Advocacy & Safety - Mirrors

Hey, I've seen some commentary from those who use the helmet mounted mirrors and those who use the handlebar mounted ones. I'm curious of the numbers.

Dave

ps. I've never posted a poll. I hope this works.

Dave, you need another option: Both.

I have both on my commuter and use only a helmet mirror when on my road bike.

There is also a third type. DELTA makes one that mounts on the top tube. You look back through your legs and around the seat post. Sounds good in theory, but doesn't work as well in practice. Tried it, didn't like it. Kept my H'Bar mounted mirrycycle.

I use a mirror on my eyeglasses, it's the one called "Take A Look."
It's very easy to adjust and, if one is fortunate enough to go touring in a drive/ride-on-the-left country, can be completely inverted and reversed to work on the right side of glasses. My own experience with handlebar mounted mirrors hasn't been good; they vibrate too much for my taste.

Originally posted by Feldman
My own experience with handlebar mounted mirrors hasn't been good; they vibrate too much for my taste.

It's much worse if you ride west early in the morning! :eek:

I dont use mirrors never have. use my ears and turn my head
no problem. few people in the group I ride with use them and they are always adjusting them ..
if you have a mirror on your head (helmet/glasses mount)
do you have to turn your head so you can see with them..
does having mirrors improve your ride??

Newly converted to a helmet mirror - just an occasional glance to the side every so often is great.

Richard

I voted helmet mounted, but I actually use eyeglass mounted Third Eye brand. I have used the handlebar mount, but it vibrated, and I found myself having to adjust it alot or contort to use it! I think the eyeglass/helmet mount takes a couple days to get used to, but I like the field of vision...and besides you get to look like a Borg! :D

Originally posted by ljbike
There is also a third type. DELTA makes one that mounts on the top tube. You look back through your legs and around the seat post. Sounds good in theory, but doesn't work as well in practice. Tried it, didn't like it. Kept my H'Bar mounted mirrycycle.
I tried one of the Delta mirrors about 2 years ago and spent more time readjusting it than I do readjusting my Rhode Gear handlebar mirror. The Delta went in the trash after a 2 month trial period.

Does using a miror improve your ride? You bet your sweet bippy it does. As for turning your head, thats fine to see whats coming briefly but what ya need is a good, steady ability to see and WATCH whats coming behind you with nothing more than a real quick head glance, if that. The answer is a helmet or glasses frame mounted mirror. With these you can see what is coming and RESPOND defensively if you need to. If there is NOBODY back there, you can zip out into the main road where there is less debris and cut your flats/wear and tear by a huge chunk.

Don't tell me you can hear whats coming. Try riding next to a raging river; or on a windy day; or both. Nor can sound tell you (within reason) just WHAT it is thats coming; are they giving your share of roadspace; do they have any gear hanging off the side of the vehicle, etc. Sound cannot tell you how many cars might be in a line of traffic. With a mirror you don't own the road (trucks do that). Instead you CONTROL it, since you can see in all directions.

I am sure you can mount a mirror on your handlebars, but this takes up precious handlebar space. In addition, when you turn the front wheel or lean to move from one land to another, you lose the mirror at the VERY time you need it the MOST. Still...in the end where ya put your mirror is a style question.

Mine does not vibrate much. It is well attached to my helmet and my helmet is firmly strapped around my chin. I wiggle my head back and forth if I need to look at several lanes of traffic; by looking straight up I can even see my panniers to make sure something hasn't slipped or shifted. The mirror is on an arm long enough to put the small, flat glass lens in my field of vision. Don't get a plastic one as they scratch; and don't get get the convex ones, the last thing you need is a mirror that makes things look far away. Having a rear view mirror is esential to defensive cycling.

roughstuff

Coming around a bend on a bike path -- I don't normally ride bike paths except to get to places most easily reached by the bike path -- I had to turn wide to avoid an oncoming cyclist on a hybrid who came wide into the turn. I'm generally pretty good at judging that kind of thing at speed, but I hadn't accounted for his rearview mirror sticking out about 10 cm from the left side of his handlebar. That brushed my sleeve. If I'd been off by one more centimetre, it would have caught my arm and I would have been pitched over a bridge into the Lachine Canal.

Mirror are a menace. Use your neck.

I use eyeglass-mounted mirrors (not one of the choices) when on the road with cars. Steady, adjustable, can be easily tightened just by pushing the ball into the socket, allows a good view.

I also always look back before making a move, but the mirror allows me to catch early deviant and aggressive drivers for whom I can make necessary adjustments prior to their getting right behind me.

When I had my upright, (wedgie), road bike I did not use a mirror at all. Tried a helmet, and a eye glasses mounted mirror, didn't like either one. So I was content to look over my shoulder or under my arm. But now that I have my recumbent I have a handle bar mounted mirror. Being that low to the ground, it has served as a great warning tool to let me know when there is traffic behind me and about how far back it is.

I use eyeglass mounted mirror,

The mirrors ive tried on older bikes <mirrors that attach to the side of the handlebars> sucked. They become unadjusted when you hit a bump, and constantly have to readjust them.

They make these mirrors a bit smaller than a dime. You stick them to the inside lens of your glasses and look at it through the corner of your eye to see behind you. Havent tried this but it seemed like a cool idea.

I used a helmet-mount until it finally couldn't stay steady in a headwind.

Since that time, I've been quite happy with looking back. But, I enjoyed my mirror whilst I had it.

i use a helmet-mounted mirror that is totally made of recycled material. the mirror is mounted on the back of an aluminum can and is attached to a used spoke that is bent around a rubber tip (similar to the ends of glasses) -it clips on the helmet--and it kicks!!! i bought it from a guy from ohio? at a bicycle show in chicago years ago. it never needs adjusting, is visually correct and is no bother.

I voted No mirror, since that’s the case. I have a mirror though, that I will use on my summer tour. I thought of mounting it on the frame, but considering your posts I might choose the handlebar instead. You see, it doesn’t take up handlebar space – it’s mounted at the far end of the it.

Has anyone on this board tried the very small mirror that attaches to the inside of an eyeglass lens? This looks interesting to me.

At this point, I haven't used a mirror in over two years. I had one on my bicycle when I was hit by a car (he "T" boned me trying to turn in front of me to the right while I was in a bike lane at 25 mph). The mirror I had was a handlebar mount, and would constantly vibrate on the rough roadways.

After that accident, I decided to learn more about riding, and my son got me a book (more on that later) which discouraged using mirrors. I raised my handlebars, and learned to look around. This is not a glance, but a very effective look to see what's happening around me. Not only do I see better, but I get to look the driver in the eye and signal my intent with both hand signals and body language that I'm turning, or doing something different.

If I ever get a recumbant, I will begin using mirrors again. I may get one for my glasses or helmet, but it won't substitute for me looking around and being aware of traffic, especially when I'm going to do something.

Originally posted by John C. Ratliff
If I ever get a recumbant, I will begin using mirrors again. I may get one for my glasses or helmet, but it won't substitute for me looking around and being aware of traffic, especially when I'm going to do something.
I feel similarly.

When I'm driving, I not only use my mirrors to my best advantage,
I look behind me.

My mirror is mounted to my sunglass'. I feel much more secure with them. They are close to your body, slight turn of your head gives you a 180 view of behind you. Would not be without them. Vibration problem does not seem to bad either. The mirror is rectangular insead of circular. Think they are great. Much preferable to constantly turing your neck, and feel less in control of the bike, while doing so.

I got to tell you guys this...last Friday I ended up my homeward commute in the hospital in "stable" condition, and I don't remember what happened. I'll tell you more about it after I talk to the police today, but I sent 24 hours under hospital observation Friday night and Saturday.

Holy Cow. I hope you are ok.

Dave

Well, I've got several skinned areas (elbow, shoulder, knee) and a lange bruise on my thigh, all on the right side. My helmet is in ten pieces, and I have three staples in a cut on the back of my head. My face is skinned on the upper right side too. I was wearing safety lenses, and that probably helped avoid any eye injury, but my face has looked better in the past. All will heal though. I haven't seen the bike yet, and so cannot comment on exactly what happened until I see it and talk with the police officer who attended the scene. More later.

John

Wow. Well, luckily you are still here with us. I hope your recovery is speedy! Hey, take some pictures. I'm sure you'll find it interesting in the future, though the whole thing is probably very distressing at the moment.

Get better
Dave

Originally posted by John C. Ratliff
I was wearing safety lenses, and that probably helped avoid any eye injury, but my face has looked better in the past.
My god, yes I'm too glad you're ok. I have to ask – what is safety lenses? Are they some special kind of contact lenses or do you just mean plain sunglasses? You don't have to reply until your wounds have healed!
:beer: (later)

Actually, on Friday I picked up some Wilson ANSI Z87.1 Safety Glasses from Fred Meyer (a local Oregon department store). These are industrial safety glasses which look like wrap-around sun glasses, but have the impact resistence of safety glasses. For sun glasses, they are fairly cheap at under $10 US. I'm glad I was wearing them, but I wouldn't recommend this methodology of trying them out to anyone.

John

I voted "helmet mounted", seemed closest to the one I use which attaches to the the eyeglasses stem(s). Once used to it, I find I like it a lot. Wouldn't ride without one now. We have some pretty aggressive and/or negligent drivers around here on everything from two wheels to eighteen, and if I can see 'em coming....I have no issue with getting out of their way.

John, glad to hear you're more or less OK! We'll be really interested to hear what happened.

I just started using a third eye eyeglass mounted mirror, and it seems to be working OK. Of course I always shoulder check as well and frequently turn around and look from force of habit.

I like the eyeglass mount because it's always there no matter what bike I'm using, doesn't vibrate.

The bar end mirrors I used on my commuter never lasted very long from vibration, the bike falling, leaning against walls, and the occasional crash!

Yesterday I was able to pick up my bicycle from the police locker, and meet Officer Lisa Erickson, who helped me during the accident. I also found out several things about the accident.

Officer Erickson stated that two or three witnesses said that I had "lost control" of the bicycle. One witness, who stayed long enough to tell Officer Erickson then left, said that I had swerved to miss a car. I am going with the latter observation by that one person, as the evidence points in that direction. I'll explain:

--All my injuries are on my right side; right knee, right thigh, right elbow and shoulder, and the right side of my bike helmet. Even the staples holding the cut on my head together are slightly to the right of the center/back of my head. My bike handlebar tape is abraided on the right side.

--My right hand is not injured. This means I was holding the top of the handlebars (I'm riding drops).

--Everyone agrees I was signaling for a left turn. If I had lost control during this turn, I would be injured on my left side.

--My bicycle was in good shape. The tires were still inflated, and everything was alligned correctly, except the chain (and that probably had come loose either during the fall or due to subsequent handling). The bar ends indicated I was in my lower front gear, and a middle range back gear. So I wasn't going terribly fast. Witnesses said I was going fast (this is a downhill portion of my ride), but 15-20 mph would look fast to them.

With this as physical evidence, my only other worry was that my handlebars had come loose. I had recently raised them to the maximum I dared, then lowered them about half an inch. I had tightened them hard too, but was worried that with raising them, they may have come loose at a critical moment, and caused the fall. This did not happen. The handlebars were rigid, and correctly alligned.

So I probably swerved to avoid missing a car which was quickly changing lanes in front of me. My bike was pretty heavily loaded with clothes and shopping (I had two panniers on the back), and that may have led to a loss of traction during the emergency.

I do know that I went down very hard, and shattered my helmet (GIRO, thank you for a great helmet!), was knocked into la-la land (yes, I was dreaming, of biking yet), and have no memory of the people helping me out or the ambulance ride. My first memory was about the time they were catheterizing me in the emergency room.

So that is my story. I'm in recovery now, and have not missed work, but am moving about a bit more slowely and painfully. I found out that of those staples in my head, if I press on the middle one, I start "swimming" (getting dizzy). 'Don't know why, but maybe I have some weird wiring up on top.

I do know that this is forcing me to look at bicycle commuting to determine if it is a viable option anymore. I have in my past participated in some very "dangerous" activities (scuba diving, parachuting--USAF Master Parachutist, parascuba jumping, helicopter rescue work, smoke jumping, mountaineering, etc.) and now, based on my personal experience, have to rank bicycle commuting as the most hazardous activity I have ever participated in. I have no good answers on this one.

John

John,

Where did all this take place? I often bike all around the Portland, OR area. We were ranked this year by Bicycling magazine as the top cycling city in the US, and though I have had problems I find that things here are definately better than other cities.

I hope you don't stop commuting by bicycle. The only way things will get better and more safe is by having more cyclists on the road so that drivers become increasingly aware of us. I saw a study that shows that accidents between cyclists and cars go down when there are more cyclists.

Get well soon!

J.O.

This took place last Friday on Evergreen Parkway close to Cornell Road in Hillsboro (it's near the Hillsboro/Beaverton border). Good bike lanes, but they don't go to the left, hence the lane change.

John

A week and a half since my accident, I'm recovering well. I still have some fluid under the bruise, but that should go away tomorrow (Dr.'s appointment).

While I have not yet resumed riding on the street, I've been doing 5-7 miles daily on my Schwinn Airdyne. The weather has not been too conducive to riding, and I've been doing a lot of research on helmets.

Concerning helmets, my helmet is now in many pieces. I found the main area of impact, and it was compressed by about 1/3, with fracture lines running out from this area. The EMT/Paramedics felt that mine would have been a fatal accident without the helmet.

I still have no clear idea of what happened. My son, Brian, feels that my front tire probably actually touched the rear of another vehicle (possibly one changing lanes into the one I was changing into in front of me). This, he feels, is the most likely reason for the violent crash I suffered. Anything else would be something I could have preparred for, and probably would not have led to head contact with the ground.

This is my first instance of head contact with the ground in all my falls (I've had at least five now). I have been trained in falling techniques by Judo training, and parachute training in the US Air Force.

The cause of my fall will probably remain unresolved. My next step is in simply getting on the bike again. But I won't do that until I pick up a new helmet.

John

I would vote both on my commuter, but only helmet on my road bike.

Sorry, that previous reply was made to the mirror poll. John I hope you continue to recover well. It is very hard to evaluate commuting when you can't remember the accident. Sometimes the memory comes back in several months, but most often that kind of memory loss is forever. Take it easy starting back.

Two weeks ago I spun around to see if a car was coming and 're-activated' a pinched nerve. It's been a pretty painful two weeks and in retrospect I feel pretty certain it could have been avoided with the use of mirrors.
I bought a handlebar mounted mirror and a helmet mirror. I finally felt well enough to ride on Monday and love both of them. With the exception of a blind-spot on my left (no left side mirror) I finally can see behind me without looking behind me. The one on the bars is concave and good for wide-view but is bad for judging distance. The helmet mirror is flat and rear-view is capable with a glance to the side.
Of course, I do ride a commuter, not some speed-racer and have taken some ribbing from co-workers, especially about the helmet mirror. Oh well, what do non-cyclists know anyway?! Try them anyway. So far I seem to like them.

I finally got on my bike yesterday evening; I had to see how it rode after my accident. In doing so, I think I've solved the problem of what happened. It was raining, and my brakes normally are okay on this bike in rain, but last evening when I braked my back break, the wheel hung and I skidded. This is an old Schwinn Le Tour, with center-pull brakes on a 27 inch wheel. The original wheels are chromed steel, but I had put an alloy wheel from another bike on it. Center-pull brakes were some of the best years ago, and more than adequate with the chromed steel rims. With the alloy rim, and new brake shoes, it stopped the wheel dead without much effort.

So apparently, the observations of the police officer were correct, and I simply lost control of the bike. It happened that I was going downhill, but at the bottom of the hill is a stop light. I needed to change lanes, and so I signaled the lane change, swung out from the bicycle lane into the traffic lane (one lane over), and was in the process of turning back to go straight down the hill when I applied the brake. This apparently initiated a skid to my right and the subsequent fall.

I don't remember much about a car because there probably was no car involved. The part of my memory which is not there is remembering any kind of skid, but that would have been immediately prior to the impact, and those seconds are most likely gone because of my fall.

So the situation wasn't as dire as I thought initially, and the fact that the helmet saved my head is a great advertisement for helmet usage. With this as the probable scenario, I can again go out and ride.

This started as a discussion on mirrors, and I turned it into a discussion about my own accident. My apologies about that, but I'll get back to the mirror situation. This whole accident scenario has me re-thinking my position on mirrors, and I will be picking up a helmet/eyeglass mirron with my helmet purchase. I will be experimenting on the mirrors, and may even be getting a different bicycle (20+ years with that bike may be enough). Thanks to everyone for your support during this time.

John

I am very glad you are healing well, John!

I went over my bars on August 31, 2001, on a friday evening after work. I was only 2 - 3 miles from home on a 14 mile commute...

I don't remember anything about falling, only several nice ladies (motorists) helping me up. They didn't look too pleased with my appearance--it's a good thing I couldn't see myself. I do remember some punk sticking his arm out in my path and me trying to block it. Now, I wear a mustache to cover the scar under my nose.

Seems mere falls can be dangerous. That's why I use a helmet.
But all in all, I think bicycling is one of the best things that ever happened to me! :)

Mirrors are there to tell you when its not clear, not to tell you when it is clear. I dont think most people understand that simple concept! :)

Joe,
It also tells me if Iam good looking, ahh, just kidding, It really helps to have a mirror either on the handle bar or attached to the Helmet, But I never got to used one,

I just got a circular mirror that fixes on my helmet with glue. We'll see how it works!

I've been testing out a handlebar fixed mirror which is better than nothing but one gripe is that I am uncomfortable with looking down and away every time I want to check out the view behind me.

Dave

I decided to give mirrors another try after my accident, and I rode Saturday with two. One was a handlebar on the bar end of drop bars, and the other was on my helmet.

The handlebar mirror suffered from several problems:

--I had to look down.
--It seemed to vibrate out of position.
--The view was sometimes through my elbow or arm (depending upon where I positioned my hands.

I found myself using the helmet mirror about 90% of the time on this ride, and decided to take the handlebar mirror off again. I will be using the helmet mirror every day from now on though, as I found myself being much more aware of traffic on both sides (front and behind) than I was before.

John

I started out with no mirror, and was reasonably content. But when I needed to make a left turn, and looked back, I could only see the edge of my eyeglasses. Turn any further, and I was swerving into the lane, which defeated the purpose of looking.

So I got an eyeglass-mounted mirror about a week ago, and after only a few days, I wouldn't want to ride without it.