Bicycle Mechanics - Struggling up the mountain, should I switch cassette or crankset?

I have a Giant Bike and am training for a road ride across Iowa (ragbrai). The ride will have 21,000 of climbing; fifteen thousand in the first two days. I am struggling when I am climbing in the bay area, mainly in Marin by Mt. Tam is where I ride. My cadence drops when I climb, and often I have to stand up to keep my bike moving uphill.

I have a standard crankset (ultegra, with two cranks, one with 53 teeth, and one with 39 teeth). My rear cassette is 12-25. I've gotten strong by riding a lot recently, but perhaps I should change my crankset or cassette to make climbing easier. Suggestions?

One of the most straightforward ways to add lower gears would be to get a Deore XT RD-M771 rear derailleur, a 10-speed Shimano or SRAM 11-32 cassette, and a new (longer) chain. The low gear would be about 28% lower. You'll have bigger jumps from gear to gear, but it sounds like the lesser of two evils here :)

edit: I'm assuming your system has a 10-speed rear cassette now. If it's 9-speed in the rear, then of course use a 9-speed cassette.

Are you sure the large chainring has 59 teeth? That seems very large when paired with a small ring of 34 teeth. That makes a huge gap when shifting from one ring to another. If it has 59 teeth, I would change it to something like a 50 tooth. The 50/34 would give you a typical compact crankset. If you still have problems, you could change to a larger cassette on the rear. How large you can go here depends on the rear derailleur capacity.

I have a Giant Bike and am training for a road ride across Iowa (ragbrai). The ride will have 21,000 of climbing; fifteen thousand in the first two days. I am struggling when I am climbing in the bay area, mainly in Marin by Mt. Tam is where I ride. My cadence drops when I climb, and often I have to stand up to keep my bike moving uphill.

I have a standard crankset (ultegra, with two cranks, one with 59 teeth, and one with 34 teeth). My rear cassette is 12-25. I've gotten strong by riding a lot recently, but perhaps I should change my crankset or cassette to make climbing easier. Suggestions?

Most of the hills in Iowa are steep, but short. Your crank with the 34t chainring is a compact double. That crank should work fine.

Is you bike a 2x9 or a 2x10? If you have a 2x9, Harris provides a 13-30 nine speed cassette that should work perfectly for the terrain. See: http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?ID=702

You should be able to use this with your existing derailleur, but be sure to install a new chain.

If you have a 2x10, consider the Sram Apex 11-32 ten speed cassette and use a new chain and long cage derailleur like this: http://harriscyclery.net/itemdetails.cfm?ID=950

I was wrong. The crankset is 53 and 39. I have ten speed cassette. How does change your response?

You're right. Its 53 and 39. Sorry, for the mistake.

The 11-32 cassette, a new chain, and a 9-speed Shimano mountain derailleur would still be a viable plan. I suggested the XT model, but it's worth mentioning that it doesn't have a cable adjuster, so if your frame doesn't have a cable adjuster, you'd also want to add an inline adjuster, or simply pick a derailleur that has one, like the Deore that Barrettscv linked to.

Just to point out a couple pitfalls:

1. if you do go with that plan, don't get a 10-speed Shimano mountain derailleur. They use a different cable-actuation setup. The 9-speed models are the way to go.

2. also, be aware that there are some mountain rear derailleurs that are sprung in reverse. They "home" on the biggest cassette cog, not the smallest. These are referred to as "low-normal" or Rapid Rise. If you like how your shifters work now, stick with a top-normal, non-RapidRise rear derailleur.

It may be simpler to get a compact double crankset. Use your existing chain (might not even have to shorten it) and derailleurs; just lower the front one. Maybe you need a compact-specific front derailleur, I'm not sure. But they're cheaper than rear derailleurs.

That'll give you 50 & 34 rings, and a 13% lower first gear. If you're tallish (say, over 5'9"), you'd prolly find 175mm cranks a boon too. Pretty much the only downside (apart from looks IMO), is you lose top gear (50/12 is roughly 53/13).

I was wrong. The crankset is 53 and 39. I have ten speed cassette. How does change your response?

Like Kimmo said, try a compact crankset. You will be able to use your existing chain and derailleurs.

Seek out something like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/105-Shimano-5650-Crankset-50-34-T-COMPACT-175-mm-NEW-/380341977834?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item588e2602ea

This item is a 175mm crankarm size, check to see what length of crankarm is on your bike.

asp2011, I doubt that you'll find any steeper climbs that you now face in the Bay Area, but the distance of the climb could very well be greater. I don't think a 53-39 is ideal for the Bay Area and if I lived there (my son was transferred there so I have a fairly good idea of the terrain) I'd change to a compact or a triple crankset.

I'd swap in a compact crankset (a compact's chainrings may be transferrable to your present crankset, worth checking on) and ride that before any other changes.

Brad

+1 Start shopping for a compact crankset.

It would be more economical to change the cassette, derailer and chain than to change the crank, depending on the level of components. A new 105 compact is going to cost around $270. A new 10 speed 11-34 or 11-36 cassette can be found for $60, a rear derailer will cost from $50 (LX) to $80 (XT) to $170 (XTR) and a chain costs whatever you want to pay. If you went with the XTR (and not including the chain cost), you'd still have to pay less than the 105 crank.

And you'd have a slightly lower gear (32 gear inches vs 36 gi). If you went with the 11-36 cassette, you'd have a low gear of 29 gear inches for the same price.

I can just picture the OP's reaction at this point - gah, option overload!

It would be more economical to change the cassette, derailer and chain than to change the crank, depending on the level of components. A new 105 compact is going to cost around $270. A new 10 speed 11-34 or 11-36 cassette can be found for $60, a rear derailer will cost from $50 (LX) to $80 (XT) to $170 (XTR) and a chain costs whatever you want to pay. If you went with the XTR (and not including the chain cost), you'd still have to pay less than the 105 crank.

And you'd have a slightly lower gear (32 gear inches vs 36 gi). If you went with the 11-36 cassette, you'd have a low gear of 29 gear inches for the same price.
Yep, compact crank gets him to 36gi. Cassette option gets him lower for lower cost. Especially if he can switch to a cassette that doesn't require a mtb derailleur. What's the biggest cog on a 10sp road or touring cassette that will work with a short cage derailleur? 30t? 39(ring)-30(cog) would get him to 34.3gi, and if he can do that with only a cassette and chain swap, might be his cheapest option.

@Kimmo, if he went with a compact crank, I don't think he'll need to change FD. I used to ride a compact crank with a standard FD.


I'd swap in a compact crankset (a compact's chainrings may be transferrable to your present crankset, worth checking on) and ride that before any other changes.Hmmm. Are compact chainrings compatible with standard cranks? I didn't think they were. But if they are, that would easily be the least expensive option.

Are compact chainrings compatible with standard cranks? I didn't think they were. But if they are, that would easily be the least expensive option.

I think Shimano did some cranksets with the compact-sized spider and normal-sized rings for a couple of years there somewhere.

Remember thinking they looked weird... IIRC it was around the time the hollow cranks started to trickle down.

Like Kimmo said, try a compact crankset. You will be able to use your existing chain and derailleurs.

Seek out something like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/105-Shimano-5650-Crankset-50-34-T-COMPACT-175-mm-NEW-/380341977834?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item588e2602ea

This item is a 175mm crankarm size, check to see what length of crankarm is on your bike.


It would be more economical to change the cassette, derailer and chain than to change the crank, depending on the level of components. A new 105 compact is going to cost around $270. A new 10 speed 11-34 or 11-36 cassette can be found for $60, a rear derailer will cost from $50 (LX) to $80 (XT) to $170 (XTR) and a chain costs whatever you want to pay. If you went with the XTR (and not including the chain cost), you'd still have to pay less than the 105 crank.

And you'd have a slightly lower gear (32 gear inches vs 36 gi). If you went with the 11-36 cassette, you'd have a low gear of 29 gear inches for the same price.


The OP should have no problem finding a Shimano or Sram Compact for less than $150. This comes in about the same as a new cassette, derailleur & chain. If these parts are worn and need replacing, the new cassette, derailleur & chain is the better option.

One problem with the 11-36 cassette is the massive change in cadence between each gear. Keeping the standard crank also provides a number of gear combinations that are useless while crossing Iowa or climbing hills in San-fran. In-fact, a 53 chainring becomes almost useless on a long tour where his average speed is going to be 12-17 mph on any given day.

However, switching to a compact double only drops the low gear by about 14%. If someone wanted just one lower gear, so he didn't have to push as hard, then maybe that would be enough, but the OP reports he has to actually get out of the saddle to keep the bike rolling, so I lean towards the 28%-lower result of the 11-32.

Here is the comparison between the two gearsets;

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/12-25v11-36.png

Anything above 100 gear inches is going to need a steep decent and climbing in Iowa is limited to short sections of a mile or less. I would really be surprised if the OP could not climb the steepest section with a 34 & 25 combination. Just as important as hill climbing will be the wind in Iowa. Having a 15% + change in cadence can be a real handicap when fighting a 15 to 25 mph headwind for 6 to 8 hours.

Good point.

Hmmm. Are compact chainrings compatible with standard cranks? I didn't think they were. But if they are, that would easily be the least expensive option.A standard 110 bcd crank, yes. but I expect you have a 130 crank,
so you only go down to where the bolt circle is, 1 tooth less than 39.

I like triples. 52/42/26 & 50/40/24 on my 2 road/tour bikes.
Campag race triples, still square taper, 3 piece.

3rd chainring, is half the # of teeth of the big one.

I went 11-34 and 34-50 but I built my bike from scratch, are you planning a temporary change?? If it's temporary go cheap and get an Altus RD and a TX cassette, your 10spd for 100$.

Go down the page to the Tiagra triple. Add a 24t small ring to replace the silly racing triple small ring. http://www.bikeparts.com/productsearch2.asp?psID=69#pN=2&f%5B%5D=656&pS=100
A 105 front Der. http://www.bikeparts.com/productsearch2.asp?psID=72#pN=1&f%5B%5D=1331&f%5B%5D=1328
If you use your present cassette you will a 25.7 inch low gear.

Anything above 100 gear inches is going to need a steep decent and climbing in Iowa is limited to short sections of a mile or less. I would really be surprised if the OP could not climb the steepest section with a 34 & 25 combination. Just as important as hill climbing will be the wind in Iowa. Having a 15% + change in cadence can be a real handicap when fighting a 15 to 25 mph headwind for 6 to 8 hours.
Cool graphic representation.

Problem is we don't know how much power OP puts out or his cadence on the climbs. But having (as opposed to choosing) to stand on anything not very steep is a sign that the 13% drop from his current small gear to 34-25 isn't going to solve the problem.

Maybe we can get at this another way. OP, what hills in particular are you forced to stand on? Someone must know the slope of all the big hills in that area from having used Garmins and such.

A standard 110 bcd crank, yes. but I expect you have a 130 crank,
so you only go down to where the bolt circle is, 1 tooth less than 39.

I like triples. 52/42/26 & 50/40/24 on my 2 road/tour bikes.
Campag race triples, still square taper, 3 piece.

A triple would be ideal, but he might need to change brifters along with a front derailleur & BB.

I was thinking about this crankset with 46 & 30 double chainrings: http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/cranksets/cranks/grand-cru-50-4bcd-crankset.html

at $200, it's a little pricey and not-in-stock currently.

A standard 110 bcd crank, yes. but I expect you have a 130 crank,
so you only go down to where the bolt circle is, 1 tooth less than 39.
OP has an Ultegra crank. Is that 130 bcd? What would be the smallest chainring combo he can get on there?

I have a Giant Bike and am training for a road ride across Iowa (ragbrai). The ride will have 21,000 of climbing; fifteen thousand in the first two days. I am struggling when I am climbing in the bay area, mainly in Marin by Mt. Tam is where I ride. My cadence drops when I climb, and often I have to stand up to keep my bike moving uphill.


If you are surviving in Cali w/ a full size, then you will be able to ride ragbrai with the same setup.

In Cali, you have 1000 and 2000ft climbs at 8% to12%. While Iowa may have steep "hills" they will be shorter and more like "rollers" to you. While it may be torture to grind out 1000ft... if you are able to do it at all, then you can certainly stand up and power through 300ft of it, recover on the "descent". Plus, you'll probably get a third of the way up the next one before you really have to start pedaling.

7,500 ft of rollers per day is nothing, and I do mean nothing, like the same gain in 2 or 3 long climbs. You get to recover between them. You get to reuse your downhill momentum. You can climb them at a faster pace, and drafting / pace lining can help considerably.

I suspect you'll be astonished at how they "climb" those "mountains". And it looks like after the first two days, you're home free.

I say you probably have nothing to worry about. Ride what you already have.

If you're really worried, use one of the elevation mapping sites to map out the "climbs" you will be facing, and compare them to the ones you're used to.

Here is the comparison between the two gearsets;

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/12-25v11-36.png

Anything above 100 gear inches is going to need a steep decent and climbing in Iowa is limited to short sections of a mile or less. I would really be surprised if the OP could not climb the steepest section with a 34 & 25 combination. Just as important as hill climbing will be the wind in Iowa. Having a 15% + change in cadence can be a real handicap when fighting a 15 to 25 mph headwind for 6 to 8 hours.

cool chart.

Notice how all the lines start out far apart and then stack up closer together? That usually means it would be more useful on a logarithmic scale.

OP has an Ultegra crank. Is that 130 bcd? What would be the smallest chainring combo he can get on there?

38t, not worth changing out.

I vote for the simplest fix, 27 or 28t cassette, maybe add a few links to the chain if it isn't worn out. Done.

I vote for the simplest fix, 27 or 28t cassette, maybe add a few links to the chain if it isn't worn out. Done.
With nycphotography's knowledge of ragbrai, this seems like it might be a good option.

Anyone know the answer to my earlier question?

What's the biggest cog on a 10sp road or touring cassette that will work with a short cage derailleur? 30t? 39(ring)-30(cog) would get him to 34.3gi

With nycphotography's knowledge of ragbrai, this seems like it might be a good option.


Whoa!

Disclaimer: I don't know much about ragbrai. But I did spend years in the midwest, and IOWA is well east of any real mountainous terrain.

I did recommend checking the route maps to see what the actual climbs would be like ;-)

Whoa!

Disclaimer: I don't know much about ragbrai. But I did spend years in the midwest, and IOWA is well east of any real mountainous terrain.

I did recommend checking the route maps to see what the actual climbs would be like ;-)My bad, I misread you.

Well, as I mentioned earlier, if OP can tell us the hills he is forced to climb on, someone can probably find the slopes/length and he can compare those to the ragbrai route.

Originally Posted by serpico7
"What's the biggest cog on a 10sp road or touring cassette that will work with a short cage derailleur? 30t? 39(ring)-30(cog) would get him to 34.3gi"

The official rating on Shimano road short cage rear derailleur is 27 or 28t maximum cassette cog size, depending on model. However this is really conservative. 99% of the road bikes using a Shimano road short cage rear derailleur can take a XX-30 cassette. Many road bikes using a Shimano road short cage rear derailleur can take a XX-32 cassette. The length of the hanger is a critical part of the equation.

I ran a 11-32 Sram Apex with a Shimano road rear derailleur last year, it functioned perfectly.

Originally Posted by serpico7
"What's the biggest cog on a 10sp road or touring cassette that will work with a short cage derailleur? 30t? 39(ring)-30(cog) would get him to 34.3gi"

The official rating on Shimano road short cage rear derailleur is 27 or 28t maximum cassette cog size, depending on model. However this is really conservative. 99% of the road bikes using a Shimano road short cage rear derailleur can take a XX-30 cassette. Many road bikes using a Shimano road short cage rear derailleur can take a XX-32 cassette. The length of the hanger is a critical part of the equation.

I ran a 11-32 Sram Apex with a Shimano road rear derailleur last year, it functioned perfectly.That might be the answer right there.

If OP's derailleur hanger works with 11-32 (or is replaceable and he can swap to one that works with a 32t cog), that gets him to 32.2gi, which is a 22% drop from his current smallest gear. Sounds like it should easily be good enough for ragbrai, plus it might solve his gearing issues for his home area climbs.

Of course, if 30t gets him where he needs to be, even easier to fit and fewer potential performance issues and smaller gear spacing.

I vote for the simplest fix, 27 or 28t cassette, maybe add a few links to the chain if it isn't worn out. Done.

Me too. I rode RAGBRAI with a 42x21 low gear... toughest hill was maybe half a mile at 8%; I think the same hill is on this year's route (Boone Hill - the mayor was at the top handing out glasses of lemonade and there was some guy with a tally board counting the riders). Now that was a long time ago, but still...

1 - 11-28 cassette and maybe new chain... cheapest and likely fine.
2 - 11-34 cassette and new RD and new chain... even lower and might be the way to go if you want to be set up like that in Marin County all the time.
3 - Compact crank... much more expensive unless you need a new crank anyway
4 - Triple crank... way too expensive when you count the shifters and RD too... you could probably get a whole new bike for the same price.

Me too. I rode RAGBRAI with a 42x21 low gear... toughest hill was maybe half a mile at 8%; I think the same hill is on this year's route (Boone Hill - the mayor was at the top handing out glasses of lemonade and there was some guy with a tally board counting the riders). Now that was a long time ago, but still...

1 - 11-28 cassette and maybe new chain... cheapest and likely fine.
2 - 11-34 cassette and new RD and new chain... even lower and might be the way to go if you want to be set up like that in Marin County all the time.
3 - Compact crank... much more expensive unless you need a new crank anyway
4 - Triple crank... way too expensive when you count the shifters and RD too... you could probably get a whole new bike for the same price.

This is more or less what I expected... even less than I expected: 5250 ft / 2 * 8% = 210 ft climb.

So for the Norcal rider who is used to much longer, and even steeper climbs on the setup they have now...

I think the cheapest (and even most appropriate) solution is to ride what he has. $0.

If he wants better climbing gears for at home, now that's a worthwhile discussion. But he really shouldn't need them for ragbrai.

If you are used to the SF Bay area, Iowa will be a piece of cake. I rode RAGBRAI in '86 when the ride was mostly in the southern half of the state which is where the majority of the hills are and there was nothing really memorable at all. I'd call the terrain rolling but certainly not mountainous or even really hilly. I don't know where that 21,000' of climbing was calculated but I have to think it's 100' of climbing 2100 times.

If you are still concerned, a wider range cassette like a 12x27 is the cheapest option, a much wider cassette, say 12x32 or 11x32, plus an MTB rear derailleur would be more costly and a new compact crank would probably be the most expensive change.

The OP should have no problem finding a Shimano or Sram Compact for less than $150. This comes in about the same as a new cassette, derailleur & chain. If these parts are worn and need replacing, the new cassette, derailleur & chain is the better option.

One problem with the 11-36 cassette is the massive change in cadence between each gear. Keeping the standard crank also provides a number of gear combinations that are useless while crossing Iowa or climbing hills in San-fran. In-fact, a 53 chainring becomes almost useless on a long tour where his average speed is going to be 12-17 mph on any given day.

Like I said, it depends on level of components. You could certainly find a Tiagra crank for cheap but you could also go with a very cheap rear derailer. Since my posting, I've found LX rear derailer for as little as $35. That would bring the price down way below just about any worthwhile crankset.

The compact double doesn't improve the combinations any. The larger steps between gears on an 11-36, especially on the low end, is the point of wide range gearing arrangements. It's the difference between struggling to the top of hills vs spinning.

If you are used to the SF Bay area, Iowa will be a piece of cake. I rode RAGBRAI in '86 when the ride was mostly in the southern half of the state which is where the majority of the hills are and there was nothing really memorable at all. I'd call the terrain rolling but certainly not mountainous or even really hilly. I don't know where that 21,000' of climbing was calculated but I have to think it's 100' of climbing 2100 times.

If you are still concerned, a wider range cassette like a 12x27 is the cheapest option, a much wider cassette, say 12x32 or 11x32, plus an MTB rear derailleur would be more costly and a new compact crank would probably be the most expensive change.

I've never been to Iowa, but the map looks like HillRider is correct. See the 2011 Ragbrai map (http://ragbrai.com/data/2011/) and click on Sunday's route, then zoom all the way in. This is Google Terrain View, and each contour line is 40 feet of elevation. The darker lines are every 200 feet. So hills that have a dark ring near the base, and no other dark line up to the summit, are less than 200 feet high.

Here's the whole 2011 route (http://ridewithgps.com/routes/393480) on ridewithgps.com. It shows 9900 feet of climbing for the 446 miles. The county roads laid out on 1 mile intervals are interesting.

Pull down the map type at the top to show Terrain. On the elevation graph at the bottom, drag to select a tiny section of the ride. It'll zoom in and expand the graph, then you can move the pointer along and see that most grades are reasonable, often well under 5%.

Dragging to select the first 64 miles, ridewithgps shows 2,100 feet of climbing. The 4,900 feet listed on the official map seems high. Perhaps there are a lot of repeated 10 or 20 foot elevation gains that don't show up on the Google maps.

Compare the first 40 miles to a Garmin GPS ride I recorded last winter (http://ridewithgps.com/trips/152933) in Ohio, the Gears for Beers (http://www.gears4beers.org/)' painted Blue Arrow Route. It had 2,700 feet in 41 miles, and most of it seemed flat to rolling, with a few 200 foot climbs added in. The GPS recording includes every little 5, 10, or 20 foot elevation change on the ride.

It looks like you'll have enough elevation gains to make the ride challenging, but you probably don't need any new gears. Perhaps a new 12-27 cassette. That's always good to have on any serious grade.

Thanks for the reply, Brad.

Its steep. I was climbing Mt. Tam from Muir Beach along Shoreline Highway. I didn't need to stand the whole ride as the slope changes, but in some places I did. Unfortunately, I am unable to say how much my cadence dropped.

Thanks for the confidence boost!


If you are surviving in Cali w/ a full size, then you will be able to ride ragbrai with the same setup.

In Cali, you have 1000 and 2000ft climbs at 8% to12%. While Iowa may have steep "hills" they will be shorter and more like "rollers" to you. While it may be torture to grind out 1000ft... if you are able to do it at all, then you can certainly stand up and power through 300ft of it, recover on the "descent". Plus, you'll probably get a third of the way up the next one before you really have to start pedaling.

7,500 ft of rollers per day is nothing, and I do mean nothing, like the same gain in 2 or 3 long climbs. You get to recover between them. You get to reuse your downhill momentum. You can climb them at a faster pace, and drafting / pace lining can help considerably.

I suspect you'll be astonished at how they "climb" those "mountains". And it looks like after the first two days, you're home free.

I say you probably have nothing to worry about. Ride what you already have.

If you're really worried, use one of the elevation mapping sites to map out the "climbs" you will be facing, and compare them to the ones you're used to.

Like I said, it depends on level of components. You could certainly find a Tiagra crank for cheap but you could also go with a very cheap rear derailer. Since my posting, I've found LX rear derailer for as little as $35. That would bring the price down way below just about any worthwhile crankset.

The compact double doesn't improve the combinations any. The larger steps between gears on an 11-36, especially on the low end, is the point of wide range gearing arrangements. It's the difference between struggling to the top of hills vs spinning.

Hi Cycocommute: I'm looking to change out a portion of my drive train too... I've come across a few choices for the long cage RD. Shimano offers the Deore LX T661 266g; some sites say this can handle a 34T sprocket, others say 32Tand I'd like to use it with the new 11-34 Shimano cassette (plan to use my existing Ultegra 10 spd brifters). Do you know if this RD will work with the 34T? If not, I guess I'll look at one of the Mtn RD's, e.g. Deore M591 299g; or the Deore M531 312g. Any input on the choices are welcome.

Hi Cycocommute: I'm looking to change out a portion of my drive train too... I've come across a few choices for the long cage RD. Shimano offers the Deore LX T661 266g; some sites say this can handle a 34T sprocket, others say 32Tand I'd like to use it with the new 11-34 Shimano cassette (plan to use my existing Ultegra 10 spd brifters). Do you know if this RD will work with the 34T? If not, I guess I'll look at one of the Mtn RD's, e.g. Deore M591 299g; or the Deore M531 312g. Any input on the choices are welcome.

Shimano is very conservative with their capacity numbers. I've never run across a mountain derailer that wouldn't handle a 34 tooth low. It would probably handle the 36 tooth low also

Not to hijack the thread, could anyone tell me if the Ultegra Triple Long Cage derailleur I have on a bike can support at the very least an 11-32 and at most an 11-36 cassette while using 50x39x30 chainrings? The most I have run on it is 11-28 cogs, but I am thinking of taking a bicycle vacation in the CO Rockies, and thus would like to know what I can get away with. I am using 10-Speed Ultegra Triple Brifters.

Thanks.

Not to hijack the thread, could anyone tell me if the Ultegra Triple Long Cage derailleur I have on a bike can support at the very least an 11-32 and at most an 11-36 cassette while using 50x39x30 chainrings? The most I have run on it is 11-28 cogs, but I am thinking of taking a bicycle vacation in the CO Rockies, and thus would like to know what I can get away with. I am using 10-Speed Ultegra Triple Brifters.

Thanks.

You are up against two limits in derailleur specifications. The Ultegra GS has both a chain wrap limit and a maximum rear cog size limit. The factory limits are 27 or 28 maximum cog size, the chain wrap limit is 37.

Both of these limits can be exceeded, the factory has a safety margin that allows the operation of the derailleur with a 30t cog on 99% of road bikes. I've used a 32 cog with excellent performance and compatibility.

The chain wrap capacity relates to the amount of chain slack the derailleur can take up, and is equal to the front range (20 in the example above) plus the rear range. Thus, if you have a 50/39/30 crank set, and a 12-28 (16 tooth difference) cluster, the total capacity required would theoretically be 36 teeth (20 front difference + 16 rear difference).

Manufacturers specify this fairly conservatively. I have a 50/39/26 crank set, and a 12-27 (15 tooth difference) cluster, the total capacity required would theoretically be 39 teeth (24 front difference + 15 rear difference). The Chain Wrap specification on the Ultegra GS is 37, but it can be exceeded.

You would have an issue with both chain wrap and maximum cog size if you ran a 50/39/30 crank set, and a 11-32 (22 tooth difference) cluster, the total capacity required would theoretically be 42 teeth (20 front difference + 22 rear difference).

I suggest using a 26t granny gear to improve your range. It is also a cost effective solution.

Thanks for your vote of confidence. I'm still deciding as to what I'll do.


If you are used to the SF Bay area, Iowa will be a piece of cake. I rode RAGBRAI in '86 when the ride was mostly in the southern half of the state which is where the majority of the hills are and there was nothing really memorable at all. I'd call the terrain rolling but certainly not mountainous or even really hilly. I don't know where that 21,000' of climbing was calculated but I have to think it's 100' of climbing 2100 times.

If you are still concerned, a wider range cassette like a 12x27 is the cheapest option, a much wider cassette, say 12x32 or 11x32, plus an MTB rear derailleur would be more costly and a new compact crank would probably be the most expensive change.

Hi Barrettscv, want to let you know the advice you provided was helpful, I installed a new Shimano T661 Long Cage Touring Derailler, and a 11-34 Shimano cassette all for the Markellville Death Ride. This was my first time on the Death Ride and I really enjoyed it! Crazy time... I'm now considering the Mt. Shasta Century. Thanks!