Classic and Vintage Bicycles: What's it Worth? Appraisals and Inquiries - CIOCC with campy

Not too far from me is this bike...

CIOCC with some campy bits... fork is not original... talked to the seller I want to go look at it any idea on value? Needs tires, tubes, pedal, general regreese and tuneup.

Here are the pictures he sent.

http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/5N35K75Jf3L63J23N8c1k4fc3e3aba69911ff.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/5Id5N35Mc3Ke3F43L7c1k6f2ce2e3dead1218.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/5Le5Ma5Jc3G83L33Jfc1kb1687be2505418ac.jpg

I can't see the pics on the work computer, but if the fork is not original, be sure to check for crash damage.

He said it was not crashed just... upgraded the fork... but he does not have the original.

I would personally still check to be sure. But asking the question was definitely a good idea.

I have 2 Cioccs and they are excellent bikes. From the photos, the bike looks to be in very good shape and the frame is probably SL or better, if it were mine, I wouldn't sell that bike for less than a grand. I would say that if he agrees to sell it for $800, take it, you will love it.

cool... I've made an appointment for noon today. Bike needs some work but the frame appears to be in good shape... as long as there is no damage I'll probably come home with it. 58cm is a bit on the tall side for me though.

Big thing to consider is the condition of the paint. A lot of 80's Italian bikes including Cioccs had a reputation of having what was jokingly called "Quick release" paint jobs. Most likely from bad preparation of the frame chromed surfaces that resulted in less than good bonding of the paint where the chrome is painted over. I still remember the many Italian framesets hanging from dealer's displays back in the 80s and the paint literally just chipped right off at the edgesat the slightest touch. I even remember one of the LBS's I frequented had to eventually segregate them from other framesets to an area where shoppers could not touch them behind the counter because of this.
So if this one still has good finish, it most likely not have the QR paint problem.

Chombi

Well... I just picked it up. I like the bike and know it has potential... has a real odd ball mix of parts. When I saw it in person there were some stress cracks in the clear coat up by the Head tube. I pointed these out to the guy and asked repeatedly if it had be crashed... he said no and he was the only owner. he wasn't interested in discounting the bike any further since he had another guy trying to start a bidding war with me over the phone... told him I was there with cash in hand and not interested in a bidding war.

Components... I believe the crank, front derailleur, and brakes are campy super record, rear derailleur GIPIEMME, down tube shifters older campy record?, Wheels and seat post are also campy not sure on the group, cinelli stem, exage brake levers, shimano 600 headset, silica pump. tange prestige fork, flight ti seat, look style shimano pedals.

Here are some quick and dirty pics... let me know what you think. Especially how much of a concern the stress cracks are and how they diminish the value of the frame.

http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0783.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0792.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0791.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0790.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0789.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0788.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0787.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0786.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0785.jpg
http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae176/synergisticsllc/IMAG0784.jpg

I believe the model is... ciocc Mockba but not sure on the model year.

Nice pick up on the Ciocc!!! I would have a shop double check the downtube area. IMO there was some kind of front end impact. Looks to be very minor and may be OK as-is, or only need a minor bit of alignment.

I own a Ciocc Designer '84. It's a great ride!!!

Here's some vintage catalogs http://bulgier.net/pics/bike/Catalogs/ciocc/ http://bulgier.net/pics/bike/Catalogs/ciocc(tsd)/

Can you have a mechanic who has the skills to check out frames look at it and make it a condition (on a signed by both parties receipt/agreement) with the seller that the bike check out OK before final sale so you have the option to return it and get your money back if there's a problem? Most of the evidence points to some kind of frontal crash. You have to make sure those "stress cracks" do not go any deeper than the paint. I don't think you're out of the woods with this sale till you are 100% sure of what's really going on. I also don't see why the Tange fork would be an upgrade from the original Columbus(?) fork....and where the heck is it?? One just don't throw away things like that. We suspect that it got mangled in an incident unless he produces it.

Chombi

sale is final... they guy had other buyers hounding him. I'll take it to a shop and have the cracks checked out. How can you tell if the cracks don't go further than the paint. He said he gave the original fork to his father.

I would have to call "BS" on the seller on this one. If you get it checked by a mechanic, you might have some leverage to cancel the deal.

Great looking Coicc. I think you have CdA cranks and hubs with Chorus calipes. Those brake levers are a bad match for the calipers so when you upgrade to Exage calipers and toss the Chorus in the trash let me know.

The GipMe bits are cool too

To my eye, the frame has taken a punch. The missing fork just adds to the implication.
I would strip it down and have a builder look at and measure it.
I have seen a number of frames like this, think of the lugged joints as pivots. small chance there is also stressed paint at the top tube near the seat lug.

I would have to call "BS" on the seller on this one. If you get it checked by a mechanic, you might have some leverage to cancel the deal.

Agree. That bike was crashed. Easy to spot. Fork was totaled. Seller sounds like a jerk, to be blunt.

okay... it was a difficult decision to make on the spot. So obviously the frame is worth significantly less but what exactly am I looking at. Just want to know if I can recoup the expense if needed. I feel the frame is still ride-able... I wont be racing it or anything just enjoying the ride on a steel frame. Other option is to part it out get back what I can and use some of the parts to build up another frame. I'm going to take it a shop and see what they say.

Thanks

Steel is pretty forgiving stuff. A good shop should be able to align the frame and it should ride fine. Ciocc's are great bikes and this one is definitely worth getting aligned.

Here's a link about the frame alignment process: http://bikeraceinfo.com/tech/frame-preparation.html

it is fine, I would ride that all day long.

it is fine, I would ride that all day long.

Agreed.

Doesn't do much good for the bike's value, but if she's a rider, you are likely good to go.

it is fine, I would ride that all day long.

I would set it on some raw rim wheels and check the head and seat tube angles. The impact expression will often make the head and seat tube slightly steeper, I have seen one half to 2 degrees change. In this case I would expect about a half degree. Still quite rideable, but maybe not as designed.

Cranking one of these back is not that hard, but the force vector to do it could be described as from the saddle to the lower head lug.