Fifty Plus (50+) - 6 inches, 50 MPH

I was riding my usual Tuesday route last night on a two lane road with no shoulder. There was a car coming from the opposite direction and one from behind. We all three met on the same piece of road. The guy behind passed me at about 50 MPH, one hand on the wheel, one holding a cell phone to his ear. His mirror missed me by about 6 inches. :twitchy:

This was in broad daylight. I had on an orange jersey and a blinking taillight.

I'm new to this sport. I realize it's dangerous, but how often do the close calls happen? If you've been hit by a car, what were the circumstances?

Later in the same ride, I recognized the same situation about to occur, and moved out into the middle of my lane, forcing the guy behind to slow down and wait to go around. The first time, I didn't realize it soon enough to claim the lane. Do you take the lane on a two lane road all the time?

I once read, and have since proved to my own satisfaction, that most drivers give you as much room between their vehicle and yours, as you take between the edge of the road and yourself. I don't know why that is; it would seem that if you're 6" from the fog line, there'd be more room for a passing cager to fit his car than if you're 3' from the line, but many vehicles will pass you with 6" to spare in the first instance, and 3' in the second.

Most of the roads where I ride have deteriorating pavement near the edge, so I go look for a smooth stretch, which is generally found between tire tracks.

On most of the roads I ride (rural, some small town areas) there is a 2ft width of pavement on the right of the fog line. That is where I ride. If there is no area right of the fog line I wont ride it. It's not worth the risk.

Otherwise, yeah I've been "zipped" a few times when motorist fly by me rather closely. That is what makes this a dangerous sport. One little jerk of the handlebars at the wrong time and you go SPLAT like a bug on the bumper.

Yes this does happen, I would say take the lane but sometimes that is not the best policy. I would take the lane, check your mirror and decided "is he moving over", if not head for the ditch. I can see a little scene in my head where my blood gurgling last words are "I had the right of way."
There are also people who believe you have no rights on the road and belong on the sidewalk, non-cyclist in their 50's have told me they were taught to ride against traffic. Old farmers who drive tractors at 15mph on the highway will later cuss at you for making them slow down on the way home.

A small percentage of cyclist and motorists are morons, and these are the ones we remember.

Craig

Later in the same ride, I recognized the same situation about to occur, and moved out into the middle of my lane, forcing the guy behind to slow down and wait to go around. The first time, I didn't realize it soon enough to claim the lane. Do you take the lane on a two lane road all the time?

Yes. Always take the lane. If conditions warrant it, you can always give more room, but your starting out position should be in the lane. Check out CommuteOrlando (http://www.commuteorlando.com) for information about riding in the traffic lane; they have lots of good videos and animations.

And +1 on using a mirror.

Depends on the area but things like this do happen. I have a rear view mirror on the bike and I am respectfull of motorists. They are bigger than me and can hurt so I keep an eye open for them. BUT- I also let them know what I am doing. Turning against the traffic and I signal- And definitely signal. Only move into my position when safe and when the car gives me room I thank them.

But one ride a few years ago we had 3 hits on cars. One pulled out on us and we damaged the bumper quite severely. One caught the end of my bars with his mirror and his door mirror went flying. And a car pulled right in front of us on a roundabout and he had a nice expensive crease down his trunk. None of these drivers saw us apparantly. Two riders on a Tandem in bright yellow and with strong lights front and rear. Damage to the Tandem--Zilch except I had to align the bars. You don't mess with an offroad Tandem- The cars can come off worse.

I've taken to the practice of staying a foot or two (or more) from the fog line, be it left, or right. If there isn't enough tarmac to ride to the right safely -default to this lane position if I can-, I'll move to the left of the line and take the lane. So far, this seems to work.
The priority above this 'idea' is NOT to be dead-right; so I'll give it up quickly if the spidey sense starts tickling.

If you hug the fog line and only take the lane when you realize you need to force an overtaking motorist to slow down, the motorists will be angry at what they perceive to be an obnoxious maneuver by you. If you default to the center of the lane and move slightly right to allow a motorist to pass more easily, they will think you are a considerate cyclist. At least that is my interpretation, as based on the amount of space they give me when passing and how hard they mash their foot on the accelerator when doing so.

Generally, if you don't take the lane motorists will assume that you think the lane is wide enough to share it with them and take your lane placement as an invitation to buzz you.

Take the lane if there's time to do it. Sometimes there isn't. I had a close call last night when I wasn't able to take the lane in a two-lane roundabout, of which there are a lot around here. I wanted to go 3/4 of the way around to in effect make a left turn, but the traffic signs allowed both lanes, inside and out, to continue straight through the intersection. I was just on the correct side of the dividing line, and a car passed me on my left and cut me off to go straight. I almost hit her. I should have been right in the middle of the lane to make her drive behind me, but there was a long enough line of traffic that I never had the chance to pull over safely.

At another roundabout that same ride, I woman talking on her cell phone while driving her minivan didn't even look at me as she motored right into the intersection directly in front of me. And I was even wearing my yellow jersey.

Sheesh. :notamused:

Take the lane if there's time to do it. Sometimes there isn't.

If you always take the lane, you don't have to worry whether there is "time to do it." Also, if you take the lane as a car is approaching, you piss off the driver because he sees you as purposely blocking him personally and you're viewed as rude. If you always take the lane, you are just taking the lane, not purposely blocking anyone. Then if you do move over to allow more space for a pass, you're viewed as polite.

If you always take the lane, you don't have to worry whether there is "time to do it." Also, if you take the lane as a car is approaching, you piss off the driver because he sees you as purposely blocking him personally and you're viewed as rude. If you always take the lane, you are just taking the lane, not purposely blocking anyone. Then if you do move over to allow more space for a pass, you're viewed as polite.

I can't see that a driver is going to have any different opinion of you if you take the lane in front of him (safely) or if he sees you in the middle of the road from 2 miles back. Either way he's going to be pissed off at you.

Many riders disagre with my style of protecting myself. I pay attention to cars approaching from behind. If I see I am about to end up in a pinch point, I'll slow down or speed up to avoid the sitration. Of course this is tough with heavy traffic but still works. The riders that disagree with me are theytpes that believe, I'm a cyclist, I have my rights. That's cool but doesn't matter once you're in a wheelchair. I'd rather lose a pedal stoke on my championshp timetrial effort than get hit. ;)

What I also do (and this is why I won't ride with earphones) is I time the car approaching from behind by sound. Just as it arrives, I swerve about 6 inches to my right. If someone was about to hit me with their mirror. I just removed myself from the danger zone. I'm sure some riders will think it's crazy, but hey, I rarely ae close calls on the road. I do this after observing too many cars on my local roads hugging the line of the bike lane and shoulder.

Yep, it happens. Yep, it's dangerous. Yep, it's annoying. Nope, there ain't much you can do about it. So keep on riding, and do what you can to keep yourself safe.

SP
Bend, OR

I can't see that a driver is going to have any different opinion of you if you take the lane in front of him (safely) or if he sees you in the middle of the road from 2 miles back. Either way he's going to be pissed off at you.

Not true. If a driver sees you hugging the fog line, then as the car gets nearer you pull out and take the lane, that's viewed as deliberately blocking the car. It doesn't matter if the lane is wide enough to share or not, the driver only sees that you've moved over to take the whole lane to your (narrow) self.

If I can leave 10 feet of lane to my left and 2 feet to the edge of the pavement, I'll ride to the right. If there's not that much lane (and there rarely is,) then my default position is the right tire track. I can always move to the right further if necessary, but if I'm on the fog line already and have an aggressive driver behind me, there's noplace else to go. In my experience, if you give a 6'1" to a 6' wide car, they'll squeeze you over half the time and not even realize how dangerous to you it is. OTOH, if you're in the middle of the lane, they may complain but they'll wait every time. Wouldn't want to ding their hood, after all!

I can't see that a driver is going to have any different opinion of you if you take the lane in front of him (safely) or if he sees you in the middle of the road from 2 miles back. Either way he's going to be pissed off at you.

But if he sees you in that position 2 miles back, he's used to the idea that you're there by the time he gets there. And, if it's safe to pass, you can move 6 inches or a foot away from center and look like you're cooperating, but the driver still has to change lanes to go around you, while in the meantime, you still have a safety zone to make even more room for yourself if you feel the car is too close.

Many riders disagre with my style of protecting myself. I pay attention to cars approaching from behind. If I see I am about to end up in a pinch point, I'll slow down or speed up to avoid the sitration. Of course this is tough with heavy traffic but still works. The riders that disagree with me are theytpes that believe, I'm a cyclist, I have my rights. That's cool but doesn't matter once you're in a wheelchair. I'd rather lose a pedal stoke on my championshp timetrial effort than get hit. ;)

What I also do (and this is why I won't ride with earphones) is I time the car approaching from behind by sound. Just as it arrives, I swerve about 6 inches to my right. If someone was about to hit me with their mirror. I just removed myself from the danger zone. I'm sure some riders will think it's crazy, but hey, I rarely ae close calls on the road. I do this after observing too many cars on my local roads hugging the line of the bike lane and shoulder.

I do kind of what you say as well... I try to control where and when I get passed, to maximize my safety. The only difference is that I feel more comfortable using a mirror and not relying on sound.

This is an interesting and "eye-opening" thread.

Much of my commute to work is on a two-lane road that is barely wide enough to be passed safely. Often jammed full of cars at rush hours. I spend a lot of time at the lane edge and even ride on the shoulder some of the way, where it is wide enough. Part of that time, I am passing cars on the right, slower and more cautiously than my usual speed, and then they sometimes pass me. I only take the lane in situations where there is not room enough for a car and a bike, such as when I get to downtown Indy: I'm not shy about taking the lane early to avoid being trapped in a right turn only lane when I am going straight.

I primarily ride two lane roads. I've found that if I hug the right I'll get someone occasionally trying to squeeze by - regardless of the on coming traffic. So I'll take my 1/3 to 1/2 of the lane. Then like Mr Beanz - move right as they pass. Also - if I think two diverging cars and I will meet - I WILL be in the middle, sure I may end up on the hood and thru the windshield. To me the speed diff of me doing 20 the car doing 50 is 30. Getting side swiped and thrown into a tree - and who knows what I get accelerated to. I'm out on that.

+1 on the mirror/s.

That said - there are friendly areas, and area's I chose not to ride.

marc

If you hug the fog line and only take the lane when you realize you need to force an overtaking motorist to slow down, the motorists will be angry at what they perceive to be an obnoxious maneuver by you. If you default to the center of the lane and move slightly right to allow a motorist to pass more easily, they will think you are a considerate cyclist. +1 I never thought of it that way but (as a driver) it makes good sense. If the statement above that drivers give you more space if you take more space is accurate that only improves this strategy.

Not true. If a driver sees you hugging the fog line, then as the car gets nearer you pull out and take the lane, that's viewed as deliberately blocking the car. It doesn't matter if the lane is wide enough to share or not, the driver only sees that you've moved over to take the whole lane to your (narrow) self.

But I maintain that the driver will have the same low opinion of you regardless of when you decide to take the lane. He/she will see you as a road hog and impediment to traffic whether done 200 feet in front of them or if they come on you already in that position. I suppose they might take it more personally if they see you do it, but a case could also be made that riding in the middle of the lane all the time will give them more time to decide exactly what method they want to use to disabuse us of our obviously misguided notion that we belong on the road in the first place.

When there is no room on the right i take the lane. Usually on the last 5 miles of some of my rides is through residential and two lane traffic. I take the lane and stay in the middle until there is room to the right or reach a stop sign. At stop signs i stay in the middle like i was in a car, wait for my turn then go. I stop with one foot on the ground and look around, no one has been rude yet after they see i came to a full and complete stop and waited my turn. On one piece of road that i ride has no shoulder with Jersey wall on the opposite side leaving no where to go. I have had a few close calls but most motorists wait until i can go to the right after this part of the road opens up. It only takes one time to make a bad day for us.

Check out CommuteOrlando (http://www.commuteorlando.com) for information about riding in the traffic lane; they have lots of good videos and animations.

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Thanks for this link - the videos and commentary are really great.

You got 6" of space!!!! WTF, I never get that much space.

Thanks for all the replies. I think I will own the lane and move right when a car is passing, but stay put if a car is oncoming until it's safe to let cell phone psycho to pass. Good advice. Thanks.

Just keep an eye on the mirror. Most drivers will slow down when you take the lane, but some are hostile and aggressive and others aren't looking at the road and don't see you at all.

Personally, I think the best tactic is to take the lane and then move toward the side of the road when the car/truck is close to passing you. That way you force them to move outward, but you give yourself some extra insurance in case they don't see you or pass too closely. This approach doesn't work as well in heavier traffic, however, when car after car keeps passing you. I don't believe in taking the lane and staying there all the time. All this does is p*ss off drivers. But I will take the lane under certain circumstances, such as crossing intersections, riding on roads with lots of potholes near the shoulder, passing lines of cars parked on the roadside, etc.

http://tempdoohickie.blogspot.com/2009/03/taking-lane.html

Do you take the lane on a two lane road all the time?

Not "all the time", but often enough.

Taking more of the lane makes you more visible and cars tend to react sooner to either avoid or aim at you, depending on their whim that day.
I've actually been hit twice, never from a car passing. Both accidents were low speed at intersections. In both cases the driver was just paying no attention when they were turning. I wasn't injured in either case.

Marc

http://tempdoohickie.blogspot.com/2009/03/taking-lane.html

Weird; I thought I deleted that. It was something I was playing around with. Well, it's gone now. You can find the same post on my real blog though.

http://doohickie.blogspot.com/2009/03/taking-lane.html

Sorry to have to tell you this, but it's going to happen no matter what you do. Be considerate of drivers and most will be considerate of you. Some just don't care and will pinch you as close as possible and others will yell obscenities at you while honking their horn and brushing you all at the same time.

How about a jersey that on the back says;

"I support Conceal-Carry"

;-)

marc

A little bit from column a and a little bit from columns b and c. There is no one perfect tactic.

Weird; I thought I deleted that. It was something I was playing around with. Well, it's gone now. You can find the same post on my real blog though.

http://doohickie.blogspot.com/2009/03/taking-lane.html

LOL! I looked at a bunch of vids and I thought that one was the best of the ones I could find. I was disappointed I couldn't find another one that I've seen before that showed very well how cars react in more crowded conditions. It left no doubt that when you move into the lane, you become something the drivers know how to deal with. Along the fog line, they're not sure how to react and some always react incorrectly.

A little bit from column a and a little bit from columns b and c. There is no one perfect tactic.

I think this is true. The only thing that can be said with any certainty is that predictability is the one and only thing that makes traffic work smoothly, safely and successfully. Be as predictable as you can and hope others do the same.

It's time for some " it's my road too dammit " thinking on all our parts. As so many others have said it establishes your place on the road to not ride to the fog line at all until a car does approach and then only move over enough to show some awareness of the over taking car without creating a dangerous situation for the cyclist. If you see a situation as you describe, an oncoming car plus an over taking car plus you intersecting at the same place and time your going to come out the loser by definition if you let the drivers dictate from their 'windshield world view' what constitutes a safe distance. Force the safe outcome by keeping your lane until the over taking driver has a safe place to pass.

I was riding my usual Tuesday route last night on a two lane road with no shoulder. There was a car coming from the opposite direction and one from behind. We all three met on the same piece of road. The guy behind passed me at about 50 MPH, one hand on the wheel, one holding a cell phone to his ear. His mirror missed me by about 6 inches. :twitchy:

This was in broad daylight. I had on an orange jersey and a blinking taillight.

I'm new to this sport. I realize it's dangerous, but how often do the close calls happen? If you've been hit by a car, what were the circumstances?

Later in the same ride, I recognized the same situation about to occur, and moved out into the middle of my lane, forcing the guy behind to slow down and wait to go around. The first time, I didn't realize it soon enough to claim the lane. Do you take the lane on a two lane road all the time?

I am a carbon copy of you!! :thumb: At first I was hugging the shoulder on roads with no shoulder. However, as we both QUICKLY found out, that ain't working. They will pass you super close. When there is no shoulder, I am taking the FULL LANE, and when there is a double lane and no shoulder, I am taking the full lane. Also, I take the middle lane too, that is the turning lane..

Again, big props to the both of us for CATCHING ON QUICKLY. Not only that, I don't take to kindly to them honking the horn either. Been know to give them the finger, and some six letter words...;)

Big props to you...:beer:

Some days I can adopt the Zen approach and not be bothered by the buzzers and hookers. Other days, not so much. Last commute trip home on my longer, street based route, I'm afraid I reacted strongly twice. The first was just after I left the office. I had signalled my intent and was moving to the left to make a turn (really wide street but with no marked turn lane), and a car that was speeding from a long way back insisted on squeezing by me to the left, straddling the center line to do so. I flipped the finger, even though it was likely a co-worker. A bit later in the ride, on a fast downhill, a car sped past right at an intersection and turned right. Had I not anticipated it and already been slowing and moving to my left to go around, it could have been a real problem. I gave a "WTF" gesture, but without the finger, as I went past, inches from the rear of the car.

When feeling more Zen, I smile and wave, like a try to do when people honk or yell.

Some days I can adopt the Zen approach and not be bothered by the buzzers and hookers. Other days, not so much. Last commute trip home on my longer, street based route, I'm afraid I reacted strongly twice. The first was just after I left the office. I had signalled my intent and was moving to the left to make a turn (really wide street but with no marked turn lane), and a car that was speeding from a long way back insisted on squeezing by me to the left, straddling the center line to do so. I flipped the finger, even though it was likely a co-worker. A bit later in the ride, on a fast downhill, a car sped past right at an intersection and turned right. Had I not anticipated it and already been slowing and moving to my left to go around, it could have been a real problem. I gave a "WTF" gesture, but without the finger, as I went past, inches from the rear of the car.

When feeling more Zen, I smile and wave, like a try to do when people honk or yell.

How does that Bob Roll Road I.D. commercial go... "Helmet, Road ID and bazooka..."

I rarely have problems, but last night I had a dude in his midlife crisis porshe try to pull out in front of me, buzz me and then pull over in front of me so I couldn't get around. Typically, I ride in the right wheel depression if the lane's not wide enough to share, but I like to modulate my speed to dictate when people are going to try squeezing by me so I have an out if needed.

Hi,

Here is what the League of American Bicyclists say on the subject via their web site:

http://www.bikeleague.org/resources/better/roadrules.php

I took one of their classes a couple of years ago after 30+ years of serious cycling and the point that I took away was: If you give a driver enough room where it looks like they can squeeze by you, they will try to do so.

I used to do the stay as far to the right as reasonable and then took the lane when needed. I now understand and have experienced, take the lane and then give them room to pass when it is safe for both of you.

If you are moving from the far right to taking the lane as a driver approaches, at a minimum they won't have any confidence in what you're going to do next. At worst, as others have suggested, the driver will think that you are purposefully trying to block them.

I highly recommend that ALL cyclists take a local LAB class taught by a certified instructor. Most of what I did was what they taught but there were a few things that they taught that have helped me and that I've added to how I ride.

Vain hope, I know, but I wish we could come to some consensus on this. Honestly though, in 5 years of commuting and recreational cycling (after a 25 year lay-off) I haven't seen a single "lane taker" in real life. It seems to be a style of riding that is espoused in print but when we get out there among the F150's and Droop Snout Kenilworth's the bravado goes out the.. tailpipe. Mirrors are useless unless you look in them and if you are doing it right that isn't going to be often enough to keep from having a half dozen of Detroits finest piled up behind you. In my state in the semi-rural part that I do most of my riding in they will not honk or become aggressive until you realize you've been holding them up. Then when you release the road they will rush by you. I avoid that by not keeping the road when I don't need it. If I don't like the look of the shoulder I will ride to the left of it but only as much as I need. It doesn't really matter what the zealot's think, its the law here. Cyclists must ride as far to the right as possible on our roads. So far I haven't found it that hard to comply and to remain safe at the same time.

H

Hi Leisesturm,

California Vehicle Code (CVC) for operation of a bicycle on a roadway:

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21202.htm

The key sentence is:

"Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at that time shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations..."

The key word is 'practicable.' The legal reading of the word leaves a lot of latitude especially when safety is considered. Of course, 99.999% of drivers and riders don't know the CVC or know the interpretation of 'practicable.' Also, the listed exceptions give the cyclist a lot of latitude -- as should be the case.

Of course, the law in your state may vary.

BTW, one of the standard commands for our group rides is "take the lane." We use this command when the lead rider(s) determine that the road conditions (width, debris, road surface, etc) warrant taking the lane.

Here is the key Arizona statute:

A. A person riding a bicycle on a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway, except under any of the following situations:
1. If overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction.
2. If preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.
3. If reasonably necessary to avoid conditions, including fixed or moving objects, parked or moving vehicles, bicycles, pedestrians, animals or surface hazards.
4. If the lane in which the person is operating the bicycle is too narrow for a bicycle and a vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.

The judges frequently get it wrong here, as they no doubt due elsewhere, but appeals by riders are general successfull. As for Item 4, cars are required to give 3' of clearance, so if they can't give you 3' without shifting out of their lane, you are free to, and in most cases should, take the lane.

Do I do it every time I should? No. There is one particular 'squeeze', a bit after an intersection, where I generally don't, because for some reason I place not disrupting traffic ahead of my safety. I take the lane through the intersection, which is followed by a wider area, where I politely give it back. But then comes the squeeze over a bridge, and I typically take my chances. I'm on the side, but in the road enough to give the message that they should change lanes. Doesn't make sense, but it's what I do. Some cars wait, some change lanes, and some squeeze by.

Along the fog line, they're not sure how to react and some always react incorrectly.

Actually when a cyclist rides on the fog line, he is pretty much saying it is perfectly okay for a driver to pass without changing lanes. The cyclist sends a pretty clear signal to the driver to go for it.

Saw this the other day. Some people are out of control... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrzbgEXGgWg&feature=youtu.be
What if someone was coming the other way?

The good news is, most drivers are aware of you (I know it only takes one....if it bothers you that much, stop riding) and give you adequate space. Has anyone started using a good rear view mirror and noticed the addl amount of psychological comfort it offers! Sort of like, "if the guy's going to run me over, at least I'll see him coming".
I ride a lot and make an effort to minimize the cruddiest/narrowest roads in my area.....sometimes we just have to ride hard/fast and get through em though. What I hate is the stupid bikelane path that the road dept painter chose, he obviously doesn't ride a bicycle! Raydog

Don't count the close ones . . . just the hits!
Been hit by pickups twice and car twice.
Each time I survived and the drivers got the ticket.
Got in over 300,000 miles of cycling and at age 78 am still riding 100 miles a week.
Pedal on!

I ride defensively with my concern for my safety first and foremost. If the road does not give me enough shouilder to let a car pass safely, I take the lane to force the driver to have to slow down and go into the oncoming lane to safely pass me. If not you end up with the 50 mile and hour, 6 inches, distracted drive by. And yes, I've been hit by a mirror before.