Cyclist beaten in Campbell CA

[scarry]

This story out to make your blood boil.
http://www.pbase.com/bohebe/campbell_reporter

[slvoid]

A wonder if it would've mattered had either one of them been packing...

http://jamesbond007.net/Images/P99.jpg

[vincenzosi]

WTF!!? I swear... Sometimes I want to carry my security baton in my saddle bag and the second one of these *******s start, put it through their window. Why do drivers have this unsatisfiable urge to taunt cyclists!?

Jeebus.

[larue]

that was a really good read, thanks for the link.

glad he was okay after the beating, that is why I try not to provoke drivers any more than they already are. it's a shame they never caught the two that assaulted him.

[TT Cyclist]

Until some of these dum ass closed eye judges start doing there job we all have a problem. What do these guys have to afraid of?? A slap of the hand? I bet the Police have an undercover officer riding in the area to see if these guys come around again. Dreaming right? I don't think it's really motorist we have the problem with. Look at the element of the people in the cars causing the problem and that says it all. Think about it, there have been Police officers murdered in the line of duty and these dirt bags still come up for perole. Judges: Where are your heads?????
There is no respect for life period. These guys had a lot of class. They are only brave when they are in groups. I carry mace for dogs and if there was more than one person I had to deal with I would not hestiate to use it.
Happy and safe riding to all!

[vincenzosi]

You know what it is? Cyclists are usually smaller guys, dress "funny," and are on bikes, which is a leverage disadvantage. I'd love to see one of these little bad asses pull up next to some big fat guy on a Harley and even do anything but roll up the windows and lock the doors.

We're easy targets folks. Bottom line.

[genec]

You know what it is? Cyclists are usually smaller guys, dress "funny," and are on bikes, which is a leverage disadvantage. I'd love to see one of these little bad asses pull up next to some big fat guy on a Harley and even do anything but roll up the windows and lock the doors.

We're easy targets folks. Bottom line.

Maybe it's time to start riding with a gun in a saddle holster.

Read the article and it was right on. Here in San Diego we have had issues with kids (~20 year olds) that have done things like this "just for kicks;" recently a woman was badly hurt when these young thugs drove an open car door into her while she was riding slowly up a long hill. No reason given, no reason could ever be good enough.

My take on the whole thing is that larger vehicles and more people have made the roads even more crowded then ever, and this frustration has to be vented somewhere... couple that with Madison Avenue ads that tout cars as "sex symbols" and "escape vehicles" and all sorts of nonsense, where frankly, no matter how luxurious the leather seating, an auto is nothing more than a box with wheels... and if you paid over 20K for it, you deserve what you did to yourself.

I think the dumbest thing on the road these days (that I see all too often) is the H2. They drive around in this area in a rather affluent part of town... here is an oversize, overpriced vehicle, that gets around 12MPG, that doesn't seat even 6 adults comfortably and is "made" for off road, and I have yet to see a single one with even a single brush scratch. Yet this is current vehicle mentality of the US driver. D'OH!

Now as to what should be done... how about PSAs that educate drivers on "share the road." This should be done to emphasize not only that the road is to be shared with bikes, but also pedestrians, and other cars... friendly driving is something that has long been ignored. Courtesy and respect for fellow road users needs to drummed back into the drivers' heads. Period.

Got manners... ?

[BeTheChange]

You know what it is? Cyclists are usually smaller guys, dress "funny," and are on bikes, which is a leverage disadvantage. I'd love to see one of these little bad asses pull up next to some big fat guy on a Harley and even do anything but roll up the windows and lock the doors.

We're easy targets folks. Bottom line.

I think that is exactly right. Last time some kids yelled at me and I came up to them at the light they were all sorry. I guess everyone looks small from inside a car... untill they see me next to their car. I was thinking the motorcyclists don't catch crap becasue there are some badassed ones of them. I think we just need some rouge bike gangs to ride around and wait for people to mess with them then they can bring the ruckus and we'll all get some more respect.

One thing I know, the next person who yells at me and I see they are drinking and driving I'm going to destroy them and their car. If they call the cops they get a drunk driving charge anyways. Skrew em.

[vincenzosi]

Amen, Bethechange. I couldn't agree more if I wrote it myself.

[vincenzosi]

A wonder if it would've mattered had either one of them been packing...

http://jamesbond007.net/Images/P99.jpg

I have a feeling that the ones packing woulda been the cagers and then the guys really woulda been screwed.

[Laika]

This story out to make your blood boil.


Yes it does.

[operator]

A wonder if it would've mattered had either one of them been packing...

http://jamesbond007.net/Images/P99.jpg

Especially if they were packing one of these

http://search.eb.com/normandy/art/obazook001p1.jpg

Too bad we aren't allowed to carry here. Even if we wanted to.

[Laika]

Especially if they were packing one of these

http://search.eb.com/normandy/art/obazook001p1.jpg

Too bad we aren't allowed to carry here. Even if we wanted to.

I imagine the recoil from that would be pretty tough to counter if yuu were firing while riding. You'd definitely want to dismount first. Definitely.

[Seeker]

I imagine the recoil from that would be pretty tough to counter if yuu were firing while riding. You'd definitely want to dismount first. Definitely.


Actually since the back blast encounters no resistance there is no recoil. However you do NOT want to fire during a group ride when there are riders behind you. Can you say EXTRA CRISPY?

[scarry]

Yes it does.

And folks wonder why we 'Mass' every month. And I don't buy the argument that these crimes of violence are incited by CM either. These idiots problably never heard of CM. But I'm sure they would of behaved better if they were surrounded by 100 bikes.

[G4teamG]

Two words...Pepper Spray. Oh, and a cell phone with photo capabilities. Last time I had someone try something I just pulled up to their window and snapped a picture of them. Chilled them out real quick...

['nother]

This story out to make your blood boil.
http://www.pbase.com/bohebe/campbell_reporter

You bet it does . . . I ride almost all of the streets mentioned in that article, on a daily basis. Frightening!

[slvoid]

Actually since the back blast encounters no resistance there is no recoil. However you do NOT want to fire during a group ride when there are riders behind you. Can you say EXTRA CRISPY?

What about one of these?
http://www.hkpro.com/oicwsoldier.jpg

[catatonic]

hmm, you would think his parter would have taken the car description, and made SURE it showed up in every newspaper in the area. Also the plate number would help...if the cops can't get them with that...then the cops need to get back to training.

[Stregone]

Actually since the back blast encounters no resistance there is no recoil.

It is no coincidence that they are called recoilless rifles ;)

[AndrewP]

They are not rifled - that is why they are called rocket launchers.

[SteveE]

hmm, you would think his parter would have taken the car description, and made SURE it showed up in every newspaper in the area. Also the plate number would help...if the cops can't get them with that...then the cops need to get back to training.Actually, they did have a description of the car and located the female driver of the car and her female companion (the two men who were the actual assailants fled the scene). The two women (both minors) were unwilling to provide the identities of the assailants. According to the police, there was no legal pressure they could bring to bear on the two girls. Also, the local cycling community worked hard to get this story out to the media.

[catatonic]

You would thin kif they drove the assailants, that they are now accessories to asault and battery.

[SteveE]

You would thin kif they drove the assailants, that they are now accessories to asault and battery.That's what we all thought. But evidently, that is not the case. The reason given by the police is that after the assault the two men fled on foot and the women did not drive them from the scene. If the men had jumped back in the car and the woman drove off with the it would have been a different story.

[HereNT]

That would be my opinion - offer them a plea on that and they'll probably start talking real quick.

[collegeskier]

Actually, they did have a description of the car and located the female driver of the car and her female companion (the two men who were the actual assailants fled the scene). The two women (both minors) were unwilling to provide the identities of the assailants. According to the police, there was no legal pressure they could bring to bear on the two girls. Also, the local cycling community worked hard to get this story out to the media.

Basically the cops don't want to do anything. If they really wanted to the would charge the two men with attempted murder and the girls with accessories, which surprise surprise I would think they would roll over pretty quick especially when the lawyer fees start rolling in. Also the door opening is a crime and the owner of the car would be responsible. If the police cared they would have the people of the driver or owner of the car in jail.

[SteveE]

I know that as of two weeks ago, the case was still open and there was a "Crime Stoppers" report on the local radio asking for additional witnesses and offering a $1,000 reward.

[karmical]

my problem is that it seems as if 98% of the stories like this all happen when the cyclist, after the initial contact, goes up and re-engages the confrontation...then when they get the crap beat out of them, they want to cry about it....

i dunno, no punk in their late teens to early 20's is going to kick my a** while my boy uses his (or her) phone...but thats another story all together...

back on point...in the 10 years i as a person of color, lived and rode in the south, i was buzzed, had beer bottles, cans, sticks and other stuff thrown at me from passing traffic, i never once tried to engage the idiots that did this...its not turning the other cheek, but more so understanding the mentality of the motorist that would carry on in such a manner...and its just not worth it, to me anyway....

[Seeker]

What about one of these?
http://www.hkpro.com/oicwsoldier.jpg

Ahh, one of the new assault rifles with the 20 mm genade launcher that can be used direct fire and laser sights that can be used to paint targets. Lemme have that sucka. I could do some serious dammage wid dat.

[erraticrider]

The answer is a palestinian suicide bomber pack -- mutually assured destruction! As soon as the idiot kids realize that they kick you or hit you in the wrong place and the palestinian suicide bomber pack goes off taking everyone out within ten feet, they will back of and start running away. Its better than packing a gun, because a gun can be grabbed a way from you and used against you with no reprecusions (except legal) to the assailant.

[Roughstuff]

Until some of these dum ass closed eye judges start doing there job we all have a problem. What do these guys have to afraid of?? A slap of the hand? I bet the Police have an undercover officer riding in the area to see if these guys come around again. Dreaming right? I don't think it's really motorist we have the problem with. Look at the element of the people in the cars causing the problem and that says it all. Think about it, there have been Police officers murdered in the line of duty and these dirt bags still come up for perole. Judges: Where are your heads?????
There is no respect for life period. These guys had a lot of class. They are only brave when they are in groups. I carry mace for dogs and if there was more than one person I had to deal with I would not hestiate to use it.
Happy and safe riding to all!

A couple good points. Yes...until judges find themselves getting killed, raped, and attacked like the rest of us citizens, dumb asses they will remain.

Definitely true about being brave only in groups. When I respond to this kind of provocation-- which by the way is not very often-- an important step to take is to break up the psychology of the "group." I always target one individual; whoever the unlucky soul may be. See if his (or her..lets not be sexist here) 'brave buddies' come to his aid. You'd be amazed at how often they run and leave them in the lurch, too.

If you are being hassled by a car, do something to make the car unquestionably recognizable for a short time:smash a window for example, if you can. I never have had to do this, but i've had the rock in my hand at the ready a couple times.

roughstuff

[BeTheChange]

Two words...Pepper Spray. Oh, and a cell phone with photo capabilities. Last time I had someone try something I just pulled up to their window and snapped a picture of them. Chilled them out real quick...

Perfect Idea! I wasn't going to spend more for a camera phone when my 2 year contract is up (I don't have a land line). But now I'm definately getting a camera phone just for this purpose. Also you can get pics of the liscence plate. What an awsome Idea. Thanks. Can you say "evidence"?

[ctyler]

That's what we all thought. But evidently, that is not the case. The reason given by the police is that after the assault the two men fled on foot and the women did not drive them from the scene. If the men had jumped back in the car and the woman drove off with the it would have been a different story.

Man is this bull****. These two women were a part of the assault. They were there and the men were with them. Throw their ass in jail, at least get them before a judge and if they don't provide the names, jail them for contempt and let them sit until they fork over the names.

Is it any wonder some of us want to start carrying guns?

[nycm'er]

Cabbies and Tourist drivers wise up real quick when they think you are capturing their faces and numbers. Just pretending can level the battleground for a bike vs car incident. I have to take issue with what Genec said about H2s being unscratched, and never taken offroad etc: I had never seen a scratched H2 either till I watched my key scratch the length of one in NYC. It was parked infront of a bar I had been sitting in too long, I am not proud of it, but to quote the Vice President "it was long overdue".

[operator]

Uh... you keyed someones car for no reason...?

[genec]

I have to take issue with what Genec said about H2s being unscratched, and never taken offroad etc: I had never seen a scratched H2 either till I watched my key scratch the length of one in NYC. It was parked infront of a bar I had been sitting in too long, I am not proud of it, but to quote the Vice President "it was long overdue".

Take issue with it??? Sounds like you joined right in... LOL Can't condone the "keying," but can indeed understand the feeling.

Oddly enough though, that H2 still has not been off road, thus proving that some dope spend enough money for two "normal" vehicles for no apparent reason.

H2s are nothing more then excessive conspicuous consumption in action... and the real reason for the war in Iraq.

[slvoid]

Man is this bull****. These two women were a part of the assault. They were there and the men were with them. Throw their ass in jail, at least get them before a judge and if they don't provide the names, jail them for contempt and let them sit until they fork over the names.

Is it any wonder some of us want to start carrying guns?

So you're saying if you were driving and at a stop light, your friend jumps out and starts wailing on a pedestrian, that you should automatically become part of the assult and be charged too?

[bac]

Actually, they did have a description of the car and located the female driver of the car and her female companion (the two men who were the actual assailants fled the scene). The two women (both minors) were unwilling to provide the identities of the assailants. According to the police, there was no legal pressure they could bring to bear on the two girls. Also, the local cycling community worked hard to get this story out to the media.

So ................ two women in the same car as these criminals @ the very lease witness the event. Now, the police can't put any legal pressure on them to finger the criminals? As bad as it sounds, it may be time for the community (probably the cycling community, as others simply will not care) to pressure them into talking. If one of those attacked was my friend or family, I would find a way to make them talk. I would do whatever it takes to find these scum-bags.

[bac]

So you're saying if you were driving and at a stop light, your friend jumps out and starts wailing on a pedestrian, that you should automatically become part of the assult and be charged too?

No, but you should have to give up the identity of the scum-bag to the police!

[slvoid]

No, but you should have to give up the identity of the scum-bag to the police!

No one's saying they shouldn't. But the previous poster said they should be jailed, etc, whatnot.
You walk a fine hairy line when you get into that cause what happens when the RIAA and MPAA decides that since they can rightfully get those scumbags with MP3 or DIVX players, they would go after their friends and family and intimidate them to give up the identify of the "file sharers"?
It sets a dangerous precedence.

Then again there's also the severity of it. If someone is physically in danger, attacked, killed, etc, you have a responsibility. I believe that's in the law and it is (or should be) illegal to knowingly harbor a criminal wether it be physically or otherwise; which is what these girls are doing. I'm not too fond of human life and if I were his friend, I certainly would've shot out the car's tires and at least put a round or two into the assialiant's lower bodies.

[bac]

No one's saying they shouldn't. But the previous poster said they should be jailed, etc, whatnot.
You walk a fine hairy line when you get into that cause what happens when the RIAA and MPAA decides that since they can rightfully get those scumbags with MP3 or DIVX players, they would go after their friends and family and intimidate them to give up the identify of the "file sharers"?
It sets a dangerous precedence.

Sorry, my bad for not reading the previous post!

Anywho, that precedence has already been set to some degree. In most every situation of interrogation, the police can legally lie, and deceive you in order to solicit information. It happens in frequency on a daily basis. Detectives are trained on this technique.

[webist]

This story makes me happy that I live where I do. While motorist-cyclist incidents are not entirely unheard of here, they are normally genuine accidents rather than "rage" incidents. Occasionally, I will hear someone yell an insult of some sort. In those instances, I am probably a target of opportunity only, and not necessarily a victim of anti-cyclist bias. A couple of years ago we had an incident of a drive-by shooting of a cyclist by kids on drugs. Even in that incident though, it is just as likely they would have shot at a pedestrian had one been available.

Sometimes I wonder whether we are simply becoming a ruder society as we eschew moral instruction, cater to a notion of individual self esteem and assign responsibility for a person's behavior to entities other than individual human beings.

[Roughstuff]

Two words...Pepper Spray. Oh, and a cell phone with photo capabilities. Last time I had someone try something I just pulled up to their window and snapped a picture of them. Chilled them out real quick...


Sheesh...I forgot completely about that, and how effective it was. I snapped a picture of some guys in Iran and got their plate number, too...gave it to a local police station about 5 minutes later, when I happened to run into a local CYCLING GROUP who was riding along that day! I can't imagine wanting to hassle with their police.....

roughstuff

[nycm'er]

i keyed an H2 for no reason, yes and I said I was not proud of it. But in the back of my head I keyed it just for its being there, it's tax exemption, it's pathetic fuel consumption, its size, its consumerist uselessness, and the idea that it really isnt a Hummer, its an H2, a Yukon chassis. (Check out www.fuh2.com)This is off the thread and that is my fault.

[ctyler]

So you're saying if you were driving and at a stop light, your friend jumps out and starts wailing on a pedestrian, that you should automatically become part of the assult and be charged too?

They are material witnesses to a crime! I say hold them until they give up the names. You can also make the case that they helped. After all, the two perps were in their car.

[ctyler]

i keyed an H2 for no reason, yes and I said I was not proud of it. But in the back of my head I keyed it just for its being there, it's tax exemption, it's pathetic fuel consumption, its size, its consumerist uselessness, and the idea that it really isnt a Hummer, its an H2, a Yukon chassis. (Check out www.fuh2.com)This is off the thread and that is my fault.


I've always wanted to do that. It makes me sick when I see some s*** h*** driving an H2.

[collegeskier]

They are material witnesses to a crime! I say hold them until they give up the names. You can also make the case that they helped. After all, the two perps were in their car.

Another option, although I agree with the material witness thing is that the car was used in the comminsioning of a crime. It would have evidence of the people and the door opening could be considered part of the assualt, then the police can just impound the car as evidence. I would have turned in my friends already but you impound my car or bike I would be even more likely to roll.

[Merryish]

my problem is that it seems as if 98% of the stories like this all happen when the cyclist, after the initial contact, goes up and re-engages the confrontation

That's the point in the story where I always cringe, too. Maybe I'm just possessed of an especially well-developed sense of self-preservation (read as: chicken). Why, why, why do some cyclists go back??? I put my sacred skin above my sacred cyclist's honor every single time. I'm not saying it's the cyclist's fault when something like this happens - anything but! I'm just saying - there are ways to reduce the risk, and one of the simplest of those ways is backing down and backing off.

I do think there's a chance that certain, uh, historically under-represented? classes of people may be more aware of the dangers of engaging with this kind of rabble than others. Speaking in my capacity as a female type person, veteran of many a self-defense class since I moved to the Big City alone, I've never felt any need or desire to find out what some idiot's problem is when he's yelling at me from his car. I mean -- he's yelling at me from his car! What more do I need to know? He's already quite obviously a few french fries short of a happy meal, and I for one don't relish the thought of betting my safety on his not having a fist or a baseball bat or a gun with my name on it on his front seat.

My philosophy is: Me & my tiny bike vs. Him & his H2 can only have one very unpleasant outcome, of which I want no part.

[Dchiefransom]

Actually, they did have a description of the car and located the female driver of the car and her female companion (the two men who were the actual assailants fled the scene). The two women (both minors) were unwilling to provide the identities of the assailants. According to the police, there was no legal pressure they could bring to bear on the two girls. Also, the local cycling community worked hard to get this story out to the media.

I believe that is only criminally. Civilly, I do believe the driver of the car is responsible for anything that happens on the road. It would be nice to find out that the cyclist could soak the girl and her parents for a tidy sum.
Although, since she stopped the car, facilitating the assault, I DO believe they could bring charges if they wanted to.

[catatonic]

well she was there and apparently took the assilants away from the scene....Something sounds fishy onthe police's side. again...one would think that a person who helped the assailants leave the scene of a crime is an accomnplice...but maybe california law is that backwards...