General Cycling Discussion - Bike Theft and Street Justice

I am pretty much a pacifist until I witness things like robberies, muggings, molestations, and Bike Thefts!

Hearing about it is one thing...Actually witnessing it take place with your own personal bike, just might be another story!

Watch this:

http://vimeo.com/6475675

- Slim :)

he deserved more than that.

Would you call the police if you saw someone with a bolt cutter attacking the lock on your bike? I would tell the thief that the bicycle he is trying to steal is mine and I'd tell him to get his hands off it. Better don't use violence unless really needed.

Would you call the police if you saw someone with a bolt cutter attacking the lock on your bike? I would tell the thief that the bicycle he is trying to steal is mine and I'd tell him to get his hands off it. Better don't use violence unless really needed.

Ever been so pissed, you just plain lose it?

- Slim :)

I'm just say'n...

Pacifists don't champion 'street justice' or mob violence.

They could have grabbed the guy and held him for LEO.

Pacifists don't champion 'street justice' or mob violence.

They could have grabbed the guy and held him for LEO.

I know! I know! I know!

...............It's just that I know how these guys operate. It's like a job to them!

While I don't think I'd be inclined to hit this guy at first. It wouldn't take much for me to nail 'em if he cursed me or something. Any provocation at all, would be enough, I think...I don't know...Maybe not?

- Slim :)

While I don't think I'd be inclined to hit this guy at first. It wouldn't take much for me to nail 'em if he cursed me or something. Any provocation at all, would be enough, I think...I don't know...Maybe not?

- Slim :)

Do you know what Pacifist means?

Do you know what Pacifist means?

Thanks for asking this question DCrowell!

You've challenged me to take a really deep and introspective look into myself...

I could easily replace my bike a hundred times over. I could never replace another person's pain or suffering. Material things can always be replaced. However, human suffering, pain, and trauma is haunting...forever!

Thanks DCrowell!

You made me think and search deep inside myself...

- Slim :)

PS.

It's not really within me to hurt anyone, really...

I guess all those Tae Kwon Do classes were for nothing, huh?

I presume use of the contraction "bro" (brother), as in "Don't steal bikes, bro." in the context of this attack is facetious, as the term "pal" might have been used similarly in the past. In attacking the thief, I would have been more inclined to say, "Hey pal, don't steal bikes." I guess that dates me?

I presume use of the contraction "bro" (brother), as in "Don't steal bikes, bro." in the context of this attack is facetious, as the term "pal" might have been used similarly in the past. In attacking the thief, I would have been more inclined to say, "Hey pal, don't steal bikes." I guess that dates me?

No...I'm afraid that words and names are nothing when it comes to violence and brutality. Names and words are dwarfed and shallowed by the inhumane treatment that one human being can impose upon another...

You're not dated... You're reminded!

- Slim :)

he deserved more than that.
I am surprised he didn't, 3 on 1 in NYC getting caught stealing someones bike usually ends worse than that, he got lucky.

Steal my stuff I might kick your a$$ depending on what it was.

Harm my family or close friend it will be a ............vendetta......against you and yours.

Old video is old.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/582770-Messenger-beats-bike-thief
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/583026-Don-t-steal-bikes-bro

"Don't steal bikes, bro" was all over the internet when it was posted two years ago. Welcome to the now.

Steal my stuff I might kick your a$$ depending on what it was.

Harm my family or close friend it will be a ............vendetta......against you and yours.

Damn Nightshade!

That's sounds just like the mentality of the Crips and the Bloods! Certainly we're above urban barbarianism!

- Slim :)

I am surprised he didn't, 3 on 1 in NYC getting caught stealing someones bike usually ends worse than that, he got lucky.

I hope you weren't wishing violence upon the guy!

- Slim :)

I hope you weren't wishing violence upon the guy!

- Slim :)
LOL I never said I was the pacifist!

Pacifists don't champion 'street justice' or mob violence.

They could have grabbed the guy and held him for LEO.

It is all fine and dandy to speak in the abstract.

I too agree that violence should only be used as a last resort.

If it was my bike, however, that was stolen I might be inclined to administer more than just a little street justice.

Damn Nightshade!

That's sounds just like the mentality of the Crips and the Bloods! Certainly we're above urban barbarianism!

- Slim :)

No false bravado or street gang mentality at all. I meant what I said.............

Steal my bike.......big deal since I've got insurance for that and most everything I own.

Messing with my family or close friend is a whole different story...........

That is all I'll say on the topic.

Violence breeds violence. People with tough guy syndrome are often as bad as criminals and often meet a "humbling" experience. Get tough with a bike thief and you might find they can be every bit as organized as any gang. That video could just have easily been one vigilante cyclist victim who decided to rough up the thief and then got jumped by the thief's lookout partners. Unless threatened with immediate bodily harm it is beyond stupid to take a simple problem/crime to physical altercation these days.

Violence breeds violence. People with tough guy syndrome are often as bad as criminals and often meet a "humbling" experience. Get tough with a bike thief and you might find they can be every bit as organized as any gang. That video could just have easily been one vigilante cyclist victim who decided to rough up the thief and then got jumped by the thief's lookout partners. Unless threatened with immediate bodily harm it is beyond stupid to take a simple problem/crime to physical altercation these days.

That's right, HokuLoa!

A G R E E D !

- Slim :)

Ever been so pissed, you just plain lose it?

- Slim :)

I'm just say'n...

Got to agree. Some a$$wipe trying to steal my bike and acting likes it's no big deal- I'd be looking to land a kick in the ribs with intention to break at least one. I'm a calm & gentle soul. I'm also human.

Got to agree. Some a$$wipe trying to steal my bike and acting likes it's no big deal- I'd be looking to land a kick in the ribs with intention to break at least one. I'm a calm & gentle soul. I'm also human.

Yes, Flying Merkel!

However, in this society, if we're to evolve, we must take a higher road and not resort to the lowest form of human interaction____ and that's violence!

- Slim :)

Do you know what Pacifist means?

Sure. A pacifist is a person who doesn't believe in violence - till the wind shifts and he hoists the Jolly Roger.

Sure. A pacifist is a person who doesn't believe in violence - till the wind shifts and he hoists the Jolly Roger.

God! I want you to be so wrong about that assumption!

- Slim :)

Sure. A pacifist is a person who doesn't believe in violence - till the wind shifts and he hoists the Jolly Roger.

LOL! Yo ho, yo ho the violent life fer me!!!

Seriously though, it IS awful tough to take the correct, high road when one gets "hot." There is a time and place for violence (I think) but unless there is a real physical threat to "you and yours" escalation is a foolish decision. MUCH better to involve a sanctioned authority rather than go pirate and risk death and/or prosecution for a non-threatening crime.

(The jolly roger image does amuse me greatly though!)

We all have a few truely reprehensible instincts.

I dunno... i shot the last guy who tried to steal my car. Granted I was still in it at the time.

If it was my livelihood, ive got babies... **** that guy.

Yes, Flying Merkel!

However, in this society, if we're to evolve, we must take a higher road and not resort to the lowest form of human interaction____ and that's violence!



- Slim :)

Very noble. In the neighborhood I live in, taking the higher road will get you labeled a chump. You will be the perpetual target. Sometimes, you have to show your evil side.

...You're not dated... You're reminded!..

- Slim :)

Hey pal, are you talking to me? (bro?)

Violence breeds violence. People with tough guy syndrome are often as bad as criminals and often meet a "humbling" experience. Get tough with a bike thief and you might find they can be every bit as organized as any gang. That video could just have easily been one vigilante cyclist victim who decided to rough up the thief and then got jumped by the thief's lookout partners. Unless threatened with immediate bodily harm it is beyond stupid to take a simple problem/crime to physical altercation these days.

we're not talking about starting a bar fight because someone looked at you wrong, we're talking about catching a thief trying to take your property. there's a difference between having "tough guy syndrome" and having a pair of balls between your legs. the "problem" these days is said best by george carlin, "the pussification of the american male".

However, in this society, if we're to evolve, we must take a higher road and not resort to the lowest form of human interaction____ and that's violence!

- Slim :)

"we" as a society are evolving into wusses. i'm not saying violence is the only answer, but it's definitely tool that needs to be used every now and again.

Hey pal, are you talking to me? (bro?)


Yeah Bro, I'm talkin' to ya!

Sup!

- Slim :)

"we" as a society are evolving into wusses. i'm not saying violence is the only answer, but it's definitely tool that needs to be used every now and again.

I'm still waiting upon the day when our spears will become prunning hooks and our shields will become plowshares...

Of course, that's if we don't all get nuked, first!

Folks! There's just got to be another way!

- Slim :)

The consensus when this video popped up 2 years ago was that it was either staged, or everyone involved was too inept for belief. The 'thief' wasn't apparently hurt, and the aggressive vigilante couldn't land a solid blow to save his life. How many swipes did he take, and there's no blood? Amazing.

I blame the lawyers and justice system ,more then the criminals. I believe in old fashioned justice. If I was the Ruler of this world the first thing I would do is get rid of the "lawyer proffession", because it's useless and all it does is protect criminals and lets them off the hook, back into society.. where they continue to take advantage of the corrupt justice system.

The consensus when this video popped up 2 years ago was that it was either staged, or everyone involved was too inept for belief. The 'thief' wasn't apparently hurt, and the aggressive vigilante couldn't land a solid blow to save his life. How many swipes did he take, and there's no blood? Amazing.

Or it could be that most people can't fight well. We see movies and MMA fights on TV, but most people just flail their arms around in a fight hoping to land a hit and not get hit themselves.

You know...at the end of the day, I guess we're just the animals we were created to be. World wars, violence, and bloodshed will continue to characterize us as the weak and fearful mammals that we are. It's out of our fear that we make weapons! It's also out of our fear that we run when unarmed, in the face of ferosity.

It's our own fear that will defeat us in the end, not some ghost from hither, or some alien from another part of the universe. We will prove more than adequately efficient at devastating ourselves, permanently. Afterall, it's in our DNA! We'll just pass this defective gene along, until one day...doomsday!

- Slim :)

Actually, I think these dudes attacking this thief were fairly lenient. They could have really hurt him badly. They were not wimpy attackers. More like ultimate fighters behind a grated fence. He's lucky to have gotten away, virtually unscathed.

Don't "Bro" me if ya don't know me.

Don't "Bro" me if ya don't know me.

Yo Bro!...Sup!

- Slim :)

we're not talking about starting a bar fight because someone looked at you wrong, we're talking about catching a thief trying to take your property. there's a difference between having "tough guy syndrome" and having a pair of balls between your legs. the "problem" these days is said best by george carlin, "the pussification of the american male".

Here's what Betty thinks about having a set of balls

Here's what Betty thinks about having a set of balls

That Betty White is as Funny as Hell, I'll tell ya! :roflmao2::roflmao2::roflmao2:

- Slim :)

Yes, Flying Merkel!

However, in this society, if we're to evolve, we must take a higher road and not resort to the lowest form of human interaction____ and that's violence!

- Slim :)

Humility, meekness, kindness are not the highest human virtues. They're just other words for weakness. I'm not a hardass but if I caught someone trying to steal my bike, I'd be so angered, I might be moved to take vengeance. Nietzche believed that in the evolution of humanity, the old virtues of Christianity were replaced with a new morality, the will to war, the will to power, to overpower. Strength over weakness is the new arbiter of what is just. That's what Nietzsche thought, at least. Feel free to correct me anyone. I've been reading Will Durant's the Story of Philosophy and that's as much as I understood of Nietzsche.


I'm not saying you're not taking a risk in taking justice into your own hands, just offering a counterpoint to people who are saying violence is always wrong.

I'm still waiting upon the day when our spears will become prunning hooks and our shields will become plowshares...

Of course, that's if we don't all get nuked, first!

Folks! There's just got to be another way!

- Slim :)

slim, with all due respect, sometimes I just don't know wtf you are talking about...and not just in this thread.

slim, with all due respect, sometimes I just don't know wtf you are talking about...and not just in this thread.

I was trying to reference what I thought I remembered from the bible at Isaiah 2:4. However, as it turns out our swords get converted into plowshares and our spears into pruning hooks...It really doesn't matter. The point is that we are supposed to have the hope that our innate ways of war and fear will be overturned by the ultimate in righteous power...Afterwards, a millenium of peace and tranquility is supposed to dwell throughout the earth and the Great Crowd...

- Slim :)

PS.

Don't worry about it, my friend!

You can no more understand the insane, than you can understand yourself...

we're not talking about starting a bar fight because someone looked at you wrong, we're talking about catching a thief trying to take your property. there's a difference between having "tough guy syndrome" and having a pair of balls between your legs. the "problem" these days is said best by george carlin, "the pussification of the american male".

Balls are far less important than brains. Ask any woman. Men are usually the only ones to make that mistake due to some perceived masculinity conflict/question. It is without a doubt tough guy syndrome to jump a bike thief who is not actually attacking you. Anyone with a critical brain who has spent considerable time around real violence and its consequences knows how foolish it is to escalate a non-violent crime to violence when there are a myriad of better, more effective ways of dealing with the problem. "Tough guys" simply convince themselves that it is "necessary" to do so for whatever their personal justification. More often than not they fall back on the "balls" and "wussy" arguments as self-justifications and to boost their own egos (no I'm not trying to bad mouth you....). Fact of the matter is using your brain and "ending " the criminal w/o violence is WAY SMARTER than risking personal death or prison. Save your moments of physical affirmation for when they are truly warranted like stepping up for someone who is getting attacked.....

Oh, and careful taking your life lesson cues from a comedian no matter how funny he may be...

Humility, meekness, kindness are not the highest human virtues. They're just other words for weakness. I'm not a hardass but if I caught someone trying to steal my bike, I'd be so angered, I might be moved to take vengeance. Nietzche believed that in the evolution of humanity, the old virtues of Christianity were replaced with a new morality, the will to war, the will to power, to overpower. Strength over weakness is the new arbiter of what is just. That's what Nietzsche thought, at least. Feel free to correct me anyone. I've been reading Will Durant's the Story of Philosophy and that's as much as I understood of Nietzsche.


I'm not saying you're not taking a risk in taking justice into your own hands, just offering a counterpoint to people who are saying violence is always wrong.

Rubbish (respectfully). You can have each of those virtues in spades and still be a savage person in necessary circumstances. Lots of more thoughtful professional soldiers embody both and know when to turn off or on using their brain first and their brawn second. As for Nietzsche he is grotesquely overrated as model for action and is really only fully relevant in the context of his geopolitical time frame. I like a counterpoint but in this case it isn't all that applicable. Violence certainly has its place but this really isn't it. Truly strong people know the difference and make a distinction between situations that warrant and necessitate physical actions and those that simply do not.

You know...at the end of the day, I guess we're just the animals we were created to be. World wars, violence, and bloodshed will continue to characterize us as the weak and fearful mammals that we are. It's out of our fear that we make weapons! It's also out of our fear that we run when unarmed, in the face of ferosity.

It's our own fear that will defeat us in the end, not some ghost from hither, or some alien from another part of the universe. We will prove more than adequately efficient at devastating ourselves, permanently. Afterall, it's in our DNA! We'll just pass this defective gene along, until one day...doomsday!

- Slim :)



Balls are far less important than brains. Ask any woman. Men are usually the only ones to make that mistake due to some perceived masculinity conflict/question. It is without a doubt tough guy syndrome to jump a bike thief who is not actually attacking you. Anyone with a critical brain who has spent considerable time around real violence and its consequences knows how foolish it is to escalate a non-violent crime to violence when there are a myriad of better, more effective ways of dealing with the problem. "Tough guys" simply convince themselves that it is "necessary" to do so for whatever their personal justification. More often than not they fall back on the "balls" and "wussy" arguments as self-justifications and to boost their own egos (no I'm not trying to bad mouth you....). Fact of the matter is using your brain and "ending " the criminal w/o violence is WAY SMARTER than risking personal death or prison. Save your moments of physical affirmation for when they are truly warranted like stepping up for someone who is getting attacked.....

Oh, and careful taking your life lesson cues from a comedian no matter how funny he may be...

i think we've veered off course, let's bring it back towards the topic at hand, bike thieves.

i'll simplify my outlook on the situation: violence isn't the only answer, but sometimes a person deserves an ass kicking.

Theft of property can and should be a capitol crime.

Most of us have heard the phrase "Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness". What many are unaware of is that Jefferson plagiarized the concept from John Locke (whose ideas served as the philosophical underpinnings of our society) who coined the original phrase "Life, liberty, and property".

When dealing with the anti-social (of which all criminals are but one example) there are two possibilities capitulation or violence. That violence can be vigilante or governmental--never the less it is violence.

Theft of property can and should be a capitol crime.

Most of us have heard the phrase "Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness". What many are unaware of is that Jefferson plagiarized the concept from John Locke (whose ideas served as the philosophical underpinnings of our society) who coined the original phrase "Life, liberty, and property".

When dealing with the anti-social (of which all criminals are but one example) there are two possibilities capitulation or violence. That violence can be vigilante or governmental--never the less it is violence.

While Jefferson and Locke were great historic figures and philosophers. They lived centuries ago. Times have changed. Today, Jefferson would no longer be able to own slaves, and Locke would no longer be able to profit from "The Royal Africa" slave trading company. Moral values have changed as well. Most Americans no longer live by the motto, "Spare the rod, spoil the child" either. We have somewhat evolved as a society, to the point of accepting people with diverse ethnicities, and biological differences.

Violence does not really solve any type of a non-violent crime. Of course, you could go round up all of the bike thieves within a fifty-mile radius and have them all summarily shot in the head. However, should you stop there?
Why not kill car thieves? ...Why not kill all forgers, burglars, and drug dealers?...Why not kill all convicted felons?

Be careful, there may be some white-collar felons in there too...You know how much we hate to convict and punish white-collar criminals! Should they be rounded up and killed too?

I say, if these thieves are on drugs, then let's see to it that as part of their sentencing, they are committed to some drug rehab facility. If they are non-violent repeated offenders, then let's provide a honorable trade, by which they may return to society so that they can support themselves and their families.

If they are repeated violent offenders, then let's make certain that they are released with a skill, given appropriate counseling, and kept under strict scrutiny for two years. However, after three strikes, you're out!

Personally, I beileve, that most older bike thieves are drug addicts. Drug addiction is a disease that can be cured by many other means than death or violence...

- Slim :)