No dyes or additives to solidify and cause clogs.
Made in USA


:roflmao2:I love these kinds of claims:roflmao2: They're as good as the "We sell only pure gasoline" signs you see all over.

Unless MSR is selling something that is all hexane (C6H6 hydrocarbon) or all heptane or any other single hydrocarbon, they can't be selling 100% pure anything...unless it's what comes out of the south end of a north bound bull:rolleyes: White gas is a mixture of hydrocarbons that is determined by a distillation cut of petroleum. There is nothing 'pure' about it.

'Pure gasoline', by the way is a similar myth. Unless they are selling 2,2,4-trimethylpentane (isooctane) which is the very definition of an octane number of 100 and incredible expensive, they are selling a mixture of hydrocarbons that are blended for specific locations and specific climatic conditions (winter fuel is different from summer fuel).

Supercat stove!

The biggest reason I want to use kerosene is this:
Coleman® liquid fuel & unleaded as burns at 7,500 BTU
• Boil time is 4 min, 25 sec
• Burn time is 1 hour, 20 minutes on high, 7 hours on simmer
• Kerosene burns at 6,500 BTU
• Boil time is 4 min 36 sec
• Burn time is 2 hrs, 25 minutes on high, 9 hours on simmer

These numbers were taken from the Coleman site....kerosene seems to be more efficient than white gas.
I like the idea of buying a gallon, and dividing it up....I don't know why that hadn't crossed my mind:o

Does anyone have experience with kerosene? I would like to know if I can use a lower grade, or if that will have terrible consequences.

Thank you for all the advice! I really appreciate it..:D

I think you can find one quart containers of kerosene at some hardware stores. Start with that and after you use it up try white gas. Report back.

I picked up a Trangia Mini Cooking Stove -

http://www.rei.com/skuimage/657906/220

And just use Yellow Heet fuel -

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41lprEFQUaL._SL500_AA300_.jpg

I think it's consider the redneck of stoves as it's the cheapest your going to get other then DIY.

I thought kerosene would be easier to find..and cheaper...than white gas, because most gas stations would carry kerosene.


I don't think you're going to find white gas or kerosene at many gas stations and your need to refuel will be a lot less than the number of gas stations, paint stores and sporting good stores that you'll drive by in a weeks time. Just start whatever trips you're doing with the fuel you need and see what works. You may find that the housekeeping effort of cooking meals that require a simmering stove and long cook times will involve carrying and caring for a lot of stuff while just heating up a can of soup or pint of water for oatmeal and coffee/tea might be all you really need.
In other words you may not need the large BTU capacity of a modern stove and dense fuel if your total BTU consumption isn't large. Which is what makes the little alcohol stoves attractive.

:roflmao2:I love these kinds of claims:roflmao2: They're as good as the "We sell only pure gasoline" signs you see all over.

Unless MSR is selling something that is all hexane (C6H6 hydrocarbon)
I certainly hope they're not selling C6H6 as stove fuel. That would be benzene - a lousy fuel and rather carcinogenic. But yes, their product is undoubtedly not 'pure' anything, but the poorly defined mix of hydrocarbons called naphtha.

I certainly hope they're not selling C6H6 as stove fuel. That would be benzene - a lousy fuel and rather carcinogenic. But yes, their product is undoubtedly not 'pure' anything, but the poorly defined mix of hydrocarbons called naphtha.

D'oh! I should read...and engage brain... while I type:o

C6H14:o

The similar Coleman stoves we used were hard enough to fill from a fuel bottle using a funnel. There was frequent spillage in part because the tank opening is on an angle.

Good point. I`ve got an older version of that stove, and it`s really been great, but I did have trouble (spilling fuel) when I filled it through a funnel. Now when I use that stove I fill it from a nalgene bottle that has a plug-type stopper/spout. The seal between the plug and the bottle dribbles a tiny bit, but much better than a funnel. I never tried with the pour ring things they make for aluminum bottles, they might work well too.

I use a cat-can alcohol stove now with HEET when I`m by myself, but still pack the Coleman when I`m with my wife.

I believe 'White Kerosene' is also known as deoderized kerosene. Its available in most paint stores in 1-gal and 1-qt cans; painters use it for cleaning painting equipment when using oil-based paints. Check the stores in your area to see if you can find it (either big box places like Home Depot/Lowes or smaller paint specialty stores). Its not as oily or smelly as regular kerosene. Use fire paste to warm your stove if using kerosene - much easier than trying to use an alcohol.

After using a variety of fuels while traveling the third world countries back in the 1980 & 1990s, I stay away from kerosene and try to use either gasoline or white gas - easier to light, not as smelly/dirty, and it'll evaporate readily if spilled.

Another option. Even though you've bought the Coleman stove, how about a small butane/isobutane canister stove for shorter trips, or summer trips? MSR Pocket Rocket or equivalent. I use one and prefer it for its simplicity on shorter trips. I try to plan meals of cold foods with a hot drink to keep things simple, and the canister stoves work great for this. Simpley attach the burner to the canister, turn the valve, and light. Soup/cocoa/coffe ready in 5 minutes. And easy to dismantle, too. Canisters are availabel almost everywhere, too.

I have an old Optimus 00 that I've had for 30 years and just love. It's a big old brass thing, made in Sweden and it burns kerosene. I never had any issues finding fuel or getting it lit in the morning once I learned the technique, using white jelly paste to light it up - it made for a nice morning ritual to get the coffee going. Far more enjoyable than the newer stoves, but it is quite heavy and you occasionally had to clean the burner orifice with a wire tool - took 2 secs. I still use it when car or motorcycle camping just for fun.

I think you're on the right track as far as the lower flammability of kerosene (vs. white gas) and the higher energy it contains. Just find a gallon locally and split it up. Carry two fuel bottles and you should have enough for 10-14 days if you don't waste it.. If you have to restock enroute most hardware or paint supply stores should have it.

once I learned the technique, using white jelly paste to light it up

Do you think sterno would work instead of the paste? I read somewhere of someone doing that and it seems that sterno would be cheaper and more readily available.

Thanks a lot for the encouragement :D
I was starting to think everyone considers kerosene to be a bad idea :eek:

Another option. Even though you've bought the Coleman stove, how about a small butane/isobutane canister stove for shorter trips, or summer trips? MSR Pocket Rocket or equivalent. I use one and prefer it for its simplicity on shorter trips. I try to plan meals of cold foods with a hot drink to keep things simple, and the canister stoves work great for this. Simpley attach the burner to the canister, turn the valve, and light. Soup/cocoa/coffe ready in 5 minutes. And easy to dismantle, too. Canisters are availabel almost everywhere, too.

I really like my MSR Pocket Rocket, but I have definitely not found the canisters to be anywhere near as widely available as I would like. On the TA in 2007 we didn't find canisters for well over 2000 miles from Pueblo eastward. Up until Pueblo we always found them when we needed them but the middle of the country was slim pickings. I know that we passed at least one place that had them (in Carbondale IL) but it was a Sunday morning and they were closed.

Even in California depending on where you go cartridge availability might be an issue. In 2010 we left San Diego with no cartridges and the first place we saw any was 19 days later in Yosemite. I was surprised that we didn't find them more often since we were often in close proximity to the Pacific Crest Trail and glad I took the pop can stove as a spare. Undoubtedly we could have found them in San Diego, but we were focused on getting out of the airport and out of town.

I have started taking a Pepsi can stove and the Pocket Rocket. Since the Pepsi can stove weighs less than an ounce including pot stand and uses the same wind screen and pot, it is easy to take as a backup. Yellow bottle Heet has been very easy to find on all my tours and if that would fail we could resort to buying alcohol at a hardware store. I would consider leaving the Pocket Rocket home and relying exclusively on the Pepsi can stove, but the Pocket Rocket is only about 3 ounces so the weight penalty for having both isn't too bad.

Bottom line... if using a cartridge stove either carry a backup or plan ahead not assuming frequent cartridge availability.

I read somewhere of someone doing that and it seems that sterno would be cheaper and more readily available.
Seems to me that if you have to carry and depend on two fuels you`re negating the benefits of better efficiency and complicating things. `Course I could be wrong about that.

Thanks a lot for the encouragement :D
I was starting to think everyone considers kerosene to be a bad idea :eek:

It's not that kerosene is a bad idea, it's just that kerosene isn't as available as you might think. Gas stations used to carry it but they also used to check the oil and radiator. They just don't carry kerosene much anymore because there's no demand for it. You might be able to find it in a hardware store but, more likely than not, it will be in 1, or even 5:eek:, gallon sizes.

White gas, Coleman Fuel, naphtha, etc. are more readily available and, like I mentioned in an earlier post, are available in 1 qt sizes at WalMart.

I'll agree that using gasoline is probably not a wise idea. It's too flammable and it's too hard to dispense into a MSR sized fuel bottle. Talk about taking a drink from a fire hose:eek::rolleyes: I'd have to be pretty desperate before I'd use gasoline. And there are just too many places to get food that ready to eat to be that desperate on tour.

Seems to me that if you have to carry and depend on two fuels you`re negating the benefits of better efficiency and complicating things. `Course I could be wrong about that.

I was thinking of using it instead of preheating paste....I don't see how carrying a small can of sterno would be much different from carrying an expensive tube of pre-heating paste. The lower cost of sterno outweighs the smaller size of a tube of pre-heating paste...for me.

White gas, Coleman Fuel, naphtha, etc. are more readily available and, like I mentioned in an earlier post, are available in 1 qt sizes at WalMart.



I won't give WalMart my business...so even though they are everywhere, it doesn't help me..:rolleyes:
I would have to find a different source even if I did use Coleman Fuel...

I was thinking of using it instead of preheating paste....I don't see how carrying a small can of sterno would be much different from carrying an expensive tube of pre-heating paste. The lower cost of sterno outweighs the smaller size of a tube of pre-heating paste...for me.
Anything that can heat up the generator tube should work fine for the preheating. The paste is just a little more convenient to dispense from the tube, but I don't see any reason why Sterno wouldn't work as well.

I won't give WalMart my business...so even though they are everywhere, it doesn't help me..:rolleyes:
I would have to find a different source even if I did use Coleman Fuel...

Unfortunately, on tour, beggars can't be choosers. I don't shop at Walmart on any kind of regular basis. However, once you get out into Helmart land, you'll find that there really isn't anywhere else to go. Helmarts are like giant ant hills. Everything around them is stripped bare...grocery, hardware, sporting goods, clothing, shoes, etc...leaving you either to try and make due with what you can find at convenience stores or you have to pass through the gates of Helmart. You don't have much choice.

Case in point is the route along the western border of Iowa following the Lewis and Clark. There's a Helmart at Sioux City, Council Bluffs and Kansas City. That's a distance of 280 miles. Between Sioux City and Council Bluffs, you'll find nothing...it's a Sonoran food desert. Between Council Bluffs and KC, you'll find less than nothing. It's a Saharan food desert. 30 or 40 years ago, there would have been 100 small towns and 200 small grocery stores. Today all you'll find is boarded up windows. People will stupidly drive 200 miles round trip to save $0.04 on a bottle of fabric softener than shop a the local stores. I know because my parents were some of those stupid people.

Even within larger towns like Sioux City and Council Bluffs, you are hard pressed to find alternatives.

Wow, thats pretty terrible! I didn't realize the extent to which Walmart has destroyed local businesses...:cry:
ok, I'll see what happens....I hope I won't have to go there...
Maybe carry a little extra fuel, IDK...I've never done a tour before.

I'll take some short ones first, and see what I can and cannot do...:innocent:

Thanks so much!!

IW, my point was that it`s an extra consumeable to carry and search for, whether it`s a can or a tube. But as noted, there isn`t really any perfect fuel. BTW, I never considered using kerosene, (didn`t even realize that it was one of the possibilities for multi fuesl stoves), and didn`t realize it was so much more efficient, so I learned that much from this thread. The bottom line is that the fuel(s) you decide to carry will really make very little difference in whether or not you`re happy, comfy, and well fed on a tour. Go ahead and research, look at the situation, then make your best guess and go for it- it`ll work out.

This stove seems similar to the old SVEA123. Nice stove!

?I thought we used to preheat our SVEA with a few drops of gas. Just meant carrying along a plastic pippette, or burping the jet. But not carrying different fuel types.

I would personally carry something like

http://i.imgur.com/qnPQp.png


WhisperLite Internationale can run on white gas, kerosene, jet fuel and unleaded automobile fuel, making it the perfect stove for globetrotters

Along with a couple of [url=http://www.rei.com/product/783963]these (http://www.rei.com/product/709000) fuel canisters.

http://i.imgur.com/ofPLr.png

That way you could use pretty much any fuel available and that gear is designed to be super light (20 ounces for stove, pump, and canister).

Actually after reviewing the stove you posted it appears I misunderstood your entire post and that aside from versatility and quality, the setup I suggested has no benefits over your stove.

My preference (which I've previously stated on similar threads - sorry for the repetition) is a stove that will burn unleaded gas, because it's so easy to find a gas station, and less easy to find a store that sells Coleman fuel by the quart (or MSR) (a gallon of Coleman fuel would be ridiculous), or butane cannisters.

I bought a Coleman 442 stove in 1992, which I believe is the predecessor to the one shown. I still have it and it still works fine, after umpteen uses. It always smelled a little bit, sometimes sputtered a little, and didn't simmer as well as butane, but it always worked and it was great to be able to top off my tank at any gas station.

I recently bought an MSR Whisperlite International with a gift certificate. It also burns unleaded. I think it's a little lighter. It's dirtier afterwards, and the wind screen is a hassle. It burns, smokes, and sputters similar to the old Coleman. It's fine.

Neither of the stoves is perfect, but they both work fine and are reliable. I still haven't decided which I like best. I'm going to take the Whisperlite on a couple more tours before I decide.

I think white gas burns cleaner than unleaded, so I look for it (by the quart) and buy it when I can (and when I need some fuel).

I'd prefer to take my butane stove if they sold cannisters at every gas station, but they don't. So I'm happy with what I have.