Classic & Vintage - the right rear derailleur

i just signed up to this forum, so nice to meet you all. also, there's a dizzying amount of topics, so i don't know if i'm posting this under the right one.

earlier this year, i bought a beautiful '83 smoked chrome puch austro daimler frame, 531 reynolds sl tubing, drilled campy dropouts. i love it. i want to keep it simple and light as possible. i don't want a second front chain ring. i only want gears in the back. i would like only 5 gears with as large of a gear ratio as possible - meaning, one that'll take me up steep hills with ease, and a nice small one that i can power through flats so fast it'll make my eyes tear up.

i would also like to use a single, classic campy shifter on the downtube. like this one:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/270806300337?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649#ht_720wt_1189

any suggestions? i'm all ears.
thanks!

Welcome. You seem to have your mind made up about the 1 x 5 thing, but here's my 2 cents worth:

If you insist on a wide range with only 5 gears, you are in for some serious compromises, most notably in terms of the jumps between gears. Your choice of rear derailleur will need to accommodate the large cog. A long cage Suntour Cyclone comes to mind, although someone else will no doubt suggest something more euro-centric, and maybe that's the way you want to go.

What do you plan to use for the chainring?

You can play around with this calculator to find a combination that will work for your needs. I would do that first, then select a rd that will handle the freewheel.
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gears/

I'll second a Suntour Cyclone GT ... that RD is a work of art.

guys - thanks so much for your quick replies. i'm ok with the big jumps between gears. believe it or not, i actually had a 5 spd sturmey archer internally geared hub on this thing until recently. i really liked the 256% gear ratio spread. if i can achieve that again with external gears and a derailleur, i will be very happy. i don't want to be shifting all the time... just when i really need to. i intend on staying in 3rd most of the time and basically treating this like a single speed with bail-out options in times of crisis... or if i just want to go really fast. i have ZERO allegiance to brand name, except for my little single shifter up front, which i would like to keep campy. so suntour sounds good - euro or not... i don't care.

keep these good suggestions coming - i feel like a resolution is just around the corner.
thanks again!

You might want to consider a smaller-than-typical chainring and a freewheel that is not too gigantic, to keep the weight and complexity down. It all depends on what you want to do with the bike - terrain, distance, as well as your preferred cadence and level of fitness....

It will be kind of like the commuter that my son just recently set up. He lives in a hilly area, so he went with gears in the 32-71 gear-inch range (with a five-speed internally-geared rear hub, and a 42-tooth chainring). That gives him the equivalent of a 42/36 low gear, but not much in the high end (which is fine for what he does with the bike).

If the frame is 126 mm at the rear, I would suggest running a seven-speed, or at least a six-speed. You can even run a skinny-six on a 120 rear hub, if your frame is 120 mm at the rear.

If you are not stuck on having a derailleur, you could even build it with an internally-geared hub of 5 or more speeds....

Edit: you posted while I was composing my post, so I didn't see it until after I posted. Why dump the S/A 5-speed, may I ask?

I agree with 753's question, why not keep the 5 speed internal gear hub? You seem to like the gear range and it will require less maintenance.

regarding the sturmey archer, i didn't like the response time and i didn't like having to stop pedaling to shift gears properly. if i didn't stop pedaling, sometimes it wouldn't shift right and would alternate between two gears as you pedaled. drove me insane. also, in 4th and 5th gear, it made an annoying ticking sound that i couldn't get rid of. i tried out some of the new linus gaston 5's, which have the same hub, they behaved the same way, i realized that these weren't problems unique to my specific hub, and so i got rid of it.

in terms of goals, i live in brooklyn where there are lots of bridges that i cross regularly, including the george washington bridge, which features a hill so narrow, steep, and curvy that it makes almost everyone dismount and walk. i never want to have to get off my bike. also, sometimes i go on some 40-50 miles bike rides in the palisades, which feature some monster hills.

also, i like to go fast. usually, as fast as i can. on flats and downhills.

so, terrain, distance, and speed are my priorities, about evenly valued.

after some thought, i would allow myself 7 gears. please - those of you who have chimed in - could you recommend, based on my intentions, an appropriate size/make of chain ring, freewheel, cassette, and derailleur.

thanks very much again. promise to post some good pics when i'm done.

shimano 105 rear hub with a hyperglide cassette and 7 105 speed rd. as Sheldon "105" Brown once pointed out it is quite the bang for less buck, and it is 126mm spaced

TA crank, 42T ring, 11-32 freewheel (they do exist! (http://www.ebay.com/itm/7-Speed-Freewheel-11-32t-LONG-YIH-Co-DNP-/300592301763?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item45fcb286c3)), Huret Duopar RD.

i bought an alexrims wheel set the other day. there was already a 11-28, 8-speed cassette on it. based on your answers, i found this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-105-6sp-7sp-rear-road-bike-derailleur-RD-1050-/260844520154?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cbb8b82da#ht_2270wt_956

on ebay

is that a fair price and will it work with what i've got?

thanks!

right now i have some crappy derailleur mounted that only accesses 6 of the 8 gears. i figure i'll upgrade derailleurs first, see how the bike rides, then proceed to the crank and freewheel upgrades you guys have given me.

i bought an alexrims wheel set the other day. there was already a 12-28, 6-speed cassette on it. based on your answers, i found this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-105-6sp-7sp-rear-road-bike-derailleur-RD-1050-/260844520154?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cbb8b82da#ht_2270wt_956

on ebay

is that a fair price and will it work with what i've got?

thanks!
http://velobase.com/ViewComponent.aspx?ID=8BB46071-2B7C-4E74-B10B-A5CFCC1078DD&Enum=108&AbsPos=4

Says it will go up to 28 teeth.

[edit] actually I just noticed the comment that says it will handle 32t with a 38-48 chainring.

What do you think of this single shifter?

216999 217000

I have had this set kicking around for a long time, hoping to find a bicycle that it would be correct and work on. No such beast has come my way so far.

I sort of like the rational behind what the OP is doing. I found this old five speed Torpado (http://www.mytenspeeds.com/My_TenSpeeds_1/Feature_Bicycles/Feature_Bicycles_Itlay/Torpado_5spd/TORPADO_LUXE_5SPD_1_Start.htm) to be perfect, in third, most of the time, however; it was nice to be able to go to a higher gear, when needed...
http://www.mytenspeeds.com/My_TenSpeeds_1/Bicycles_Table/Italian_Bicycles/Torpado_Bicycles/Torpado_Luxe_5SPD_55/Tor5SPD_Marina/Tor5SPD_Marina_Crank_1.jpg

hi i love the single shifter dunno about the derailleur. i've never seen a campy like that before. what model is it? how many gears can it accommodate? would i be able to assemble the 11-32 rear cogs that i'm now considering? i'd have to do some research. i don't guess you'd separate them, hey? what would you need for just the shifter, if so. if not, what would you need for the set?

thanks,
~m

what would you need for just the shifter, if so.

It is best to conduct buying and selling through the assigned forum. You are welcome to email me through my website, should you wish. Or, do as I did, join the Bicycle Forum so that you can access all of the options available. I find it to be a useful resource.

randyjawa - i sent an email to mail@mytenspeeds.com regarding your parts.
thanks!

the bike is finished... for now. here's the frankenbike that you all helped create... MMMMWWAAAHAHAHA... :

http://s1016.photobucket.com/albums/af284/misiakfotos/Puch%20Austro-Daimler/?albumview=slideshow

rear cassette: 11-28, 8spd
shimano deore, 9spd derailleur

that rear derailleur is quite ugly and doesn't match the rest of the bike at all. i may remove it, take it apart, take a wire wheel to it to strip everything off, clear coat it, and then reinstall. i happened to catch a flat in manhattan and when i rolled her into a nearby bike shop that i frequent, i started talking about my plans... my man brought out this derailluer and i said what the hell. it does work brilliantly, though.

shimano shifter stem mount shifter, simplex downtube shifter - severely chopped up and modified into something of a steam-punk style cable guide, shimano derailleur, sugino crank... this this is all over the place.

That thing is sexy.

Congratulations!

that rear derailleur is quite ugly and doesn't match the rest of the bike at all. i may remove it, take it apart, take a wire wheel to it to strip everything off, clear coat it, and then reinstall. i happened to catch a flat in manhattan and when i rolled her into a nearby bike shop that i frequent, i started talking about my plans... my man brought out this derailluer and i said what the hell. it does work brilliantly, though.

Nothing wrong with Deore- I'd just have gone for the 1986-ish version of it on that bike:

As it is on my Black Chrome High Sierra:

http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg180/scaled.php?server=180&filename=bikes928009.jpg&res=medium

You made it yours. Love the saddle. Way to go!

That thing is sexy.

Congratulations!

thanks, man!

You made it yours. Love the saddle. Way to go!

thanks! it was an ebay purchase, shipped from paris. $60 - incl shipping!

Nothing wrong with Deore- I'd just have gone for the 1986-ish version of it on that bike:

As it is on my Black Chrome High Sierra:

http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg180/scaled.php?server=180&filename=bikes928009.jpg&res=medium

i like yours WAY better - i totally would have preferred yours - but - like i said... i was only there cuz i caught a flat, dude pulled out what he had laying around that he thought would work, and i said what the hell.

Hi Meezy, Welcome to the C&V Forum. Your Deore is much better than the Campagnolo rear mech that was shown in an earlier post - that looked like a Valentino Extra - IMO the worst rear derailleur ever and should never have borne the Campagnolo name. Your bike looks awesome. I'd probably have used Deore cranks as well - mainly because I have a set available, but you can't go far wrong with the Sugino set up. I'm a bit puzzled by your shifter arrangement, the single Down tube Campy would have been much better, maybe you're still looking for one? Anyway, enjoy your bike - your saddle and frame are exquisite.

ha ha!! yeah - i'm puzzled by it too. i was actually shopping for exactly that - a single campy downtube shifter - but this was before i understood what a hallowed and holy name "Campagnolo" was. oh my god, how people on ebay gush over it! they're going for like $25-$35!! i'm just not that into brand names. i'm more into RIDING.

anyway, as quickly as i can sum it up - here's how i arrived at my unorthodox and likely temporary arrangement...

basically, i initially built this bike with a 5 speed internally geared hub, which i sold, once it annoyed me enough.

then i bought this used wheel set which already came with the 8 speed cassette. as it turns out, after some talk with you helpful dudes on the forum, the gears gave me about the ratio i wanted between the smallest and largest cogs... good.

i bought an appropriate chain. just to get me back on the road a friend gave me an old suntour derailleur (which could only access 5 of the 8 rear cogs, btw) and the dude at my local bike shop just gave me an old, crappy simplex double downtube shifter he had laying around -

http://i.ebayimg.com/t/VINTAGE-SIMPLEX-BREV-BICYCLE-DOWNTUBE-SHIFTER-SET-/00/$(KGrHqMOKjEE17SS4ZU+BNmNLnUVqw~~_35.JPG

i only have one chain ring and that extra, idle shift lever was bothering me.

i started shopping for the campy downtube single shifter you mentioned, but the prices turned me off and i also wanted to compare how a stem shifter would feel to the downtube position i had been using anyway, so i bought the shimano one you see on ebay for like $6.

well, if i was gonna go stem shifter, then i needed a cable guide near the top of the downtube - so instead of buying yet another part, i macgyvered the crappy simplex into what i needed. if you look at the link to the slideshow, the cable housing fits into it pretty snugly. it all looks kind of stupid - but i don't really care - it's quite effective and i even kind of like it for the time being. i'll ride it like this for a while. thank you for the welcome and the thumbs up on the bike.

Ah! That makes sense! I always prefer to use what I have, or what I can get for free/cheap where I can. Unusual approach but it obviously works. the main thing is to be able to ride your bike, not leave it in a work stand while you search for unobtainium parts!

well said, man. unobtanium is a material i'm VERY familiar with, as i also try to restore my 1950 plymouth!!

It's a true "dog's breakfast" but you get major style points (for most of it, anyway). Is that a lightweight (professional) 531 tubeset? The decal has red lettering, but not the same as later "super light" 531 decals...it's a thoroughbred frame in any case, so don't trash it. You'll probably get better shifting if you slide the rear wheel a bit forward in the rear drop-outs.

that is indeed a 531 SL reynolds tubeset.
the thing shifts about as well as i could ever hope for as is, so i'm gonna follow the old "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" adage.