Advocacy & Safety - Police kill rider: Cycling now a capitol offense in NC

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/10415249/
Don't act foolish now. They might kill you. Gotta keep cops safe.

While I generally support the police, in this case it was just plain stupid to stun someone on a bicycle. The cop should have known it would cause the cyclist to crash, and possibly injured.

I guess the stun gun was safer than spike strips.

Something tells me that there's going to be an update on police protocol in using tasers on cyclists, especially when the city gets the civil court bill.

A seriously idiotic move by the cop who did that.

As far as the original poster goes, let's not pretend that cycling is an capital offense in NC.

While I generally support the police, in this case it was just plain stupid to stun someone on a bicycle. The cop should have known it would cause the cyclist to crash, and possibly injured.

A stun gun should ONLY be used if the individual is an ACTUAL threat to the officer!!! Stun guns have become the 'quick fix' when the police come upon ANY situation!!!

Story was a bit one sided. I'd guess from the comment about putting his hand to his mouth, the cop thought he was trying to destroy evidence. I think the problem is less the police and more that innocent people are "suspicious" based on where they are and what time it is. If they are engaging in an "antisocial" activity like cycling, it's probably even worse.

-G

victim was deaf. He probably didn't think the cop was trying to stop him

had trouble hearingTo me means someone has a hard time understanding what people are saying, not that they cannot hear a siren.

Story was a bit one sided. I'd guess from the comment about putting his hand to his mouth, the cop thought he was trying to destroy evidence. I think the problem is less the police and more that innocent people are "suspicious" based on where they are and what time it is. If they are engaging in an "antisocial" activity like cycling, it's probably even worse.

-G

Given that the article said that the cyclist also suffered from seizures it's reasonable to think that he was taking his medication. Sounds as if the LEO jumped the gun. Also according to the article the LEO has only been on the job for a month, where was his training officer?

I'm going to take a wild guess (but no wilder than suggesting the cyclist was killed because he was on a bike): a big part of the offense was CWB, a variant on DWB. Look it up if you don't know what that means. That + deaf (not responding immediately to police call), + seizure condition/medication (unusual affect/manner) and an inexperienced and poorly trained officer, and you get that kind of tragic but completely preventable situation.

I'm going to take a wild guess (but no wilder than suggesting the cyclist was killed because he was on a bike): a big part of the offense was CWB, a variant on DWB. Look it up if you don't know what that means. That + deaf (not responding immediately to police call), + seizure condition/medication (unusual affect/manner) and an inexperienced and poorly trained officer, and you get that kind of tragic but completely preventable situation.

That is pretty accurate.

Given that the article said that the cyclist also suffered from seizures it's reasonable to think that he was taking his medication. Sounds as if the LEO jumped the gun. Also according to the article the LEO has only been on the job for a month, where was his training officer?

Another case of 'shoot first, ask questions later'.

Another case of 'shoot first, ask questions later'.

It sounds like it.

I have to wonder just what is the SOP that the police have for dealing with deaf/hearing impaired individuals.

It is also reasonable to think that given that the cyclist suffered from seizures, that that is why he fell? And that he wasn't drunk?

Even if he was drunk if he fell in an empty parking lot how is that a crime? Shouldn't the officer have pulled in front of the "suspect" and again lit up his lights?

Couldn't they have passed him and turned on the cherry while blocking him? Na, I'll just use this stun gun.

Couldn't they have passed him and turned on the cherry while blocking him? Na, I'll just use this stun gun.

This.

Generally, unless it's to block foot escape after terminating a high-speed chase, cops don't generally pull in front of a 'person of interest'; but a wobbly older man on a bike...? REALLY? You couldn't get his attention in a peaceful way? You felt so threatened that you TASED him? I probably would have been shot, just for being a smartass.

Peace to the family, and RIP to the victim. CWB, for sure.

Yet another witch hunt. Tazers are evil and those pigs are just abusing them! Look at all the stories that make the news! This cop acted like judge, jury, and executioner :rolleyes:

It's easy to judge a cop and his actions based on a local news story.

Yet another witch hunt. Tazers are evil and those pigs are just abusing them! Look at all the stories that make the news! This cop acted like judge, jury, and executioner :rolleyes:

It's easy to judge a cop and his actions based on a local news story.

Um, wut?:


Richmond to pay $1.5M in suit over police killing (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/11/23/BAU91M3HM8.DTL#ixzz1evsiQmqp)
Will Kane, Chronicle Staff Writer, Thursday, November 24, 2011

The city of Richmond has agreed to pay $1.5 million to the family of a mentally ill man killed in a struggle with police in 2008, officials said Wednesday....
Four officers used pepper spray, shock weapons and batons to subdue him. At one point they administered a Taser shock for 72 seconds straight, followed by several additional jolts, Dach's attorneys said.

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UHP to pay man shocked with Taser during traffic stop $40,000 (http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/52979392-78/jones-steed-case-taser.html.csp)
BY MELINDA ROGERS, The Salt Lake Tribune, First published Nov 23 2011 01:19PM, Updated Nov 23, 2011 07:08PM

A Salt Lake City man who sued a state trooper in federal court after she shocked him with her Taser during a traffic stop has received a $40,000 settlement in the case.

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Chattanooga Police Officer Arrested In Road Rage Incident (http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_213961.asp)
posted November 21, 2011

A Chattanooga police officer was arrested on a warrant for assault following a road rage incident on Brainerd Road this weekend. Officer Greg Chambers turned himself in to the Hamilton County Jail on Sunday in response to the charge.

Christopher Smith of 5512 Pearl St. in Ooltewah filed a complaint with the Hamilton County Sheriff’s Department against the officer in which it is alleged that Officer Chambers went to his home and pulled a taser on him Saturday night.

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Former Tuscaloosa Sheriff's sergeant pleads guilty to charges of wrongful Tasing (http://blog.al.com/tuscaloosa/2011/11/former_tuscaloosa_sheriffs_ser.html)
By Chris Pow, Wednesday, November 16, 2011, 4:38 PM, Updated: Wednesday, November 16, 2011, 6:33 PM

BIRMINGHAM, Alabama -- A former Tuscaloosa County Sheriff's sergeant pleaded guilty Wednesday in federal court to three counts of assault with a deadly weapon while acting under color of law for using a stun gun on jail detainees in separate incidents in 2008, the U.S. Justice Department announced.

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^^^ This is just tasering incidents that made the news in the past couple weeks. Want to hear about the cop beatings and peppersprayings that made the news? How 'bout the cop DUIs and sexual assaults?

FYI, here's one day. Of what's reported.

National Police Misconduct NewsFeed Daily Recap 11-24-11 to 11-25-11 (http://www.injusticeeverywhere.com/)

[Unterhausen: covered by creative commons notice at the bottom of the injusticeeverywhere.com site]

November 25th, 2011
Since I took the day off yesterday I decided it’s only fair to make today’s review of police misconduct reports a live blogging edition. So I posted them as I found them.

So, here are the 16 reports of police misconduct tracked in our National Police Misconduct News Feed for Thursday and Friday, November 24-25, 2011:

Richmond CA settled a lawsuit for $1.5mil to the family of a mentally ill man who died after tasered for 72 seconds straight and beaten with batons by 4 police officers.

Marco Island FL settles suit for $50k to a man who was punched then peppersprayed along with his two friends by a cop while they were cuffed in a police cruiser, as shown in the above video.

Chatham-Kent ON cop was charged with assault causing bodily harm after man suffered serious facial injuries while detained, no details about the actual incident were released.

A Kinston NC cop working an off-duty security gig at WalMart is accused of pepperspraying a man who accidentally fell into a cellphone display at that store. The spray affected at least 20 other shoppers and one news article decided to go with an Orwellian “Police use pepperspay to calm crowd” headline… I’m pretty sure that was pepperspay, not camomilespray.

In the same incident, Kinston NC police are being accused of arresting an ex-cop for complaining about that cop’s use of pepperspray inside a crowded store. Use of pepperspray in an enclosed area like that is generally discouraged because it takes a long time to dissipate and has an increased likelihood of affecting bystanders. This is considered a separate complaint from the use of pepperspray itself.

Buckeye AZ cops are accused of injuring a 54-year-old man, shown in the above video, by slamming him face-first into the concrete floor at a Toys-R-US after allegedly mistaking his attempt to save his grandson from being trampled by a Black-Friday shopping mob for an attempt at shoplifting. Generally, you can’t charge someone for shoplifting until that person tries to leave the store with the merchandise. Police say the officer did nothing wrong despite witness statements to the contrary.

Del City OK police accused of using excessive force by tackling #OccupyOKC protesters from behind for doing mic checks at Walmart store

Waterloo Regional ON police ordered to return property & pay $32k to man in suit over unlawful raid, arrest & strip search after police found nothing in his home.

Canyon Co ID sheriff and chief deputy sued by ACLU alleging retaliation against jail detainees who filed complaints about that jail in an apparent effort to derail a lawsuit alleging unconstitutional conditions there.

Nogales AZ cop suspended while investigated on allegations he had sex with a 17-year-old girl who was participating in that department’s explorer program. UPDATE: That officer has now been charged with 13 counts of sexual conduct with a minor based on those allegations.

Montreal QC police officer arrested on 2 charges of luring a child on the internet, no other details released

Stanislaus Co CA sheriff’s lieutenant on paid leave after charged with 2 counts of felony welfare fraud

Houston TX cops sued for racial profiling alleging they cuffed & searched a man for being white in black neighborhood

Barrie ON cop arrested on drunk driving charges while stopped for speeding, he was charged for drunk driving in 2005 as well but that case was dropped.

Clayton County GA cop was arrested for doing 108mph in a 55mph zone, he claimed he was afraid of a desolate road he was on and wanted to hurry up and get past it.

Mount Gilead OH cop was convicted on 18 of 20 theft charges despite his astounding defense that claimed that a ghost stole the city’s property, including 12 air conditioners, that were found in the basement of his home.

That’s finally it for today. Stay safe out there!

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16 reports of police misconduct. That made the papers. In one day.

Sure, only a few bad apples...

How come cops sexually assault at a rate twice what the general public do?

How come cops sexually assault at a rate twice what the general public do?

Just a guess here... but my understanding is that sexual assault is a crime of power and not sex; could it be that some cops are just not feeling the power trip that wearing a badge may bring.

I wonder too if there is any corresponding connection between being a politician and sexual abuse... for similar "power" reasons.

Um, wut?:

[gish gallop] (http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop)...[/gish gallop]



All of which have nothing to do with the OP story.

All of which have nothing to do with the OP story.

Actually, it does. Original reportage was included in one of the day's police misconduct roundups (http://www.injusticeeverywhere.com/?p=4926). And while there were no other tasering incidents that particular day, there were another 27 reports of police misconduct, including sexual assault, excessive force, DUI, etc., not including the incident in the OP...

But really, if you want to split hairs, my post has as much to do with the OP as yours. I.e. general commentary on police (mis)conduct.

Actually, it does. Original reportage was included in one of the day's police misconduct roundups (http://www.injusticeeverywhere.com/?p=4926). And while there were no other tasering incidents that particular day, there were another 27 reports of police misconduct, including sexual assault, excessive force, DUI, etc., not including the incident in the OP...

But really, if you want to split hairs, my post has as much to do with the OP as yours. I.e. general commentary on police (mis)conduct.

Actually, my post has to do with the demonizing of an effective tool and the people who are authorized to use it. The OP, and the news story, has no real information--but a tazer was used so the cop must have been wrong. Posting all the alleged misconduct on a daily basis doesn't prove anything.

Actually, my post has to do with the demonizing of an effective tool and the people who are authorized to use it. The OP, and the news story, has no real information--but a tazer was used so the cop must have been wrong. Posting all the alleged misconduct on a daily basis doesn't prove anything.
Effective killing tool:
http://truthnottasers.blogspot.com/2008/04/what-follows-are-names-where-known.html

Actually, my post has to do with the demonizing of an effective tool and the people who are authorized to use it. The OP, and the news story, has no real information--but a tazer was used so the cop must have been wrong. Posting all the alleged misconduct on a daily basis doesn't prove anything.

So your original post had about as much to do with the OP as my response to your post. Which you had the audacity to contest as not relevant. I would not have responded in kind if you had not raised the unrelated issue in your post, first.

While the cop in question might have been authorized to use a proven-lethal "effective tool", his valid use in this case is very much in question. <-- point of the OP and supported on the "invalid use" side of things in this case with my linkages to other cases of alleged or actual misuse of said "effective tool" and others.

BTW, if you look through the injusticeeverywhere.com site, you'll notice that a lot of what is reported is not just alleged, but actual--either convicted or settled--cases of police misconduct.

So your original post had about as much to do with the OP as my response to your post.

You are trying to arrange my argument to fit your agenda. Read the comments following the article in the OP. Read the OP title--use hyperbole much? It's nothing but a witch hunt.


BTW, if you look through the injusticeeverywhere.com site, you'll notice that a lot of what is reported is not just alleged, but actual--either convicted or settled--cases of police misconduct.

Some of what is reported, just enough to make their site look legit.


Effective killing tool:
http://truthnottasers.blogspot.com/2008/04/what-follows-are-names-where-known.html

Policy should be decided on facts, not cooked up blogs with an agenda. How many lives were saved by not using the previous "pre-tazer" level of force?

victim was deaf. He probably didn't think the cop was trying to stop him

Typical, I know it isn't the actual reason, but it smacks as another reason to use a stun gun on someone with a physical health problem.

Typical, I know it isn't the actual reason, but it smacks as another reason to use a stun gun on someone with a physical health problem.

According to the article, a family member "said her brother was disabled, suffered from seizures and had trouble hearing". This does not read as "victim was deaf". Was he blind too? The article stated it was "Sunday night" and "[the officer] followed Anthony in his patrol car, briefly put on his sirens and lights and yelled out of the window for him to stop". The whole story isn't being told here.

My favorite part is where the Mayor throws the cop under the bus. That's a great way to keep an effective police force.

You are trying to arrange my argument to fit your agenda. Read the comments following the article in the OP. Read the OP title--use hyperbole much? It's nothing but a witch hunt.

Nope, sorry, you don't get to accuse me of hyperbole and use the term "witch hunt" in the same quote without getting called a hypocrite: you are a hypocrite. Of course I'm using your argument to fit my agenda, just like you're using mine to fit yours. Unfortunately, you're looking more the fool here because your argument is unsound and mine is indisputably superior, supported by facts.


Some of what is reported, just enough to make their site look legit.

They quote news reports of police misconduct, not hearsay unsubstantiated rumors and/or stories, and since there's no mandate on the cop end to officially keep track of police misconduct, it is the most legit site out there. Prove differently.

Again: what's reported on the site is only what makes the news. I'd say, "Tip of the iceberg? How much is not reported?" but that would definitely be dipping into personal opinion and hyperbole, vs. simply reporting what's out there for them what want to look.

You really haven't researched the issue much, have you? Just winging it here, based on your unfounded personal beliefs, perhaps? Y'know, like you're accusing others of doing?

My favorite part is where the Mayor throws the cop under the bus. That's a great way to keep an effective police force.

Or maybe, just maybe, in this case, the cop was actually in the wrong...

Y



Policy should be decided on facts, not cooked up blogs with an agenda. How many lives were saved by not using the previous "pre-tazer" level of force?

It does not matter. Not one bit. If you give bullies another tool to wield their authority they will use it. I am against the use of tasers. This local yocal threatened to tase my nephew to communicate his authority. He did not realize, due to his amazing power of observation, that the 35 year old he was threatening was severely handicapped and had the cognitive abilities of a 2 year old. I'm not saying all cops are bad. I'm saying if you give a bully a tool to make bullying easier, they will use it.

Actually, my post has to do with the demonizing of an effective tool and the people who are authorized to use it. The OP, and the news story, has no real information--but a tazer was used so the cop must have been wrong. Posting all the alleged misconduct on a daily basis doesn't prove anything.

Come on, you're not really trying to say that's it's a "good" idea to use a taser gun on a person who is riding a bicycle? I think that any reasonable person can see that as being a recipe for disaster.

Also if I am not mistaken, in the case in Ohio shortly after Trotwood v Selz I believe that one of the two cyclists had also been tased by a LEO while riding his bicycle in a safe and legal manner. And that if I am not mistaken his helmet was damaged in the process. What would have happened to him if he hadn't been wearing a helmet?

Court to Cops: Stop Tasing People into Compliance (http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/01/court-dials-back-taser-use-cops-cant-zap-to-force-behavior/)


Now a federal appeals court in San Francisco has set down new rules for when police officers are allowed to use Tasers. In particular, the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that Tasers can’t be used simply to force a non-violent person to bend to an officer’s will. The court’s reason was that Taser’s X26 stun gun inflicts more pain than other “non-lethal” options:

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/01/court-dials-back-taser-use-cops-cant-zap-to-force-behavior/

How many lives were saved by not using the previous "pre-tazer" level of force?

^^^ legit observation.


It does not matter. Not one bit. If you give bullies another tool to wield their authority they will use it. I am against the use of tasers. This local yocal threatened to tase my nephew to communicate his authority. He did not realize, due to his amazing power of observation, that the 35 year old he was threatening was severely handicapped and had the cognitive abilities of a 2 year old. I'm not saying all cops are bad. I'm saying if you give a bully a tool to make bullying easier, they will use it.

^^^ Also legit, but, if anything, might even support s'mutt's contention. Would your nephew have been better off in a submission hold? Threatened or assaulted with a baton? Peppersprayed?

Can't be worse than dead, but not seeing much of a possible better outcome if bike rider had been: tackled, baton-ed, or run down with the patrol car. <--All stuff that has also happened and resulted in injury or death.

It's less about the taser, more as you say, the bullying. And lack of accountability.

What would have happened to him if he hadn't been wearing a helmet?

Go away.

^^^ legit observation.



^^^ Also legit, but, if anything, might even support s'mutt's contention. Would your nephew have been better off in a submission hold? Threatened or assaulted with a baton? Peppersprayed?

Can't be worse than dead, but not seeing much of a possible better outcome if bike rider had been: tackled, baton-ed, or run down with the patrol car. <--All stuff that has also happened and resulted in injury or death.

It's less about the taser, more as you say, the bullying. And lack of accountability.

A submission hold would be more effective since a taser would likely kill him because of his cardiac and respiratory conditions.

I figure a big problem is that cops are spread pretty thin and now ride one per car. It is cheaper and easier to tase than send back up.

A submission hold would be more effective since a taser would likely kill him because of his cardiac and respiratory conditions.

I figure a big problem is that cops are spread pretty thin and now ride one per car. It is cheaper and easier to tase than send back up.

I think the cheaper and easier statement is true when it comes to the use of tasers. I've seen cops tase a person who was not being violent--she just refused to get out of her car during a traffic stop and she was being verbally abusive. Prior to tasers I imagine the cops would have been forced to either to continue to talk to her or manhandle her out of the vehicle. Now that they have tasers, which they are told are "non-lethal" they can just use it rather than, as they may see it, wasting time with talking.

On the whole, as others have mentioned here, tasers can be lethal to people with certain health problems such as heart conditions. It's not smart policy to refer to them as "non-lethal" weapons.. perhaps "less-lethal" is more apt (although it will never fly because the Taser corporation has done such a good job of branding their weapon as a safe alternative to firearms).

Anyway, this cop is certainly in the wrong. The cyclist was not being violent and cops are supposedly trained to use a level of force that is just enough to end violent situations. Since this scenario was not violent, the cop should not have had to resort to any force.

Or maybe, just maybe, in this case, the cop was actually in the wrong...

Yes, that may be. Cops can and do abuse their power. This may be a case of that, and hopefully the investigation will come to the right conclusion. However, I see this knee-jerk response every time it comes up. The news article with few facts, but--cop tazed person, cop evil. The mayor is not helping things by making a pronouncement before the full investigation took place--he just threw the city employee under the bus. The mayor actually said he hopes the family sues.

I did a Google search on the officer's name to see if there was more info, and came up with this brief article: http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/134378973.html 298 comments follow showing some pretty absurd assumptions on both sides. Perhaps "witch hunt" was a bit extreme of a term, but the knee-jerk reactions are telling.


Again: what's reported on the site is only what makes the news. I'd say, "Tip of the iceberg? How much is not reported?" but that would definitely be dipping into personal opinion and hyperbole, vs. simply reporting what's out there for them what want to look.

It's really a glass half-full vs half-empty argument. I see it as evidence that the system is working. Just about every death caused by police in this country is reported, stats can be gathered, improvements can be made. Compare that to a police force in Mexico or Iraq or etc. where in order to even move through the country you better have enough money to bribe the cops. Our police force isn't perfect, but it's pretty damn good.


Come on, you're not really trying to say that's it's a "good" idea to use a taser gun on a person who is riding a bicycle? I think that any reasonable person can see that as being a recipe for disaster.

We don't know the circumstances. All we know from the article is that the dude was falling off his bike and ignoring repeated requests to stop moving. Any reasonable person would not jump to assumptions about the circumstances.


I am against the use of tasers.

So what level of force are you for? The cop has to at least stop this guy to question him and make sure he is fit to ride--what SOP would you follow?

Speaking of bullies and use of force, I need to get ready to join the orange army and shoot Bambi tomorrow. I'll need to drop this for tonight and get back into it tomorrow if I have a chance.

Go away.

Why, are you so anti-helmet that you can't admit that it probably saved the cyclist considerable injury if not possibly his life?

It's right there on page 6 (http://www.bicycling.com/news/advocacy/when-cop-says-stop?page=0,5) of the article "When the Cop Says Stop (http://www.bicycling.com/news/advocacy/when-cop-says-stop)."

Yes, that may be. Cops can and do abuse their power. This may be a case of that, and hopefully the investigation will come to the right conclusion. However, I see this knee-jerk response every time it comes up. The news article with few facts, but--cop tazed person, cop evil. The mayor is not helping things by making a pronouncement before the full investigation took place--he just threw the city employee under the bus. The mayor actually said he hopes the family sues.

I did a Google search on the officer's name to see if there was more info, and came up with this brief article: http://www.witn.com/home/headlines/134378973.html 298 comments follow showing some pretty absurd assumptions on both sides. Perhaps "witch hunt" was a bit extreme of a term, but the knee-jerk reactions are telling.



It's really a glass half-full vs half-empty argument. I see it as evidence that the system is working. Just about every death caused by police in this country is reported, stats can be gathered, improvements can be made. Compare that to a police force in Mexico or Iraq or etc. where in order to even move through the country you better have enough money to bribe the cops. Our police force isn't perfect, but it's pretty damn good.



We don't know the circumstances. All we know from the article is that the dude was falling off his bike and ignoring repeated requests to stop moving. Any reasonable person would not jump to assumptions about the circumstances.

From the article I read he fell once in a parking lot of a bank. A third party called the police and reported it as a possible drunk. So other then possibly being drunk in public and maybe trespassing for being in the parking lot after business hours. What crime had he actually committed?

A month or so ago my front wheel hit a patch of loose sand or gravel and I went down. Does that mean that I committed some sort of crime that required police intervention?

Given that according to the deceased's family he was hard of hearing as well as suffered from seizures it is reasonable to presume that he fell because he suffered a seizure, not because he was drunk.

Again given that the man is/was hard of hearing (you do know that there are people who cannot hear certain frequencies, right?) he may not have heard the siren. He may or may not have seen the lights, but not being able to hear the siren he reasonably may have presumed that the lights were not meant for him.

The next thing he knows he's being hit by a taser. And falls to the ground and is injured.

Wouldn't it have been more prudent as others have suggested for the new on the force officer to pull in front of the cyclist and stop to get his attention? And again given that this officer was on the job for about a month where was his training officer?

And again what did the officer think was going to happen when he hit a person who was on a bicycle? We do not know how fast the cyclist in question was traveling. I think that most here are capable of maintaining a speed in the high teens to low 20's without much effort. What do you think would happen if a cop thinking that they've committed some "horrendous" crime such as suffering from a medical condition that caused them to fall. Followed by them taking their anti-seizure meds, then pulling out their taser and tasing them while they're riding at 20+MPHs?

Isn't it reasonable to presume that they're going to hit the ground and hit the ground hard? Resulting in injury? And possibly death?


So what level of force are you for? The cop has to at least stop this guy to question him and make sure he is fit to ride--what SOP would you follow?

Speaking of bullies and use of force, I need to get ready to join the orange army and shoot Bambi tomorrow. I'll need to drop this for tonight and get back into it tomorrow if I have a chance.

The next thing he knows he's being hit by a taser. And falls to the ground and is injured.

This is conjecture.


We do not know how fast the cyclist in question was traveling.

You're right, we don't.

This is conjecture.

Really? In the incident that I related above I wasn't traveling very fast and when I hit the driveway I skinned my knee pretty good. And that's just me traveling at probably about 10MPH or so. What do you think would happen if a person who is pretty much just minding their own business while riding a bike get's hit by a taser?

Hint, read the article that I linked to above. In which a cyclist who was already stopped and off of his bike was tased and hit the ground hard enough to break his helmet.


You're right, we don't.

It is reasonable to presume though that he was traveling faster then walking speed. And given that the cyclist in the article that I linked above was tased while already off of his bike and hit the ground hard enough to break/damage his helmet what do you think is going to happen to someone who is tased while actually riding their bicycle?

Actually it's not cycling it's being ill that's illegal. There are tons of similar stories of people who had some illness that caused shaking, had Down's syndrome, or hard of hearing, that enraged a cop into tasering them, beating them, and sometimes killing them. Even if the person is well known in the community for being "slow" and everyone looks out for him, as in this case.

And it's not just the US, you can find similar news stories in even civilized countries all over the world. tasers are a big enough problem, but the problem with how police treat the mentally ill, or people with diabetes, cerebral palsy, parkinsons, deaf, etc, has been around far longer.

Actually it's not cycling it's being ill that's illegal. There are tons of similar stories of people who had some illness that caused shaking, had Down's syndrome, or hard of hearing, that enraged a cop into tasering them, beating them, and sometimes killing them. Even if the person is well known in the community for being "slow" and everyone looks out for him, as in this case.

And it's not just the US, you can find similar news stories in even civilized countries all over the world. tasers are a big enough problem, but the problem with how police treat the mentally ill, or people with diabetes, cerebral palsy, parkinsons, deaf, etc, has been around far longer.

Agreed, sadly we see this in the Cuba Gooding, Jr. movie Radio. Cuba plays a developmentally challenged man. Who the whole town turned out to give him Christmas presents. He turns around and decides to give them to others. A cop who was new to town and who didn't know "Radio" tries to pull him over (he was pushing a shopping cart down the street) to see where he got the stuff from and not getting an answer that he likes arrests "Radio."

The irony is that when the other officers come back to the station and see who the "rookie" has arrested they let him out of the cell and feed him and let him watch TV until the High School football coach can come and pick him up. The "rookie" is then assigned to help "Radio" to finish distributing his presents to the townspeople.

LEOs need to learn/realize that just because a person is not responding to them it does not mean that the person is doing anything wrong. They may be deaf/hard of hearing, have Downs Syndrome, be Autistic, or what have you. And that they should only use force of any sort as a last resort.

What do you think would happen if a person who is pretty much just minding their own business while riding a bike get's hit by a taser?

Where in the article does it say this?


Even if the person is well known in the community for being "slow" and everyone looks out for him, as in this case.

More guessing games--where in the article does it say this?

Anyone who actually believes cycling is a capitol offense needs to turn the computer off and go outside in the real world.

Agreed, sadly we see this in the Cuba Gooding, Jr. movie Radio...

What is this, Northern Exposure?

I'm going to take a wild guess (but no wilder than suggesting the cyclist was killed because he was on a bike): a big part of the offense was CWB, a variant on DWB.


CWB, for sure.
Is there any evidence this is racially motivated?

Why, are you so anti-helmet that you can't admit that it probably saved the cyclist considerable injury if not possibly his life?

I am vehemently not anti-helmet, but thanks for the assumption. I do, however recognize the correct thread for a debate or even commentary on helmet use and effectiveness, and it's most definitely not this thread.

Unless you're saying a helmet would have helped the tazed dead guy...?

You know how contentious the helmet debate is, it has nothing to do with this thread, yet you insist on inserting it into this discussion?!?

What's the matter with you...?

Take your helmet trolling someplace else, it has no place here.

Do all trolls use drunkard, anti-semite, woman beaters for their avatar? Just wondering...

I thought tasers were supposed to be a non-lethal means of either self defense or defense of an innocent victim. No one was in danger here, so the use of a taser was innapropriate. The bicycle in this case is irrelevent (although how could anyone think tasing someone on a moving vehicle of any kind would wind up good?).