Touring - mountain biker looking to go on a tour

Hi guys. I have been wanting to get a road bike. I was looking at getting a regular road bike until I realized that tour bikes were a whole different machine. I have a budget of $2k but dont neccesarily need to spend it all if I can find a nice bike for less. The only one that I have looked at is the Trek 520. I like the Trek but wanted to see if there were better options for less/more. I would probably only be using the bike to get around town and go out riding on the weekends but I like the idea of being able to load it up and hit the road.

Hi guys. I have been wanting to get a road bike. I was looking at getting a regular road bike until I realized that tour bikes were a whole different machine. I have a budget of $2k but dont neccesarily need to spend it all if I can find a nice bike for less. The only one that I have looked at is the Trek 520. I like the Trek but wanted to see if there were better options for less/more. I would probably only be using the bike to get around town and go out riding on the weekends but I like the idea of being able to load it up and hit the road.

Jamis, Surly, Bruce Gordon (BLT) and Fuji have nice bikes also. Bikes Direct has a couple of bikes that you'll need to perform final assembly on and by this time of the year the more popular sizes are sold out.

Brad

PS I forgot to mention that older full rigid mountain bikes often have a second life as commuters and tourers.

Figuring out the kind of touring that appeals to you will help you narrow your choices. For example, I like to tour on and off road, sometimes on the same tour, so I wanted a bike that could take fatter tires for off road, gravel roads, mud, sand, etcetera, but not be overbuilt and clunky on pavement like a modern mountain bike can be.

I carry a light load, but not an ultralight load, and hover around 200lbs myself, so I wanted durability, but in a frame that was not so stiff unloaded that it would beat me up on my daily commute. If I loaded out heavier, I'd have chosen a beefier frame, knowing I'd take a hit in comfort when not loaded. I also wanted disk brakes for easier setup over cantilever brakes and good control in wet and steep environments.

Make a list of bikes in your price range, and a list of places you want to go, and note how comfortable you care to be getting there, then start eliminating bikes from the roster. When you get as short list, start test riding the remainders, and figure it out.

Or, just go the 520 and correct from there. You could do a lot worse.

A steel 29er with a rigid fork will allow you to tour on or off road and carry the the heaviest loads comfortably.

Surly LHT is the current favorite touring bike for many. About $1200. The 520 has been around forever and will certainly get the job done. It may be a little lighter than the Surly, and reportedly has frame flex issues with a heavy load being pedaled by a stong rider. OTOH, it may be a bit more nimble than the Surly. Probably just splitting hairs.

Getting further from the 'road' bike concept is the Trek 7.3 fx. More along the lines of the ridid MTB mentioned by bradtx. Comfortable geometry suitable for around town and light touring. Much less expensive than most dedicated touring bikes. The flat bars are a negative for touring, but that can be fixed.

Make sure that whatever you decide on is as close a fit as you can get. Then, with experience, you can modify the components to suit your personal preferences.

A steel 29er with a rigid fork will allow you to tour on or off road and carry the the heaviest loads comfortably.

So will a Salsa Vaya or Salsa Fargo.

Not sure if you WANT to spend $2K for another bike (in which case the suggestions above are fine), but if you want to save some money, see if your MTB works as a tourer (>= 1050 mm wheelbase, >= 440 mm chainstay, braze-ons for rear rack, low gearing [shouldn't be a problem for a MTB conversion]). If so, then you can switch out knobbies for MTB slicks (Schwalbe is the way to go) and even consider spending a couple hundred to switch out flat handlebars for drops, trekking, mustache bars, etc. Just remember that if you switch to drops you'll need to get brake levers that work with your brakes and bar-end shifters.

This is just an idea if you want to save some money on the bike and use that extra money on accessories like a trailer, panniers, cycling clothes, bike lights, etc.

So will a Salsa Vaya or Salsa Fargo.

Put a dirt drop such as the WTB Mountain Road, Salsa Woodchipper, or Soma June Bug on a 29er and you have essentially the same thing. But, it will be better on the dirt and every bit as good on the road at a much lower price. The Dawes Deadeye and Bullseye are good examples.

You could just modify the bike you have 26" wheels are fine with the right tire ,
rather than the knobbys for dirt riding, and racks , panniers and so forth , with that $2K,
camping gear, sleeping kit, etc..

Rigid fork, hard tail MTB's work well ..

Just rode my Surly LHT, which I also commute with, on a 460 mile tour in SW Montana. Everything stock. Racks and panniers and a pretty good load on it. The route included over 50 miles of unpaved roads, some of which were pretty bumpy in places. The bike performed beautifully. This was taken after 20 rough, unpaved miles:

210337

The discerning eye may notice a potentially catastrophic condition. I mounted the racks at a riverfront park in Missoula five days earlier. A rain storm began to move in and I finished the job quickly. Right after this photo was taken, I noticed my front rack was askew. When I checked it, I realized that the one of the eyelet bolts had worked itself loose had fallen off. The second one was half way towards the same fate. In the words of Foghorn Leghorn "or occasions rare, I carry a spare."

Don't forget to check your rack bolts.

Put a dirt drop such as the WTB Mountain Road, Salsa Woodchipper, or Soma June Bug on a 29er and you have essentially the same thing. But, it will be better on the dirt and every bit as good on the road at a much lower price. The Dawes Deadeye and Bullseye are good examples.

I think you need to look at the Fargo a bit closer before you make that statement. Steel frame, disc brake, rigid or suspension fork long chainstayed 29'er. It was designed from the ground up as a dirt tourer

The Deadeye is an aluminum framed singlespeed (without discs), and The Bullseye is closer but still singlespeed and chock full of crap parts. . Both aren't even in the same ballpark.

There's a host of decent touring bikes, as well as MTB conversions and cross bikes that have the braze-ons for racks. I'm mildly surprised that nobody has mentioned the Kona Sutra. (http://www.konaworld.com/bike.cfm?content=sutra) my tastes generally run to European tourers, but I like Kona bikes, and this is a bike that is fun to ride when unloaded as well as a capable tourer. Well withIn your budget and, in my view, more enjoyable than a LHT.

I don't know if you are in a small town, or a city, but the most significant issue in the internet purchase of my touring bike was size. Once it arrived, I realized I would be better off with a size larger. If you don't have a selection where you live, it is worth phoning the shops in the nearest city to see if they have your size in the bikes you want to test ride. Then make the two or three hour drive on a nice Saturday.

One more bike you might consider is the Cannondale t1 and t2. They were discontinued in 2011 but a dealer may have a couple in stock.

The main thing is not to get overwhelmed by all the choices. It is supposed to be fun. Once you have the basic attributes - 44 cm chainstay, granny gear, dropped handlebars, braze-ons for fenders and racks - the rest is academic.

Enjoy!

I currently ride a Trek Marlin 29er. It is a hard tail but does have a fork lock out for road use. How hard would it be to put racks on it? And I have never even ridden a bike with drop down bars so I guess I do not know what I am missing but is it really that important to have them? I went to my LBS's today and looked. The trek/gt dealer did not have anything but full on road bikes or mtb. The other place is mostly a Kona dealer with a few cannondale/rocky mountain. They did not appear to have anything instock either. They did have some commuters though.

I think you need to look at the Fargo a bit closer before you make that statement. Steel frame, disc brake, rigid or suspension fork long chainstayed 29'er. It was designed from the ground up as a dirt tourer

The Deadeye is an aluminum framed singlespeed (without discs), and The Bullseye is closer but still singlespeed and chock full of crap parts. . Both aren't even in the same ballpark.

The Deadeye and Bullseye both have the same CrMo steel frame and fork. They're sold as singlespeeds but are gear ready. The Bullseye has Avid disks and the Deadeye is disk ready.
Fargo $1650, Vaya $1499, Deadeye $339, Bullseye $379.
I could build up a pretty nice Deadeye or Bullseye for less than half of a Fargo or Vaya. The wheels on the Deadeye/Bullseye are very nice, 29er rims, good hubs, 36 spokes, are great touring wheels. They have a very nice Gravity crank with an Isis bottom bracket.
All the other parts on these bikes are plenty good and usable.
If you've never seen these bikes I can't blame you for assuming they are junk, but they are not.

I am really only wanting something to ride around town and go out on the highway on the weekends. I figure it will be atleast a year before I am fit enough to be able to put in substantial miles. I have thought about buying a cheaper bike to help me get to the level were I need to be and then go get something better. Right now, I only go riding on the weekends and have to drive about 25 miles down to the canyon. I might go a little in the evenings with my kids but that really does not count. I would like something that I could jump on in the evenings and ride about 10 to 15 miles. Should I just try and do this on my mtb? If not, suggestions on what to get. Thanks again for all the replies and opinions. I really appreciate it.

A NICE folding bike will be easy to move about, with, and on, and are, just fine to ride.

I like my Brompton, temporarily have 2, shedding 1, soon, M3R

I currently ride a Trek Marlin 29er. It is a hard tail but does have a fork lock out for road use. How hard would it be to put racks on it? And I have never even ridden a bike with drop down bars so I guess I do not know what I am missing but is it really that important to have them? I went to my LBS's today and looked. The trek/gt dealer did not have anything but full on road bikes or mtb. The other place is mostly a Kona dealer with a few cannondale/rocky mountain. They did not appear to have anything instock either. They did have some commuters though.

Your Trek Marlin is fine for touring. Of course, you'll want to run smooth, narrower touring tires, they'll fit fine on the 29er rims.
You do not need a drop bar. Many people have them but few ever ride in the drops. A wide mountain bar will give you better leverage for climbing.
Check out Old Man Mountain racks. I used to have one that worked on a suspension fork.

Never even thought of using my Marlin and I like the sound of it. It saves some serious cash as well. Do you think that I would need to change the gearing at all. I struggled a bit a few weeks ago in Colorado on some hills. They were not real steep like a pass, but were not ant hills either. I never had to stop but damn sure wanted to a few times and if I would have had any gear loaded, I would have had to do the walk of shame.

Never even thought of using my Marlin and I like the sound of it. It saves some serious cash as well. Do you think that I would need to change the gearing at all. I struggled a bit a few weeks ago in Colorado on some hills. They were not real steep like a pass, but were not ant hills either. I never had to stop but damn sure wanted to a few times and if I would have had any gear loaded, I would have had to do the walk of shame.

No, you won't have to change the gearing, your lowest gear is as low as it gets.
Climbing is an art, there's a lot more to it than stuffing it in the lowest gear and "gearing" your way up.
It's about getting the maximum leverage at the cranks and this is done by very carefully adjusting your bike fit.
It can take years to get it and some never get it.
If it feels better to walk, walk, why suffer? Or, even better, sit down in the shade, breath in the air, and take in the view.

I ended up doing just that. I put it in low and sat down and just crawled up at about 3-4 mph. How much difference would it have made if I would have had thinner tires? Is it a big advantage over my 2.10's?

Converting a Gary Fisher (made by Trek) mountain bike now... Not a 29'er though. If yours has disc brakes make sure you get a rack that will work with them (passing along what I learned on here). Check out the Ergon grips, love the ones I just put on my bike. You can adjust the grips and bar ends independently of each other to get a fit you like. No need to change brake handles or shifters (although you might have to move them a bit on the bars) I haven't ridden my first tour yet... but before I got my road bike I put a LOT of miles on my mountain bike (with semi-slicks) on it. My only regret.... I wish I would have had the Ergon grips!!

Still don't know what I'm doing...... but still I'm having fun doing it....

I ended up doing just that. I put it in low and sat down and just crawled up at about 3-4 mph. How much difference would it have made if I would have had thinner tires? Is it a big advantage over my 2.10's?

You're not going to revolutionize your climbing prowess by BUYING anything, including smoother/thinner tires.
It takes practice and thought to improve, neither of which can be bought.
But, smoother/thinner tires will save you a lot of energy over the course of the day leaving you more energy for climbing.

Converting a Gary Fisher (made by Trek) mountain bike now... Not a 29'er though. If yours has disc brakes make sure you get a rack that will work with them (passing along what I learned on here). Check out the Ergon grips, love the ones I just put on my bike. You can adjust the grips and bar ends independently of each other to get a fit you like. No need to change brake handles or shifters (although you might have to move them a bit on the bars) I haven't ridden my first tour yet... but before I got my road bike I put a LOT of miles on my mountain bike (with semi-slicks) on it. My only regret.... I wish I would have had the Ergon grips!!

Still don't know what I'm doing...... but still I'm having fun doing it....

Yeah, those Ergon with the built-in bar ends are great. You can really generate some good leverage for climbing with bar ends.

I'm not real worried about the climbing now. I was on vacation then but I actually live in the Texas panhandle. Which just happens to be one of the absolute flattest places in the us. The only hills around here are the highway overpasses. I am just trying to learn the pro's and con's of the different set ups. Has anyone had any experience with the Bruce gorden BLT. It seems to be a nice bike for a good price. Is there anything that compares to it in the same price range?

@ zzOtherlandzz

Thanks for the info. I got your pm but could not respond because I don't have enough posts yet.

You're not going to revolutionize your climbing prowess by BUYING anything, including smoother/thinner tires.
It takes practice and thought to improve, neither of which can be bought.
But, smoother/thinner tires will save you a lot of energy over the course of the day leaving you more energy for climbing.

Another consideration is how long your tires will last. Schwalbe has a reputation for making great touring tires (for 700C or 26" wheels). GeoKrpan is right when he says that buying things won't make you a better climber, but if you're going to be out on the road for hundreds of miles at a time, having durable tires will certainly make your life easier.

And regarding climbing, I have only recently discovered the beauty of dropping down in my granny gear lower than I think I need to be. I remind myself that I'm not out there racing, so as I'm climbing a hill, I want to enjoy the scenery (and have a conversation with someone if they happen to be around).

I could build up a pretty nice Deadeye or Bullseye for less than half of a Fargo or Vaya.

But you really can't. By the time you get rid of the singlespeed wheelset, put a double or triple crank on it, add derailleurs, brifters, road discs, the only thing you really have left is the frameset and some bits on the Dawes you bought. Had you bought the Fargo (or Vaya) frameset instead of the full bike you'd only be a bit more than buying the Dawes and building it up. We won't even go into the fact the Fargo frameset is available in TI :) For comparison's sake since we're having to build the Dawes's after purchase we can't really compare to a built bike and price here.

You're holding a singlespeed bike against a multispeed and saying they're comparable and they're not which is the only issue I really have. Sure there's a price difference at first blush, but if you built either of the Dawes's to the exact same spec as the Fargo I don't think the difference would be all that great. And just as a FYI, I've built two Vaya's from the frameset, I can build a LOT more bike at a lower cost and better spec than Salsa's complete bike specs (and prices). So if we're talking comparisons we really need to figure that also.

And if I have trouble with that Fargo (or Vaya) frame on a tour, I can go to any dealer with a QBP account and get help. Which is only what, most US shops at minimum? That has value also that may or may not negate the difference.

Hi guys. I have been wanting to get a road bike. I was looking at getting a regular road bike until I realized that tour bikes were a whole different machine. I have a budget of $2k but dont neccesarily need to spend it all if I can find a nice bike for less. The only one that I have looked at is the Trek 520. I like the Trek but wanted to see if there were better options for less/more. I would probably only be using the bike to get around town and go out riding on the weekends but I like the idea of being able to load it up and hit the road.

A lot will depend on just what kind of distance you're going to be covering and how light you want to travel. If you're stopping overnight in the kind of places that provide towels and a cooked breakfast it means you can travel much lighter than if you're planning on preparing every single meal you need yourself.

If you swap out the tyres on your mountain bike for something with a less aggressive tread you'll make it much easier to ride on the road. Also check for puncture protection - you obviously want to spend more time riding and less time fixing punctures. I did a trip with a bunch of friends a while back and between 12 of us we had probably half a dozen punctures in the two days of the outward journey (more than one of which was caused by something so small the affected rider nearly missed it when checking their tyre). On the return journey I pulled an inch-long thorn out of my tyre which had failed to penetrate it. For puncture resistance I really recommend Schwalbe Marathon Plus tyres - they are a lot heavier than other tyres but seem to be nigh on bulletproof.

Mountain bikes also have low gearing options which are handy for climbing, you can put a rack on the back to carry panniers and if you've got a suspension fork with a lockout that can also be handy if you are spending any time on less forgiving terrain. Then on smoother tarmac you can lock out the suspension so you're not using up your pedalling power to bounce the fork.

If you buy a touring bike you'll still need to buy the panniers etc to go on it, and I'd reckon that ergonomic grips, bar ends, slicker tyres etc put on your existing MTB will cost you an awful lot less than a whole new bike.

But you really can't. By the time you get rid of the singlespeed wheelset, put a double or triple crank on it, add derailleurs, brifters, road discs, the only thing you really have left is the frameset and some bits on the Dawes you bought. Had you bought the Fargo (or Vaya) frameset instead of the full bike you'd only be a bit more than buying the Dawes and building it up. We won't even go into the fact the Fargo frameset is available in TI :) For comparison's sake since we're having to build the Dawes's after purchase we can't really compare to a built bike and price here.

You're holding a singlespeed bike against a multispeed and saying they're comparable and they're not which is the only issue I really have. Sure there's a price difference at first blush, but if you built either of the Dawes's to the exact same spec as the Fargo I don't think the difference would be all that great. And just as a FYI, I've built two Vaya's from the frameset, I can build a LOT more bike at a lower cost and better spec than Salsa's complete bike specs (and prices). So if we're talking comparisons we really need to figure that also.

And if I have trouble with that Fargo (or Vaya) frame on a tour, I can go to any dealer with a QBP account and get help. Which is only what, most US shops at minimum? That has value also that may or may not negate the difference.

I fully agree and would add that the Deadeye/Bullseye bikes aren't set up for any kind of rack attachment. Sure you could cobble together something that would work but why bother? There are tons of choices out there with all the proper equipment, why mess with adapting something that's substandard?


I ended up doing just that. I put it in low and sat down and just crawled up at about 3-4 mph. How much difference would it have made if I would have had thinner tires? Is it a big advantage over my 2.10's?

Well if you 2.1" tires have knobbies, changing them to a slick tire that a bit thinner would make a world of difference if you are riding on-road. Won't help if you want to ride off-road but...


Never even thought of using my Marlin and I like the sound of it. It saves some serious cash as well. Do you think that I would need to change the gearing at all. I struggled a bit a few weeks ago in Colorado on some hills. They were not real steep like a pass, but were not ant hills either. I never had to stop but damn sure wanted to a few times and if I would have had any gear loaded, I would have had to do the walk of shame.

I don't know that trying to change the Marlin into a road bike will save you anything. You'd need tires, handlebars, brake levers, shifters, racks, probably a new front fork and a few miscellaneous items. It would be a pretty good chunk of change. And your Marlin would be road worth but not off-road worthy. You could swap things back and forth but that's a pain. It'd be about as expensive to just purchase a B.O.B...and I'm not a big fan of trailers:rolleyes:

Rather the try to platypus the Marlin, get a real touring bike. The LHT has all that stuff worked out for you. No messing with trying to adapt something that won't do the job as well as the proper tool.

Alternatively, look into the idea of using the mountain bike to do mountain bike - or at least off-pavement - touring. Revalant Design (http://www.revelatedesigns.com/)makes bags that work very well for turning your mountain bike into an adventure bike. The aforementioned B.O.B. is also an alternative. There are millions of miles of dirt roads across the country that are just begging for exploration. Think a little outside the box.

But you really can't. By the time you get rid of the singlespeed wheelset, put a double or triple crank on it, add derailleurs, brifters, road discs, the only thing you really have left is the frameset and some bits on the Dawes you bought. Had you bought the Fargo (or Vaya) frameset instead of the full bike you'd only be a bit more than buying the Dawes and building it up. We won't even go into the fact the Fargo frameset is available in TI :) For comparison's sake since we're having to build the Dawes's after purchase we can't really compare to a built bike and price here.

You're holding a singlespeed bike against a multispeed and saying they're comparable and they're not which is the only issue I really have. Sure there's a price difference at first blush, but if you built either of the Dawes's to the exact same spec as the Fargo I don't think the difference would be all that great. And just as a FYI, I've built two Vaya's from the frameset, I can build a LOT more bike at a lower cost and better spec than Salsa's complete bike specs (and prices). So if we're talking comparisons we really need to figure that also.

And if I have trouble with that Fargo (or Vaya) frame on a tour, I can go to any dealer with a QBP account and get help. Which is only what, most US shops at minimum? That has value also that may or may not negate the difference.

The Dawes are "gear ready" meaning that the rear hub is a 8/9/10 speed cassette hub so you don't need to "get rid of the singlespeed wheelset". To gear it you'll need a cassette, derailleurs, and shifters. The crank will take two chainrings, enough for me, but if you need more, 3 ring MTB Isis cranks are cheap. Google shopping results has Fargos for $1649, $1270 more than a Bullseye. Half that is $630, more than enough for me to gear a Bullseye.
BTW, Google shopping results has a Fargo Ti frameset for $2000 :(.

I don't know that trying to change the Marlin into a road bike will save you anything. You'd need tires, handlebars, brake levers, shifters, racks, probably a new front fork and a few miscellaneous items. It would be a pretty good chunk of change. And your Marlin would be road worth but not off-road worthy. You could swap things back and forth but that's a pain. It'd be about as expensive to just purchase a B.O.B...and I'm not a big fan of trailers:rolleyes:

Rather the try to platypus the Marlin, get a real touring bike. The LHT has all that stuff worked out for you. No messing with trying to adapt something that won't do the job as well as the proper tool.

I'd disagree that converting the Marlin won't save serious money.

Let's just say that you can get the LHT for $1200 (to be conservative). This is a ready-for-touring 26" (or 700c) bike that doesn't come with any bells and whistles. So anything you'd have to buy for the LHT (racks, panniers, trailers, etc.) you'd also have to buy for the Marlin, so we'll call that a wash.

I'm in the process of converting my flat-handlebar commuter into a drop-handlebar touring/commuter bike. To do that I will need:
- Drop bars (I'm going with generic cheap bars [~$45], but let's say you want to get a Nitto Noodle) = $100
- Bar-end shifters (Ultegra for 8-speed, Dura-Ace for 9- or 10-speed) = $150
- Brake levers (I'm going with Tektro RL-520 since they work with v-brakes) = $30
- New housing and cables (let's just assume that you can't reuse the old ones) = $40
- Handlebar tape (you want the nice stuff) = $30

In his case, he will also have to change his tires, so let's say it costs $100 for Schwalbes.

These estimates are all very conservative (very VERY conservative in some cases), but your total is still just $450. That's a savings of $750 vs. getting the LHT (and $750 is a lot of money for almost everyone). He won't have to change his fork since he said already that he can lock it.

All he would have lost (besides not having two bikes) is the ability to use front panniers (unless he can use low-riders... can't remember who makes the MTB low riders), but I think using a BOB or Burley trailer would be fine (or packing lighter and just using two rear panniers).

He saves $750 and has a bike that can serve as a commuter, a road tourer, and an off road tourer.

This might not be the ideal plan for some people, but I think it's incorrect to say that it doesn't save you any money or that it doesn't work out fine (even splendidly).

I have decided that I do not want to mess with my Marlin. I just dont want to have to move stuff around and swap stuff out. So definantly going to be getting a full on tour bike. I have been looking all over CL and eBay with no luck. Still never heard what you guys think of that Bruce Gorden BLT. I have never even heard of them but the price is right. Would this be about the same as a BD bike?

Google shopping results has Fargos for $1649, $1270 more than a Bullseye. Half that is $630, more than enough


But you're still comparing a built Fargo to a Bullseye you have to build. If you're doing comparisons you're still not building an identical bike, and you're comparing pricing on a factory built bike of one spec as is and bike and sourced parts for a cheap bike, and not building them to an equal spec. It's not a fair comparison, I'm sorry.

I'll grant you that the Bullseye will be cheaper. But you're skewing the delta. Case in point. You don't have drop bars. If you do, you have to trash the Bullseyes brakes as they're not road discs that you'll need with brifters. So your claimed $$ savings just went even less.

I'm not asking the world here. Just that you do an apples to apples comparison rather than making epic claims on how the huge the price delta is when you're refusing to make an EQUAL comparison. I'm not talking two bikes that ride here. I'm talking two bikes with EQUAL configuration.

And tell me, when your Bullseye frame breaks in Timbuktu, what bike shop can call their supplier and have a new Bullseye frame on it's way to you?

I've built two Vaya's. They retail for $1500 built. Retail on the frame is $599 but they can be bought for less. Mine both have 105 front, XT rear, 10 speed. BB7 road discs, one has XT hubs/Sun Rims, Other a set of Bontrager 29'er wheels. Raceface seatposts, Easton bars, WTB tires. Don't have more than $1200 in either. You have a bullseye that you can use the frame, wheelset (arguable if the nutted wheels will clear the derailleur but I'll give you them) Saddle and seatpost. You need to buy 10 speed cassette, FR and RR Derailleurs, cables, drop bars, brifters, road calipers, chain, bartape and a crank. 5700 series 105 parts if you want to match mine. You're going to be lucky to get all that for your $600, so now you're near $1k for a bike that you can't even call the seller on the phone to get resolution to a problem, where I can walk mine into just about any bike store. I'll pay the difference for that alone when I'm on tour thank you.

If you're doing an apples to apples comparison the delta really isn't that much more than the cost of the Bullseye, versus the cost of the Vaya or Fargo FRAME. Couple hundred $ tops.

Would this be about the same as a BD bike?

Better.

I have decided that I do not want to mess with my Marlin. I just dont want to have to move stuff around and swap stuff out. So definantly going to be getting a full on tour bike. I have been looking all over CL and eBay with no luck. Still never heard what you guys think of that Bruce Gorden BLT. I have never even heard of them but the price is right. Would this be about the same as a BD bike?

The BLT is a superior bike to anything that Bikesdirect has. It's superior to the LHT for that matter. If you can afford it's the best way to go. Just remember that's $750 for a frame, fork, headset, stem, front and rear racks (which are worth $350 on their own). His build kit adds another $975. That's $1750 total but that's for a tour ready bike. The LHT is about $1200 but you still have to buy front and rear racks. And it's not nearly the bike the Gordon is.

I have decided that I do not want to mess with my Marlin. I just dont want to have to move stuff around and swap stuff out. So definantly going to be getting a full on tour bike. I have been looking all over CL and eBay with no luck. Still never heard what you guys think of that Bruce Gorden BLT. I have never even heard of them but the price is right. Would this be about the same as a BD bike?

Yep I agree.... If I didn't have the extra bike to convert I would have done the same thing and found a bike instead of swapping stuff all the time..

But you're still comparing a built Fargo to a Bullseye you have to build. If you're doing comparisons you're still not building an identical bike, and you're comparing pricing on a factory built bike of one spec as is and bike and sourced parts for a cheap bike, and not building them to an equal spec. It's not a fair comparison, I'm sorry.

I'll grant you that the Bullseye will be cheaper. But you're skewing the delta. Case in point. You don't have drop bars. If you do, you have to trash the Bullseyes brakes as they're not road discs that you'll need with brifters. So your claimed $$ savings just went even less.

I'm not asking the world here. Just that you do an apples to apples comparison rather than making epic claims on how the huge the price delta is when you're refusing to make an EQUAL comparison. I'm not talking two bikes that ride here. I'm talking two bikes with EQUAL configuration.

And tell me, when your Bullseye frame breaks in Timbuktu, what bike shop can call their supplier and have a new Bullseye frame on it's way to you?

I've built two Vaya's. They retail for $1500 built. Retail on the frame is $599 but they can be bought for less. Mine both have 105 front, XT rear, 10 speed. BB7 road discs, one has XT hubs/Sun Rims, Other a set of Bontrager 29'er wheels. Raceface seatposts, Easton bars, WTB tires. Don't have more than $1200 in either. You have a bullseye that you can use the frame, wheelset (arguable if the nutted wheels will clear the derailleur but I'll give you them) Saddle and seatpost. You need to buy 10 speed cassette, FR and RR Derailleurs, cables, drop bars, brifters, road calipers, chain, bartape and a crank. 5700 series 105 parts if you want to match mine. You're going to be lucky to get all that for your $600, so now you're near $1k for a bike that you can't even call the seller on the phone to get resolution to a problem, where I can walk mine into just about any bike store. I'll pay the difference for that alone when I'm on tour thank you.

If you're doing an apples to apples comparison the delta really isn't that much more than the cost of the Bullseye, versus the cost of the Vaya or Fargo FRAME. Couple hundred $ tops.

Building a bike costs me nothing, I do the work.

I don't use "brifters" on a bike that I ride on the dirt, too vulnerable. I DO have drop bars. Tektro makes linear pull road brake levers so I don't to "have to trash the Bullseyes brakes".

The Bullseye frame and fork are very well made. I trust it not to break, more than my much more expensive Jamis Exile. If the Bullseye was available when I bought the Exile I wouldn't have bought the Exile and saved a wad. By the same token, I wouldn't buy a Fargo.

BTW, the derailleur DOES clear the wheel nuts, and, I notice that the Fargo comes with a 2x10 drivetrain.

I'm nowhere near $1k.

　

　

　

　

　


　

　

I'm nowhere near $1k.



But you haven't turned the Bullseye into the equivalent bike which is what you've claimed your comparison is based on, and you've avoided all requests to do so. All you have is a *different* bike. Your initial statement IIRC was " you have essentially the same thing" If that means a bike with two wheels you're right. Beyond that you've missed the "same thing" part.

Equivalent to me saying "I can buy a Wal-Mart bike and save TONS over a Bullseye and have the same thing"

But you haven't turned the Bullseye into the equivalent bike which is what you've claimed your comparison is based on, and you've avoided all requests to do so. All you have is a *different* bike. Your initial statement IIRC was " you have essentially the same thing" If that means a bike with two wheels you're right. Beyond that you've missed the "same thing" part.
Equivalent to me saying "I can buy a Wal-Mart bike and save TONS over a Bullseye and have the same thing"

Whatever. I built a bike I can tour on, on or off road. It does that beautifully.

The BLT is a superior bike to anything that Bikesdirect has. It's superior to the LHT for that matter. If you can afford it's the best way to go. Just remember that's $750 for a frame, fork, headset, stem, front and rear racks (which are worth $350 on their own). His build kit adds another $975. That's $1750 total but that's for a tour ready bike. The LHT is about $1200 but you still have to buy front and rear racks. And it's not nearly the bike the Gordon is.

ok, so I am almost sold on the BLT, I really like the looks of it and it seems to get good reviews. How does the Trek 520 compare to this. I know that it will not come with a front rack and I have heard that the rear rack is junk but I guess I could buy new racks and still be in the same range as the blt. I have also heard that I would need to change the gearing on the 520 but doubt that I would for a long while because it is really flat here. what do you guys think?

ok, so I am almost sold on the BLT, I really like the looks of it and it seems to get good reviews. How does the Trek 520 compare to this. I know that it will not come with a front rack and I have heard that the rear rack is junk but I guess I could buy new racks and still be in the same range as the blt. I have also heard that I would need to change the gearing on the 520 but doubt that I would for a long while because it is really flat here. what do you guys think?

If I were starting from scratch with your budget, I'd have to go with the BLT. Bruce Gordon has long been respected for his approach WRT touring bike design.

Brad

ok, so I am almost sold on the BLT, I really like the looks of it and it seems to get good reviews. How does the Trek 520 compare to this. I know that it will not come with a front rack and I have heard that the rear rack is junk but I guess I could buy new racks and still be in the same range as the blt. I have also heard that I would need to change the gearing on the 520 but doubt that I would for a long while because it is really flat here. what do you guys think?

The 520 has some warts. Gearing is okay...now. It does have chainstays that are on the short side for a touring bike. The rear rack is okay for everyday use but subpar for a good touring rack. At $1500 is less expensive then the Gordon but once you put equivalent racks on the bike, you'd be pushing the price of the Gordon.

The Gordon on the other hand is legendary. Not many people have one. Given the choice, I'd go with the Gordon.

I have been the pleased rider of a Bruce Gordon RNR for over twenty years. The design is the same as the BLT. The only limitation compared to the Fargo is maximum tire size. My max with full fenders is 1.75" or 2.0 w/o fenders. I tour on and off pavement and rode the Divide Ride with it. The racks front and rear are well worth the price and a real deal in the BLT package.

The Gordon on the other hand is legendary. Not many people have one. Given the choice, I'd go with the Gordon.

Not only is he legendary, he's also pretty cool; all it takes is one visit to his 'Another Big Stinkin' Handbuilt Whoop-de-Doo' (http://brucegordoncycles.blogspot.com/2011/05/abshw-2011.html)to figure that out.

Not only is he legendary, he's also pretty cool; all it takes is one visit to his 'Another Big Stinkin' Handbuilt Whoop-de-Doo' (http://brucegordoncycles.blogspot.com/2011/05/abshw-2011.html)to figure that out.

I am really liking the bruce gorden but if I did decide to go for a entry level bike, what do you guys think of the Novara Safari or maybe the randonee? I really like the look of the safari and like the bars and grip shifters. I have never had any experience with rei and dont even have a dealer, should I take that into account?

k_allison510, Well, it may be a moot point WRT the BLT as BG has stopped importing them and when the inventory is sold, that's it.

Another possibility: http://www.raleighusa.com/bikes/steel-road/sojourn-11/ .

Brad

k_allison510, Well, it may be a moot point WRT the BLT as BG has stopped importing them and when the inventory is sold, that's it.

Another possibility: http://www.raleighusa.com/bikes/steel-road/sojourn-11/ .

Brad

Thanks Brad, I love the look of that as well. The only problem is I dont have a dealer here in Amarillo. Do you know what the MSRP of that Sojourn is? I like the looks of the Safari as well, but the bars are what really caught my eye on it, and the grip shifters are appealing as well. I noticed that REI sells some Raleigh bikes but not the sojourn. How do these 2 bikes compare?

I am really liking the bruce gorden but if I did decide to go for a entry level bike, what do you guys think of the Novara Safari or maybe the randonee? I really like the look of the safari and like the bars and grip shifters. I have never had any experience with rei and dont even have a dealer, should I take that into account?

I'd rank the bikes this way Gordon BLT>>>>>Surly LHT>Trek>Safari>Randonee>Sojourn.

Down to the nitty. If you can swing the Gordon now, it'll be a bike that will provide you touring pleasure for 20+ years (one of the problems with touring bikes:rolleyes:). The other bikes will last as long (again, the problem with touring bikes) but they won't have the style of the Gordon. And you won't be one of the herd

The LHT is probably the best production touring bike around. It's not terribly expensive. It's well designed and shows some real thought about what a touring cyclist needs in terms of ride geometry, components and braze-ons. You can't go wrong with it and you instantly join a club of literally million of LHT owners. And advantage of the LHT is you can buy a frame and build the bike as you want it. It's not cheap but you get what you want to ride that way.

The Trek is almost as good as the LHT. If it had the length of stay that the LHT had (longer chainstays means less heel/bag interference) and cost about the same as the LHT, I'd put it on the same level. It's close. Unfortunately, the bike costs around $400 more than the LHT and it's not any better than the LHT. That's a lot to pay for a Trek decal.

The Safari and Randonee are okay bikes. Both have more warts than the Trek, however. The Safari is portly. The LHT isn't a lightweight but the Safari is a chunk! They say it weighs 30 lbs but the ones I've hefted in the store feel a lot heavier. The Randonee is a little lighter but it has short stays which means if you have medium to large feet you'll clip the bags on each rotation or you have to cantilever the bags off the back of the bike which can influence handling. For the same price (or less) you can get an LHT.

Finally the Sojourn. It was a nice try. Similar to the Trek but it makes the Safari feel light:eek: It's not a chunk, it's the whole damned boulder! I don't know what makes the bike so heavy but it is. And the price is similar to the LHT. Too pricey for a bike that's not as good.

k_allison510, Well, it may be a moot point WRT the BLT as BG has stopped importing them and when the inventory is sold, that's it.
Brad

Well Not Exactly. We are discontinuing the BLT's from Taiwan - but, we are still building Frames in the USA - just as we have been doing for the past 35 years.
We are going back to our roots - MAKING STUFF IN THE USA

We are out of 2 sizes of the BLT's - but we still have 39cm, 52cm, and 56cm.
I know the sizes seem small - but they are sloping top tubes - so, a 56cm frame would be a 61.3cm frame center to center if it had a level top tube and has a 58.5cm top tube and a 12cm stem. http://www.bgcycles.com/blt.html
Any questions - feel free to give me a call (707) 762-5601

Regards,
Bruce Gordon
http://www.brucegordoncycles.blogspot.com/