I ran right into a car door that a motorist placed directly in my path! Granted, we probably could have arranged something a little more elegant than me pitching over my handlebars and landing on my ass had he not caught me completely by surprise, but I do what I can with what I have!
Special thanks to his girlfriend, who started telling me it was my fault for hitting the car door. And I'd like to tell the motorist that when I told him, "Shut that b*tch up" I really just wanted her to be able to hear the constructive dialogue I was having with him.
It's nice when cyclists and motorists get along, and I especially like having a chance to share my concerns and thoughts regarding "sharing the road."
The massive bruises on my arms from where I hit the door, the pavement and a parked car are thrilling souveiners of a worthwhile and stimulating encounter, as is the large patch of scraped and scabbed flesh on my thigh and knee. And I'd like you to know, dear motorist, that I called you "motherf*cker" with the greatest possible sense of respect and affection.
(this is one of the many reasons i ride cm and refuse to apologize for it.)
TuckertonRR
11-15-04, 06:33 AM
did you get their drivers licence #? or a name? or at least copy down the licence plate #? Get their insurance company to pay for their clients' neglegence. Dooring is illegal. Call a doctor, get yourself checked out, then call a lawyer! I'm serious!
Seanholio
11-15-04, 11:22 AM
Lawsuits will do more than CM. When drivers are held accountable for their actions and failures, they will become more aware, because it costs them money otherwise.
Recover your damages, both property, medical, and mental, from his insurance company.
slvoid
11-15-04, 11:26 AM
You're in NY right? No-fault baby!
twahl
11-15-04, 12:48 PM
hmmmmm...everything I have ever read, on these forums, in cycling books and magizines, etc. tell me to take the lane if necessary to avoid the possibility of being doored, but under any circumstance to make sure that I am clear enough of cars parked along the side of the street to allow clearance. Most publications even include little diagrams illustrating this. While this doesn't absolve a motor vehicle occupant of checking before opening his or her door, is there some handicap you have that prevented you from being aware of the possibility that it could happen and taking whatever steps need to be taken to keep yourself out of harm's way?
And exactly how does CM increase the chances that drivers will be more careful when getting out of a car?
noisebeam
11-15-04, 01:11 PM
I've always wondered if cars get 'doored' as often as bikes.
Is the problem that people opening their door don't look (Which would lead me to expect cars get doored just as often) Or is the problem that people look before opening door, but don't 'see' the bike?
Al
Ebbtide
11-15-04, 01:14 PM
Is this is like your tenth accident I've read about, you are the Ultimate Cycling Martyr!!
The etiquette to be observed in cycling is to be civil to all; assist the timid, and do not mock or laugh at awkwardness."
-Annie Randall White, 'Twentieth Century Etiquette'
I called you "motherf*cker" with the greatest possible sense of respect and affection.
-Laika, 'Bikeforums.net'
Glad you lived, better luck next time.
timmhaan
11-15-04, 01:21 PM
I've always wondered if cars get 'doored' as often as bikes.
Is the problem that people opening their door don't look (Which would lead me to expect cars get doored just as often) Or is the problem that people look before opening door, but don't 'see' the bike?
Al
drivers just don't notice cyclists as much as they do other cars. further, they tend to misjudge the approcahing cyclists speed and think they have more time then they actually do. other times they are so preoccupied with whatever they are doing they just don't think. this is more of a problem in places where you have to ride right next to a row of parked cars (almost every road is like this in NYC). you just have to ride as if everyone is going to hit you and try not to get boxed in by the surrounding traffic (easier said then done). i've only been doored once but it happened so fast that i had no option of avoiding it.
noisebeam
11-15-04, 01:26 PM
drivers just don't notice cyclists as much as they do other cars. further, they tend to misjudge the approcahing cyclists speed and think they have more time then they actually do.
As I suspected - its not that folks don't look before opening door, its that the don't 'see' - This danger of cycling visiblity I am very aware of.
I don't ride in door zone. My biggest fear of accident while cycling (and actually while driving too) is having someone turn left in front of my path - while I am cautious thru intersections and watch the behavior of left turners, it is just not possible to ride like every left turner may suddenly turn.
Al
mirona
11-15-04, 01:29 PM
I'll keep playing in traffic. You do it your way, I'll do it mine.
Maybe you should rethink 'your way' because it doesn't seem to be working in your favor ;)
timmhaan
11-15-04, 01:35 PM
As I suspected - its not that folks don't look before opening door, its that the don't 'see' - This danger of cycling visiblity I am very aware of.
I don't ride in door zone. My biggest fear of accident while cycling (and actually while driving too) is having someone turn left in front of my path - while I am cautious thru intersections and watch the behavior of left turners, it is just not possible to ride like every left turner may suddenly turn.
Al
where in Arizona do you live? i grew up in tucson and it was always nerve racking to cross those huge intersections. i'm sure you know the ones - three lanes in each direction and people driving so fast as to not get caught at the light. i feel safer riding around in NYC traffic than i did in midtown\downtown tucson. i feel like i'll get injuried in NYC as opposed to getting killed in Tucson.
noisebeam
11-15-04, 01:48 PM
where in Arizona do you live? i grew up in tucson and it was always nerve racking to cross those huge intersections. i'm sure you know the ones - three lanes in each direction and people driving so fast as to not get caught at the light. i feel safer riding around in NYC traffic than i did in midtown\downtown tucson. i feel like i'll get injuried in NYC as opposed to getting killed in Tucson.
Tempe, but I ride in Chandler, Mesa, all the surounding cities, and yes, every day on those 5 and 7 lane streets with 50mph+ traffic and a large intersection with a light every mile, and a minor one about every 1/2 mi.
Al
Laika
11-15-04, 02:12 PM
hmmmmm...everything I have ever read, on these forums, in cycling books and magizines, etc. tell me to take the lane if necessary to avoid the possibility of being doored, but under any circumstance to make sure that I am clear enough of cars parked along the side of the street to allow clearance. Most publications even include little diagrams illustrating this.
I was three feet or so from a row of parked cars on my left, having taken my lane- the left lane of a three lane, one way street. And before you even ask, I was in the left lane and not the right because I was about a hundred yards from the beginning of a left-side bike lane. As I proceeded up Centre Street to where it merges with Lafayette Street, a driver stopped in the middle of a lane change from the center lane into my lane and opened his (driver's side) door into my path. Next thing I knew I was on the ground, facing back towards him. So as near as I can guess, my right arm hit his left door as I managed to get most of my body clear of his door. The resultant impact both knocked me from the bike and spun me around and to the left hard enough that I bumped up against the parked car hard enough to leave a mark.
While this doesn't absolve a motor vehicle occupant of checking before opening his or her door, is there some handicap you have that prevented you from being aware of the possibility that it could happen and taking whatever steps need to be taken to keep yourself out of harm's way?
Well obviously, I was handicapped by not being able to predict that he would stop driving half in and half out of my lane and fling his door open his door directly in my path. So if not being telepathic is a handicap, yes I guess there was something. OTOH, you seem in need of a decongestant or antihistimine to clear up what seems to be an acute case of terminal snottiness.
And exactly how does CM increase the chances that drivers will be more careful when getting out of a car?
I believe it rasies the profiles of urban cyclists. You are of course entitled to a different and, in my view, mistaken opinion about CM.
I'm fine, by the way. Thanks for asking. The only thing nicer than good motorist-cyclist relations is the sort of very touching solidarity and empathy that cyclists share that you've demonstrated here. Thanks bunches. Really.
Laika
11-15-04, 02:17 PM
Is this is like your tenth accident I've read about, you are the Ultimate Cycling Martyr!!
Glad you lived, better luck next time.
Glad to see you actually crawl out of the political ghetto and talk about cycling sometimes.
I've only posted about this accident, as far as I know. If you'd like to hear the other accident stories, such as "The First Time I Tried Clipless Pedals," "I Should Have Been More Careful Going Downhill In Wet Leaves," or "Who Put That Pothole There?" I'd be glad to share.
You are, of course, correct to point out my lapse into vulgarity and incivility. Though I have always thought of that quote in relation to cyclist-cyclist relations and communications, you are correct in pointing out that I could perhaps have tempered my expressions of anger and disbelief in a more civil manner. I thank you for the guidance and will strive to meet with your approval the next time something of this sort happens.
EDIT: I went back and checked as your apparent fatigue with my accident stories had me worried. Was I really some sort of cycling injury martyr? I posted once before about going over my handlebars in the context of a poll about the efficacy of helmets. And another time, I posted about getting a flat. So that would be now three, rather than ten accidents.
vincenzosi
11-15-04, 02:32 PM
Frankly, if the idiot doored you and didn't apologize, civility goes out the window. People need to pay better attention. Of course, these are usually the same pricks that jump out into an oncoming lane of traffic without signalling or checking their mirror, so it's like preaching to the choir.
As for the shmuck who wished for a more catastrophic result:
Is this is like your tenth accident I've read about, you are the Ultimate Cycling Martyr!!
..
Glad you lived, better luck next time.
Dude, what's your problem? Laika crashed and you say better luck next time?
Maybe you should take a good tumble so we can all have a laugh. I for one will be pissing myself at your extensive cycling prowess as you endo through someone's driver side window.
Ebbtide
11-15-04, 02:35 PM
Frankly, if the idiot doored you and didn't apologize, civility goes out the window. People need to pay better attention. Of course, these are usually the same pricks that jump out into an oncoming lane of traffic without signalling or checking their mirror, so it's like preaching to the choir.
As for the shmuck who wished for a more catastrophic result, dude, what's your problem? Laika crashed and you say better luck next time?
Maybe you should take a good tumble so we can all have a laugh.
No need to read that much into it, vincenzosi. I said "Glad you lived (as in it could have been worse), better luck (as in "I hope you don't get as badly hurt) next time. Sheesh, think before you type, people.
vincenzosi
11-15-04, 02:38 PM
Heh... I didn't take it that way and neither did he...
Must be something wrong with both of us then.
Ebbtide
11-15-04, 02:39 PM
Heh... I didn't take it that way and neither did he...
Must be something wrong with both of us then.
Yes, you have prejudge me and my intentions. Very small minded act if you ask me.
Laika
11-15-04, 02:40 PM
As for the shmuck who wished for a more catastrophic result:
Dude, what's your problem? Laika crashed and you say better luck next time?
Maybe you should take a good tumble so we can all have a laugh. I for one will be pissing myself at your extensive cycling prowess as you endo through someone's driver side window.
Thanks for the kind words. I think he has a chip on his shoulder because we're on very different sides of the fence politically, and he apparently takes that pretty personally (though I'm not trying to put words in his mouth here and will admit right off the bat that I could be woefully wrong about his apparent dislike of me.) As for me, with what little attention I pay him, I wish him many miles of smooth pavement and unrestricted motion in or on the conveyance of his choice. Crashing sucks, whatever the cause.
Yoshi
11-15-04, 02:40 PM
As I suspected - its not that folks don't look before opening door, its that the don't 'see' - This danger of cycling visiblity I am very aware of.
I don't ride in door zone. My biggest fear of accident while cycling (and actually while driving too) is having someone turn left in front of my path - while I am cautious thru intersections and watch the behavior of left turners, it is just not possible to ride like every left turner may suddenly turn.
Al
A car almost hit me once making a left turn at the intersection at Bowery and Delancey. I ended up crashing into a traffic light trying to avoid the car. Driver didn't slow down at all, even though I was directly in front of his/her car.
Also, dooring is the fault of the driver. According to the New York traffic rules, section 4-12c:
Getting out of vehicle. No person shall get out of any vehicle from the side facing on the traveled part of the street in such manner as to interfer with the right of the operator of an approaching vehicle or bicycle.
Laika
11-15-04, 02:43 PM
A car almost hit me once making a left turn at the intersection at Bowery and Delancey. I ended up crashing into a traffic light trying to avoid the car. Driver didn't slow down at all, even though I was directly in front of his/her car.
Also, dooring is the fault of the driver. According to the New York traffic rules, section 4-12c:
Getting out of vehicle. No person shall get out of any vehicle from the side facing on the traveled part of the street in such manner as to interfer with the right of the operator of an approaching vehicle or bicycle.
You have state bicycle law down pat, Yoshi. I know who to call next time I need backup!
Ebbtide
11-15-04, 02:48 PM
Thanks for the kind words. I think he has a chip on his shoulder because we're on very different sides of the fence politically, and he apparently takes that pretty personally (though I'm not trying to put words in his mouth here and will admit right off the bat that I could be woefully wrong about his apparent dislike of me.) As for me, with what little attention I pay him, I wish him many miles of smooth pavement and unrestricted motion in or on the conveyance of his choice. Crashing sucks, whatever the cause.
Glad you lived, better luck next time.
Jeez, maybe I'll get banned now that I wished death upon you :rolleyes:
Typical :rolleyes:, per the rules you can't keep the stuff that goes on the political section where it belongs. This is a case of your biased feelings bumbling over, not mine. I think someone in NYC needs to lighten up. Edit: I was not even aware we discussed anything in the political forum, I'm flattered you remembered me. Any snideness (pointing out hypocracy) in this thread is a result of you comments about the CM and how you think it is the "end all" of cycling advocacy when it has become apparent CM does very little these days.
Good Luck (in general, not in death ;) ),
ehenz
Laika
11-15-04, 03:08 PM
Jeez, maybe I'll get banned now that I wished death upon you :rolleyes:
Typical :rolleyes:, per the rules you can't keep the stuff that goes on the politcal section where it belongs.
"2: What is said in this forum stays in this forum."
While I mentioned that we're political opposites, and that I believed your apparent fatigue with me and my three boring accident stories might be rooted in that, I made no specific mention of anything said in the political forum. Indeed, without the context of our other posts, using only the post which you seem to have a problem with as a source text, all I've mentioned is that we disagree politically. Withut conext, which could only be provided had I actually broughtsomething said in the political forum into this forum or if someone here had read our posts in the political forum, for all anyone here knows, I could be a monarchist and you a radical Stalinist, or I could be a Fabian Socialist and you a third generation member of the John Birch society. If you disagree and believe that I am in violation of rule 2. ( or any of the four rules for that matter), I invite you to email a site moderator and have this thread deleted or moved &/or my account suspended or terminated.
Interestingly, the use of the word "typical" in the above section actually indicates that you have a set of interactions with me fresh in your mind with which to compare any new interactions with me which enables you to determine if they're typical or not; that is, you're working with a set of biases against me. Pot, kettle, etc.
This is a case of your biased feelings bumbling over, not mine. I think someone in NYC needs to lighten up.
For my "biased feelings" to "bumble" over, I'd have to have some feelings about you. Which I don't.
And lightening up? Once more, the relative hues of cooking implements seems a facile comparison.
Later, gator.
BeTheChange
11-15-04, 03:13 PM
First off I'm glad you weren't seriously hurt Laika. Second I really love the way you wrote the whole procedings with driver who doored you. At least we know the crash didn't hurt your writing skills. Good luck with the morons.
Laika
11-15-04, 03:18 PM
Edit: I was not even aware we discussed anything in the polemical section, I'm flattered you remembered me.
Methinks the poster doth protest too much.
Good Luck (in general, not in death ;) ),
ehenz :D
I'll take this at face value and wish the same to you, quite quite sincerely.
Best,
Laika
Ebbtide
11-15-04, 03:21 PM
Interestingly, the use of the word "typical" in the above section actually indicates that you have a set of interactions with me fresh in your mind with which to compare any new interactions with me which enables you to determine if they're typical or not; that is, you're working with a set of biases against me. Pot, kettle, etc.
"Typical" of those who hate, prejudge, and are close minded. All of which you have proudly demonstrated over the past couple of days.
What you just said is a classic example being prejudice and drives my point home. Just because I say "typical" does not mean you can throw your own definition in there and prejudge my intentions (yet again).
I wish you "better luck" and you assume I mean "good luck getting killed", I'm sorry, but you must be a complete moron to think like that.
I walk the walk and can respectfully disagree, you sir, seem to fall far short of that mark.
After a while
Laika
11-15-04, 03:31 PM
"Typical" of those who hate, prejudge, and are close minded. All of which you have proudly demonstrated over the past couple of days.
What you just said is a classic example being prejudice and drives my point home. Just because I say "typical" does not mean you can throw your own definition in there and prejudge my intentions (yet again).
I wish you "better luck" and you assume I mean "good luck getting killed", I'm sorry, but you must be a complete moron to think like that.
I walk the walk and can respectfully disagree, you sir, seem to fall far short of that mark.
After a while
In this post, you make my point for me more explicitly and more directly than I might have dared, for fear of being called exactly the kinds of things you have called me. I am not interested in your brand of respectful disagreement, which I have heard called other, less polite names, and rather than indulge you further, I will simply wish you, quite sincerely, all of the very best and most rewarding things that the vagaries of life and your own hard work and industry can provide you, and I further extend my good wishes to your family, loved ones, pets and treasured posessions.
With best and most warm regards,
Laika
Seeker
11-15-04, 04:54 PM
Nice p!ss!ing match folks. Getting a bit off topic don't ya think?
genec
11-15-04, 05:03 PM
Tempe, but I ride in Chandler, Mesa, all the surounding cities, and yes, every day on those 5 and 7 lane streets with 50mph+ traffic and a large intersection with a light every mile, and a minor one about every 1/2 mi.
Al
Yup the dreaded urban hiway/boulevard! Sigh... "uh, just take the lane dude."
This is exactly the thing that urban road planners think is perfect for cities... and it does NOTHING for either pedestrian or bicycle traffic.
I have no solution, this is where I think bike lanes and parallel bike paths are the only way... actually would love to see an even better situation... a bicycle only freeway. Miles and miles of bicycles merging together on highspeed roads with on ramps and off ramps designed for bicycles only. :D
twahl
11-15-04, 05:21 PM
I was three feet or so from a row of parked cars on my left, having taken my lane- the left lane of a three lane, one way street. And before you even ask, I was in the left lane and not the right because I was about a hundred yards from the beginning of a left-side bike lane. As I proceeded up Centre Street to where it merges with Lafayette Street, a driver stopped in the middle of a lane change from the center lane into my lane and opened his (driver's side) door into my path. Next thing I knew I was on the ground, facing back towards him. So as near as I can guess, my right arm hit his left door as I managed to get most of my body clear of his door. The resultant impact both knocked me from the bike and spun me around and to the left hard enough that I bumped up against the parked car hard enough to leave a mark.
Well obviously, I was handicapped by not being able to predict that he would stop driving half in and half out of my lane and fling his door open his door directly in my path. So if not being telepathic is a handicap, yes I guess there was something. OTOH, you seem in need of a decongestant or antihistimine to clear up what seems to be an acute case of terminal snottiness.
I believe it rasies the profiles of urban cyclists. You are of course entitled to a different and, in my view, mistaken opinion about CM.
I'm fine, by the way. Thanks for asking. The only thing nicer than good motorist-cyclist relations is the sort of very touching solidarity and empathy that cyclists share that you've demonstrated here. Thanks bunches. Really.
From this more detailed description, if the guy actually stopped in the middle of two lanes and started to get out of the car, then he was an idiot regardless of whether you were on a bicycle or not. I wasn't being "snotty" as you profess, I just wasn't considering the possibility that this happened out in the middle of a couple of lanes of traffic, since as a driver, stopping my car and getting out in the middle of the street is not something that I would ever consider doing without some other extenuating circumstances, such as an accident having occured in front of me. Since that's a key detail that separates the incident from any normal circumstances of being doored, perhaps some humility on your part for leaving it out of your initial description might be in order. In any case, I still don't see where CM would cure this particular driver's apparent stupidity.
And I assumed you were fine, otherwise you wouldn't have been posting about it with such flowery descriptions and overabundant sarcasm. When one of my kids receives a minor injury while doing something they've been taught not to do, if there's no ER trip required, sympathy isn't what they get from me. Given your initial description, I think it only natural to assume that you were riding in a way that you have been told not to. For the lack of telepathic skills on my part, I apologize.
glomarduck
11-15-04, 05:24 PM
Hell, I have been doored just walking down the sidewalk.
Laika
11-15-04, 05:36 PM
I thought asking if I was handicapped in some way that prevented me from avoiding the dooring was snotty. If the comment was not intended to have a resemblence to hardened phlegm, I sincerely apologise for what could definitely be seen as an overreaction. Additionally I apologise for assuming that, as cyclists, we would give each other the benefit of the doubt when there's a cyclist/motorist incident or accident. It has been my experience that motorists pose a far greater danger to cyclists than cyclists do to motorists, and it has further been my experience that, in urban settings especially, motorists are responsible for the far greater share of accidents and incidents. I should have realized that even other urban cyclists might not share my perspective on the state of urban cycling. And I certainly could have provided a more detailed description of the incident at the beginning. I was still so angry that I was mostly venting at that point, but you are right in suggesting that some reflection and actual description of the event might have helped give perspective on it. Further, I am sorry if my writing, which could, at times, be described accurately as florid and overly wordy, gave offense or caused upsetment. I can only thank you for bothering to write back at all, which I really do appreciate, and warn you in advance that while the tone of my future posts & threads is likely to vary depending on the subject matter, my choices of language and style are likely to remain largely the same. Unless I've had a couple...then I start dropping my g's and cussin'. ;) So if you don't like the style of my writing here, you are somewhat unlikely to enjoy it much in the future, sadly.
Thanks for taking the time to respond. This was my first dooring after many close calls here in NYC. I do my absolute level best to avoid stuff like this during my daily commuting and leisure riding, but I knew that it was probably just a matter of time if I kept riding here. Talking (or posting) it out here has been a great help in thinking about something that really freaked me out when it happened.
Best,
Laika
Laika
11-15-04, 05:39 PM
Nice p!ss!ing match folks. Getting a bit off topic don't ya think?
You're absolutely right. I cannot and will not put words in the mouth of the other posters involved, but I apologise for having wasted your time. As I said above, though, having this conversation, contentious as it sometimes has been, has helped me to get some perspective on something that I had been dreading for as long as I've been riding in NYC and which really freaked me out. So again, thanks, sorry, and best regards.
twahl
11-15-04, 05:53 PM
If the comment was not intended to have a resemblence to hardened phlegm, I sincerely apologise for what could definitely be seen as an overreaction.
<snip>
... So if you don't like the style of my writing here, you are somewhat unlikely to enjoy it much in the future, sadly.
great help in thinking about something that really freaked me out when it happened.
<snip>
Best,
Laika
I would think that hardened phlem would be referred to as buggers, boogers, or bogies, depending on where you are from. Perhaps it's different in NY, but here in Northern Virginia, "snot" is what we call the more fluid state of phlegm, usually when it's dripping from the tip of one's nose or running ...well never mind, that's just one step beyond necessary.
I'm actually enjoying the floral quality of your postings, and am attempting to assist you in providing those viewing from the sidelines some meaningful and fulfulling dialog.
I do hope you heal quickly.
scarry
11-15-04, 06:35 PM
Seems to be a lack of good weed around here :rolleyes:
Best wishes for EVERYONE.
And I AM afraid of parked cars. And where is it written that motorists have a right to store their personal property in public space. There should NEVER be free public parking.
steveknight
11-15-04, 06:36 PM
I've always wondered if cars get 'doored' as often as bikes.
Is the problem that people opening their door don't look (Which would lead me to expect cars get doored just as often) Or is the problem that people look before opening door, but don't 'see' the bike?
Al
watching people go to their cars and geting in and out they don't seem to see anyone or anything most of the time they don't even look.
Laika
11-15-04, 07:13 PM
watching people go to their cars and geting in and out they don't seem to see anyone or anything most of the time they don't even look.
Theopen-then-look thing drives me bats, but it doesn't scare me as much as some of the moms around here who push their strollers out into traffic and then look. I never, ever, ever come close to them but as a dad I get the heebie-jeebies thinking about incautious moms+tiny babies+speeding cars....
Oooh. I have to stop thinking about this.
steveknight
11-15-04, 07:22 PM
hell I see so many people cross the street and they never look at all. right accross a 5 lane street making traffic stop.
vincenzosi
11-15-04, 07:38 PM
Steve, correct me if I'm wrong, but you ride a bent, don't you?
I can only imagine how many times you've barely escaped being doored...
Dchiefransom
11-15-04, 08:22 PM
Yup the dreaded urban hiway/boulevard! Sigh... "uh, just take the lane dude."
This is exactly the thing that urban road planners think is perfect for cities... and it does NOTHING for either pedestrian or bicycle traffic.
I have no solution, this is where I think bike lanes and parallel bike paths are the only way... actually would love to see an even better situation... a bicycle only freeway. Miles and miles of bicycles merging together on highspeed roads with on ramps and off ramps designed for bicycles only. :D
My Lord!!!!!!!!!!! What would people think a hundred years from now when the roadway was still in the same condition as the day it was laid????????
suntreader
11-15-04, 08:25 PM
And I'd like you to know, dear motorist, that I called you "motherf*cker" with the greatest possible sense of respect and affection.
Have you ever considered wearing a Kevlar vest? You'd need one here.
Laika
11-15-04, 08:32 PM
Have you ever considered wearing a Kevlar vest? You'd need one here.
I try not make that sort of confrontational language a habit. But when I've just been knocked on my ass and am trying to decide if anything's been broken, sometimes it just slips out, savvy?
But I do think folks in NYC may have thicker skin about profanity than those in the Palmetto State. Not saying that's good or better, bad or worse, just an opinion. For instance, this guy didn't bat an eye the whole time I was going off on him. Granted, I had about six inches and thirty pounds on him, and he was clearly aware he was in the wrong. But when I started yelling, I was flat on my ass, so he did have the upper hand and yet put up with my coarse and angry language like a meek lamb.
glomarduck
11-15-04, 08:37 PM
At one point there really is no prevention to getting doored and will almost always take you completely by surprise.
glomarduck
11-15-04, 08:41 PM
And Laika you had a hard first time. Stay well and god speed.
suntreader
11-15-04, 09:01 PM
But I do think folks in NYC may have thicker skin about profanity than those in the Palmetto State.
That's good, I guess.
In our area, with so many people carrying legal and illegal weapons, you just never know who might be armed. When you have the clear size advantage as you did in this situation, it might make the other guy feel that he has no choice but to use a weapon.
I'm not speaking theoretically here. I've been called in to a lot of crime scenes where somebody has been shot and/or killed. I've also spent a lot of time in emergency rooms counseling with shooting victims and their families. I've heard similar stories from people who weren't so lucky. A little thing becomes a big thing... then somebody gets hurt badly.
Having had a few near-door experiences myself, I can imagine how angry I would get if someone hurt me or my bike. However, I've learned that if the other guy is at fault, you can screw him a whole lot harder by using the police or a good lawyer.
Laika
11-15-04, 09:18 PM
That's good, I guess.
In our area, with so many people carrying legal and illegal weapons, you just never know who might be armed. When you have the clear size advantage as you did in this situation, it might make the other guy feel that he has no choice but to use a weapon.
I'm not speaking theoretically here. I've been called in to a lot of crime scenes where somebody has been shot and/or killed. I've also spent a lot of time in emergency rooms counseling with shooting victims and their families. I've heard similar stories from people who weren't so lucky. A little thing becomes a big thing... then somebody gets hurt badly.
Having had a few near-door experiences myself, I can imagine how angry I would get if someone hurt me or my bike. However, I've learned that if the other guy is at fault, you can screw him a whole lot harder by using the police or a good lawyer.
You're absolutely right in your last paragraph, st. But as regards your first paragraph, one of the advantages of living in this city is that firearms are actually fairly rare in the mainstream. I'm not saying people don't get shot, and perhaps the relative rarity of guns gave me a false sense of confidence, but I've lived here for my whole life, through times when it's been really awful, and through times when it's been relatively not awful and have never been threatened with anything worse than a clenched fist.
suntreader
11-15-04, 09:35 PM
Better check the tag the next time. Make sure it's not a South Carolina car. (grin)
Laika
11-15-04, 09:38 PM
Better check the tag the next time. Make sure it's not a South Carolina car. (grin)
It's an article of faith here in New York City that all the crap drivers have Jersey plates. ;)
suntreader
11-15-04, 09:56 PM
It's an article of faith here in New York City that all the crap drivers have Jersey plates. ;)
Now I think you should reconsider the Kevlar vest.
steveknight
11-15-04, 11:09 PM
Steve, correct me if I'm wrong, but you ride a bent, don't you?
I can only imagine how many times you've barely escaped being doored...
yes but I stay clear of doors. I get far more notice on the bent then I ever did on my DF bike.