General Cycling Discussion - To Ding or Not to Ding?

Please help my wife and me understand each other's opinion on this. Is it better to pass a cyclist or pedestrian with a single "ding" of your bell, or to verbalize "passing" or "on your left"?

She believes that words are less upsetting and more effective. She finds the bell offensive. Okay.

I'm partial to the "ding", because I think that it's distinct from the rest of the surrounding sounds. I think that both work fine, but the voice fails me. Especially if I'm working hard or am parched. The result from suddenly trying to speak is, well, underwhelming unless I yell.

Again, there's no animosity between us on this, just a difference of opinion.

What say you?

Phil

Please help my wife and me understand each other's opinion on this. Is it better to pass a cyclist or pedestrian with a single "ding" of your bell, or to verbalize "passing" or "on your left"?

She believes that words are less upsetting and more effective. She finds the bell offensive. Okay.

I'm partial to the "ding", because I think that it's distinct from the rest of the surrounding sounds. I think that both work fine, but the voice fails me. Especially if I'm working hard or am parched. The result from suddenly trying to speak is, well, underwhelming unless I yell.

Again, there's no animosity between us on this, just a difference of opinion.

What say you?

Phil


I say you should follow the convention in your area. On the major MUP around here, pretty much everyone says "On your left!", and people know what to do. In other places, bells seem more common.

Personally, I don't see what would be "offensive" about a bell. As long as someone isn't just ringing it to be obnoxious, what's wrong with it?

I usually give a quick "ding-ding" from afar and then say, "on-your-left", just before passing...

I think the convention in my area is to scare the crap out of people on the MUP after both using your bell and stating "passing!" as they had their headphones on and couldn't hear you if you fired a Howitzer to announce your presence. :)

Why waste my breathe on a slower rider or ped.

Ding, ding, ding....

Unless you yell, which gets tiring and old really fast, they aren't gonna hear you until you're right on top of them anyway. I prefer to ding the bell when I'm getting close.

Ding the bell or use your words...whatever is more convenient. There are other things to be offended about...such as saying, "Move your ugly fat ass on an ugly bike, out of my way!"

Unless you yell, which gets tiring and old really fast, they aren't gonna hear you until you're right on top of them anyway. I prefer to ding the bell when I'm getting close.

This is my position. The bell is much easier to hear.

There is no right answer. Pedestrians are totally unpredictable and whatever you do is wrong. If you shout, you are being rude. If you use a bell you are being rude. If you warn people of your presence, they jump across the road like headless chickes or cower by the side till the "danger" has passed. If you approach a group and one person sees or hears you, they wont tell the others. If you approach a couple, they do the Split-S (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split_S) manouvre so you have to ride between them. If a dog hears you bell, he wont tell his owner to reel in the lead.

There is no right answer. Pedestrians are totally unpredictable and whatever you do is wrong. If you shout, you are being rude. If you use a bell you are being rude. If you warn people of your presence, they jump across the road like headless chickes or cower by the side till the "danger" has passed. If you approach a group and one person sees or hears you, they wont tell the others. If you approach a couple, they do the Split-S (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split_S) manouvre so you have to ride between them. If a dog hears you bell, he wont tell his owner to reel in the lead.

+1 on the no right answer.
On Sunday, I started my 10 mi am ride on MUP. Had a couple on matching bikes ahead. He was riding to the right of MUP. She was slowly weaving behind him across the entire width of the MUP. Dinged my bell a couple of times, finally yelled OYL, and as she weaved to right I started my pass. I was nearly abreast of her, when she started to weave right into me. Rode off onto to the grass to keep from crashing. I looked over at her, wanted to say something, and noticed she had hearing aids. Dead batteries? Turned off? I don't know. Didn't say anything. Would she have heard or understood anyway?

Why waste my breathe on a slower rider or ped.

I'm usually breathing anyway, aren't you? ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnL4fjMzsSU

Truth.

+1 to doohickee's video, that is pretty much what I've found. If I yell on the left, as often as not, the pedestrian will move to the left. For me a bell works better, that is assuming they don't have an ear bud firmly implanted.

I find that I can't really yell without sounding mean. To me a bike bell is a nice sounds. Ding or brrrring. Isn't it a friendly sound?

[QUOTE=Doohickie;13154252

Truth.[/QUOTE]

Nice Video, Doohickie!

Now that's what I'm talkin' bout!!! :thumb:

Ding a ling ,ding a ling. Singing hidey ho brother don'tcha know they will move when they hear my ding a ling, ding a ling!

I do the "ding ding.........ding ding" and not the DING!DING!DING!DING!

I get lots of friendly comments like, I thought it was the ice cream man!::D

I did get a "YEAH YEAH I HEAR YOU!" from one hard core wannabe. I figure his obnoxious reply was part of his own arrogance in response to my wife effortlessly rolling around his sorry ass! :p

I'm with the ding ding dingies

I do an "on your left" and ding if they don't move over. The people on the bike path usually understand "on your left" better, but pedestrians react better to the bell.

The worst, and I repeat WORST are the ******** who walk in the bike lane on the descent of the NYC bridges. Nothing like going 30mph+ when a stupid tourists decides to abruptly walk in front of me to take a picture. I hate them, and would not feel bad if I clipped them. Theres a reason why there are separate lanes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnL4fjMzsSU

Truth.

Nice...but, that is in Japan...totally different set of values. I lived there for 2 years...can't wait to visit again.

I will say with years of experience that a BELL works 10x better than your voice. I don't see how a bell could possibly offend anyone, but if it did, screw them. I'm more concerned with keeping myself and everyone else safe.

That video above is pretty accurate for the states too. Much of the time they don't even turn around. They know it's a bicycle and scoot to their right.

LOL at the escalator btw.

I usually say some form of 'good day'. I don't have a bell.

I absolutely HATE "On your left". I KNOW what it means. Even so,by the time I am able to consciously process what's going on when I hear those words from behind me, I find I have already moved left by a couple of inches, thus moving in the way of the one trying to pass me.

It's easier for me to hear bells. I can't hear you when you say "to your left" i'm deaf in my left ear -_-

I often ride on the same MUP as the OP and perceive current practice is evenly split between bells and voices (for those that actually announce their presence). I currently say "passing" to avoid confusion regarding left / right. I don't want them to move left or right, just be aware that someone is going to pass them and they should maintain a straight line.

The tone of the bell or voice is probably more important than which device is used.

I usually say some form of 'good day'. I don't have a bell.

I absolutely HATE "On your left". I KNOW what it means. Even so,by the time I am able to consciously process what's going on when I hear those words from behind me, I find I have already moved left by a couple of inches, thus moving in the way of the one trying to pass me.

I would think that after you've heard it over ten times, you wouldn't have much to process by now...

You'd think! I'd think! Nonetheless, no matter how many times I hear it, I still move to the left when I hear it, THEN realize that someone wants to pass me and that I should go FRAP in the path so that they can. It's a completely counterproductive signal, sort've like telling people "The signal for you to stop what you're doing instantly is the word 'Go'!"

I usually say some form of 'good day'. I don't have a bell.

I absolutely HATE "On your left". I KNOW what it means. Even so,by the time I am able to consciously process what's going on when I hear those words from behind me, I find I have already moved left by a couple of inches, thus moving in the way of the one trying to pass me.

A wobbler, usually no warning for the above reason, but if I do give warning it's just yelling LEFT. A bell, absolutely not....

Bell.
(this would have been good as a poll)

I don't have a loud voice, and when people say "on your left" or "passing" or even "good morning" most times I can't quite hear them properly and don't even know if they're talking to me. Bell-noise is instantly recognized.

I think the convention in my area is to scare the crap out of people on the MUP after both using your bell and stating "passing!" as they had their headphones on and couldn't hear you if you fired a Howitzer to announce your presence. :)

haha! I know exactly what you mean by this.

Nice...but, that is in Japan...totally different set of values. I lived there for 2 years...can't wait to visit again.

That's pretty much the way it works on the MUP around here.

However, I have met ped's plenty of times who seem to absolutely ignore or have no idea that there is a "ding ding" sound coming from behind them. Up until the point where I am right behind them and I just say "excuse me". At this point I am of course coasting at walking speed :mad:

Almost never, ever happens around here. Of course, if I see no reaction, I start ringing with a frequency inversely proportional to the distance to the pedestrian until they react.

Hey Guys!

If you're Ding Dinging, that must mean that you're either on the sidewalk or some place where both bike and pedestrian sometimes can legally comingle. That would be in a park, perhaps along the boardwalk, or possibly even a parking lot. Otherwise, the pedestrians are in the street, where we should be.

If it is on the sidewalk or the boardwalk (like in the Japanese video), then we should not be too perturbed by folks who don't react so quickly to our ding ding warnings.

If it's in the street, then give 'em eternal Hellish Dings forever! :thumb:

I usually say some form of 'good day'. I don't have a bell.

I absolutely HATE "On your left". I KNOW what it means. Even so,by the time I am able to consciously process what's going on when I hear those words from behind me, I find I have already moved left by a couple of inches, thus moving in the way of the one trying to pass me.

That is why when riding on a MUP if I say anytign I say it before passing, and not jsut before. That means having to slow before passing.

Most of the time I say nothing and pick a time when I can pass quickly with plenty of space. So 'On your left' is reserved for those going not that much slower than I am and is easy to say well before passing. (And I'm perfectly happy with someone I just passed grabing my wheel for a while, not happy if I then slow to safely pass someone else and they blow by botjh of us. In that case next pass I'll blow by and try to quickly leave them far behind).

I'm a bell man.

Two dings with a short space between give people an idea of how fast you are catching up to them (i.e. move now!!)

You'd think! I'd think! Nonetheless, no matter how many times I hear it, I still move to the left when I hear it, THEN realize that someone wants to pass me and that I should go FRAP in the path so that they can. It's a completely counterproductive signal, sort've like telling people "The signal for you to stop what you're doing instantly is the word 'Go'!"

I'd considered you one of the shaky riders and a threat to others. I'd take extra caution while passing you seeing how you react to my verbal warning that means, "I will be passing on your left" not "I am on your left".

Plus, if someone says "onyerleft", it doesn't necessarily mean you have to move FRAP. It is used as a warning so that other rides hold position to avoid swerving into the passing rider.



There are shaky scary paranoid riders and then there are safe cool, well disciplined riders that are safe.

Check out the 5 year old kid on the bike at the beginning of my video. I shouted "onyerleft". He knows how to ride, hold his line and remains calm without panic. :thumb:




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nq7Owu6Z4Mw

Good and well-reasoned answers. Thanks, everyone. I can see now why my wife prefers the voice. She's a good rider, but just as frequently jogs on MUPs through our town.

From my perspective, I've also learned (from this post) that adding voice to the bell may be a better answer in many cases.

As a post script, I told my wife about the question here... Her response: "Why ask THEM? They're all bike riders. You need to ask the walkers and runners." [Head slap] "You're right, Honey" :love:

Phil

I always slow down and ding from a healthy distance back at people with dogs or kids, and at groups that are blocking the path. When passing people who're already to the right, I just slow down to a respectful speed and inform them in a normal tone of voice that I'm passing, sometimes with "On your left", sometimes with "Hello" or "Good morning/afternoon/evening". If it's a lone runner or walker and I have room to move all the way over to the far side of the path to pass, I will often say nothing at all.

I hate the feeling of yelling at people, which is what if feels like if I both use my voice and pass at speed, so the only people I pass at speed are other cyclists, and they get the bell.


That is why when riding on a MUP if I say anytign I say it before passing, and not jsut before. That means having to slow before passing.

Thank you for doing so, it goes a long way towards making the MUP a more pleasant place for all of us.

I can't hear the bell in the video due to the ringing in my ears. Neither is obnoxious--this is obnoxious:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na9dvLoLVTg&feature=related

I can't hear the bell in the video due to the ringing in my ears. Neither is obnoxious--this is obnoxious:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na9dvLoLVTg&feature=related

Yeah, you're right!

I don't think my Ding Ding would have worked there!

However, it didn't look like the AirZound really worked either!

GotDm Trucker!!! :mad:

I'm a bell guy, hate yelling. Sometimes on wooded sections it's funny when they start looking up in the trees for a bird though.

Some people do other things than bicycling, though. In other things I do and have done, if someone says "Left!" it means "I just saw something dangerous that you probably haven't and it could potentially put you in the hospital if you don't trust me and move to your left RIGHT NOW!" So when I hear the word "Left!" I immediately move left. This takes priority over parsing the fact that it is preceeded by "On your".

Some people do other things than bicycling, though. In other things I do and have done, if someone says "Left!" it means "I just saw something dangerous that you probably haven't and it could potentially put you in the hospital if you don't trust me and move to your left RIGHT NOW!" So when I hear the word "Left!" I immediately move left. This takes priority over parsing the fact that it is preceeded by "On your".
Please.

Stay off any trails.

Seriously.

You're dangerous.

Please.

Stay off any trails.

Seriously.

You're dangerous.

That was so very unkind!....BUT TRUE! :lol:

From my experiences, it's best not to say anything and just pass. Less chance of them moving into your path...

I prefer to scare the crap out of people by silently passing them. It sounds mean, but if a person is using a multi-use path correctly they should be out of your way anyway, and if you startle them a few times they will eventually get the idea they should stay to the right. My local MUP is about 8 feet wide in most parts, and there are still tons of people that feel the need to use every part of it. There is plenty of room to pass a couple walking hand in hand, if they're walking where they should be walking. It's beyond me why some people think they need to walk hand in hand, five feet apart from each other, swinging their arms totally oblivious to what is around them, but I get great satisfaction whizzing by them in the dirt/grass and hearing the girl squeal as if she never expected another soul would be on the trail.

Another pet peeve of mine is joggers/bikers who run or bike on the left. I mean, you drive all day, you can't understand the convention is to stay to the right when passing opposing traffic?

Some people are too dumb to understand a bell.

I'm not maimed, so i'm fine with how I am. If I stopped dumbly for a moment to try to figure out if "Left" meant 'Go left or don't go left?' where chainsaws and falling trees and such were involved I might have been.
I wasn't the one who's brilliant idea it was to embed a request to do a thing into a request not to do that thing. It's a bad phrase at a psychological level, and so I don't like it and find it seriously irritating.

As noted, "Passing" works fine with less confusion and time, and a simple greeting usually gets better results from pedestrians.

I prefer to be silent until beside the person, then a "hello" or "good morning" as I pass. Saying something while approaching seems to do more harm than good because you don't know how they'll react.

The general consensus of people I've talked to about my bell is "Oh, so that's what that noise was". People ignore it. So I now say "on your left". Or right if they are riding like maroons.