Classic & Vintage - LHT to Salsa Casseroll - possible - difficult - dumb?

I posted this in the Touring forum, but thought I would post it here as it does have a vintage element and I frequent here more often and very much want and respect the opinion of you all.

So - I have a LHT that I have spent a few thousand miles on. I really like the bike but.... I have yet to tour on it and am looking for something a bit sportier for brevet or century riding. FWIW - I also have a mint '85 Trek 620 sitting in the wings ready to be put into service. The LHT and the 620 would fit the same purpose. I do love the LHT, but I just want something a bit more spry
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b110/e_merlin/LHT%202010/IMG_0015.jpg
So - I am interested the 2011 Casseroll, it seems to fit the bill and I like the looks. I was thinking about purchasing frame only and moving the parts over from the Trucker which is all XT. The trucker is 26" wheels so that won't work, but what about the other parts? Can I transfer everything else over? I think the seat post is the same as well?

The complete bike is like 1199 and the frame is 549 - before any good guy discounts :-). I wonder what my LBS would charge to do the work.

Any thoughts would be appreciated - also any other bikes I should consider in this price range? Wish I had the cash for a Riv Hilson.... or the like. I wish a Paramount P-15 would show up for a song... Would I be making a poor decision to make the switch?

Cheers

imo frames are slightly overrated. you may save 1lb at the most.

remove anything unnecessary (rear rack) and get some sportier tires. save yourself some cash.

edit: i missed the part about the 620. why don't you just ride that?

edit: i missed the part about the 620. why don't you just ride that?

I guess I assumed the 620 would ride much like the LHT with the long rear end and wheel base.

Does the 620 have cantilevers? I don't think the 620 could be anything but more spry than the LHT.

Does the 620 have cantilevers? I don't think the 620 could be anything but more spry than the LHT.

yes cantilevers - here is pic

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b110/e_merlin/1985%20Trek%20520/DSC_0092.jpg

Sell the 620 and buy something that does what you're wanting to do well. Or, for that matter, sell the LHT. Nice job, by the way!

Buy yourself a nice Raleigh Super Course or maybe an old racing bike. Keep your LHT. Whatever you get, put on lightweight rims and some very good tires.

Dude the tires you have on that LHT are huge. I'd try something with less rolling resistance personally before I just gave up on the bike. :)

Buy yourself a nice Raleigh Super Course or maybe an old racing bike. Keep your LHT. Whatever you get, put on lightweight rims and some very good tires.

This.

That's a sweet LHT.

But keep the awesome 620 too.

Does the 620 have cantilevers? I don't think the 620 could be anything but more spry than the LHT.
Anything is more spry than the lht. I agree with col, use the trek.

Buy yourself a nice Raleigh Super Course or maybe an old racing bike. Keep your LHT. Whatever you get, put on lightweight rims and some very good tires.

I have been thinking that may be a nice option as well - or an international :-)

Thanks for all the replies. I am surprised to see the recommendations on 620 as a brevet bike. I really believed it would have a touring bike type ride, but I must say I have not put enough miles on it to really know.

The LHT is pretty heavy duty compared to some of the older touring bikes with reynolds tubing etc. I have an LHT and love it. I wouldn't dare sell it.

And if you're looking to spend $600 on a frame and then part out your LHT you're mad. Just buy an old road bike or sport touring bike off craigslist, clean it up, put a couple of hundred bucks into it and you'll still spend less money and you'll get to keep your LHT!

The LHT is pretty heavy duty compared to some of the older touring bikes with reynolds tubing etc. I have an LHT and love it. I wouldn't dare sell it.

And if you're looking to spend $600 on a frame and then part out your LHT you're mad. Just buy an old road bike or sport touring bike off craigslist, clean it up, put a couple of hundred bucks into it and you'll still spend less money and you'll get to keep your LHT!


I have been hunting for one and am just getting tired of waiting I guess - I would love to find a trek 520 or the like. Just nothing in my size :-( I am probably being to picky.

I vote for really good tires on the 620. The 720 was the crazy-long-wheelbase touring bike; isn't the 620 more sport touring geometry?

I vote for really good tires on the 620. The 720 was the crazy-long-wheelbase touring bike; isn't the 620 more sport touring geometry?

47 - same as Surly LHT

Why does one need two dedicated touring frames? Sell one. Buy what you want.

Rudi, I think this 620 has straight-up touring geometry. Seems there was an earlier version with caliper brakes and different geometry, though.

Even though it has a longer wheel base, the 620 is probably a lighter and more nimble bike. I would just put a rando rack on the front, take the rear rack off, and 28mm tires, and maybe swap out the crank for a double. You can also change the FW and RD if it is a long cage . I think it would be a fine sporty bike.

I don't know if the 620 is ever going to be nimble, but it'd be a shame to run tires any narrower than 27 x 1 1/4" or 700 x 35mm on that bike.

My vote is to keep the LHT rather than try to make that into a quicker/nimble machine and sell the 620 inorder to fund a nice sport tourer.

I'd be patient and hunt for that ideal sport touring frameset. IMO, I agree with the Col. that the 620 won't be as nimble as desired. It'll feel significantly 'better' than the LHT due to weight, and narrower tread. Meantime, ride the Trek, or do as another suggested, swap those tires on the LHT for narrow hp slicks.

@ Puget and the Col

I can justify two different class bikes, but it is hard for me to get rid of that 620....

With upgraded components the 620 should out perform the LHT in just about every way, right? It would perhaps be a bit more flexy fully loaded....

Ugh this is not easy - especially when bikes stop being bikes and become a personality with wheels... Sorry for the romanticism. The practical decision would be to trade/sell the 620 for a like vintage sports tourer and keep the LHT.

I'd be patient and hunt for that ideal sport touring frameset. IMO, I agree with the Col. that the 620 won't be as nimble as desired. It'll feel significantly 'better' than the LHT due to weight, and narrower tread. Meantime, ride the Trek, or do as another suggested, swap those tires on the LHT for narrow hp slicks.

I went from the WBT ties that were stock to these continental contacts and did not notice WAY more drag. I have a fire/dirt road the borders on mountain biking that they work well on. I like the versatility and the adventure bike feel they have. I am sure a little lost efficiency over 50 miles adds up to a lot of wasted energy, good comment.

I would think the LHT would edge out the 620 as a loaded tourer (its intended use). I understand not wanting to sell any bike. I'm just saying that you've done a bang up job on the LHT and there should be enough interest in a cleaned, well presented 620 to pay for (or at least a good portion of) a sport-tourer that is better equipped for a front load.

I don't get the comments on the LHT tire size. It's designed for 26" wheels. What's the point in running anything narrower than 1.95" tires?

When you do build up this brevet/century bike, do yourself a solid and build a dynamo wheel.

The practical decision would be to trade/sell the 620 for a like vintage sports tourer and keep the LHT.

Yes yes and yes.

That is exactly what you should do. Be a little patient. I had only my LHT for all of last year. And when I wanted to do a 90km fast pace charity ride, I stripped it down to just the bare essentials and a handlebar bag and did it. Now I have some nice vintage road bikes. After riding my '84 Colnago pretty exclusively most of the spring, I doubted my Surly would get any action this summer. Yet I took it for a spin the other day and I'm so glad I did...don't know how I doubted it. It's just such a comfortable ride.

The 620 is a great bike but you really have no need for it. I would try to sell it at a decent price. The right buyer will pay the right amount. Rather than spending the $500 on a frame from Salsa, I'm sure you can probably even find some vintage beauty on ebay for a decent price.

I'm just saying don't do anything you'll regret. I think the 620 is a nice bike, but it's not like it's a Miyata 1000 or something.

Yes yes and yes.

That is exactly what you should do. Be a little patient. I had only my LHT for all of last year. And when I wanted to do a 90km fast pace charity ride, I stripped it down to just the bare essentials and a handlebar bag and did it. Now I have some nice vintage road bikes. After riding my '84 Colnago pretty exclusively most of the spring, I doubted my Surly would get any action this summer. Yet I took it for a spin the other day and I'm so glad I did...don't know how I doubted it. It's just such a comfortable ride.

The 620 is a great bike but you really have no need for it. I would try to sell it at a decent price. The right buyer will pay the right amount. Rather than spending the $500 on a frame from Salsa, I'm sure you can probably even find some vintage beauty on ebay for a decent price.
.

That is solid advice - thanks. That is the direction I am leaning.

I'm just saying don't do anything you'll regret. I think the 620 is a nice bike, but it's not like it's a Miyata 1000 or something.

Yikes - I am not so sure about that comment. After having ridden both bikes in my size I preferred the 620 to the 1000 or the expedition. Why do you make that statement? Not trying to start a war just curious. That must mean you would prefer the 1000 over the LHT hands down?

I don't get the comments on the LHT tire size. It's designed for 26" wheels. What's the point in running anything narrower than 1.95" tires?


It was for those brevet/century events where he won't be hauling a load x-country. Just to lighten up the bike and lower the rolling resistance.

Yikes - I am not so sure about that comment. After having ridden both bikes in my size I preferred the 620 to the 1000 or the expedition. Why do you make that statement? Not trying to start a war just curious. That must mean you would prefer the 1000 over the LHT hands down?

The Miyata 1000 (depending on the year) is just one of those iconic 80's touring bikes and I just kind of have a thing for them. They are not that easy to come by either.

Turn the LHT from a "loaded rando" into the true loaded tourer it was meant to be, sell your 620 to someone who knows what to do with it, and scratch your "sport tourer" itch with one of these...

520 like this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Trek-520-Touring-Road-Bike-54cm-720-USA-/110701688936?pt=Road_Bikes&hash=item19c655b868

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c91/cusco-awd/Ebay/DSCI6003.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/albums/c91/cusco-awd/Ebay/?action=view&current=DSCI6003.jpg)

520 like this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Trek-520-Touring-Road-Bike-54cm-720-USA-/110701688936?pt=Road_Bikes&hash=item19c655b868

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c91/cusco-awd/Ebay/DSCI6003.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/albums/c91/cusco-awd/Ebay/?action=view&current=DSCI6003.jpg)

nice looking bike in my size too - wonder how that would ride.

It was for those brevet/century events where he won't be hauling a load x-country. Just to lighten up the bike and lower the rolling resistance.

Have you seen a LHT? They're barge long. I don't think one would make a good brevet bike.

Provided it fit, the 520 should work well; even better with smaller wheels and bigger tires.

nice looking bike in my size too - wonder how that would ride.

Probably fantastic.

The Miyata 1000 (depending on the year) is just one of those iconic 80's touring bikes and I just kind of have a thing for them. They are not that easy to come by either.

FWIW, got one in the bay area that doesn't fit, trying to trade for a touring rig on that par that fits me...

E_merlin, You're making this too difficult on yourself. Many, many members have a bike (maybe more than one) that they have kept simply out of sentimentality. The LHT, even if not used for touring is a great bike for everything, but racing. The 620 likely has seniority and would make a nice rando bike, but will never be all that the LHT is, good and bad. Go find a nice racing frame, and presto, three types of road bike.

Brad

What size are you, merlin? I'm in Madison and I could keep an eye out for you too.

I personally say just go for everything, keep whatever bikes you want, and buy a go fast, fun bike on top of it all. But this is also coming from someone who's going to be selling off a few bikes this week because they tend to gather around my place. :o You could always get a storage unit. :)

I think your best bet is to try and trade the 620 with the uber long stays, for one of Treks very popular sport-touring models, like the 520 above. They are fantastic riding bikes, fit decent sized tires and have a semi-relaxed geometry perfect for what you are looking for. They are really good "randonneur" type conversion bikes, and that particular 620 you have there is a pretty desirable one because it's full touring geometry like the famed 720.

What size are you, merlin? I'm in Madison and I could keep an eye out for you too.

I personally say just go for everything, keep whatever bikes you want, and buy a go fast, fun bike on top of it all. But this is also coming from someone who's going to be selling off a few bikes this week because they tend to gather around my place. :o You could always get a storage unit. :)

Thanks 3speed - I am a 52-54cm depending on the angles - 21" vintage stuff works for me. I very much appreciate the offer.

The problem with a storage unit is my wife would make me sleep in it if I get another bike!

FWIW - I have a go fast bike and a mountain bike..... Rarely ride them - I have been riding the go fast more and more.

Cheers.

To correct a bit of info in the thread...

Note that the geometry of the 620 changed several times over its production through the '83/'84/'85 years.

'83: Calipers, 440mm stays, 1028mm w/b
'84: Cantis, 455mm stays, 1049mm w/b (for comparison, the '84 720 was 470/1062)
'85: Cantis, 470mm stays, all wheelbases given for various sizes in catalog. The 720 had a different s/t angle than the 620, so to call them the same geometry-wise isn't 100% correct.

I found all this out when I bought a desirable 47 chainstay " '85 " 620 frame only to find out that it was actually an '84 that wasn't that different from the 520 I already owned. Live and learn.