Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - Average Speed - I dont get how some of you guys are so fast....

Hi Guys,
I just thought I would mention a pattern that I see constantly on these forums. After a year of constant cycling, my avg MPH is hovering around the 13mph mark on a 40 mile ride - and thats pushing it. However, in numerous threads I repeatedly see reports of avgs in the 17,18,19 and even 20+mph catergories. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but didnt the "2011 USA Cycling Pro Time Trial Championships":

http://www.dailypeloton.com/displayarticle.asp?pk=18798

report the winner averaging 25mph? If so, it looks like we have a bunch of Clydes who are almost Tour De France caliber!

How are people calculating their average speed? If its calculated on riding downhill with a tailwind, then I may be able to beat the World Champions this weekend on my way to Wendy's ;)

Group rides are much faster than solos because you get to draft. Some places are just plain flat.

By myself I struggle to average 15 with a group of friends I'll average 19+.

I know some clydes doing 5 hour centuries averaging 20 over flat ground. But the article says something about the last climb. Possible it was a hilly race. That makes a big difference.

But you should be faster than 13 mph if you are doing flat rides. I did 13.8 ave ride time/ 13.1 ave total time mph on a century with a 62 mile 10,000 ft climb. Not anything close to a TDF rider. But on the flats, I've averaged 19 mph for a flat 40 miler solo. Heck, Gina's averaged 18.4 at her best on a 42 miler riding my wheel.

Heck, on a flat orgnized ride (Palm SPrings) I average 17.5 solo for 100 miles. (I don't draft on rides ;))

I average 14 on this ride, you should have no problem averaging 16 or 17 on a flat ride. I'm not a lightweight.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2508/3765696703_7aae20fe15.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/40913998@N06/3765696703/)
Bear (http://www.flickr.com/photos/40913998@N06/3765696703/) by gulpxtreme (http://www.flickr.com/people/40913998@N06/), on Flickr

Old short fat guy here with a 24" inseam...... new bike, new Clydesdale member.

The GPS I mounted to my bike indicates that in the last 70 miles, my average speed around town of setting out for the purpose of getting my butt used to my Specialized saddle..... has been "12.4 mph".
Keep in mind that I haven't ridden a bicycle in over 25 years. I'M MAKING A COMEBACK!

This is what confuses me. Can the difference between the ultra-elite, pro cyclist and clyde hobbyists (who are admittedly overweight) be a mere few miles per hour. In a logical world, if a clyde can ride 17+ mph for numerous miles a skinny "World Pro" should be able to ride at least 10 mph faster - hills or no hills. The winner from the article averaged 25mph ,the WINNER. Therefore, it is quite possible that many of the clydes on this forum are in the wrong profession :)

I have had numerous comments that my 13mph seems low. But it is what it is. I push and really feel Im maxing it out. I dont see anyway that I will ever get close to 17+mph anytime soon. Dont get me wrong, Im fine with my 13mph, I just dont get how a pro-athlete and a clyde can have avg mph's that are so close to each other ;)

Required power goes as the cube of speed, so going 27 mph on flat ground (all other things being equal including drag, bicycle efficiency, etc.) requires 4 times the power of the same cyclist going 17 mph. In more real world terms 15 mph requires approximately twice the power of riding 12 mph. You don't say what type of bike you're riding, but an upright position can really affect speed. You indicate that you've been riding for about a year, but don't say what sort of riding you've been doing. Even without riding in a paceline you'll naturally push harder/go faster/get faster riding with a group, but it takes time. If you really want to get faster you might consider somewhat of a structured training approach. Otherwise, just enjoy riding.

You can't assume that all clydes are over weight. Some of us are just big (like Beanz ;)) I've done 115 miles in 4:45 minutes (that was in a group), numerous 20mph centuries and done flat TT's averaging over 22mph. I've ridden with pro riders and I'm definitely not in their league but in the right circumstances and terrain I can ride with them. Just because you are big, doesn't mean you have to be slow.

Magon, how many miles do you ride per year and do you do the proper type of training to get fast? Miles for the sake of miles are meaningless. I ride as much as 10k miles a year and do specific speed work. It all comes down to no pain, no gain! ;)

You can't think of mph like a car. The difference between 17 mph and 25 mph is huge for a bike, almost 50% increase.

Required power goes as the cube of speed, so going 27 mph on flat ground (all other things being equal including drag, bicycle efficiency, etc.) requires 4 times the power of the same cyclist going 17 mph. In more real world terms 15 mph requires approximately twice the power of riding 12 mph. You don't say what type of bike you're riding, but an upright position can really affect speed. You indicate that you've been riding for about a year, but don't say what sort of riding you've been doing. Even without riding in a paceline you'll naturally push harder/go faster/get faster riding with a group, but it takes time. If you really want to get faster you might consider somewhat of a structured training approach. Otherwise, just enjoy riding.


Thanks for the reply. I ride a full-carbon Roubaix and my average ride is 30-40 miles per ride. I usually ride 30+ miles twice per week and a couple of shorter 6 mile local rides on my "in between" days. i always arrive home soaked in sweat and certainly know I have been exercising.

Following your breakdown would it also follow that a clyde who can average 19mph avg would dictate the following formula:
(15 mph requires approximately twice the power of riding 12 mph) + (17 mph requires approximately twice the power of riding 15 mph) + (19 mph requires approximately twice the power of riding 17 mph) = A clyde averaging 19mph is working 6 times harder than I am at my 12-13mph? I find that hard to swallow ;)

Excuse my meanderings, but if I may use my brother as an example. He is 160lbs and lives and breathes fitness/cycling 9always has since being a kid). On his best day he averages 20mph over 50 miles and this guy can ride like the wind. He rides 150+ miles per week and is president of his local racing club. I can see how he could come "kinda" close to pro levels (but still respectively slower) but have a hard time imaging a 250lb'ish clyde on a Trek Fx pushing the high teens - just doesnt make sense to me.

First off, you use a bike computer/speedometer that stops measuring time when you stop riding, such as at stoplights and rest stops. That is how nearly everyone measures "average speed". If you actually ride from one end to the other of a 30 mile course with a bunch of stop lights and all, and take the total time and figure your speed, it'll be a lot slower. If your course has a lot of stops, it'll drop your average speed on a bike computer due to the slow-downs at those stopping points. So a long rural route produces higher average speeds.

If you don't believe other people are averaging 18 or 20 mph, go find a fast group ride and watch them disappear into the distance while you cough up a lung or two. Yes, people do go that fast.

A while back, I was on the local club ride, managed to make it to the front of the pack as we went up a little hill. As we neared the top, I and one other guy were about even, going 20 mph. I was giving it everything I had. But then the other guy just took off like I was sitting still. That's the difference between being 50 years old, 200+ lbs, on a 40 lb bike, and being 25 years old, 140 lbs, on a 20 lb bike. There's old men that can ride circles around me, and a lot of the women in Lone Star Randonneurs can outride me pretty handily if they take a notion.

There is a BIG difference between averaging 20 mph and averaging 25 mph in terms of power output, so being "almost" TdeF material doesn't mean much. Also keep in mind that the TdeF has some major climbs in it, so you can't compare average speeds of that route to your route in a meaningful way.

Right now, my average speed for the year is around 15.5 mph or so. I've done a couple of longer rides that averaged around 18.1 mph. They involved favorable wind (or rather, lack of unfavorable wind), working really hard at it, and doing lots of drafting. Oh, and lots of riding in the drops.

...I've done 115 miles in 4:45 minutes (that was in a group)...

Congrats! Your match the 2010 winners of the "2011 USA Cycling Pro Time Trial Championships" that was also over 115 miles! (see the article linked)

"Today’s mark of 4:28.02 is more than 16 minutes faster than reigning champ Ben King’s (RadioShack) 2010 time of 4:44.59."

Told you us Clydes are as fast as the pro's ;)

Congrats! Your match the 2010 winners of the "2011 USA Cycling Pro Time Trial Championships" that was also over 115 miles! (see the article linked)

"Today’s mark of 4:28.02 is more than 16 minutes faster than reigning champ Ben King’s (RadioShack) 2010 time of 4:44.59."

Told you us Clydes are as fast as the pro's ;)


"under hot condition on Memorial Day this past Monday"
"Despite the soaring temperatures 95 F (34 C) and signature southern humidity"
"on the final climb up Paris Mountain"
"The powerful field turned up the pace, despite the heat"
"Fusche and Hincapie attacked on the final climb and joined the survivors of the break and then forcing the selection on the final move to the final three circuits."
"Those four emerged as the strongest riders in the race that included four ascents of Paris Mountain"
"As usual on the last time up that mountain the attacks went"

Hi Guys,
I just thought I would mention a pattern that I see constantly on these forums. After a year of constant cycling, my avg MPH is hovering around the 13mph mark on a 40 mile ride - and thats pushing it. However, in numerous threads I repeatedly see reports of avgs in the 17,18,19 and even 20+mph catergories. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but didnt the "2011 USA Cycling Pro Time Trial Championships":

http://www.dailypeloton.com/displayarticle.asp?pk=18798

report the winner averaging 25mph? If so, it looks like we have a bunch of Clydes who are almost Tour De France caliber!


No. With power to overcome aerodynamic drag increasing with the cube of velocity it's nearly twice as hard to go 25 MPH as 20 MPH on flat ground.

Running the numbers for a 180 pound rider on a 20 pound bike riding on the brake hoods I get 88-89% more power depending on frontal area.

With physiological strain proportional to the square of power production, an hour at 25 MPH racks up as much stress as 3.5-3.6 hours at 20 MPH and some one winning a 115 mile time trial in 4:28 has done the equivalent of about 15.6 hours and 312 miles at 20 MPH.

Once the rate of lactic acid production exceeds your body's rate of clearance things get much worse, with levels increasing with to the fourth power of power. 2-3% faster can be the difference between a lot of work and painful where you run out of steam after 10 minutes instead of an hour.

This also neglects that it's much, much easier to ride in a group where you may be spending 30% less energy between pulls.

A clyde averaging 19mph is working 6 times harder than I am at my 12-13mph? I find that hard to swallow ;)


19 MPH is only 2.5X as hard as 13 MPH on flat ground (200 pound Clydestale, 20 pound bike, .760 Cd, .4 m^2 Sd per Gibertini's measurements of a cyclist riding on the brake hoods, .004 Crr).

http://www.analyticcycling.com/ForcesPower_Page.html

Congrats! Your match the 2010 winners of the "2011 USA Cycling Pro Time Trial Championships" that was also over 115 miles! (see the article linked)

"Today’s mark of 4:28.02 is more than 16 minutes faster than reigning champ Ben King’s (RadioShack) 2010 time of 4:44.59."

Told you us Clydes are as fast as the pro's ;)

You're mixing up time trials with group rides. It doesn't work that way. My RAAM team averaged 20mph for 3000miles non-stop. Don't believe it, look up the record.

You're mixing up time trials with group rides. It doesn't work that way. My RAAM team averaged 20mph for 3000miles non-stop. Don't believe it, look up the record.

No disrespect intended. ;)
Im sure you reported accurately your performance. Im just trying to get it clear in my head how there can be such a difference between clyde riders. Looks like you guys can and do ride 17+mph. Just saying it looks like Im riding in another dimension ;) and probably will have to be satisfied with the low teens....

Just as an FYI, I have had much pain and so far little gain with respect to speed.

No disrespect intended. ;)
Im sure you reported accurately your performance. Im just trying to get it clear in my head how there can be such a difference between riders. Looks like you guys can and do ride 17+mph. Just saying it looks like Im riding in another dimension ;) and probably will have to be satisfied with the low teens....

A little structure to your riding
- Hard on the tough days, easy enough on the light days so you're rested enough to go hard when you should
- 5-10 minute intervals a couple days a week
- rest days, weeks, and months
will do wonders to your average speed.

Quantifying your effort via heart rate (or power, but that's more expensive) can make it easier to dig deeper when you can but your legs feel tired, and hold back when things feel great but your plan calls for an easy day/week/month.

There are more printed and on-line resources than you can shake a stick at.

Naive approaches like "always ride hard" (you're never rested enough to go really hard or have enough time to recover so you're both slow and tired) or "ride with a faster group" (either you're going to hard for too long so you're not getting the intensity in, or you're not working hard enough when you're not pulling) don't work.

I feel your pain. While I can crank on the flats and downhill I have resigned myself to being a slug whenever the road tilts up. Gravity is an evil mistress. ;):)


Regarding training...What Drew said.

I don't give a rat's ass about my average speed. I ride purely for fun. While I love climbing and don't mind suffering on a climb, I'm not into hammering on flat ground to the point of pain. Especially since I nearly always ride solo, so I never have the benefit of drafting. If I have to start worrying about average speed and trying to compete with people, I will get burned out like I did in 1994 when I quit riding hard and gained all the weight. I refuse to make that mistake again.

stopping and starting on the road takes a bit off your average.. My best average speeds are on MUP where there are no stop signs, just wide open trails..

What is amazing is the Mt. Baldy stage of TOC they averaged 18.8mph with 15k of climbing.. The average was over 20mph before the final ascent of to the baldy ski lifts..

I don't give a rat's ass about my average speed. I ride purely for fun. While I love climbing and don't mind suffering on a climb, I'm not into hammering on flat ground to the point of pain. Especially since I nearly always ride solo, so I never have the benefit of drafting. If I have to start worrying about average speed and trying to compete with people, I will get burned out like I did in 1994 when I quit riding hard and gained all the weight. I refuse to make that mistake again.

I couldn't have said it better myself!

Another thing you have to remember is speed doesn't come over night. I rode my first year thinking the guys doing 20 in a paceline were superfast. I thought I'd never be able to hold 20 even on the back of a paceline. I kept riding, threw in some hills including ez ride recovery days. A year later I woke up one morning and blew down the trail at 26 leaving that paceline far behind. I was shocked.

Give it time for the leg muscles to develope and adjust to cycling. One thing that really enhanced riding is sustained climbs cause you have no choice but to keep the energy flowing.


You can't assume that all clydes are over weight. Some of us are just big (like Beanz )


Who is this guy? I love this guy! I love you Man! :p

Me 195 lbs, 5' 8'', bike 23 pounds, stuff/water 8 pounds, total of 226 pounds. I ride solo all the time so i blast a hole in the wind all the time. 5-27 first 7 miles 20.6, 10 miles 20.3(up and over a check dam at both sides) 17 miles 19.7(7 miles head wind), 30 miles 18.8(reached my turn around point, head wind 13 miles of 8 to 14mph wind). Finished ride at 17.7 mph avg, 51 miles. 66 years old. I do a lot of speed work, hill repeats, sprints which has helped build my legs/lungs. This August it will be 2 years on a road bike after 45 years on not riding. Everyone has different talents, if you want to go faster, you have to go faster first with your cadence, then endurance, it all builds on what you have done. It will take time. Some told me when i started it would take about 2 years before you will really see results. He was right.

I ride solo all the time so i blast a hole in the wind all the time.

Yup, not everyone drafts. I ride alone and the only reason anyone rides with me is because I ride with Gina but I'm rarely on a wheel unless I fall back to take a pic etc.. I've done about 35 centuries and only drafted on maybe 2 or 3 that were set up with forum members.

Last Fall I posted a somewhat similar question in another bike forum. The advice I got was Ignore anyone that tells you what speed you should be going. They also concluded that it takes five years of riding to reach your genetic potential. So we really are just beginners.

Leaving aside issues of how people calculate their "average" speeds, a little time spent riding with club racers will make it painfully clear how big a performance differential there is between us average joes/janes and those folks. Then there's a similar performance gap between that group and the regional level racers, and another one between those and national caliber riders. Then another gap between them and the best pros.

Hard numbers can be all over the map depending on how they're calculated. Slowing, stopping and restarting at traffic lights will have a big impact on average speed and because of that some don't count those things. Our average-joe rides are also influenced by some of the same things that dictate speed for the racers, too, like terrain, wind, temps, and type of race (TT vs mass-start with drafting).

Regardless, the one thing you can count on no matter who you are is that it is incredibly hard work to improve your average.

Average speed also depends on what you're trying to accomplish. If you're riding for fitness you're probably pushing your limits a lot of the time which will lead to an increased average speed. For myself, I ride for relaxation instead of fitness. This means I don't push that often which means my average will be lower.

Most of my riding is my commute to work, about 14 miles one way. There are only three stop signs/lights along the entire route.

If I ride at my normal pace - relatively hard but not painfully hard - I average around 18 mph based on my bike computer. Maybe a bit higher, say 18.5 if I'm feeling good, or a bit lower if I'm tired -- but all at the same perceived effort for me.

If I push it hard I can probably average 20 mph - haven't tried in a while. Possible I could be even be a smidge faster, but probalby not much. But at this pace I'd be trying a lot harder than at my 18mph pace, and arrive at work a LOT more tired.

If I take it kinda easy and just cruise along at a nice quick pace but without ever feeling like I'm pushing it, even up a the small rollers, I will probably be around 16.5 to 17 mph. This feels MUCH easier than my 18mph pace, almost restful.

So, same ride, and my average speed would only vary about 4mph from what I would call a relatively easy effort to pushing it pretty hard. A head or tail wind has a huge impact on my avg speed, as do longer hills.

As I've mentioned in other threads, a lot of it depends, too, on how people define "average speed." For me, it's distance covered divided by time on the bike. Period. Others think of it as a completely different animal - when they're riding along at a pace they feel is comfortable on a flat road - a pace they feel they could easily maintain for any particular distance - they'll check their computer, which will say they're going 14, 17, 20 MPH or whatever, and because they can maintain that speed under those same conditions for the better part of a ride, they'll consider that their "average," even though their actual mathematical average will be less than that. But that's fine; there are valid reasons for doing it either way. Just as long as everyone understands the difference when it comes time to compare.

A couple things, Magohn--

The article is mislabeled as a Time Trial. It was, in fact, the road race championship, a group ride. Do not draw any conclusions from avg speed of road races. Road racing is not about how fast you go. It's about getting to the line first. Plus, the course was indeed hilly. Most Pro races average 25mph regardless of the terrain. Can they go faster? Yes, definitely. Do they? Depends on the tactics of the moment & race.

Also, keep in mind the computers do record you slowing as you approach a stop light/sign. Mine stops recording when below 4mph, but it still gets 5 & 6mph, drastically altering my average speed.

Many times, on BF, we report what we normally ride at, and this may not be the same as our "average". For instance, my normal commute to/from work averages 16-17mph according to my computer. But during this commute, I routinely maintain 19-20mph, only slowing for hills or lights.

And last, as for a difference between Pros & us mortals. Yes, there is a drastic difference between 20mph and 25mph and 27mph. Believe me: I have experienced all three. Plus, the Pros ride up hills maintaining these avg speeds. We clydes (and everyone else) do not. They go up these hills at about 15mph--and this is their easy pace! They run along flat ground at 25mph. Again--their easy pace. They only start working when hitting 30mph. Again, racing is about arriving first. They ride their easy pace as much as they can so they have gas left in the tank when it does get hard. The first 3 hours of their races are 20-25mph. The last 2 hours? 30mph plus!

In their time trials (individual, not group rides), the winners regularly average 29-30mph or more (Zabriske in recent Tour of California TT)! I, nor most of BF, cannot do this (my best was 40K in 55-minutes).

No, we here on BF--clyde or not--are not in their league. Do we ride faster than some clydes? Sure. Some of us may ride with the pros during a group ride (I occasionally get to), but they can certainly drop us when they feel like it (especially if climbing).

With the hills around here in Utah I average about 16. On flats I can average almost 20. And in groups I can average 25+.

I use my bike computer to measure my avg speed. The higher the avg speed I can achieve the more calories I am burning. There is a 20 mile flat route I sometimes ride where I can avg 18 -19 mph. I ride it for fitness. There is a 20 mile route I ride at lunch time where the first 4 miles is a 1200ft climb, there is another short but steep climb. I usually avg 13 - 13.5 on this ride. As I have been trying to increase my fitness level I reached a 14 mph avg on this route yesterday. This means to me that I am climbing a little faster than before. Avg speeds definitely depends on whether there are hills or no hills. Most of my rides are solo but I have noticed avg speed changes depending on who your riding with as well. For example, one 60 mile ride last summer I was riding with a guy who was way more fit than me, it was a flatish route, and I avg about 21 mph (we also had a little bit of a tailwind). I guess what I am saying is that avg speed depends on the conditions you are riding in. The same guy I rode with last summer on that 60 mph ride is way more fit than me and is known to be able to put the hammer down when needed. He told me a story about when he got to ride with the US Postal time in Philly way back when he was even fitter, he rode with Hincapie for about 10 seconds and then they dropped him like rock and disappeared over the horizon within the matter of seconds.

I don't give a rat's ass about my average speed. I ride purely for fun.

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Looks like I will have to go with Ms FreightTrains methodology as there is no way in the near future I will approach 20+ mph as some of your guys. Im offf out today for a 50 mile ride and at 12-13 mph it will take me approx 4 hours. I think that when you feel it the most. I will be doing 3000ft of climbing (in the rain) if thats any excuse. ;)

I also have my Garmin set to "Pause" at 2 mph or less - could this be messing my average up? Im not looking for miracles but it would be nice to get into the mid-teens on a 3000ft ride...

Then I also have the Seattle To Portland ride coming in mid-July (204 miles) and last year I averaged 11mph over the 204 miles. Now that was a long weekend. I would love to be faster this year...

Don't worry about what your computer says is your avg speed except when it's on the same course and there are no stop lights/signs or other traffic that will get in your way. That is the only way to compare averages.

Instead, focus on what is your "cruising" speed. That's the speed you ride at comfortably or only minimally winded. And, keep track of "cruising" speed for different types of terrain. Cruising speed on a 10% grade is alot different than 5% grade, and is alot different than flat ground.

And, keep in mind, these numbers really only mean something to you unless you're in a race. Watch for improvement over time. Keep a journal.

A couple things, Magohn--...


Well said!

Unless you are riding a time trial, average speed means squat for comparing yourself to others. There are just too many variables. Enjoy the ride more, obsess over average speed less. ;)

Then I also have the Seattle To Portland ride coming in mid-July (204 miles) and last year I averaged 11mph over the 204 miles. Now that was a long weekend. I would love to be faster this year...

On my short rides I can average in the 18+ range, and that includes my stoppage time for lights, signs, etc. When I start looking at my longer rides, my average time is considerably slower. I once "blasted" a 200k solo brevet in 8h 29m total time. That's only a 14.7mph overall average, though. My fastest 300k was 15h 03m, which works out to be 12.8mph overall average, and that was rolling with a group. My average 400k time is 24h 15m, which ends up being 10.43mph overall average.
When I did STP as a 1-day a few years ago, I finished in 14h 45m total time (13.7 overall average) with 13h 33m in the saddle (15mph rolling average.)

We should go for a ride sometime when I'm feeling better. I had some craptacular bug the past few days that had me laid up in bed for a half week, but I might be feeling up to riding by Sunday for a short one.

FWIW, when I ride with my wife and kids on weekends, our average speed for time spent on the bike is probably < 10 mph. Our average speed measured by miles / time from start to finish might be as low as 4 or 5 mph -- the kids like to stop at the park, at the store, at the ice cream shop, at the creek, etc, etc.

My weekend slow rides with them are more fulfilling than my commute rides which I try to use a fitness rides also. Given a choice, I'd have more slow rides with my wife and kids than "faster" commute rides.

Hey Clifton,

You need to get and STAY healthy!

I hope you feel better soon!


Avg speed means very little.

Heck, on a flat orgnized ride (Palm SPrings) I average 17.5 solo for 100 miles. (I don't draft on rides ;))

Were there stops during the ride? And was that time included in your average? I don't mean to take away from a 17.5 mph average, but I think one thing to consider when comparing to the pros is when they ride 100 miles or 115 miles or whatever, there are no rest stops involved. It's probably easier to maintain a higher average rolling speed when you are stopping every 20 miles or so and resting a bit.

On the other hand, there is a pretty huge difference between running 18 or 20 mph over a hundred miles and 25 mph.

I claim to run 13 mph on average. Sometimes I'm faster, sometimes slower, but it's usually about 13. I don't try to improve on it; it just is. That includes time stopped at stop lights, etc., considering most of my rides are urban/suburban.

This is what confuses me. Can the difference between the ultra-elite, pro cyclist and clyde hobbyists (who are admittedly overweight) be a mere few miles per hour. In a logical world, if a clyde can ride 17+ mph for numerous miles a skinny "World Pro" should be able to ride at least 10 mph faster - hills or no hills. The winner from the article averaged 25mph ,the WINNER. Therefore, it is quite possible that many of the clydes on this forum are in the wrong profession :)

Flat races can favor big people, while hilly ones don't. It takes more effort to haul more weight up hill, thanks to gravity, but on the flats, the biggest problem is air resistance, and a Clyde or Athena doesn't put up that much more frontal area to the wind, but often has more muscle mass. One type of race is decided on watts per kilogram, while the other is watts per square meter of frontal surface from the bike.

Also, a few miles per hour is a lot. Most people can move a bike at 15 mph on the flats with no wind; some can do 20 mph, and not all that many can do 25 mph.

But there's more going on. It's the internet. I can tell you I average whatever speed I like. Maybe I can do 186,000 miles per second in a sprint. If you go look at the thread in the road forum where people share their Garmin data, though, it's pretty enlightening. There are technical issues going on ( stopping for a light means slowing and accelerating again, hurting your average even if you don't count stopped time - a route with no stopping helps ), the length of peoples' routes, and also human nature.

Were there stops during the ride? And was that time included in your average? I don't mean to take away from a 17.5 mph average, but I think one thing to consider when comparing to the pros is when they ride 100 miles or 115 miles or whatever, there are no rest stops involved. It's probably easier to maintain a higher average rolling speed when you are stopping every 20 miles or so and resting a bit.
.


Yes, PalmSpring is a city like any other city with lights and stop signs. I thought everybody knew of the city of PalmSprings, it's in all the movies.:D

Well you figure on century with 10,000 ft of climbing, I had to stop along the way somewhere. I stopped maybe 3 or 4 times for a total of 30 minutes. That is figured into my 7:40 official time.

That's on a major climbing ride. On a flat ride, there really isn't much need to stop other than a quick tinkle and a fluid refill. I can get on a bike and ride 50 miles nonstop at any time. So a flat century isn't a ride where I'd have to make several stops. So yeah, that's total time.

I don't know how many times you stop on a ride but when I'm training for a climbing ride, my training rides are 42 miles with 5,000 ft, no stopping. On my usual fun rides with the wife, I only stop for her sake. If I'm alone, I don't stop. I have done several flat centuries with not more than 5 minutes of breaks. It's not hard if it doesn't involve much climbing.

If I ride with others that stop, the century takes about 6:30 -7 hours. But like I said, I ride alone and only 3 or so of my centuries were with other riders.

Plus, on a my rides and big organized ride, I dont draft. I like the "I did it under my own power" factor. Not even the pros do that. ;)

This is my type of training while prepping for centuries.

Taken from my bikejournal (2009) while training for a century with 10,000 ft of clmbing. As you can see, I try to avoid wasting time with stops on rides. This is 7200 ft of climbing with only 4 minutes of rest ( to rewater). 4.5 hours with 4 minutes of rest with lots of climbing.

It's this type of training I do for a big ride like Breathless Agony. The jersey I earned that they wouldn't sell to me, the one that you didn't understand why I was fighting about it. ;)


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...If you go look at the thread in the road forum where people share their Garmin data, though, it's pretty enlightening...


If you have a Garmin. Maybe I should get one of those some day. If you race in timed events, results also speak for themselves...

If you race in timed events, results also speak for themselves...

Yup! I don't "race" but the timed events I've done are posted on the net. No cheating, lying for stealing. Computer bar code scanned, start to finish ,rest stops and breaks included.:D

Yup! I don't "race" but the timed events I've done are posted on the net. No cheating, lying for stealing. Computer bar code scanned, start to finish ,rest stops and breaks included.:D

Yeah, except you switched chips with Gina and posted her times. :lol::p Just kidding. I know you've had some great rides up there on the Bear, better than I've done. :thumb:

Yup! I don't "race" but the timed events I've done are posted on the net. No cheating, lying for stealing. Computer bar code scanned, start to finish ,rest stops and breaks included.:D

The Perimeter (http://www.pbaa.com/) events (El Tour de Tucson, and Tour of the Tucson Mountains) use timing chips. The chips are activated at the gun (regardless of when you cross the starting line) and keep time until you cross the finish line.

...If you go look at the thread in the road forum where people share their Garmin data, though, it's pretty enlightening...

If you have a Garmin. Maybe I should get one of those some day. If you race in timed events, results also speak for themselves...

You don't need a Garmin to go appreciate that thread. People sometimes post things like "I went on a ride and averaged 20 mph" but what they mean is they held a moving average of 20 up until the first hill on the ride, and that's what they think it would have been if the whole ride was on flat ground. You can mentally adjust your 'score' any number of ways that make sense to you personally. But a lot of cyclists upload their files and share them online, providing an objective, unadjusted average speed along with some of the other details of their ride. This doesn't always match up with forum bravado. Anyone who wants to see how they compare should also have a look at the data, instead of just wondering how people in the forums get so fast.

Here's my data from the Chilly Hilly (http://connect.garmin.com/activity/72320363). I remember my bike computer showing an average speed of 15.6, but the GPS data is less impressive at 14.2 mph. That might be because I tend to reset the cateye daily, so it included the ride to the ferry dock. :innocent:

On the internet, no ones knows that you're not a dog or how fast you really ride.

Thanks for all the feedback guys. Looks like I will have to go with Ms FreightTrains methodology as there is no way in the near future I will approach 20+ mph as some of your guys. Im offf out today for a 50 mile ride and at 12-13 mph it will take me approx 4 hours. I think that when you feel it the most. I will be doing 3000ft of climbing (in the rain) if thats any excuse. ;)

I also have my Garmin set to "Pause" at 2 mph or less - could this be messing my average up? Im not looking for miracles but it would be nice to get into the mid-teens on a 3000ft ride...

Then I also have the Seattle To Portland ride coming in mid-July (204 miles) and last year I averaged 11mph over the 204 miles. Now that was a long weekend. I would love to be faster this year...
When I first bought my Garmin I tried that "auto pause" feature, but promptly turned it off when it would pause on steep climbs. Many times on grades of 18% or higher I'm going 3 mph. I've even seen 2.x mph a few times, but because I have good balance I never toppled over at those slower than walking speeds:lol:

Another thing I've noticed that negatively impacts the average speed reading on a Garmin is trees. When climbing through forested areas I've seen my speed drop to 1.x mph even though I was riding at a steady 5 mph or whatever. Trees mess with satellite signals.

Like Mr. Beanz, I stop to take pictures of interesting sights. I also stop to change camera batteries and eat energy chews. The stops are always brief so I don't cool down too much, but that definitely affects the final reading.

Even though my climbing has improved since I stopped lurking in January and started posting regulary here, my average speed readings on climbing rides has never improved. So I will repeat what I said earlier: I don't give a rat's ass about my average speed:p As long as my climbing improves, that's all I really care about. My flat ground speed on my trike has increased, so the climbing is helping my flat ground speed.

Yeah, except you switched chips with Gina and posted her times. :lol::p Just kidding. I know you've had some great rides up there on the Bear, better than I've done. :thumb:


Hahaha, now that's a thought!:D Maybe they 'll give me an extra chip then Gina can drive the course under my name.:p