Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - experience with liquid diet and riding?
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Does anyone have any experience with a liquid diet and still riding a lot? I ask because I need to lose a ton of weight and the local fat people clinics offer two approaches. Surgery, or a liquid diet. I do NOT want surgery! The liquid diets are generally the same, with some variations. Drink a protein and vitamin shake for breakfast, another one at lunch, and then depending on which diet, you can have a normal meal, a highly limited meal, or another shake at dinner. And there are usually bars and stuff for between meals.
The problem I see (other then the potential GI issues) is that all the liquid diets have very low calorie numbers. very very low. You basically put your body into starvation mode. I am concerned that I would not have the energy to ride and be on a liquid diet at the same time.
Has anyone done this? Can you still ride?
oh... and I am fully aware that most people put the weight back on when they stop the diet. But like any other addict, I think I can handle it and keep it off once its off.
By looking at your sig ticker, looks like you are doing great thus far. Are you sure you need to take such a drastic measure as this liquid diet? I think you will be able to continue biking but you will need to stick to slower rides that don't burn up your glycogen stores as quickly. The upside is that the liquid diet should help keep you hydrated.
I tried the Slim Fast diet once when I was working. I gotten to the point where I was nauseated all the time and flat worn out. That and I felt weak,not good when you had to work 10 hours a day.
06-17-11, 08:40 AM
How far per outing and how many days a week do you get out now? Let's pretend you get out 5 days for 10 miles each time. If you go forward with the liquid diet I would keep the same number of days but start out going 5 miles each time. Do this for the first week while your body gets used to what you are doing to it. If at the end of the first week you are managing it then maybe I'd jump up to 10 miles every other day, ensuring you have that recovery day between. If that goes well do a 10-5-?? sequence in with the ?? being the distance your body tells you can go.
In other words.... sneak up on it, but certainly start out lower than what you are doing now. If you hit it too hard the chance of quitting the diet is higher.
Over the past 50 years, I've tried every diet known to man, including the liquid ones. Then about 5 years ago, I finally realized there's no quick fix to this problem, despite what shows like Biggest Loser would have you believe. My goal back then was to lose around 10 pounds a year, or slightly under 1 pound a month, until I got to the weight I wanted. So far, I'm more or less on schedule, having gone from 273 lbs. back then to 222 today.
One thing that about 95% of all people discover is that they'll put the weight right back on if they lost the weight through means that they can't keep up the rest of their lives. Sure, you can lose weight quickly by eating nothing but broccoli, or going on a 1000 calorie a day liquid diet, but can you do that the rest of your life? Because when you reach your "goal", you're going to revert to what you did before, and the weight will come right back on, plus some.
Another downside of excessively low cal diets is that after heavy exercise, your body will feed on your lean muscle mass for replenishment. This is something to avoid. It is very, very difficult to add muscle mass while dieting, as any weight lifter knows. You of course want to lose weight, but you don't want to do by cannibalizing your muscles.
06-17-11, 12:10 PM
A different view..... I am ok with a "quick start" diet like the liquid, etc. but then after that you need to follow what Chaco is talking about.
I need to update my sticker. I've drifted up to 335 again.
I ride a couple times a week for around 20 miles or so. starting in two weeks I plan to have more frequent rides, but I hear you about taking it easy for a week or so to give the body time to adapt. My fear is exactly what was mentioned, that i would be eating into the muscle as well. From what I've studied, that can be lessened by keeping the vitamin and protein intake very high, and making sure the evening meal includes real food. But it is still a concern.
The trick is, I need to do something, and the usual suspects are not working. Followed WW, no improvements, hell I couldnt even eat all my points. I jumped my exercise level, and while my fitness is better, my weight has climbed.. not dropped. I've eliminated categories... no change. I've pre-made all my meals. No success. Much of the problem, I think, is that I have trouble fighting the hunger, so i tend to add more food. Not usually bad food, just too damn much of it. I've looked into phentermine, and actually think it would be a good kick-start choice for me, but is seems the medical community thinks its a bad idea, as no doctors anywhere near me will even consider prescribing it. They are almost certainly correct to refuse. But each and every bariatric clinic I look into within a days drive has the same choice. Surgery, or a liquid diet. I'm betting there is something to the liquid diet thing, and I bet if its done with proper supervision, the incidence of putting the pounds back on is much lower.
Either way, I'm trying to set up an appointment or two at a couple clinics to discuss all of this. Its very important to me that I can still ride, so that will be a big point in the conversations.
06-17-11, 09:00 PM
Stick with a regular diet, and lots of exercise as it's the only true way to do it. It is a very long, and difficult road, but you can do it if you put your mind to it. Here is a before, and after picture of me and my Son, and you can see the difference in his age, and this is how long it took. I lost 125lbs as of today. Good luck, and stay with it.
Haff, why don't you take a look at Gary Taubes's book, Good Calories, Bad Calories (http://www.amazon.com/Good-Calories-Bad-Controversial-Science/dp/1400033462/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1308367402&sr=1-1), or if you want some lighter reading, Why We Get Fat and What to do About It (http://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Get-Fat-About/dp/0307272702/ref=pd_sim_b_1).
06-18-11, 12:29 PM
Basically, it is math. Calories go in, but calories don't go out then you have a big bag to hold all of them.
I agree with has been said about liquid diets, it is very likely that you will put some weight back once you stop them. Something to think about is that if you are not exercising and suddenly begin to exercise without changing anything (i.e. not eating more not less), in theory you will either stop the weigh gain or start loosing weigh. To accelerate the loss ratio then add a more sensible diet.
Don't go crazy with crash weight loss approaches, in the end there will be disappointment. A rate of 2 t 3 pounds a week is great and can be accomplished with regular high pace exercise and little diet. For the diet, watch your carbs and the canned stuff. You will be surprised how much effect stopping the consumption of sodas has on weight loss.
The body is a perfect machine, that said, the worst obstacle you have is yourself. It is more difficult to stick to a regiment when all that there is to gain from it is weight loss. I am sure that if someone were paying money for pound lost to anyone, there would be a lot more people paying taxes these days lol
As we get older and after being inactive for so long, finding the motivation to do any exercise, be it weights, running or biking, is more difficult than ever and every little hiccup in life becomes an excuse for skipping that day or the other and we are back off the wagon.
Keep the good attitude, take the time to understand your body and go ahead. Do weigh yourself every two days or so and don't see any "no loss" reading on the scale as if you are wasting your time, see it as an indication that you need to change something. Also reflect on what you have been doing, sometimes we are guilty of deceiving ourselves.
Keep up the motivation, this group is a blessing for those in our situation.
Let's do it!!!
It sounds to me Haff that you need alternatives to your food choices. Without knowing what you currently eat its hard to say what alternatives might work for you. Also, thirst can be confused for hunger.
Generally speaking, something that is nutrient dense, water rich, high in fiber, and low in calories would be a starting point. These usually revolve around fruits and vegetables.
Also, certain foods do better than others to satiate hunger. Milk, cottage cheese, & oatmeal are examples of things that work with me.
Without knowing where you are going and what is discussed, I am usually a bit skeptical regarding what recommendations they make. In other words, if every Clyde/Athena in this forum went to them, would they still recommend the same thing?
This is not to say it might not work for you, just that it may not be ideal.
07-13-11, 09:52 PM
I was 500lbs. 464 days ago. I started on a liquid diet using a high protein/low carb drink i found at Costco. For the first 6-8mos. I didn't exercise much (laziness mostly). What little exercise I did was riding my bike. I dropped weight quickly and got motivated. I started riding more and kept on losing. Now I ride 300-500 miles/month and have lost over 200lbs. I feel great and medical checkups in the interim showed no negative effects from my self administered liquid diet. I did have experience, however. I went on a liquid diet once before and lost weight. I like the liquid diet because it has the necessary nutrients, low carbs and, most importantly, you lose weight fast. Keep on exercising, it'll save time. I do eat regularly, however. I read somewhere that successful dieters take regular breaks. I will do the liquid diet for 2-3 weeks and then take 2-3 days off and eat regular food. it prolongs the diet but preserves sanity. If I did the liquid diet solely for the entire time, I think my sanity would be challenged. So, do the liquid diet, keep working out and treat yourself every once in a while.
Keep up the good work.
07-14-11, 01:09 AM
At 255 pounds 7 months ago, I decided that I needed to do something to improve the condition my condition was in.... I didn't eat any differently, I just went out and bought a stationary bike, followed by some dumbbells & weight bench. I started a routine of thirty minutes daily on the stationary bike, later adding a "push/pull" dumbbell routine. I then read about "interval training", bought a heart rate moniter and worked that into my routine three times a week on the stationary bike. I wasn't looking to lose weight, I was just looking to change my lifestyle by exercising..... I noticed that it was difficult to get my heart rate up by walking around the park or peddaling on my stationary bike, so it was time to buy a real bicycle.
I shed 20 pounds in short order by riding my new bicycle, but I worked at it by riding almost daily for up to 20 miles in a single ride. Then I signed up for Medifast..... but rather than starting in July, I wanted to continue with my bicycle riding, add some resistance training, and lately I've begun walking three miles daily on an empty stomach upon getting up in the morning. Given as how Medifast will have me eating 6 times a day and advising that I drink (for my weight) a gallon of water every day.... I've begun the task of downing 4 mason jars of water through the day, and eating every three hours.... all the while getting stronger and going out on the bike for more aggressive rides.
I got my body fat weighed the other day, apparently my 5' 2" frame has 36.2% body fat, and 63.8% lean body mass. Obviously it's TIME to take care of business! I've already begun fixing Irish Oat meal for my mornings, cooking chicken breasts and asparugus to be frozen in individual meals, and counting calories and protein. I'm gonna learn how not only to cook for myself, but to eat well.
- BUT -
August 1st I will start the Medifast program. It is a program of meal replacements 5 times a day and one "lean & green" meal of a 6 oz. meat & 3 servings of vegi. It's claim is that the 1,000 calories a day is equal ("nutritionally") to 2,000 calories a day. But more importantly, it is balanced with the correct ratio of carbohydrate to protein, and claims not to be at the expense of muscle mass. I'll have to cut down on the amount of exercise I've grown accustom to, but after my first month of sticking with the program I can kick it up toward what I'm doing right now (maybe....).
I also asked about a liquid diet elsewhere, and when I need to confuse the body again after a month or two or four (or following the program until I get my weight to where I want it) of Medifast, I may try it. See links below, one with some quick questions answered about Medifast, the other about The Velocity liquid diet.....
07-14-11, 06:53 AM
In June of 2009 I weighed at least 425 and decided to become healtier. In stead of jumping right in to it I set my first goal. I would seriously think about why past efforts failed and what I'd done in partially successful attempts. I would begin in August. A common theme emerged. The more radical approach I took, the less success I had. I also identified several emotional issues to avoid that had derailed earlier efforts. As I was an inactive computer geek my first "goal" was to walk 20 minutes 3 times a week. I told myself to not do anything about diet or weigh myself for 6 months. So August 2009 came and I began. My resting HR was 90.
So slowly ,I mean sloooowly, I got to walking 20 minutes 6 times a week. After the 6 months going to the y became a habit I was ready to tackle weight-loss. I weighed 397 lbs. went to the Doctor for advice and a checkup. Resting HR 72. He advised me to eat 1800 C a day and increase my walking to an hour a day. I kept up on the 1800 C. , walking and added eliptical. In June 2010 I added weight training but vowed not to "bulk out". After one year (Aug 2010) I weighed 291 lbs. Resting HR 60.
Sept 2010 brought my first sustained Plateau.As I had been losing 10-15 lbs/month after the big losses in the beginning so it was time for something "new" I bought a Trek 7300 and began riding. I kept the walking,eliptical and weight training going. After Thanksgiving 2010 I added a Pilates 2X/week Class to help with comfort issues of Bike riding. I got down to 214 in May of 2011 but my strenght was decreasing so I've upped my eating and gained back 7 lbs. My strenght is back to where it was at 275, actually 10% better now. I still want to get to 210 but i will not sacrifice strenght to do it. Resting HR 44.
I've made many changes over the last 2 years but I gave myself time to make them part of me. I suggest the more gradual the changes are more likely you'll stick with them.
07-14-11, 10:31 AM
That was an inspirational read! I find it interesting that I've taken the same approach to weight loss; slow, steady, with subtle changes as needed (though I must admit this Medifast meal replacement thang is going to be a rather dramatic jump start). I must say, it was rather sobering to read your first mention of a "90 (bpm) resting heart rate" at 425 pounds. More importantly, that your resting heart rate has since been reduced to 44!
To sum it up, Wow!
Great story - did you start on the Schwinn Probe at 500lbs? Any modifications?
10-25-13, 04:12 PM
I am not generally a fan of "Magic Bullets", though accept that for some they are life and death. Proper diet is the best long term solution, but of the Magic Bullets, programs like Medifast etc. are the ones that probably have the fewest negative side effects. Once the program has done what it is intended to do, there has to be a changed mindset for life, or the risk of recidivism is very real.
10-26-13, 02:27 PM
i did the whole fruit and veg juice diet. worked great. first 4 days were tough but after the first week the only had part was avoiding all the fast food that i loved. my energy was great and i still worked out hard. maybe not as hard as if i had an excess of calories. i supplemented my protein with a protein shake. personally i used a non whey based one but thats personal preference. started at 327. did it for 60 days lost 60 pounds then did another 60 days 10 months later and dropped another 40. i plan on doing it again this January coming up to try for the last 40 pounds of my original goal. summer season i might have gained 10 pounds up to 235 but my waist still shrunk a bit according to the tape measure. final goal is to be an ex Clydesdale and stay one.
option 2 is less hardcore. my friends replaced one or 2 meals with the fruit and veg juice and they lost weight. like you said, like any addict its a bit nerve racking trying not to go back to where we came from. its a lifestyle change.
10-26-13, 03:59 PM
One thing with WW is you do need to eat most of your points. Most people who start to into "diet" mode with low fat this and that's. I started at 432 in September 2012, and am now down to 274.2, all on WW. Careful with things like liquid diets, as soon as you stop the weight comes back fast.
10-26-13, 07:04 PM
As someone who has been there, let me offer some advice. In 1989 I did Optifast. I had SEVERELY injured my back and the doctor threatened me with not being able to walk if I didn't do something quick. The great thing about a medically supervised liquid diet is that most require you to through nutrition training. As a matter of fact, my Optifast group held group therapy sessions every week to identify the mental part as well as teaching us about good nutrition habits. At the time, they suggested we didn't exercise for the first couple of weeks to let our body adjust to the diet. I began with walking but then did cycling when my back could handle it. In 6 months, I lost 135 pounds. I continued losing on a sensible diet for the next six months and lost another 65 pounds. But, the key is to do it medically supervised!
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