Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - pedal options

OK, guys, what would you do:

I've documented my love/hate relationship with my road bike, and what I think it comes down to is my lack of love for my clipless pedals, which are the Shimano R540 (http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product_10053_10052_506076_-1_202630_10000_202531) model.

Here's what bugs me: I can generally get clipped and unclipped OK, but when I feel like I'm in a bit of a tight spot in terms of traffic, etc., I never can get clipped in very well - could be anxiety from the traffic situation causing me to have trouble clipping in. Like the other day, I had to try to pull out on a busy road and get clipped in at the same time, and it was like trying to juggle 10 balls and a chainsaw.

But I kinda like the power advantage of being clipped in. So here's what I think are my options:

1. Ditch the R540s and get a set of Shimano PD-M324s (http://www.amazon.com/Shimano-PD-M324-Clipless-Clip-Pedals/dp/B001AT33CW/ref=pd_sim_sg_1).

I think these would be good because I could clip in on one side, and if I'm in a pressure situation, I could temporarily switch over to the platforms long enough to get out of trouble and get clipped back in again. I'd have to buy some different shoes, but hey.

2. Ditch that whole rig and try out Power Grips (http://powergrips.mrpbike.com/). I dunno how well these work. Anybody here using these?

Thanks for the consideration.

What you want is a mountain bike pedal and a mountain bike shoe. I would suggest a set of $35 Shimano M520 pedals and the shoe of your choice.

In my 20-year cycling career, I've used quite a few pedals: cheap platforms, expensive platforms, traditional clips & straps, PowerGrips, high-end Look road pedals (similar to your R540), Crank Brothers Eggbeaters, Crank Brothers Candy, and a number of others. For me, Shimano's two-sided SPD mountain bike pedals combined with a mountain bike shoe work the best. I use this combination on all my bikes!

There are two key reasons for this: 1) the pedal is two-sided, so you never have to align the pedal before you can clip in and, 2) even if you miss clipping-in the pedal is large enough and the shoe has enough tread that you can still pedal very effectively. It doesn't hurt that these pedals are durable, easy to clip-in, have adjustable release tension, and are dirt cheap.

I have a set of the M324's on my hybrid. I also run mountain bike pedals on my road bike so I can use the same shoes for both bikes.

You can adjust the M324s to clip in/out pretty easily (i.e. adjust tension). I've yanked my foot out in a panic (surprise! there's a mom, a stroller, and a dog hogging the bike path!) a couple times and it saved me from going over.

What I don't like about the M324s is that no matter what I'm trying to do, I always end up on the wrong side of the pedal. If I want to take off and clip in as I ride, I end up on the clip side. If I'm intending to clip, I wind up on the bear trap side. In theory one side always rotates down and you could train your foot to roll into it a particular way to flip the pedal over to the desired side, but I've certainly not mastered it yet. I am considering getting rid of mine for this season, or stealing the pedals from my Bianchi.

I have M520's on my hybrid-flat handlebar road bike, and love them. I used them on the Specialized Allez that I owned, as well and loved them on that.

I prefer Time ATAC for offroad though, much quicker to get in, and a lot more float. I just need new shoes for mine so I can put them back on my MTB... Someday!

Maybe try some eggbeater/platform pedals that will allow more of an unclipped riding for those iffy situations?

I do think Mountain pedals allow you to get out quicker. Road pedals are kinda designed around racing, I feel. I could be wrong though.

My minority opinion?!?!--Get a pair of decent platforms pedals such as MKS touring pedals from Amazon or ebay and don't look back. Amaze yourself at how much "power" you didn't loose and enjoy the freedom of wearing any shoe you want. Like I said, it is a minority opinion but after taking my M520's off I have been a happy camper.

My minority opinion?!?!--Get a pair of decent platforms pedals such as MKS touring pedals from Amazon or ebay and don't look back. Amaze yourself at how much "power" you didn't loose and enjoy the freedom of wearing any shoe you want. Like I said, it is a minority opinion but after taking my M520's off I have been a happy camper.

Actually, that's what I'd like to do - I yearn for the freedom of being able to put my foot down with no trouble and start pedaling again. I just don't feel like I'm in control of the bike when I'm clipped in. I feel like it's controlling me. But I've been able to climb some grinding hills and wondered how much of my climbing success is due to the extra torque I get from being clipped in.

I've got a metric century I wanna try to do in April, and part of it includes a mountain climb. I'm kinda paranoid I can't do it without the clips. Hey, stupid race question: are you allowed to get off your bike and push up a hill if you just can't make it? I've never been in any sort of organized bike deal before.

I love my Power Grips. I have them on two of my bikes. Never had clipless so I can't comment on them.

I'm a year round commuter and have been using a pair for over 3 years now. Some fraying, but I just wrapped some duct tape around where it was happening and it should last me for a while.

John,
I don't sweat having both sides clipped in to deal with a traffic situation. My right foot stays clipped in. When I leave a stop I ride with my right foot clipped in and my left resting on the pedal. I don't care if my left foot clips or not until the traffic situation is past. I can easily accelerate with just my right foot in and my left on the pedal but not clipped. The way I learned to do this was by practicing leaving a stop with just my right foot doing the work. Most of the time my left foot finds it's own way home (it clips in) but sometimes I have to fiddle a bit after the traffic situation has resolved.

I happen to use speedplay pedals but I don't think it's about the type of pedal. I think it's about the approach.

I pretty much agree with what bbeasly mentioned, however, everyone has different comfort and confidence levels.

You can if you wish have a bit of both.

As an example, if you switch to SPD, then you could use the
Shimano PD-A530 SPD Dual Platform Pedal which you can use clipped in or simply clip out when in traffic and use the platform side.
http://www.amazon.com/Shimano-PD-A530-Dual-Platform-Pedal/dp/B002NVJEOM

Actually, that's what I'd like to do -

Listen to your instinct and try it. Then you will know for sure! :thumb:

I just don't feel like I'm in control of the bike when I'm clipped in.

That's funny; I'm just the opposite: I don't feel like I'm in control of the bike until I am clipped in!


Hey, stupid race question: are you allowed to get off your bike and push up a hill if you just can't make it?

If it's really a race, as opposed to a non-competitive organized ride, you'd probably be disqualified for creating a hazard...

That's funny; I'm just the opposite: I don't feel like I'm in control of the bike until I am clipped in!

This sounds stupid, but I wanna be able to do what I want when I want. If I want to put my right foot down right now, I wanna put my right foot down right now. If I wanna pull over on a dime, I wanna pull over on a dime.

And I wanna be able to give my undivided attention to what I'm doing on the bike and the traffic around me sometimes, as opposed to having to try to get the pedal flipped over to the proper position and getting clipped in during a tense situation involving two-ton cars. This only happens about 5 percent of the time during a ride, but it's that 5 percent that makes me not want to get on the bike.


If it's really a race, as opposed to a non-competitive organized ride, you'd probably be disqualified for creating a hazard...

This is really more non-competitive organized ride. Thanks.

I agree with getting platforms and trying them. Try going up the hill in question. If you can't make it, then you know the clipping in was giving you something... and if you can, then you win!

To be honest I really think the main thing is being comfortable on your bike. You've tried the clipless for long enough now that you can say you gave it a fair try. Do you have platforms on your commuter you can switch over to the road bike for trying?

Personally I haven't tried clipless and I don't plan to. I like platforms. Both bikes I bought came with clipless and I asked them at the store to switch them to platform before taking possession.

The two-sided (clipless/platform) pedals you linked may be the best solution for you, John. You'll always have the ability to go either way.

You'll need to keep in mind though that your shoes could be a limiting factor. For this experiment to work, they'll need two characteristics: they'll need to be stable when used on the platform side of the pedal (in other words, no slick cleat to want to slide off that side), and the cleated side will require a two-bolt SPD type of cleat. Your current shoes may or may not meet either of those requirements. You'll just have to take a look at them and see. If you need new shoes, you'll want to get ones with recessed cleats, like most SPD mountain-bike shoes. Even a road shoe that's two-bolt (SPD) compatible may still have a projecting cleat, making the platform side of the pedal problematic.

The two-sided (clipless/platform) pedals you linked may be the best solution for you, John. You'll always have the ability to go either way.

You'll need to keep in mind though that your shoes could be a limiting factor. For this experiment to work, they'll need two characteristics: they'll need to be stable when used on the platform side of the pedal (in other words, no slick cleat to want to slide off that side), and the cleated side will require a two-bolt SPD type of cleat. Your current shoes may or may not meet either of those requirements. You'll just have to take a look at them and see. If you need new shoes, you'll want to get ones with recessed cleats, like most SPD mountain-bike shoes. Even a two-bolt (SPD) compatible road shoe may still have a projecting cleat, making the platform side of the pedal problematic.

This is one of the reasons, I use only platforms... For short trips like to the post office or town, getting on the bike with regular clothes and shoes, makes sense, having to put on special clothes and shoes, is just a reason to take the car instead. That fits the mountain/hybrid and given that the road bike is 35 years old, clipless on there would just look silly, now a set of stainless toe clips and straps, yeah....

Needing special shoes is just another thing to use as an excuse not to ride.

This sounds stupid, but I wanna be able to do what I want when I want. If I want to put my right foot down right now, I wanna put my right foot down right now. If I wanna pull over on a dime, I wanna pull over on a dime.

And I wanna be able to give my undivided attention to what I'm doing on the bike and the traffic around me sometimes, as opposed to having to try to get the pedal flipped over to the proper position and getting clipped in during a tense situation involving two-ton cars. This only happens about 5 percent of the time during a ride, but it's that 5 percent that makes me not want to get on the bike.


Sounds like clipless may not be your deal, but... have you tried to figure out why you sometimes have trouble clipping in or out? I've been riding clipless for a few months on 3 different bikes but with the same pair of shoes. I recently got a different pair of shoes -- road shoes as opposed to the MTB shoes I had been wearing. (SPD cleats on both.) The first couple rides with them I had a terrible time getting clipped in. It was to the point where I was ready to get rid of the new shoes when I figured out that the problem was the cleat location. They were a little farther back on the new shoes and I was trying to clip in too far behind correct spot. (Hope that makes sense.) A minor adjustment to what I was doing with my foot and everything is copacetic.

Now, this is probably not what's causing your issue, but... if you can figure out what's causing your problem you might be able to solve it.

Here's what bugs me: I can generally get clipped and unclipped OK, but when I feel like I'm in a bit of a tight spot in terms of traffic, etc., I never can get clipped in very well - could be anxiety from the traffic situation causing me to have trouble clipping in. Like the other day, I had to try to pull out on a busy road and get clipped in at the same time, and it was like trying to juggle 10 balls and a chainsaw..

Hmm, use a totally different approach. I don't unclip. Whiel approachinga signal, I plan ahead. I will slow and try to time the light. If I'm a little off I can trackstand for 3 or 4 seconds, I'm good. I rarely unclip on the road and in traffic. At stopsigns, I don't unclip, brief stand and I'm off, no unclipping.

Many of my buds unclip at signal and when the light turn green, I'm 20 yards up the road before they can even shove off.:D

Give it a try. Then the pedals don't worry you as much. I mean if you plan on trying to juggle 10 balls and a chainsaw.:p

Do you have platforms on your commuter you can switch over to the road bike for trying?

By jove, that's a fine idea. I get my new hybrid (platforms) from the LBS on Tuesday or Wednesday, and my old commuter's probably going to become a backup. I could take the platforms off it for a while (or get the LBS to - I can't figure out how to get the pedals off my road bike, I tried, but I probably don't have the right tools) and put them on the road bike. If I feel comfortable enough on the hybrid, the road bike's headed to Craig's List anyway, so the whole point may be moot.


The two-sided (clipless/platform) pedals you linked may be the best solution for you, John. You'll always have the ability to go either way.

You'll need to keep in mind though that your shoes could be a limiting factor. For this experiment to work, they'll need two characteristics: they'll need to be stable when used on the platform side of the pedal (in other words, no slick cleat to want to slide off that side), and the cleated side will require a two-bolt SPD type of cleat. Your current shoes may or may not meet either of those requirements. You'll just have to take a look at them and see. If you need new shoes, you'll want to get ones with recessed cleats, like most SPD mountain-bike shoes. Even a two-bolt (SPD) compatible road shoe may still have a projecting cleat, making the platform side of the pedal problematic.

Yeah, I saw some spiffy Nike shoes at the LBS yesterday that would be perfect. They didn't have 'em in my size, but at least they give me an idea. I'd like to be able to walk around a little bit better than in the clogs I have now, with the Look road shoes. Nothing like walking on your heels all the time.

I figure I could go with the 324s, or maybe the M424s (http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product_10053_10052_197362_-1_201502_10000_202530). Maybe.


Sounds like clipless may not be your deal, but... have you tried to figure out why you sometimes have trouble clipping in or out?

I don't have a problem 95 percent of the time, but it's that 5 percent that gives me pause. I'd prefer not to have a problem 100 percent of the time. I've got a good system worked out where I line up one of my velcro straps with the pedal to clip in. But in traffic, any time spent flailing around getting clipped in is time I'd rather be spending figuring out whether I'm gonna get creamed by that SUV or not.



Hmm, use a totally different approach. I don't unclip. Whiel approachinga signal, I plan ahead. I will slow and try to time the light. If I'm a little off I can trackstand for 3 or 4 seconds, I'm good. I rarely unclip on the road and in traffic. At stopsigns, I don't unclip, brief stand and I'm off, no unclipping.

This bad intersection wasn't at a red light - I sat there for at least 2 minutes waiting for a break in traffic.

This bad intersection wasn't at a red light - I sat there for at least 2 minutes waiting for a break in traffic.

So you're thinking of spending money to switch out an entire pedal system because of one intersection, waiting 2 minutes and not having problems 95% of the time? That's like asking for tire that never flats. Good luck with your search!:thumb:

I like 2-sided spd pedals, with mountain bike shoes that have rubber in the arch. I don't like the shoes with slick plastic or fiberglass in the arch. Ones with rubber in the arch allow you to pedal through the intersection, and THEN clip in.

That is what I do. SPDs also work on spin bikes at my gym.

This sounds stupid, but I wanna be able to do what I want when I want. If I want to put my right foot down right now, I wanna put my right foot down right now. If I wanna pull over on a dime, I wanna pull over on a dime.



I've tried clipless twice, and twice had to give it up because I couldn't get clipped in properly. While that was a physical issue leading me to give them up, switching back to platforms taught me that being attached to the pedal gave me very little, if any, additional power. I say ditch'em, John423, and just ride your bikes.

So you're thinking of spending money to switch out an entire pedal system because of one intersection, waiting 2 minutes and not having problems 95% of the time? That's like asking for tire that never flats. Good luck with your search!:thumb:

Like I said above (and Neil quoted below), it's a matter of feeling like I'm in control regardless of the situation. I want to be able to do whatever I want to do on the bike any time, and if that's put my foot down or pull over in a big hurry or pull into a busy intersection without having anything but that busy intersection to worry about, then it's worth it to me to at least try platforms and see the difference before trying more expensive options.

Even if I can't figure out how to change the pedals on the bike (and I haven't even started YouTubing yet), how expensive could it be to have it done at the LBS where I got it? They're putting together/Frame Saving my hybrid right now - steel is real :) - and I believe I'm well on my way to earning frequent flyer status down there. I'm already greeted like Norm from Cheers by the repair guy, so it's all good.

Yeah, I know I should HTFU and ride the Look pedals. And I'm going to today, I've got to get more miles under my butt. And I've got a new route that bypasses the bad intersection (and a mean ol' dog along the way), so lets see how it goes.


I've tried clipless twice, and twice had to give it up because I couldn't get clipped in properly. While that was a physical issue leading me to give them up, switching back to platforms taught me that being attached to the pedal gave me very little, if any, additional power. I say ditch'em, John423, and just ride your bikes.

I'm curious to see just how much power it adds. The first order of business with the hybrid is to go on my typical road biking route and see how I pull some of the hills on that country road.

It is affecting my enjoyment of the road bike, so I feel like I have to do something to make myself feel more comfortable on it, which will make me want to ride it more.

Like I said above (and Neil quoted below), it's a matter of feeling like I'm in control regardless of the situation. I want to be able to do whatever I want to do on the bike any time, and if that's put my foot down or pull over in a big hurry or pull into a busy intersection without having anything but that busy intersection to worry about, then it's worth it to me to at least try platforms and see the difference before trying more expensive options.

Even if I can't figure out how to change the pedals on the bike (and I haven't even started YouTubing yet), how expensive could it be to have it done at the LBS where I got it? They're putting together/Frame Saving my hybrid right now - steel is real :) - and I believe I'm well on my way to earning frequent flyer status down there. I'm already greeted like Norm from Cheers by the repair guy, so it's all good.

Yeah, I know I should HTFU and ride the Look pedals. And I'm going to today, I've got to get more miles under my butt. And I've got a new route that bypasses the bad intersection (and a mean ol' dog along the way), so lets see how it goes.



I'm curious to see just how much power it adds. The first order of business with the hybrid is to go on my typical road biking route and see how I pull some of the hills on that country road.

It is affecting my enjoyment of the road bike, so I feel like I have to do something to make myself feel more comfortable on it, which will make me want to ride it more.

I found I didn't lose power when I lost clipless. The hills didn't get any more difficult.

As for swapping pedals, that's what a pedal wrench is for, and it's not an expensive tool.

John423, if it makes you feel more comfortable riding, then do it.

Neil's right about the pedal wrench. It isn't expensive. It's large, because you need a good deal of torque. The only other thing to know about changing pedals is that the threads are reveresed on the left pedal. In both cases, to loosen you want the lever arm of the wrench to point toward the back of the bike, and you push it down toward the ground. The other thing to remember is to grease the new pedals' threads before you install them.

Neil's right about the pedal wrench. It isn't expensive. It's large, because you need a good deal of torque. The only other thing to know about changing pedals is that the threads are reveresed on the left pedal. In both cases, to loosen you want the lever arm of the wrench to point toward the back of the bike, and you push it down toward the ground. The other thing to remember is to grease the new pedals' threads before you install them.

That's why I couldn't get the pedals off. :lol: I thought I needed a special tool, like you do for about 99 percent of the stuff on a bike, but I wasn't so sure, so I tried using just a regular adjustable wrench with no luck. :innocent:

I'd read that about the reversed threads, and I read about greasing the new threads, but somehow the "pedal wrench" thing escaped me.

Is hill climbing the only advantage of being clipped in? I've been working on my form and have made good progress with increasing my cadence. I don't know if this is correct but I try to think "Keep my feet light on the pedals." My belief is thinking that way forces me to lift my legs on the up stroke and not depend on the downward stroke to lift the opposite leg. Another thing I'm playing with is thinking that my legs are spinning in an oval that is pointed slightly down in the front. My belief is that this helps pull the up stroke leg over the top of the crank and lengthens the beginning of powerstroke. I really am just guessing here. Any Thoughts?

I found I didn't lose power when I lost clipless.

You say this like it's a scientific fact. Do you have data from a PowerTap or Quarq power meter to prove it? Or are you really just guessing?

That's why I couldn't get the pedals off. :lol: I thought I needed a special tool, like you do for about 99 percent of the stuff on a bike, but I wasn't so sure, so I tried using just a regular adjustable wrench with no luck. :innocent:

I'd read that about the reversed threads, and I read about greasing the new threads, but somehow the "pedal wrench" thing escaped me.

You can also use a large allen wrench on some models (from the inside of the crankarm at pedal axel level) ;)

NTW, I don't care for Look myself, I use two sided SPD's so there is no HTFU here.:D. My point is that no pedal is 100% failsafe. Even platform pedals. Sooner or later the foot slips and a whack to the archilles, maybe at a busy intersection.:p Something with every pedal and style.

If it's a stubborn one (old ), you may not want ot force it too much to avoid stripping. The advatng eof liek what CraigB mentions, adding grease to the threads during installation. Also helps the threads seat better.


http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5173/5465705498_3287075c13.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/40913998@N06/5465705498/)
pedal (http://www.flickr.com/photos/40913998@N06/5465705498/) by gulpxtreme (http://www.flickr.com/people/40913998@N06/), on Flickr

Is hill climbing the only advantage of being clipped in? I've been working on my form and have made good progress with increasing my cadence. I don't know if this is correct but I try to think "Keep my feet light on the pedals." My belief is thinking that way forces me to lift my legs on the up stroke and not depend on the downward stroke to lift the opposite leg. Another thing I'm playing with is thinking that my legs are spinning in an oval that is pointed slightly down in the front. My belief is that this helps pull the up stroke leg over the top of the crank and lengthens the beginning of powerstroke. I really am just guessing here. Any Thoughts?

You've really stepped in it now, Jethro. ;) You're going to get answers that are all over the map.

For me (and I stress this is for me), the advantages are twofold, and they really come down to cleats vs none, and have nothing to do with clipless pedals per se. First, I feel incredibly uncomfortable and insecure when my foot isn't attached to the pedal. Maybe it's just a case of what I'm used to, maybe it was one too many times a foot slipped off a platform pedal as a kid, resulting in a whack to an achilles or a shin. Maybe it's just that I don't have a high-friction pedal and shoe combination anymore, so all I have to compare is a running shoe on a clipless, cleated pedal. That's not a happy combination for anyone.

The other advantage for me is in terms of power transfer and form, the latter being mainly about efficiency. When I'm standing to climb, if the cadence gets low enough, I'll pull up on the back side of the stroke, sometimes with great force. And when I'm not standing, or trying to "ride light" over bad pavement, I make an effort to pedal smoothly and deliver power all the way around the stroke. The best way I've found to do that is not worry about foot angle or anything like that, but just concentrate on "making circles" with my feet. And I refuse to believe anyone can do that effectively without being attached to the pedals in one way or another.

You can also use a large allen wrench on some models (from the inside of the crankarm at pedal axel level) ;)

NTW, I don't care for Look myself, I use two sided SPD's so there is no HTFU here.:D. My point is that no pedal is 100% failsafe. Even platform pedals. Sooner or later the foot slips and a whack to the archilles, maybe at a busy intersection.:p Something with every pedal and style.

If it's a stubborn one (old ), you may not want ot force it too much to avoid stripping. The advatng eof liek what CraigB mentions, adding grease to the threads during installation. Also helps the threads seat better.


http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5173/5465705498_3287075c13.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/40913998@N06/5465705498/)
pedal (http://www.flickr.com/photos/40913998@N06/5465705498/) by gulpxtreme (http://www.flickr.com/people/40913998@N06/), on Flickr

Actually, if they don't come off with a little pressure, carefully tilt the bike over on it's side with spot the arrow is pointing to up. Fill the little depression with penetrating oil, and let it sit for a few hours, if the depression is empty, that's good, fill it again, after a full 24 hours, put the wrench on it, if it's still tight, repeat again, after a couple of days it will come right off. you don't want to really force it, if you do, often as not the threads in the aluminum crank are will come out instead. To prevent future problems, when putting pedals on, grease the threads, and go easy, you should be able to thread most pedals on by hand.

You say this like it's a scientific fact. Do you have data from a PowerTap or Quarq power meter to prove it? Or are you really just guessing?

I was faster going up hills after I got rid of clipless. Is that good enough for you? It certainly is for me.

Is hill climbing the only advantage of being clipped in? I've been working on my form and have made good progress with increasing my cadence. I don't know if this is correct but I try to think "Keep my feet light on the pedals." My belief is thinking that way forces me to lift my legs on the up stroke and not depend on the downward stroke to lift the opposite leg. Another thing I'm playing with is thinking that my legs are spinning in an oval that is pointed slightly down in the front. My belief is that this helps pull the up stroke leg over the top of the crank and lengthens the beginning of powerstroke. I really am just guessing here. Any Thoughts?

They help me / force me to keep my foot in the correct place. With platforms I tend to slide my foot forward and mash.

The biggest thing though is clipping in helps me put my race face on. I'm working hard to increase my cycling fitness level and clipping in signals game on.

You say this like it's a scientific fact. Do you have data from a PowerTap or Quarq power meter to prove it? Or are you really just guessing?

Do you have scientific data to prove otherwise? I haven't tried clipless, did try clips and straps for a couple of weeks.. I track the distance and time for every ride, and if you look at that time period, you can not tell which rides were with the clips and which were not, the average ride performance for the weeks of the test were no better then the weeks before and no better then the weeks after I took them off, in fact it was slightly less, because of needing to futz with the pedals when getting going. I've seen more then one rider futzing around getting clipped in, so this isn't just a clips thing, I've seen a few zero speed fall overs, too.

There is another issue too, if for every ride you need to stop and get the uniform on and find the special shoes and put those on, your more likely to just take the car....

I have owned and repaired my own bikes most of my life and never have I owned a pedal wrench.

I have owned and repaired my own bikes most of my life and never have I owned a pedal wrench.

A specifically designed pedal wrench is definitely not required, but some sort of wrench that's got a large moment arm is usually needed, even if that's a normal wrench with a piece of pipe slipped over the end to make it temporarily longer. The longer it is, the easier. At least that's been my experience.

I have owned and repaired my own bikes most of my life and never have I owned a pedal wrench.

I don't either and I have been wrenching my own bikes for 40 years. I have a 15 mm wrench and that works just fine on most of my pedals and when I am trying to remove my Shimano M770 pedals, these don't have flats on the spindle and you need an allen wrench to take them off back side (see Mr Beanz's photo).

Do you have scientific data to prove otherwise?

Yes. I have a power meter and a computer that reports cadence. I can easily see that clipless pedals allow a higher cadence than platforms, which actually translates to using less power for a given speed (= better efficiency). I see significantly larger power numbers during sprints and slightly higher number during climbing with clipless pedals. Part of that is surely psychological: I've had my foot slip off a pedal during a full-tilt sprint and it didn't end well, so I'm always a bit reluctant to trust platforms when power outputs rise above 500W...


I haven't tried clipless

Before pretending to know something about them, perhaps you should give them a try?

A specifically designed pedal wrench is definitely not required, but some sort of wrench that's got a large moment arm is usually needed, even if that's a normal wrench with a piece of pipe slipped over the end to make it temporarily longer.

Disagree. Pedals really don't need to be much more than hand-tight. Properly greased and installed, you shouldn't need a large lever to remove them...

The primary reason to own a pedal wrench is that the wrench flats on pedals seem to be getting narrower and narrower. I've purchased several sets of pedals recently that had flats so narrow that a standard wrench wouldn't fit! The head of a pedal wrench is narrower, so it will fit on the flats that are too narrow for a standard wrench.

The primary reason to own a pedal wrench is that the wrench flats on pedals seem to be getting narrower and narrower. I've purchased several sets of pedals recently that had flats so narrow that a standard wrench wouldn't fit! The head of a pedal wrench is narrower, so it will fit on the flats that are too narrow for a standard wrench.

That seems to be the norm for several different components on bikes, and is something I've always found annoying.

Before pretending to know something about them, perhaps you should give them a try?



+1000..........:banned:

I can't really tell that much difference on hills between my bike with toe-clips and the one with SPD pedals. BUT, I like the SPDs better.

The only places where I actually pull up on the pedals hard enough to make a difference is on flat roads where you can ride for about an hour without stopping at all (also allows me to engage more hamstring power on the bottom of the pedal stroke), and on steeper hill sections if I get out of the saddle to "stomp it."

Especially if I'm tired, and feel like the hill is winning, I will stand up and pull up hard on the up-stroke, while pulling back down against the handlebars with my arms for the opposite leg going down. Anything to relieve some pressure from my throbbing and burning lower quads, and engage and stretch other muscles in my feet, legs, and hips.

Along those lines, I prefer SPD cleats with no float. I always have a problem pulling out on the up-stroke with floating SPD cleats. It can be scary to snap-pull your cleat off a pedal on a hill.

If you pull up hard, Look-type road cleats are the most secure, but I don't think they are worth the trouble. The shoes are too difficult to walk around with in a pinch, you simply CANNOT pedal out of a busy intersection until you are clipped-in, the cleats don't work on spin bikes at most gyms, AND I would end up with a separate set of shoes just for my mountain bike and gym. Not that I'm against having another pair of cycling shoes. I just like knowing that no matter which pair that I pick that is dry and in good repair, will fit any of our bikes at home or the gym.

anyone every try speedplay? Both sides can clip in. I came from shimano.

anyone every try speedplay? Both sides can clip in. I came from shimano.

I've toyed with the idea of Speedplays, and Eggbeaters, but I guess I'm not dissatisfied enough with the SPDs on the Fisher to be really motivated to do it. I doubt that I'll ever stray from Look or Look-compatible pedals on the Trek, or any other road bike I might have.

i switched to speedplay and will never look back, you just clip and go, just step on and your in... at first the are a little hard to clip down on them because they are new but the wire that attaches loosens up and its so easy, and they stay clipped unless you want them to come off. there is not way you miss clipping in like looks. no looking down to spin the pedal to make it latch.

I've toyed with the idea of Speedplays, and Eggbeaters, but I guess I'm not dissatisfied enough with the SPDs on the Fisher to be really motivated to do it.

I've tried Eggbeaters. My problem with them is the release angle: either 15 or 20 degrees as opposed to the 6 degrees (or is it 4? I forget) with SPDs. Because you have to twist your heel so much further before the pedals release, I found it more difficult to unclip before falling over. This was a particular problem when attempting to negotiate technical single-track on the mountain bike, where I might need to bail out at a moment's notice.

Can anyone give a quick lesson in the differences among all the available Speedplay pedals? There seem to be quite a few.

The biggest difference seems to be weight among the road pedals but the concept of "float" should be the same. I use speedplay pedals and like them. Though there has been some discussion on whether they're good for your knees.


Can anyone give a quick lesson in the differences among all the available Speedplay pedals? There seem to be quite a few.

The biggest difference seems to be weight among the road pedals but the concept of "float" should be the same. I use speedplay pedals and like them. Though there has been some discussion on whether they're good for your knees.

No. Speedplay has several different lines of pedals. Within a given family, weight is the primary difference, though there are others (ex: number and type of bearings). Between the families, there are a number of significant differences: amount of float, adjustable vs. non-ajustable float, and release angle to name a few. The Speedplay (http://www.speedplay.com/) website does a pretty good job of explaining the differences. The road pedal comparison (http://www.speedplay.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=roadcompare.compareroad) screen is a great way to figure out the differences between their various pedals.

As mgsullivan noted, the biggest difference is the claimed weight of the pedal and of course the make up of the component materials etc.
Edit:
See sstorkel's posts for links to the site.

How much is marketing vs. something one would notice ?

If my memory hasn't failed me, I think that some may have float options not available in others .... up to ~ 15%.

I liked the double sided option for clipping in, although your choice of shoes are narrowed down if you are looking for a native 4 hole mounting connection, otherwise the adapters work fine.

Since the clip mechanisms are essentially transferred to the shoes, whereas others Look, Shimano,Time etc. are part of the pedal the total weight difference is likely negligible. Of all styles that I have used, I found them the most difficult to walk in.

I liked the double sided option for clipping in, although your choice of shoes are narrowed down if you are looking for a native 4 hole mounting connection, otherwise the adapters work fine.

I was wondering about that. I'm not sure I've seen a shoe with 4 bolts - only 2 and 3. But then I haven't made the rounds of all the shops, turning every single shoe over to check.