Foo - Jetta doesn't start after visiting gas station.

I'm trying to figure out why a '99 Jetta wouldn't start after it's visited a gas station and had its tank filled. This happens every time it fills up, and at random intervals after that. What happens is I'll try to start it, and it'll crank but but not start. If I depress the gas pedal it tends to help, but the engine dies if I let my foot off the gas. I have to hold the gas pedal to keep the engine operating at the lowest speed that isn't obnoxiously loud. If I hold it long enough I can let my foot off the gas and the car runs well.

I haven't really worked on VW's, is there something I should be looking for here? It seems like a normal tune up isn't in order because usually the car starts right up. Being able to press the gas pedal makes me wonder if this is an airflow issue, but I'm unsure of which parts control that on this car.

Maybe clean/replace the air intake if that hasn't been done lately. Dirty fuel injectors or fuel filter?

Maybe clean/replace the air intake if that hasn't been done lately. Dirty fuel injectors or fuel filter?

+1

I'll asume it fuel injected as opposed to carburated? (Rube made up a new word here...lol)

I had a 1994 honda that was kinda slow @ rest and would shutdown occasionally. I fixed it by cranking up the accelerator cable at the carburetor. Maybe it's expressed differently on real mechanical terms but in techie, that what I did.

Man, it is clearly time to give that Jetta away to someone who will rice it out.

There is also a module(having brain fart,can' remember the name) upstream of the air filter just after the start of the air intake that maybe part of the problem, measures the air flow.

I kind of remember this being brought up on Car Talk one day. The answer involved they all do that, as well as the fix. Not that I can remember what they did to fix it.

There is also a module(having brain fart,can' remember the name) upstream of the air filter just after the start of the air intake that maybe part of the problem, measures the air flow.
mass air flow sensor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_airflow_sensor) :)

I thought we already covered the girlfriends car issue months ago?Share the "beater Honda"till your first Christmas bonus comes through.

I suggested previously (now that you're employed) to find a girlfriend with a better car and taste in boyfriends.

You know, maybe Ruben can fix this. Send the Jetta to him and borrow his Hyundai for a while.

I kind of remember this being brought up on Car Talk one day. The answer involved they all do that, as well as the fix. Not that I can remember what they did to fix it.
Yes, I heard that episode, too. I thought the original post sounded oddly familiar. I agree that they said "they all do that" and I don't remember the fix, either.

Search the Googles and see what you find!

Last post: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4147330-Car-won-t-start-after-I-get-gas.-Help-!

Halfway down: Evap purge valve stuck: http://community.cartalk.com/discussion/2130864/car-wont-start-after-getting-gas/p1

Yet another vote for the purge valve: http://jettajunkie.com/vw-jetta/showthread.php?6223-wont-start-after-putting-gas-in

And again: http://community.cartalk.com/discussion/2276718/2006-jetta-wont-start-after-getting-gas/p1

You get the idea. :D

My checklist: First, have the fuel pressure checked. Hard starts that are unpredictable are a sure sign of a bad fuel pump. If you have low fuel pressure, the possible causes are bad pump, bad pump relay, bad fuel filter, or any combination of the three.

If you have good fuel pressure as a constant, then it's very likely the mass air sensor or the fuel flow/pressure sensor, or both. If it's either of those sensors, though, you will be getting codes and the check engine light will be on.

Could be the Idle Air Control failing, the IAC takes the place of the old idle screw on a carb, it essentially is the air bleed past the throttle blade.

Yes, I heard that episode, too. I thought the original post sounded oddly familiar. I agree that they said "they all do that" and I don't remember the fix, either.

Search the Googles and see what you find!

Last post: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4147330-Car-won-t-start-after-I-get-gas.-Help-!

Halfway down: Evap purge valve stuck: http://community.cartalk.com/discussion/2130864/car-wont-start-after-getting-gas/p1

Yet another vote for the purge valve: http://jettajunkie.com/vw-jetta/showthread.php?6223-wont-start-after-putting-gas-in

And again: http://community.cartalk.com/discussion/2276718/2006-jetta-wont-start-after-getting-gas/p1

You get the idea. :D

I've seen those. I opted to make a new thread because the symptoms don't exactly match the ones I've described.

The IACV would have been my first guess if I were fixing my Honda.

The fuel pressure is a great idea -- I should have thought of this! The car never hesitates, bogs, or in any way performs poorly once it's started and actually driving; my experience is that fuel pumps usually cause poor driving performance all together.

The check engine was on, and my hope was that the light may be related to the problem (bad sensor), but I got it scanned at Autozone and they were all old codes. Cleared the codes and the light isn't on. I told the guy at Autozone about the car's problem and he said "it's normal." Right. :rolleyes:


I'm not too familiar with OBDII. If there is low fuel pressure, will the CEL throw a code that indicates this?

What Tom said, but DO NOT use the RubenX (TM) Method of unplugin' the fuel hose to see if gasoline comes out....just saying.

Does the car make wakka wakka puff puff sounds?

If it's the fuel pump and you change it out, change the fuel filter at the same time.One reason pumps fail is that they're working to hard to pump fuel through an old clogged filter. Besides the filter is reasonably cheap to change much less than another fuel pump.

Thanks, Black_box, that is the name I couldn't recall.

Long shot here, if it happens mostly (or only) when the car is cold it could be the gasket between the carb and the air filter is perished. I had that problem on an old Honda and it took three trips to the dealer for them to fail to fix it (it happened right after they allegedly serviced it, so I wasn't happy) and in the end a friend who knew a bit about engines took a look and fixed it within 5 minutes.

have you by chance checked out the owner's club forums for jettas?
they usually have a list of problems and fixes for the various models.


I know my 2000 nissan maxima has a mass air flow sensor problem that I only get when it's cold. Basically I know the MAF sensor is clogged with carbon and it's a common problem for that year's model.

Take off the gas cap. Does it start now?

Perhaps the tank isn't vented well and when you fill up there is to little air to allow the gas to be drawn into the pump.

After a few miles there would be enough air to allow said suction.

Take off the gas cap. Jam a lit flare in there.

This

This

Not even Ruben would do that, and he's on a first name basis with the Fire Department.

Not even Ruben would do that, and he's on a first name basis with the Fire Department.
your username precludes you from answering questions about all cars other than the Flintstonemobile. just sayin'

+1

I'll asume it fuel injected as opposed to carburated? (Rube made up a new word here...lol)

I had a 1994 honda that was kinda slow @ rest and would shutdown occasionally. I fixed it by cranking up the accelerator cable at the carburetor. Maybe it's expressed differently on real mechanical terms but in techie, that what I did.

Uhhh Ruben? Ummm no. We don't need no more wacka wacka puff puff choke pop dies oh crap call the fire dept please.


Man, it is clearly time to give that Jetta away to someone who will rice it out.

Can't rice out a German.

Can't rice out a German.

Yeah, tell taht to the guy in Lewisville Texas rocking a Jetta that is lowered, blacked out and covered in Japanese lettering, decals, stickers, etc. I think the theme of the car was "People who America beat in WWII." Seriously.

Can't rice out a German.

Whatever the term is for the pimped-out Jettas running about the streets. You know what I mean.

Cause and effect - gas station = won't start. Simple solution, don't take it to the gas station.

1) Or, does it not start because the tank is full? (test that by just filling the tank half full and see if it starts)

2) Is it because the engine is already warm when trying to restart? (easy to test - drive somewhere, turn off engine, wait 5 minutes and try to start)

3) Or, maybe the act of adding gas stirs up some gunk in the fuel system?

Drive the p.o.s. back to Mexico and see if the mechanic will warranty his work.

Cause and effect - gas station = won't start. Simple solution, don't take it to the gas station.

1) Or, does it not start because the tank is full? (test that by just filling the tank half full and see if it starts)

2) Is it because the engine is already warm when trying to restart? (easy to test - drive somewhere, turn off engine, wait 5 minutes and try to start)

3) Or, maybe the act of adding gas stirs up some gunk in the fuel system?

(4) Her ex-boyfriend did a wiz fill-up into the gas filler port of the car.

My Passat wagon had exactly the same problem. Check the Evap Purge Valve. I'm surprised you don't have a check engine light. It is a Jetta after all ;-)

+1

I'll asume it fuel injected as opposed to carburated? (Rube made up a new word here...lol)

Carburated is a word you don't hear much anymore, but used to be pretty common. Now get off my lawn!

Fuel pump.

Couch

I say it is the muffler bearings.

Blinker fluid!

My Passat wagon had exactly the same problem. Check the Evap Purge Valve. I'm surprised you don't have a check engine light. It is a Jetta after all ;-)

I say over filling the tank, getting raw fuel in the vapor canister. New cars, injected need an
air space in the tank for the emissions system to operate properly.
Stop filling the tank when the nozzle clicks off.

Or your flux capacitor is shot. Check voltage, should be about 1.7899 million. Give ro
take a .0000000001 volt.

Fuel tank vent valve.

Could be the Idle Air Control failing, the IAC takes the place of the old idle screw on a carb, it essentially is the air bleed past the throttle blade.
This, I've had the exact same issue on two other cars. The IAC in my Ford (Mazda) had a thermostat component which over-rode the electronic side once it jammed up. The car was fine cold, but never restarted hot, which was almost always at gas stations. It could be taken apart and cleaned out, at which point it worked again. The GM on the other hand had a motor that had gone bad, and could not just be cleaned out. Note that some cars (like Ford) have a coating on the intake that will dissolve if you use intake cleaner on it. Unfortunately while it was a $40 part on the GM, it looks like a $250 part for your car. It might be worth trying to clean the carbon out of it. Also, a lot of these have an adjustment screw on the back of them. Some web pages will encourage you to drive this in until the other end pops out. Don't do this. If you do it will be stuck forever open.
The reason it starts (and idles) while barely holding the accelerator pedal down is that you are replacing the small air gap path through the IAC with a similar small path past your throttle plate. After a couple minutes the car is warmed up enough that the mechanical side of the IAC can move again and you're ok.

I say over filling the tank, getting raw fuel in the vapor canister. New cars, injected need an
air space in the tank for the emissions system to operate properly.
Stop filling the tank when the nozzle clicks off.

Or your flux capacitor is shot. Check voltage, should be about 1.7899 million. Give ro
take a .0000000001 volt.

The VW flux capacitor is $985 for that model car.
He might as well scrap the car and girlfriend.

Carburated is a word you don't hear much anymore, but used to be pretty common. Now get off my lawn!

They can,t grow a lawn down there,just sand and a few green weeds.
We would have nothing to yell at the kids during retirement years.

Fuel tank vent valve.
How long has it been since you replaced either the gas pump, gas filter or PVC valve? Could be one of these.

Thanks for the helpful replies -- I didn't expect this many. My attention as been diverted from the Jetta's problem. I've learned recently:
1) If you're able to fix computers, keep it to yourself.
2) If you're able to fix cars, keep it yourself.
3) If you've ever been willing to help someone move, keep it to yourself.


I'm going to research this EVAP canister/purge valve system. I think there's a way to bypass it, which should at least indicate whether or not it's the culprit.
I'll check fuel pressure. I think the fuel pump is okay, but I'm checking it just the same. I'll replace the fuel filter; the car is in need of maintenance anyways.

You're welcome.
We're always here to help till her next boyfriend takes over the Jetta repairs.

Thanks for the helpful replies -- I didn't expect this many. My attention as been diverted from the Jetta's problem. I've learned recently:
1) If you're able to fix computers, keep it to yourself.
2) If you're able to fix cars, keep it yourself.
3) If you've ever been willing to help someone move, keep it to yourself.


None of these are what I would consider rocket science. In fact, none of these are what I would consider "Foo Science".

None of these are what I would consider rocket science. In fact, none of these are what I would consider "Foo Science".

Are you implying "Foo Science" is a lesser science by smaller minds?

None of these are what I would consider rocket science. In fact, none of these are what I would consider "Foo Science".

I don't know what your point is. Mine is that you should keep it to yourself because everybody and their mother will ask for your help.

Man of all skills,master of none^

Are you implying "Foo Science" is a lesser science by smaller minds?

No, I am implying that Foo Science is a lesser science by larger minds. It's very complicated.

I can't say what Foo Science is or even if it exists...

But I'd know it if I saw it :thumb:

Take out the old fuel filter, put it in another car, toss out the Jetta. Plan B, drive it 150 mph for an hour to clean out the carbon. Hope this helps.

I can't say what Foo Science is or even if it exists...

But I'd know it if I saw it :thumb:

I've seen it. it was gamma coloured.

Too bad your not in socal... I have a VAG Com cable that scans any Volkswagen Auto Group owned car. VW, Audi, Bugatti, Lamborghini, Spyker, well you get the idea... Basically its the same scanner as the $15k one the dealers use to diagnose cars and will scan/do WAY more than a basic OBDII scan will tell you....

Look for someone in your area with a VAG com... not hard VWVortex.com