General Cycling Discussion - The Good Name of Schwinn

I remember a time when the name Schwinn used to be synonymous with bicycle quality. Sure, there were other brand named bicycles around. However, if it wasn't a Schwinn, your bike was somehow looked upon as being somewhat less than a Schwinn. It really didn't matter too much what the actual, mechanical merits that your bicycle possessed, it was the name.

Everyone knew, that if the Schwinn name was on it, it stood for, longevity, durability, and reliability. To everyone back in the 50's and 60's, Schwinn bicycles were the most popular bicycles for the youth. Captain Kangaroo used to always remind us kids about how Schwinn bikes were the best bikes made in America. Subsequently, practically every kid in America wanted a shiny new bicycle endorsed by their favorite TV star. At that time, Schwinn bikes were durable and reliable. All were made of hi-tensile steel, and most lasted for over a decade. There were so many Schwinn tricycles and bicycles being handed down to younger siblings across the nation. Everyone just had to know, that Schwinn made bicycles were just as good as the Captain had promised us, they all were. For almost two decades, this is what America believed.

Schwinn also experienced modest success with its most exclusive road bike called the paramount. Its frame was made of 531 steel and its tubes were completely lugged. It had a Campagnolo drive train and fine leather seats. The paramount appealed to the upper middle, upper class of cyclists, and of course the professional racer.

Schwinn also tried to appeal to the common everyday cyclist who might try to emulate the more elite and well-to-do cyclists, by providing road bikes called, the Varsity and the Continental. Many of these bikes sold throughout the 1960's. However, their sales began to plummet in the late 70's due to a heavy influx of European and Japanese 10 speed bikes of much lighter mass. Schwinn failed to upgrade its product line and continued to attempt to sell the heavy Hi-Tensile steel-frame of the Varsity and Continental.

Schwinn experienced records sales of youth oriented bicycles back in the 50' and 60's, with the introduction of the Sting Ray with its high-riser handlebars and its banana seat. It didn't take long for that style to take off at all. All the kids in my neighborhood, thought the Sting Ray was just a blast!

It would appear that as long as Schwinn kept youth-oriented, it did well. However, once it lost its focus upon the youth, it began to downwardly spiral. It always trailed the crest of the BMX wave back in the 1970's, by always producing bikes that were slightly less competitive than the rest. By the time Schwinn caught on to the proper type of BMX racing bike to produce, in the form of the Predator, back in 1982, the BMX craze had leveled. Schwinn did practically that same thing when it came to Mountain Bikes (MTN bikes). At first, they claimed that MTN bikes were just a fad. They refused to acknowledge the obvious popularity of the mountain bike (MTB) and missed out on miilions of dollars in sales revenue. Schwinn has had a history of producing inferior MTN bikes ever since the first one they've ever made, back in 1978 called the Klunker5.

They've been floundering ever since with one mediocre MTB, after another. The Spitfire, the King Sting, and the Sidewinder, have all been MTN bikes of mediocre qualilty and have not done much to uplift the name of Schwinn. Their hybrid and road bikes were once wracked with cheap componentry.

However, when it comes to hybrid and road bikes, Schwinn has definitely improved, here lately. The improvements may not have been monumental, but they indeed have not been incremental, either. The top of the line Schwinn road bike, would be the Fastback Comp. It is featured in a triple butted 6061 aluminum frame, a carbon fork, and a carbon wrapped seat post, with a 105 drivetrain. It also comes in five different sizes. At the top of the hybrid heap, we have the Sporterra Comp. It also comes with a triple butted aluminum frame, a carbon fork, an alivio rear derailleur and an altus for the front. That's pretty good for Schwinn of 2012.

Schwinn is obviously trying to make a comeback. Let's all pray that the new Schwinn has at least half the quality of the days of Captain Kangaroo. Perhaps Dorel Industries can restore the good name of Schwinn, for old times sake.

- Slim :)

Tripple butted aluminum?

Tripple butted aluminum?

Yes, Nermal!

Triple-butted means that the tube has three different measured thicknesses. For example, the two ends of the downtube may be of different thicknesses, as well as the middle of the downtube. That means that it's triple-butted.

- Slim :)

Hmmm, I wasn't even born back then so I have no idea how good they were. I did a wiki on them and it's not the original company anymore? it's bought over? Not to sure but I think so.

Schwinn rode the Sting-Ray craze for all it was worth, but when lightweight '10-speed' road bikes started becoming more popular in the early- to mid-70s, they didn't get the message. Their competition was producing bikes that weighed in the high 20s and low 30s; but they stubbornly clung to the notion that heavier meant more durable, and continued to produce 40+ pound behemoths. The other thing they clung to was their prices, which could be double what a much more desirable bike would cost. So when the mountain bike craze hit, they were already on the ropes, trying to play catch-up to everyone else.

No Hands: The Rise and Fall of the Schwinn Bicycle Company: An American Institution (http://www.alibris.com/booksearch?qisbn=9780805035537&qsort=p?&cm_mmc=shopcompare-_-bing-_-shopping-_-na) by Judith Crown.

You can probably find it at your library.

Schwinn rode the Sting-Ray craze for all it was worth, but when lightweight '10-speed' road bikes started becoming more popular in the early- to mid-70s, they didn't get the message. Their competition was producing bikes that weighed in the high 20s and low 30s; but they stubbornly clung to the notion that heavier meant more durable, and continued to produce 40+ pound behemoths. The other thing they clung to was their prices, which could be double what a much more desirable bike would cost. So when the mountain bike craze hit, they were already on the ropes, trying to play catch-up to everyone else.

My first bike with speeds was a Scwhinn Woodlands moutain bike (what we used to call a 10 speed) from the local Scwhinn dealer (I believe it was just called the Scwhinn Cyclery) in 1989 at my 10th birthday. It was a decent enough bike that I rode it all the way throughout college though it had gotten pretty beaten up by the end.

Brand names are a commodity to be sold, now basically Waterford is the Schwinn Paramount.
Richard Schwinn founded it with partners, when the family brand name went on the marketplace,
[ I believe, .. (not a partner in the transaction) .. ]

Brand names are a commodity to be sold, now basically Waterford is the Schwinn Paramount.
Richard Schwinn founded it with partners, when the family brand name went on the marketplace,
[ I believe, .. (not a partner in the transaction) .. ]

Yeah, sadly names mean little in this modern, globalized economy. I always find it amusing and a little sad when people dogmatically defend a corporate brand that is no longer even a shade of its former self do to changed hands and completely different standards.

Top of the line Schwinn is and always will be the Paramount:

http://www.performancebike.com/bikes/ProductDisplay?storeId=10052&langId=-1&catalogId=10551&productId=1098876&utm_source=Google_Product_Search&utm_medium=cse&utm_campaign=datafeed&CAWELAID=859294148

http://www.gifflix.com/media/809/Lame_Thread/

Could it be that you were a sucker for good marketing when you were a kid, Slim? :p

Could it be that you were a sucker for good marketing when you were a kid, Slim? :p


Then I was in a huge crowd of suckers all across the nation. Be careful, some of your closest relatives could have been in the crowd. Ask your parents about Schwinn...They'll tell ya!

- Slim :)

Then I was in a huge crowd of suckers all across the nation. Be careful, some of your closest relatives could have been in the crowd. Ask your parents about Schwinn?...They'll tell ya!

- Slim :)
That was a big crowd, I was a kid in the 60's and 70's, and Schwinn was the cool bike then. Especially the Stingray.

I dunno I think Schwinn had marketing cornered, not bike quality.. I love my 67 racer deluxe and all but it's a "Light weight" it outweighs my all steel 72 raleigh sport.. by enough to matter. I also love my le tour.. but again the frameset comes in at close to 8 lbs! My path beater is also a schwinn, much newer though I think it's on 06 timberline or high timber.. one of the two, the components level definitely went down on the newer stuff... and again other then compared to box store bikes.. it's HEAVY! I love schwinn, but I don't think I'd say it was ever more then a good name in hype. (With the notable exceptions of anything that came out of Waterford.)

Schwinn came out with the Varsity and sparked the bike boom of the 70s. The Stingray started the BMX craze, which played a big part in inspiring the mountain bike movement. Schwinn then got complacent and blew the biggest opportunities in bicycle history. I loved my EF Schwinns, but they were obsolete a long time ago.

The things that carry the Schwinn name in Wallymart are horrors. I'm riding a '64 Varsity framed cruiser. What BSO will be around in 47 years?

If it's thicker at both ends, and lighter in the middle, that's double butted. It just happens to have three sections with differing thickness of tubing.

Well as a kid (in the 70's) I remember hearing the name "Schwinn" on "The Price is Right" TV game show. I didn't know Schwinns were "the" bike to own (I guess I didn't even contemplate the concept of brands and competition among brands). I doubt anyone living within 20 miles of me owned a Schwinn. I lived up a "holler" 10 miles from a small town in extreme southwest Virginia USA and didn't even know that bikes existed that cost over $100.

My first bike was a single speed with a banana seat and 20 inch wheels/tires from Western Auto (I think it had "Western Flyer" written on the chain guard) and it seemed like a good bike, I think I rode it for like 8 years until I out- grew it. (could it had been a rebranded Schwinn? Did they do that kind of thing?I think it cost around $60).

A few years ago at 40 years of age (after infrequently riding an ill-fitting Huffy for 20 years) I got back into cycling. My first first "real" adult bike was a Bikesdirect Windford Stratford flatbar road bike with an aluminum frame.

In time I wanted to try a chromoly-framed roadbike with dropbars. I found an '86 (Chicago) Schwinn Traveler for $150 (including shipping) on ebay (I found an old Schwinn catalog online and I think the original list price for the bike was around $150 also). I think its a very decent bike. It's got Shamano parts (I don't know what level they would compare to today), stem shifters which I like (I would rather though have the shifter for the rear derailer be indexed like another BD bike with stem-shifters that I have). The bike weighs around 28 lbs which is okay by me (my mid-80's Huffy weighs around 35 lbs in comparison). Its got a two-ring chainring upfront and 6 gears in the back. I like the simplistic but very functional dual brake levers that allow braking while the hands are in the top position. I know its not technologically up-to-date and is considered quite heavy for a road bike today but with a little tweaking (I need to get the handle bars higher/closer for a perfect fit and I'd like indexing on the rear derailer) I would be quite satified if this '86 Schwinn Traveler was my only bike.

Schwinn's electroforged beasts were made of 1010 steel, not 1020/Hi-Ten steel. http://sheldonbrown.com/varsity.html
Why no mention of the made-in-Japan LeTour and related Schwinn bikes? I took up cycling with a Continental but got totally hooked on a LeTour which was pretty nice once I equipped it with aluminum wheels.
Sting-Rays? Kids toys that didn't exist when I was a kid.

Schwinn's electroforged beasts were made of 1010 steel, not 1020/Hi-Ten steel. http://sheldonbrown.com/varsity.html
Why no mention of the made-in-Japan LeTour and related Schwinn bikes? I took up cycling with a Continental but got totally hooked on a LeTour which was pretty nice once I equipped it with aluminum wheels.
Sting-Rays? Kids toys that didn't exist when I was a kid.

Hi there JanMM!

1010 steel is still a type of hi-tensile steel. The middle number simply indicates the relative amount of carbon added to the iron alloy, steel. Evidently, the more carbon added, the harder the alloy, steel becomes. Therefore, while 1010 steel is harder than iron, it still maintains its heavy mass, and does not increase in the actual strength of the alloy steel. Had molybdenum and chromiun been added in addition to carbon, then a much superior type of steel would have made called, chromoly steel. One of the strongest types of steel ever to make bicycles. A material so strong, that the walls of bicycle tubing can be made thin enough, to make the bike as light as some of its aluminum, counterparts.

1010, 1020, and 1030, are all types of hi-tensile steel.

I thank you for your contribution.

- Slim :)

PS.

The narrative was already too long, JanMM. I thought about the Le Tour, but opted out. Sorry..

When I was a kid (the 1950s) it was either a Schwinn or an "English bike." An "English bike" meant a Raleigh or a a Rudge, with the 3-speed Sturmey-Archer hub. I think I knew one kid with a FOUR-speed Sturmey-Archer hub; it seemed unbelievable.

The problem is only Waterford makes a bike like the old Paramount. The new Schwinn Paramount is just another bike. Between it and a Fuji, or any number of other bikes sold at Performance I am not sure I would give Schwinn another shot. I might but the name garners a sneer from other cyclists today. Schwinn can be used in the same paragraph with Bikes direct and no one will notice.

I got my hands on an old Schwinn twinsport not long ago and have received advice not to put much money into restoring it. And I never saw the Varsity or Continental as a real road bike.

When I was a kid (the 1950s) it was either a Schwinn or an "English bike." An "English bike" meant a Raleigh or a a Rudge, with the 3-speed Sturmey-Archer hub. I think I knew one kid with a FOUR-speed Sturmey-Archer hub; it seemed unbelievable.

Who would ever need four speeds? That's ludicrous.

1010 steel is still a type of hi-tensile steel
1010, 1020, and 1030, are all types of hi-tensile steel.


1010 is lower tensile strength that 1020.

This from Sheldon: "Hi-Ten - A fancy-sounding name for the ordinary tubing used to build cheap bicycle frames"

Slim I suggest that you look into how Schwinn buckled to the pressure by WalMart. And why there are currently two different divisions of Schwinn.

I might but the name garners a sneer from other cyclists today. Schwinn can be used in the same paragraph with Bikes direct and no one will notice.

I got my hands on an old Schwinn twinsport not long ago and have received advice not to put much money into restoring it. And I never saw the Varsity or Continental as a real road bike.

Approval from "sneering" cyclists and talk about "real" road bikes were hardly a focus for the consumers of Schwinn products prior to the "bike boom" of the 1970's. Don't know that current Schwinn consumers are all that concerned today either.

Seems much more a concern of the bike provenance obsessed/weight weenie set.

I think they're basically disposable cheap bikes. The kind of ride you might leave locked up with a chain and Master combo padlock in an older part of town, and not worry too much about it.

I was a kid in the '50s and early '60s, and rode a Schwinn. It was more tank than bicycle. Years later, I re-entered bicycling and got a new DiamondBack, which got stolen. Since 1995, I've been riding a GT Xizang (titanium) hardtail mountain bike. I swap my narrow road tires-wheels for my off-road knobbies or vice-versas, when I change my riding style for the day. I'm a happy camper.

Approval from "sneering" cyclists and talk about "real" road bikes were hardly a focus for the consumers of Schwinn products prior to the "bike boom" of the 1970's. Don't know that current Schwinn consumers are all that concerned today either.

Seems much more a concern of the bike provenance obsessed/weight weenie set.

Don't know about that. I see a lot of posts in these forums that are anti big box bike and Schwinn fits right in those brackets. I remember the old days when Schwinn was last gasping for air and weight was only one reason for scorn. Even today do you long for a Stove pipe schwinn? I doubt it and I doubt there is a good name attached to the new schwinns either. Current Schwinn customers seem to be the same customers that buy Next and as I said Bikes direct bikes. Or do you have some indication that Schwinn has redeemed itself and the new Paramount has the same following as the old one? In the last few years I can't remember even one time someone suggesting a Schwinn when I or anyone else here asked for a bike suggestion, would you suggest one as a quality bike choice?

Harley-Davidson has a brand name that is gold. Schwinn could have been the bicycling equivalent, but fooked it up royally. No the Schwinn brand name is trash.

Slim I suggest that you look into how Schwinn buckled to the pressure by WalMart. And why there are currently two different divisions of Schwinn.

Hey there Siu Blue Wind!

Apparently, Walmart is Dorel's primary retail outlet store. Since Walmart is China's fifth largest export market, just behind Germany, Walmart places excruciatingly painful financial pressures upon Dorel and any other business dependent upon its strong retail attraction for the world consumer. Dorel is dependent upon OEM's to produce products that Walmart will purchase at an already predetermined price. All business parties, must therefore, meet Walmart's price, in order to do business with Walmart. That means that Dorel must ensure that all related OEM's keep labor costs down, so that they may have continued access to the huge retail magnetism of Walmart. Of course Dorel, is merely following the example that Pacific Cycle began, back in August of 2002. Pacific Cycles led the way of labor exploitation in China. Dorel though, has augmented the prohibitive labor demands placed upon its OEM workers due to its enhanced profit incentive from Walmart. At this time China has one of the cheapest labor markets in the world. The average Chinese worker makes $105 per month. There's no way that an American worker can complete with that price for labor.

Since Schwinn is an integral part of Dorel and acts as its subsidiary, it has to remain compliant with its demands. Therefore, Dorel mandated that Schwinn make its bicycles more accessible to Walmart and at even cheaper prices. This made it compulsory for OEM's to use the cheapest materials in the production of components of all bicycles, destined for Walmart. This would include Schwinn. Dorel industries therefore, have two lines of Schwinn bicycles. One line is earmarked exclusively for Walmart and a few other big boxed bicycle depatment store outlets and come from mainland, China. The other more refined line of bicycles are made in Taiwan and are produce exclusively for local bicycle shop retail. Unfortunately, at the end of the day, Schwinn will always remain on many American cyclist's conscience, as a dysfunctionally cheap product of Walmart. A product that generates objects shaped to look most conspicuously, like bicycles.

- Slim :)

PS.

Apparently, the Schwinn Paramount series are no longer in production, but their remaining inventory from 2011 and 2010 are still being sold by Peformance. It would appear as though, the more refined line of Schwinn, is gradually disappearing.

Don't know about that. I see a lot of posts in these forums that are anti big box bike and Schwinn fits right in those brackets.
You and I have different opinions on how representative the BF anti big box bike contingent are of the bicycle buying public, specifically the people who purchase the bulk of the bicycles sold in the U.S.

I doubt if there are any lists on BF that accurately reflect a wide slice of the bicycling public. Perhaps you are of the opinion that people who purchase bicycles at big box stores are not Real Cyclists,™ and therefore their opinion on the value delivered for the price is irrelevant.

You and I have different opinions on how representative the BF anti big box bike contingent are of the bicycle buying public, specifically the people who purchase the bulk of the bicycles sold in the U.S.

I doubt if there are any lists on BF that accurately reflect a wide slice of the bicycling public. Perhaps you are of the opinion that people who purchase bicycles at big box stores are not Real Cyclists,™ and therefore their opinion on the value delivered for the price is irrelevant.

It is never good to assume what opinion I might have not knowing me. :lol: Mine is not the first opinion that Schwinn no longer exists except in name. I do base my speculation on how in the middle of the largest bike boom our country had seen Schwinn lost market share because they didn't seem to see what the customer wanted. Some of the best Schwinns made other than the revamped Paramount were really Bridgestones and Panasonics. So it wasn't that they didn't know what people wanted it seems as if they felt they knew best. Once that happened the "Good" name of Schwinn started to die and only Waterford has kept the ideal of Quality alive. IMHO.

As an example there are people still producing stories about Sherlock Holms, they are not however the same as Authur Conan Doyle.:D

I don't make a considereation on what kind of cyclists wally world bike buyers are. All I can judge by is how many we see in the trash bins and being adjusted correctly in the LBS shops where I live. So I say again, the "Good" name of Schwinn was sold to a company and they simply stuck their decal on whatever they felt like. Absolutly no judgement on my part just an observation that tends to be shared by more people I know and talk to than not.

Have you observed a different attitude in your circle of friends?:rolleyes:

Just an observation: I've noticed the bikes in Walmart with the Schwinn name on them are usually twice the price of the cheapest bikes they sell like Roadmaster (that was name they were using at least a couple of years ago anyway) and Next. The Schwinns also appear to me to be better bikes than the $60-$90 bottom offerings. I have in the past considered the Schwinn Avenue hybrid just to try a bike with slightly sway-back handlebars (the Avenue was around $199 a few years ago, now it is around $240).

Not really trying to make a great point, but apparently there are consumers that are a least willing to pay a bit more in hopes of getting a better bike (or these Schwinns won't be selling while sitting beside the cheaper bikes). Maybe the uninformed (bicycle-wise) who shop at Walmart think they are getting a great (top-of-the-line) bike when they shell out the extra cash for the Schwinn name. Maybe there is hope that the "race to the bottom" that I see mentioned in these forums (which goes something like: all the masses want is cheap goods and competition for the consumers dollars leads to a constant dropping of quality) might bottom out somewhere.

...Schwinn lost market share because they didn't seem to see what the customer wanted. Some of the best Schwinns made other than the revamped Paramount were really Bridgestones and Panasonics. So it wasn't that they didn't know what people wanted it seems as if they felt they knew best.

Bottom Line: What percentage of Schwinns sold at any period in its history were Paramounts or equivalent "quality"? Quality obviously in your mind means high end enthusiast models sold to the relative handful of Real Cyclists who can appreciate the "quality" of this type of bike.

I am sure that Real Cyclists™ sneer at the the great unwashed who don't "know best" and appreciate "quality" as the guys at the LBS. It is this attitude that makes them the arbiter of the Real Cyclist™ Creed

Yesterday's Schwinn racing bike is today's Cannondale by Dorel. Cannondale has more international appeal, something that Schwinn never had. One may knock Dorel for this but I think that's the reality for today.

Schwinn Mesa and Moab, same frame, good bikes.

You guys put way too much value on brand name.

Schwinn Mesa and Moab, same frame, good bikes.

You guys put way too much value on brand name.

....Ya Think!

- Slim :)

Bottom Line: What percentage of Schwinns sold at any period in its history were Paramounts or equivalent "quality"? Quality obviously in your mind means high end enthusiast models sold to the relative handful of Real Cyclists who can appreciate the "quality" of this type of bike.

I am sure that Real Cyclists™ sneer at the the great unwashed who don't "know best" and appreciate "quality" as the guys at the LBS. It is this attitude that makes them the arbiter of the Real Cyclist™ Creed

And yet their customers let them fail? If they made what ther customer wanted wouldn't they still be in business? And still they are not Schwinns, made by the Schwinn family anymore than Mini cooper is still a Mini cooper now that they are a small BMW.

What is this real cyclist thing you keep talking about? Is it some code word you use because I don't think anyone else did.

All I believe I said was today Schwinn is nothing more than any other bike Pacific makes. Just a differnt name plate. If someone is trying to be nostalgic about it only Waterford is made by Schwinn. Like Masi is made by Haro not Masi. Like Schwinn the name was sold to the highest bidder without using any hard parts or people from the origional company. By the way a real Masi made by the people that used to make Masiis still manufactured, but because the name was sold they are called Milano. Is there a real Schwill made by the people that made the origional Schwinns or even with Schwinn equipment? I think not. So to the question, the "good name of Schwinn" Sold out and is now the good name of Doral/Pacific.

I think whether or not you believe the Schwinn name stood for quality depends on how you define the word "quality." Yes, they were durable, and mostly reliable. But unless you invested in a Paramount, Schwinn bikes were also heavy and sluggish, and made with many inexpensive steel components that were prone to rust. If you were interested in performance, the sub-Paramount Schwinns were not what you thought of as "quality" bikes.

Actually the Paramount today does NOT represent Schwinn's top of the line road bikes, a different model named the Fastback is Schwinn's top of the line now. Paramount is the top of the line Schwinn that Walmart sells; but there's over a $1,000 difference between the two!

I have a 85 Schwinn LeTour Luxe made with Tenax (Columbus SL or SP that Columbus rejected due to cosmetic blemishes, but once painted the blemishes were concealed, but Columbus sold those to Schwinn renamed Tenax) double butted lugged steel frame and it's a great riding bike.

I don't think Schwinn will ever get back into the high end market, they've pretty much destroyed their image for that attempt. They would have to make a really nice road bike (with several excellent downgrade models from the top one), sponsor a few top level racing teams and market like crazy to get that recognition back. I don't think they have that desire. But I though back in the day Schwinn had too many crappy bikes like the Collegiate, Suburban, Varisty, Sprint, Continental, Traveler, Sportabout, Caliente, some of the LeTour's. They should have back then eliminated all but the Varisty for the low end market, and kept the Traveler and the LeTour for the next step up. The Collegiate and the Suburban were the lowest costing bikes but they were just as junky and heavy as the Varisty, so not sure what niche those were trying to fulfill that the Varisty couldn't. And then the Sprint and the Continental were basically another piece of crap but yet cost more the Varisty. I thought one piece of crap of a bike was enough for them back then, not alone 8! I think all of those junky bikes pretty much sealed the fate of Schwinn. They needed to concentrate on 2 or 3 low end bikes, 4 or 5 mid end, and 2 or 3 high end bikes. This would have removed all the confusion that Schwinn only made crappy bikes. That's my opinion anyway, very worthless one at that.

Harley-Davidson has a brand name that is gold. Schwinn could have been the bicycling equivalent, but fooked it up royally. No the Schwinn brand name is trash.

Well, Schwinn should look at what HD had done. In the late '70s when AMF owned Harley Davidson, they were the laughing-stock of motorcycles. The bikes were slow, unreliable and poor-handling compared to what was coming off the boat from Japan.

Well, Schwinn should look at what HD had done. In the late '70s when AMF owned Harley Davidson, they were the laughing-stock of motorcycles. The bikes were slow, unreliable and poor-handling compared to what was coming off the boat from Japan.

Harley came out with motorcycles that were true to their history. The Evolution HDs were also a huge step up in quality and reliability from the AMF days. Harley would be long gone if they had started buying cheap motorcycles from China with Harley stickers applied. They pulled off probably one of the greatest corporate comebacks ever. According to Sheldon's website, the electroforge process had a lot of untapped potential that new steel alloys could have exploited. Too late.

My Cub Scout pack got to visit Schwinn's Chicago factory back in the 60's. I remember the cool electro-static frame painting system, and the guy running painted fenders through the pinstriping machine by hand to give them the final touch. Yes, all of us kids wanted a Stingray. Schwinn didn’t just ride out the Stingray fad, they pioneered it.


My first bike was a single speed with a banana seat and 20 inch wheels/tires from Western Auto (I think it had "Western Flyer" written on the chain guard) and it seemed like a good bike, I think I rode it for like 8 years until I out- grew it. (could it had been a rebranded Schwinn? Did they do that kind of thing?I think it cost around $60).

No. Yours was an inferior copy that the Real Kids were sure to sneer at! :lol: Original Stingrays command top dollar today and have a cult like following. Here's one I restored:

http://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss306/mlskol/OrangeKratesidefront.jpg


Sting-Rays? Kids toys that didn't exist when I was a kid.

I feel sorry for you.

Yesterday's Schwinn's were solid bikes that were able to withstand plenty of use (even abuse) and keep right on rolling. I pick up many 30 and 40 year old units that often need nothing more than re-greasing, re-cabling and cleaning. They still roll as good as new.

The Schwinn's of today are comparable to any other brand at the same price point... certainly nothing to sneer at.

Yabba Dabba Doo!

That's a gorgeous job you've done there, AlmostTrick! :thumb:

- Slim :)

Any effort made at reviving Schwinn's mystique will only exploited by its owner-du-jour, who is only looking to squeeze what little value they can out of the logo while selling Chinese dreck. Same thing with Masi.
But viva the Information Age, you can still find some of the examples of what Schwinn was producing back before & during their zenith. Check Ebay.
I shopped for four years before I found an '86 Schwinn Peloton (my first real race bike) frame in my size, and then bam-another one popped up. So now I have two of those beauties; a 25-inch (pictured), and a 24-inch (currently undergoing build). These are the good-old days IMO.
http://www.calamarichris.com/images/100721-peloton430.jpg
http://www.calamarichris.com/images/100721-spyvspy.jpg
http://www.calamarichris.com/junk/1986peloton1.JPG
http://www.calamarichris.com/junk/1986peloton2.JPG

[QUOTE=calamarichris;13392433]Any effort made at reviving Schwinn's mystique will only exploited by its owner-du-jour, who is only looking to squeeze what little value they can out of the logo while selling Chinese dreck. Same thing with Masi.
But viva the Information Age, you can still find some of the examples of what Schwinn was producing back before & during their zenith. Check Ebay.
I shopped for four years before I found an '86 Schwinn Peloton (my first real race bike) frame in my size, and then bam-another one popped up. So now I have two of those beauties; a 25-inch (pictured), and a 24-inch (currently undergoing build). These are the good-old days IMO.

Hey there Calamarichris!

I'm sitting here just loving it!!.......What a beautiful bike! ...OMG!!! :love:

Most Respectfully,

- Slim :)

Slim I suggest that you look into how Schwinn buckled to the pressure by WalMart. And why there are currently two different divisions of Schwinn.

i was looking at schwinn's website and they have 2 lines, signature available only from schwinn dealers, and the mass market line.

Thanks for the kind compliment Slim.
The late 80's were a great time to be an admirer of Schwinn road bikes and terrible music.
Seriously, give Ebay a look once in while. There are Paramounts, Pelotons, Tempos, and some real beauts that come up now and then.
http://velospace.org/files/Schwinn_Tempo_001_resize.JPG

And another advantage is, it's not like buying a modern, Taiwan-built carbon fiber frame on Ebay. These steel beasties are the bicycle version of a Sherman tank!

Thanks for the kind compliment Slim.
The late 80's were a great time to be an admirer of Schwinn road bikes and terrible music.
Seriously, give Ebay a look once in while. There are Paramounts, Pelotons, Tempos, and some real beauts that come up now and then.

And another advantage is, it's not like buying a modern, Taiwan-built carbon fiber frame on Ebay. These steel beasties are the bicycle version of a Sherman tank!

Man! if you never hold another dollar, you're rich in my eyes!

You own two really beautiful bikes!.....I'm in awe....


- Slim :)

I am sure that Real Cyclists™ sneer at the the great unwashed who don't "know best" and appreciate "quality" as the guys at the LBS. It is this attitude that makes them the arbiter of the Real Cyclist™ Creed

This shtick was tiresome the first 100 times you posted it... are you unable to process a discussion about differences in quality without slipping in to the "real cyclist" and great "unwashed" diatribe ?

Anyways...

I think Slim forget to include the filet brazed Schwinns that were produced for over 40 years like the Superior, New World, Super Sport, and Sport Tourer which were all brass brazed 4130 chromoly frames.

They are often confused with the Varsity and Continental as electroforged frames resemble filet brazed frames.

Some of the workmanship on the frames is a little sloppy (but functional enough) and they were fitted with heavier parts like a one piece crank and Astabula bottom bracket but unlike the low end bikes of today that are fitted with the same type of bb assembly, these were very well made and designed to survive the apocalypse.

In the early 70's a Super Sport listed for $137.00 and the Sports Tourer listed for $196.00 and for those folks who know about these, they are a much sought after bicycle due to the solid frame construction and vintage appeal.

For as nice a these were they could compete with cheaper and lighter bicycles coming out of Japan that were fitted with nicer parts... while a Schwinn would have run a Huret the Japanese bicycles used Suntour and Shimano which offered superior shifting. And when Schwinn tarted using Shimano derailleurs they seems to like the Eagle which is solid but also a bit of a boat anchor.

Schwinn also sold a small number of very nice mountain bikes / atb's in the mid eighties that were Japanese built... believe these were made by Kuwahara while Japanese made Schwinn road bikes were made by Panasonic.

Like others, I do not believe that Schwinn will ever regain a reputation for providing a better quality bicycle as for decades Schwinn has been equated with lower end bicycles.

The story of Schwinn is also the story of the decline of the American manufacturing sector where the things we used were once built on this continent by our citizens and now the things we use are built overseas and we are merely consumers... in most cases.