Classic & Vintage - Shimano Crane RD with Huret Dropout

Huret dropouts have caused me a few headaches as of late. My last issue is finding a RD for use with a 1975 Grand Jubile with Huret dropouts. I have a Huret Eco RD that will do the job, but I wanted something a bit better. I read here that the Shimano Crane RDs were made to work with Huret AND Campagnolo type dropouts. So, I bought one.

But, when I went to mount it to the Motobecane something didn't look quite right. I asked Nlerner, who is currently using a Crane GS on a Grand Jubile for some pics to help me out. It looks as though the piece that acts as the stop is in a different orientation on the two derailleurs.

Neal's Crane GS

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3963/web.jpg?ver=13087497350001

My Crane (short cage)

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3949/web.jpg?ver=13087483390001

Neal also sent a pic of his RD installed so I could see how that "stop" piece sat in relation to the dropout.

When I tried to mount my short cage Crane with the "stop" piece in that position, the RD was at an incorrect angle (say 3 o'clock when it should've been at 6 o'clock).

So, as I'm want to do late at night whilst drinking brown liquor in the bike dungeon I call a basement I decided that it seemed perfectly plausible that the position of this "stop" piece could be moved. So, I removed the sir clip that held the "stop" piece to the mounting bolt. I didn't see a second hole for the spring end or any other way to change the position of the "stop" piece while keeping the spring taut so I just tried to "put it back how I found it". That worked, although the spring is now not as tight as it was before I removed and reinstalled the sir clip.

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3954/web.jpg?ver=13087487940001

I mounted the Crane to the Jubile and it looks like it might work, but the derailleur mounting spring is decidedly more flaccid than the usual Shimano RD of this type design.

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3959/web.jpg?ver=13087493850001

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3958/web.jpg?ver=13087492220001

Here's what Neal's looks like mounted. Mine would NOT mount like this. It's as if the diameter of the entire dropout is too large for the "stop" piece.

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3965/web.jpg?ver=13087497810001

So, any advice?
Reckon this thing will work as is?
Should I stop tinkering with small RD parts?
Should I stop drinking bourbon all together?

It doesn't look like it will work too well as is.

I've got a couple Cranes in my bike dungeon that I was using on a Huret dropout. I no longer own the bike. Let me look at them tonight, and if one has the right style stop I'll send it to and you can send me your stop.

Much appreciated. Thanks!

I have no detailed knowledge on this particular subject but many years ago, in my ignorance, I installed a (short cage) Crane on my 78 GJ (with Huret dropouts) and rode it that way off and on for the next 30 years; and wasn't aware of any issues. A couple of years ago I switched to a short cage Cyclone, mainly for "correctness". I still have the GJ and the Crane, if any further research is needed.

Colonel, someday we will all look back on this and laugh (gulp!).

Neal

Justin:

My Cranes stops are like yours. Mine fit the Huret dropout on my Schwinn Sports Tourer. You look like you have a different Huret dropout than mine.

Mark

quit screwing with this crap and get some campy 10 or 11 sp.

The Colonel is holding out for 12 sp Campy.

You guys are killing me. It's becoming apparent that my priorities aren't what they ought to be.


Justin:

My Cranes stops are like yours. Mine fit the Huret dropout on my Schwinn Sports Tourer. You look like you have a different Huret dropout than mine.

Mark

I didn't realize there was more than one type.

I didn't realize there was more than one type.

That's correct. You have a somewhat-rare Huret dropout with a "front" and "rear" stop. By contrast, the much-more-common Campy-style dropout has only a "front" stop. I don't know if I ever saw a successful "normal" derailleur installation on the oddball Huret dropout- the "B" screw needs to be extra-extra long and bent around to contact the stop.

I do remember that the Huret Duopar had an interchangeable stop on the main pivot bolt. One version worked with the "Campy" style derailleur hanger, the other worked with the "Huret" style.

Geez- that's from the really dusty parts of my bike parts memories.

Just to be clear, Jeff, are you saying that Huret produced two different dropout designs? The Huret dropout on this 1975 Grand Jubile has only one stop, at 4 o'clock.

Edit: I found that the "honeycomb" dropout has both Huret and Campagnolo stops (4 and 7 o'clock).

Grand Jube with NR available for cheap on Long Island...... Local pickup only

http://cgi.ebay.com/Motobecane-Grand-Jubilee-Bicycle-/300568625925?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item45fb494305

Okay, I've used Cranes on Huret hangers and to the best of my recollection, the tabs go on either side of the hanger. I'm not sure what kind of hanger that is in the pic... I use it strictly as an illustration.

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee161/baxter67/Random%20Shared%20Pics/P1060896.jpg

http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee161/baxter67/Random%20Shared%20Pics/P1060895.jpg

The RD hangers on the Colonel's Moto and my Moto look the same to me:

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3958/web.jpg?ver=13087492220001

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/100082/IMG_3965/web.jpg?ver=13087497810001

Neal

Grand Jube with NR available for cheap on Long Island...... Local pickup only

http://cgi.ebay.com/Motobecane-Grand-Jubilee-Bicycle-/300568625925?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item45fb494305

Great, just great, now I'm wishing I hadn't opened this thread! Is that bike all original, do you think? If someone wants it, I can facilitate.

Is that bike all original, do you think?

Never heard of Dura Ace on a Grand Jubile. The stickers were included when you bought the parts, so it looks like someone upgraded and slapped a sticker on there. I wouldn't think the handlebar to be original.

I think the Grand Jubile went to Vitus tubing in 1977, so this would likely be 1976. It has Suntour GS dropouts. Hoo-friggin'-ray!

Nice original saddle.

Why do you think your dropout hanger is too large in diameter? Isn't it supposed to hit that stop? It looks like Neal's misses the stop and plants itself elsewhere on the hanger. If you rotate yours to hit the stop, wouldn't it be in the correct position?

I'm confused, and I'm not even drinking bourbon.

Great, just great, now I'm wishing I hadn't opened this thread! Is that bike all original, do you think? If someone wants it, I can facilitate.

PM sent!

PM sent!

really?

_________________
edit:

Ah, there it is. Sneaky!

really?

It was a stealth message :-).

Why do you think your dropout hanger is too large in diameter? Isn't it supposed to hit that stop?.

I'm not sure, but the RD won't sit like Neal's.


If you rotate yours to hit the stop, wouldn't it be in the correct position?


I think so, yes. But, as I wrote above, it just sort of hangs there limp. Not like a typical Shimano RD with a spring in the mounting bolt.

Justin, is the spring seated in the correct orientation inside the RD? I had this problem once with a newer (80s) Shimano RD. The spring was seated 180 degrees out of phase, causing inadequate tension when angled properly in the DO.

Good question, Anton. It would make sense that the spring is 180 degrees "out of phase" (you audio geek!). I suppose I can try to change that. I don't suppose I have much to loose. The Crane's spring tension is not how it came to me after removing that sir clip.

The Crane's spring tension is not how it came to me after removing that sir clip.

Aha! the plot is unraveling. Ask me how my spring came to be 180 degrees out of whack. ;)

Actually, in your case, it may not be 180 degrees. It may be that the tip of the spring has simple come unseated after removing the circlip. That's what happened with mine during a complete rebuild. When I opened it up to investigate, I ended up reseating the spring, but 180 degrees OOP. I didn't realize the spring was directional. So I had to open it up yet again, correct it, and it was good to go. But it's a PITA to get that circlip back on when the spring is (a) seated and (b) in the right orientation.

Haha! I came clean with that in the OP!

The orientation was incorrect for this dropout before I removed the sir clip. So, it sound like I should attempt to move the spring 180 degrees and reinstall the sir clip, yes?

Aha! the plot is unraveling. Ask me how my spring came to be 180 degrees out of whack. ;)

Actually, in your case, it may not be 180 degrees. It may be that the tip of the spring has simple come unseated after removing the circlip. That's what happened with mine during a complete rebuild. When I opened it up to investigate, I ended up reseating the spring, but 180 degrees OOP. I didn't realize the spring was directional. So I had to open it up yet again, correct it, and it was good to go. But it's a PITA to get that circlip back on when the spring is (a) seated and (b) in the right orientation.

Anton, how did you do this??? I have a Crane long cage rd and for the life of me I can't compress the spring, get it in the right position and put the circlip on. I feel like an idiot.

The Colonel is holding out for 12 sp Campy.

How foolish! I'm holding out for 13-speeds!

Anton, how did you do this??? I have a Crane long cage rd and for the life of me I can't compress the spring, get it in the right position and put the circlip on. I feel like an idiot.

Not easily. Cursing and throwing things helped. That and a large forked C-clamp to hold it under compression while I got the circlip on.