Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - My Reading Comp or LBS BS?? Not Allowed to Order Jersey

So Gina and I drive all the way to the shop to order the jersey figuring I am qualified by according to the advertisment below take from "their" website. PAY ATTENTION TO THE BOLD SECTION.

I ask the guy at the shop and he says I'm not allowed to order "this jersey" since I did it back in 07. I explain that's not what the ad says. So he calls the guy in charge of the jerseys ( Robert Kahler in the webstie pic modeling the kit). He says that I can only buy the color for the year I completed the ride. WTF! Funny, this is taken from their website, Robert K. owns the shop. Robert Kahler minces no words when he describes himself as a lousy businessman and a reluctant retailer. Atleast he's got that right!



I inform him of the statement made in the ad on "their" website. It says "the year was not put on the jersey so that you can purchase it at anytime as long as you have completed all 4 passes in the past. There is even an example that says 'for instance, if you completed it in 09, you may still purchase this jersey".

He says no, I am only allowed to purchase the color signifying the year I completed the ride and if the statement is on the website, it was placed there by mistake.

So I asked why did the ad say "we don't put the year on the jersey so that you can buy them if you have ever completed the 4 passes if I am limited to only the green color signifying my year. If that was true, why don't you put the date on the jersey?

It also says that if you uhave completed the ride in a prior year, you should come out to the park to order the jersey (Also in Bold)

Then he says that it's that way to prevent riders who haven't complete the ride from purchasing a jersey. He said sorry for the mistake andif he has any leftovers in a few months, he'll sell me one.

"F" it, I wouldn't buy one now if you begged me. Seems you guys have your heads so far up your arse, you don't even understand what you wrote on your website.

BTW, YOUR website says the store opens at 10:30. I made a long drive just to get there in time and your store doesn't open till 11 am. So that was an extra half hour of my time wasted on your stupid shop because of your inadequacy.

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Features:

Beautiful Yellow, Carbon Fiber Black, and Grey fully sublimated jersey showing Grim Reaper chasing you on the Breathless Agony Course on the Front. "Now - Go Elevate Yourself" on the Front.


"Breathless Agony Century", Full Route Elevation Chart, "4 Pass Finisher", "114 Miles - 12,000 Feet of Climbing", and "The Toughest Century in Southern California" on the Back.


"114 Miles", "12,000 Feet of Climbing", and "Dan Thomas Memorial Ride" on both sleeves.


You have to complete the 4 Passes of the ride in order to qualify to purchase these special jerseys at the Ride Finish or later at the Santiago Cycling Bike Shop in Tustin, thereby guaranteeing their exclusivity and prestige value.


This high-quality jersey was designed by Tony Rodriguez, 4 Pass Finisher of the Breathless Agony in 2000, 2001, and 2002!! A big thanks to Tony for all his work on this project!!


Manufactured by VOLER Team Apparel.


Price: $75 which includes Sales Tax


This design does not include the year on it ... so you can order it if you ever completed the 4 Pass Breathless Agony Century. For instance, if you completed the 4 Passes of the Breathless Agony Century in 2009 but not since, you can still order this Jersey. Of course, we expect and want to see you on the Breathless Agony Century again in the future ... in your Voler Jersey!!


If you have completed the Breathless Agony Century with all 4 Passes including 114 Miles and 12,000 Feet of Climbing in a prior year, you should come out and buy one of these Jerseys at the Finish at Sylvan Park in Redlands!![/B] If that doesn't work for you, call Robert Kahler at (714) 544-6091 and drop by Santiago Cycling at 115 North Prospect in Tustin. If you'd like us to ship you a Jersey, there is an Order Form Here. Do not order a jersey before you have successfully completed all 4 Passes of the ride.

Screenshot from their webstie to show I didn't change a thing.

click for larger

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3268/5713546183_69d25d1b89.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/40913998@N06/5713546183/)

It could be that we both have a reading comp issue, but...
Seems like a valid rant you have there Mr. What a s#*t deal. Sorry you wasted a morning that way. The only caveat that I saw on there was that it said-

"...or if that doesn't work for you, call ___________ at ### and drop by SC..."

I suppose that if you didn't call first, he could've made that argument; but as you put it out he didn't even make that argument, so I'm calling shenanigans on the deal.

Did you say you were Mr. Beanz? If so expect exceptional service and 1/2 off :D.

Seriously though it sounds like the guy is just a "hard a$$". You now know what shop to avoid and business not to spend your money on.

Did you say you were Mr. Beanz? If so expect exceptional service and 1/2 off :D.

Seriously though it sounds like the guy is just a "hard a$$". You now know what shop to avoid and business not to spend your money on.

...and what ride not to participate in anymore, along with a lot of other people...

It could be that we both have a reading comp issue, but...
Seems like a valid rant you have there Mr. What a s#*t deal. Sorry you wasted a morning that way. The only caveat that I saw on there was that it said-

"...or if that doesn't work for you, call ___________ at ### and drop by SC..."

I suppose that if you didn't call first, he could've made that argument; but as you put it out he didn't even make that argument, so I'm calling shenanigans on the deal.

I could have called first to save the trip but the argument would be the same. ;)

Yeah, I wrote a letter to the organizer of the rides on the issue. He runs the two big Mountain rides that I've done.

Sad thing is that have done the other ride 4 times, always ordered a XXL t shirt and always received an XL as they say they ran out of XXL.:mad: This is at the beginning of the ride with my t shirt in a packet.:eek: I gave 3 away as souviners and the last one I kept hanging in the closet (doesn't fit). They're screwed up somewhere!

so he won't sell you one now because he'll only sell you the corresponding color to the year you actually rode? but then he will sell you one after a period of time if he has any in the color you want left over?

Sounds like a moron.

you would think he wants to make money so sell to people they prove finished, who cares which year if its not on the jersey. so stupid

Yeah, I know pretty crazy. I've emailed the oraganizer of the rides and asked that if anything, he correct the mistake on the swebsites to avoid this issue in the future with other riders expecting to order a jersey.:thumb:

i think your reading was correct.

The thing that gets me is that the wording on the website, as you quoted and showed it, is completely unambiguous. I could see his argument if the printed statement was equivocal or just plain confusing in some way, but it seems crystal clear to me, and his attitude is completely contrary to it.

The thing that gets me is that the wording on the website, as you quoted and showed it, is completely unambiguous. I could see his argument if the printed statement was equivocal or just plain confusing in some way, but it seems crystal clear to me, and his attitude is completely contrary to it.

I agree with you guys. I even looked through the entire website for something that proved me wrong. Nothing, not even a hint of confusion! I looked for soemthing stating color codes, nothing. But the statement "riders that have completed in the past are encouraged to show up at the park to order this jersey" says it all. ;)

i love how they talk about "protecting the exclusivity" as if these jersey are really gonna be worth money one day. what a moron. he should be selling jerseys to anyone thats willing to fork over the money.

i love how they talk about "protecting the exclusivity" as if these jersey are really gonna be worth money one day. what a moron. he should be selling jerseys to anyone thats willing to fork over the money.

Funny, the order form asks what year you completed the ride then ask for you to circle the color you want.:rolleyes:

What a maroon!

This is the kind of sheot that makes me glad to be car-lite. If I go somewhere expecting to be able to buy something and I get the usual Sacramento jingle of "we don't have it", "we have to order it", etc. etc. I just consider it a bike ride and some good exercise/weight loss, not a stressful drive in traffic, waste of gas, wear and tear on my truck, etc.

These are the same kind of shops that probably complain all day long that the Internet is killing there business.. First impressions on new customers can be long lasting - either in the positive or negative.. I know which camp Mr. Beanz is in and he has good reason.

Funny, the order form asks what year you completed the ride then ask for you to circle the color you want.:rolleyes:

If you didn't have such a sour taste in your mouth over the ordeal, I'd suggest mailing in the order form and circling yellow. It's going to go to some event volunteer/minimum wage helper who probably doesn't give a sideways fart which year you finished the ride in so long as your check is enclosed.

The thing that gets me is that the wording on the website, as you quoted and showed it, is completely unambiguous. I could see his argument if the printed statement was equivocal or just plain confusing in some way, but it seems crystal clear to me, and his attitude is completely contrary to it.

I agree with Beanz's gripe, but there IS one little ambiguity there:

This design does not include the year on it ... so you can order it if you ever completed the 4 Pass Breathless Agony Century. For instance, if you completed the 4 Passes of the Breathless Agony Century in 2009 but not since, you can still order this Jersey. Of course, we expect and want to see you on the Breathless Agony Century again in the future ... in your Voler Jersey!!

I find this phrasing a little weird, but it does not say "2009 but not previously" which is the case with Beanz. It seems to indicate that 2009 and 2010 riders cannot get the jersey for some reason. Just weird....

I agree with Beanz's gripe, but there IS one little ambiguity there:

This design does not include the year on it ... so you can order it if you ever completed the 4 Pass Breathless Agony Century. For instance, if you completed the 4 Passes of the Breathless Agony Century in 2009 but not since, you can still order this Jersey. Of course, we expect and want to see you on the Breathless Agony Century again in the future ... in your Voler Jersey!!

I find this phrasing a little weird, but it does not say "2009 but not previously" which is the case with Beanz. It seems to indicate that 2009 and 2010 riders cannot get the jersey for some reason. Just weird....

I comprehend that a bit differently from you. I see the "if you ever compelted" as ever and take "for instance" as "for example" meaning if you did it in 09, you can still order this jersey and the "if you evercompleted" includes previous years. :)

Throw in this for alittle more support of my case, in the ad:
If you have completed the Breathless Agony Century with all 4 Passes including 114 Miles and 12,000 Feet of Climbing in a prior year, you should come out and buy one of these Jerseys at the Finish at Sylvan Park in Redlands

Like I said though, I don't have to get the jersey. I wanted it but after this, it's no longer a must knowing the stupidity that goes along with it.

I'm just amazed that they're being so sticky about this. Somewhere I have an old provincial cycling team jersey and I was never good enough for the provincial team - the association sold off the old ones to anyone who wanted one when they updated to a new design. My better half has some open water swim tee shirts from events I've been in where more tee shirts were printed than there were participants. No-one cared that he can barely swim, doesn't even like swimming, and definitely didn't do the events. I have a charity ride shirt that he was given as an extra after he finished the ride. Too small for him, and no-one cares that I didn't actually ride it, it's good advertising for them if I wear it to the gym.
Their snobbishness will eventually come back to bite them in the butt.

Their snobbishness will eventually come back to bite them in the butt.

I believe it already has. :D

Their snobbishness will eventually come back to bite them in the butt.

I emailed one of the oragnizers involved (only name I'vd found and suggested on the forums) and haven't received a response. No real biggie but I hope they do clean up the several "mistakes" in the advertisement. Anyway, I'd done their other similar ride 4 times in the past. That one seem so be suffereing. Used to sell out in hours, now takes weeks. Might have to do with the roads failing during the rains, washed out roads etc. There was a threat of a detour last year and this year, a detour as the road collapsed with this years rain. Karma I guess. ;)

I've seen shops come and go. Brings to mind a local high end shop. We went in years back to browse with one of the kids when he was 10. Very well behaved kid! First the sign on the front window said " no cycling shoes allowed on the floor". Then as we were looking at the bikes, the owner walked up and said, "kids aren't allowed to touch the bikes". WTF! The kid knows better than to mistreat a bike, actually rode tandem for a while ..They were there for about a year then vanished.:eek:..The shop was name "Rotrax". See Ya!:p

Hey Beanz,
I agree with you... the phrase I pointed to actually suggests that more recent riders could not get the jersey.

Chuck is a good guy! Situation all cleared up and I will get my jersey! He cleared things up with the shop, the shop cleared up the mess and made good!

Well as you may have read, I was very upset that I was not allowed to purchase the jersey of which I thought I was qualified to purchase. After sending out a few notices I received a response from Santiago Cycling's Robert Kahler. He apologized for the misunderstanding and has offered to sell me the jersey to make things right. Cool, that's what I was after. In my email, I asked that if the policy was not so, then maybe look into having it withdrawn from the ad in order to save other riders some frustration.

Robert also mentioned that he had never encountered this issue before and that it was a big mistake. Ha ha, leave it to Mr. Beanz to bring it up! So I replied that I would surely want the jersey even though I said I never would. Hey, we post things out of anger when we are upset.

So anyway, it was all a big mistake and like any business, stuff happens. The final outcome is how the business handles an issue and in this case, everything worked out for the best! That's all I ask from a shop, if something is wrong, make it right and Robert did. So my hat is off as he could have flipped me the bird after the things I posted but he was kind enough to make things right. So I apologize as well and hope that we go forward from here.

So I kindly retract any negativity I posted about Robert and Santiago Cycling over the misunderstanding as they have made things right as any good business would after such and issue. I'll be getting my jersey!

I had sent an email to Chuck Bramwell after hearing he was pretty good guy from others on the forum. So if he had anything to do with clearing up the misunderstanding, I thank him as well for his help! Plus, I hope to ride Breathless Agony again with you sometime soon. ;)

Thank you Robert, Santiago Cycling and Chuck B.!

The question always is whether it was done because they saw the error of there ways or if someone told them about this thread and they went out of there way only because of the negative comments posted above.

The question always is whether it was done because they saw the error of there ways or if someone told them about this thread and they went out of there way only because of the negative comments posted above.

I emailed Chuck Bramwell with links to the threads and to my blog. I expressed my feelings and asked that they remove the statements if they weren't true.

Richard emailed me and said he saw my blog and stated he had never encounterd this issue and didn't realize that this was their policy and that it was his mistake being unaware. I think Chuck contacted him with the link I sent to him as I never sent it to Richard cause I couldn't find his email or the shop's email link.

Plus I am sure the comments posted were a factor. I posted the thead on the other socal forum as well. Some of the guys asked if they should send an email in my support. I said it would only help , feel free. So must have been a combination of things as well as reading the policy correctly.

Either way, it's good that he knows the policy is what I understood and not the way he understood it. More than lilkley this will help another rider in the future.

But he made good on the deal like a good business should once they find their mistake. He also "mentioned" that it would be appreciated if I removed the negative comments from my blog. He didn't ask but I did since he made good on the misunderstanding. He also said he isn't a blank hole like I thought, and that it was an honest mistake.

From what I read, the policy will stand the way I understood it. :thumb:

Everything is good now!

Beanz, that's a nice mess they made for you. Good for you for having the nerves to handle it right, I've would have probably dropped it and walked away. And in my book if they really wanted to make it right, you would have that jersey free, with an accompanied apology. But to make you pay for it after all of that hassle, hm, it just does not sit right with me.

Anyway, as long as you are satisfied with the outcome I think that's fine, we can talk all we want here, but it is your decision after all. If you ask me what I would have done in a such a situation, I would have probably walked away the moment that guy started giving me attitude. I'm the customer when I buy something and it's my money that they live from, so if they can't or won't be polite, they will not get my money.

Mr. Beanz gets flack here from time to time for being argumentative, but here's a case where he's not only right and stuck to his guns, but gracious in settling the dispute afterward. Three cheers for Mr. Beanz!

And in my book if they really wanted to make it right, you would have that jersey free, with an accompanied apology. But to make you pay for it after all of that hassle, hm, it just does not sit right with me

Let me say, when I say he made it right, he made it right. I don't want to post all the details so that others might not try to take advantage of the situation but "I AM HAPPY" with the final outcome!;)

Yes, Historian, I stick to my guns when I know I am right. Someone mentioned that I should not have posted any of this issue online but as far as I am concened, the net is a very powerful tool and it pays to have friends. Posters that I have ridden with from another forum said hey were also emailing certain indviduals in my support. Thanks to those guys, it all adds up and when you are right, you are right!:thumb:

It is easy to be gracious once the other party admits their mistake and shows good will on their part, so I need not be sticky about it as they made it right. Like I said, this will also help any other riders facing this issue in the future.:D