Fifty Plus (50+) - Spin class frequency

I'm a 55 yo Clyde and have 2 1/2 years in of slowly increasing fitness. Probably 15 lbs over ideal weight. I started spin class and have done 4 weekly sessions. The classes are taught by 120 lb women and about half the hour long session is spent "out of the saddle." For me to stand and pedal takes quit a bit of resistance and my cadence drops into the mid 60's.( normal 90's) After the first session I had delayed onset muscle soreness in my quads for 4 days but I kept up with my normal workout routine. After session 2 I knew I'd worked my quads hard but no real issues.

Session 2-4 had Heart rate Monitor on.

Session 2 http://connect.garmin.com/activity/138308507
Session 3 http://connect.garmin.com/activity/140341215
Session 4 http://connect.garmin.com/activity/142506368

My present workout schedule is

Mon- 20 minute warmup. Then Spin Class--- Then 4 hours later Weight training
Tuesday 1 hour eliptical 100-110 beats/minute
Wed 30 minute eliptical 100-110 bpm then weight training
Thursday Varies anywhere from 1 hour eliptical with 1 to 1 60 sec intervals (10 reps) to 95% max if feeling good to complete rest if I think I need it.
Friday Same as Wed
Sat 1 hour incline treadmill walking (speed 4.5 mph) 120 bpm
Sun Rest Day

My real problem is that the class fills quickly so I can't walk in Thur and decide whether I want to spin or not.




My max heart rate is 158 and I believe my LT is 130. Distance data and speed are estimated.


Should I do a Mon-Thurs schedule or is once a week enough?

What are you trying to accomplish with the class? Is it just to get an aerobic workout?

I teach spin class and I gear my classes toward cyclists. You can modify the workout the instructor has you do so that it works for you. If you don't like spending so much time out of the saddle, don't do it. I have one guy in my class with knee problems who stays seated the entire time.

My max heart rate is 158


How do you know that?

I never stand as much as the instructor wants. I don't ride that way, and don't enjoy it. I ppretty much do what I want.

And, those sweet ladies who attend all the time will KILL you.

Are you a bicycle rider? I guess I missed that part...

I wear headphones and ignore the instructor, or use the room when it's empty. I prefer it empty. Frankly, most of the attendees aren't cyclists, use little resistance, ...and there isn't a strong correlation between the class plan to what you might want to work on for actual riding/climbing. 2-3 times a week is plenty for me.

Afterall, it's a fitness class - yo! Look at the way the bikes are set-up by most spinners - that's everything you should need to know.

Do your own thing. If you spin instructor is a proven competitive rider maybe you get some good training tips, but I think not.

If your interest is aerobics and fitness, then talk to a trainer I suppose.

What feedback are you getting from your body?

A one out of seven day cycle is not frequent enough, unless you are cross training with other activities. Twice a week is better.

The structure of your work-outs looks beneficial. The 60 rpm cadence under load intervals is a good element to build strength. Most cyclists living in Illinois do not get enough strength training, due to the lack of hill climbing. The trainer is a good place to replicate the strength training that climbing provides.

I do question the time spent out-of-the saddle, it seems excessive.

If you want a full evaluation, visit Vision Quest in Chicago: http://www.visionquestcoaching.com/coaching/getting-started/


Performance Fitness Assessment
At Vision Quest Coaching, we believe in understanding the science before building your plan for success. Therefore, we require all members of the Vision Quest family to take a Performance Fitness Assessment. This will allow us to gain your “baseline” numbers.

Finding Your Baseline
How much have you improved over the years? If you’re like most, the answer will be “a lot” or “better than some” or “I don’t know for sure.” The fact is, you can’t know for sure unless you have quantitative metrics to compare your performance from year to year. If you are just starting out and/or have never looked at your fitness level in a measured fashion, a Performance Fitness Test will get you started on the right track.

Performance Testing by Vision Quest Coaching is a complete power performance profile for the athletic cyclist.

It includes;

Baseline Physiological Measurements
• Body Fat Percentage
• Body Mass Index
• Blood Pressure
• Resting Heart Rate

Performance Assessment
• Power Testing
• Blood Lactate Threshold Test
• Maximum Heart Rate Determination
• Spinscan Pedal Stroke Analysis

Post-Assessment Analysis
• Heart Rate Training Zones
• Prescribed Race/Workout Warm-Up
• Professional Bike Fit
• Athlete-Specific Areas for Growth

CBadrider: Starting 2nd season riding want to get speed up to 16-17 avg from 14
DnvrFox: I'm a Data Junkie. Trust me I know. Resting HR 45. The sweet ladies are half the reason for attending.
FrenchFit: Yes. Trainers are not cyclists. Small town Y just got the spin bikes.(I went to their first session.) They're still paranoid about people doing their own thing and keep the room locked up. I am able to sneak in early to warm up (20 minutes zone 1) before a session as the 5:30 am instructor so far doesn't lockup afterward. I really can't imagine going as intense as I do with doing just the 5 minute warmup the class provides.

I do like the challenge and the closest active bike club is 50 miles away so these classes are 'what we got" here

DnvrFox: I'm a Data Junkie. Trust me I know. Resting HR 45. The sweet ladies are half the reason for attending.


Great. So many folks use 220 - age or some other formula. I am glad you are not using these but are basing your figure on your actual performance.

Dudelsack: My body is adapting to the high resistance/lower cadence workout. In the past I'd get my HR up there by spinning up to 160 rpm. There is some sprints in the class where I'll blank out the display (above 140 rpm).

Barrettscv: You're given me good advice in the past. Thanks! I hear you about the lack of hills. Not sure if I'm ready for an all out structure of a Vison Quest program. I think I need to better define what my goals are so that the structure will fit the desired outcome. Hopefully another year of riding will bring that in focus. I'm not training for any events.

I attend a two hour indoor cycling program twice weekly. I do train for racing and climbing is important. We spend a lot of time OTS. In the overgear 53/12 we will do up to 5 minute intervals @ 70+ rpm as part of a longer OG interval. We also do OTS sprints @ 100+ rpm. I expect DSM in the legs because of the stress to the body's largest muscles.

Barrettscv: You're given me good advice in the past. Thanks! I hear you about the lack of hills. Not sure if I'm ready for an all out structure of a Vison Quest program. I think I need to better define what my goals are so that the structure will fit the desired outcome. Hopefully another year of riding will bring that in focus. I'm not training for any events.

Hi J-56

You have made huge progress during the last two years, both in terms of cycling fitness and overall health. Very few of us at Bikeforums have done as well, including me! The fact that you have made this progress on-your-own, without a coach is remarkable.

Like you, I have no interest in competing in events, and I train indoors to remain active, focus on strength development and improve my pedal stroke efficiency.

I do think that working with a coach helps in two ways. It helps you focus on the parts of a cyclist fitness that need the most attention. It speeds up overall progress by improving time management, providing a greater benefit from the same amount of hours.

It took me two years of 250 to 400 miles/per month of cycling to complete a century. It took five years to lose 50 lbs. It took five years to hold a 20 mph average speed for two hours (without the help of a pace-line).

If I had structured my training with the help of a good coach four years ago, I would have achieved the same results in half the time.

Just got back from 5th Class. I did 2 things that I believe helped. 1.) I didn't do the out of the saddle sprints. I did them as I would on a bike... seated. They want you to use the "Aero bars" on the Keiser spin bikes. I don't have them on any bikes and my form goes all to hell when I try to use them. 2.) The instructor allowed me to spin for 15 minutes after the class for a warm-down. I feel really good now.

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/144059923

This doesn't include the 15 minutes of warmup or the 15 minutes of warm down. It's just the actual class. I wonder how accurate the power meter is. It said I averaged 179 watts for the main session.I know the mileage meter is too generous.

PS Barrett: Thanks for the kind words when you're as in as bad a shape as I was 2 1/2 years ago big changes are easier to come by.

Allegheny: I share your videos shamelessly.

PS Barrett: Thanks for the kind words when you're as in as bad a shape as I was 2 1/2 years ago big changes are easier to come by.

Allegheny: I share your videos shamelessly.

Cool, I have a milestone coming up and will post here on the 50+ regarding it.;)

Out of training at present and just surviving till time to ride more becomes available.

But spinning classes are a useful part of a training programme. They are the easy part.

Offroad so speeds and milage mean nothing for roadies but 50 to 60 miles on Sundays- Twice a week a 20 mile ride- One up hills and one a flat route with speed. Twice a week at the gym for 1 hour of hard Cardio workout. It's milage and effort on those miles that help you get fit. Probably won't lose weight though because after the gym sessions it was down to the Curry House for a takeaway--I was starving.

Sorry this is long, but I've done hundreds of spinning classes on Keiser bikes. For several years I tried to either ride or go to spin class 5 days a week - all riding in summer and during the winter, weekends on the road and 2-3 nights a week in the gym.

For improvements to fitness, going 3x per week is way better than 1-2. Get yourself feeling comfortable in class (may take several weeks), and then try to use one class a week for an all out effort and the others for recovery/base building.

Feel free to ignore any/all instructions from the class leader, but generally try to give the appearance of fitting in. People who do a totally different workout than the one being given can be a distraction to other riders, especially if you're sitting up front.

Ignore the standing part if you want. You'll either get better at standing or not. The key is getting a good workout without hurting yourself.

I really like the Keiser bikes. They're very smooth, and are generally more comfortable (for me) than Schwinns and other front wheel resistance spinning bikes you usually find. The tilt on the Keiser saddles can be adjusted, but you need a wrench. Try to find a saddle that has a tilt that is comfortable for you, and adjust height, set back, handlebar height to suit.

The power readout on the Keiser bikes is a neat function, but remember that it's only an estimate, and can vary quite dramatically from bike to bike. Don't be depressed if your average power drops 20% when you change bikes. Just try to use the same bike if you can, or identify several bikes that give fairly consistent results. I've turned some fairly massive power numbers on Keisers, but part of those numbers were 1) selecting a bike that I knew was a bit on the high side, 2) adjusting the resistance to where I was at the lower end of friction, with maximum power numbers for a given setting, and 3) finding out that high rpm trumps high resistance on the Keisers if you want to generate high power numbers. ;)

After I got used to the bikes, I always tried to sit in the front row where I could see myself in the mirrored wall in the spinning room. Mirrors are great to work on form. I always tried to minimize upper body movement when seated. I'm building an exercise room at my house, and plan to put mirrors on at least one of the walls to watch myself on the trainer and when doing yoga.

Oh, I don't remember if you said, but get the SPD clip-in cycling shoes for classes, and try to wear padded cycling shorts, etc. for class.

Ear plugs may be useful if you don't like the music or if music is too loud. Good luck, and have fun!

terex: yep full kit in class.

Well today while weightlifting the other 50+ cyclist was there and as I told him I was thinking about going twice a week he rolled his eyes. So I'm "all in" for tomorrow. Like they say "There's no fool like an old fool."

For improvements to fitness, going 3x per week is way better than 1-2. Get yourself feeling comfortable in class (may take several weeks), and then try to use one class a week for an all out effort and the others for recovery/base building.

Excellent advice! Completely agree.


Dudelsack: My body is adapting to the high resistance/lower cadence workout. In the past I'd get my HR up there by spinning up to 160 rpm. There is some sprints in the class where I'll blank out the display (above 140 rpm).

There's no need or reason to get that high a cadence. Increase resistence so that you hit target HR at a reasonable cadence of 100-120.

There's no need or reason to get that high a cadence. Increase resistence so that you hit target HR at a reasonable cadence of 100-120.

But it is pretty cool to blank out the screen occasionally. ;)

But it is pretty cool to blank out the screen occasionally. ;)

Does that mean the screen goes blank or you go blank and can't see it?

The Keiser M3 computer goes blank, no display when the cadence >140 rpms. I use this feature for high cadence workouts, I'm a track(velodrome) racer and I use 5x1 minute sprint drills (gear 14) in the saddle staying smooth. Really gets the heart rate up there! I use the wattage and my HR to determine if I'm working hard enough and to maximize my workout. I take spin class 4 days a week @545AM, but Thurs is my 1.5 hr workout session as there isn't a 545AM spin class.
I use a Powertap SL+ on my Moots Compact. I'd love a Powertap for my track bike.........

StanSeven:Since I went clipless 100 rpm is a normal/recovery cadence. I'm blanking it out only during a sprint interval. I'll try holding it back to the high 130's and up the "gear".

Terex:I have a Kurt Kinetics Road Machine for Base Miles, The spin bikes are so new to the Y that the classes of 14 are almost always booked full. I also think it'd be distracting for me to easy spin while everyone else is maxed out.

tony2v:I've heard the "hard core" class is the 5:30am sessions. A tri-guy leads them. I'm kinda a slow to get going guy now that I don't have to be at work @ 6:00 am. A powertap sounds like good data for someone that knows how to use this info but that's not me yet.

I'd highly recommend reading Jennifer Sage's "Keeping it Real"- buy/download at RoadBikeRider. GREAT advice for using IDC as training for riding, and for what NOT to do on an IDC bike.

Did OK for 40 minutes and then started to fade. (Lead Legs set in) Hip Hop music hard for me to get psyched about. Rock and Roll is the king of Music. I went harder than I would have on the eliptical machines so it was a positive experience.

Just got back from 5th Class. I did 2 things that I believe helped. 1.) I didn't do the out of the saddle sprints. I did them as I would on a bike... seated. They want you to use the "Aero bars" on the Keiser spin bikes. I don't have them on any bikes and my form goes all to hell when I try to use them. 2.) The instructor allowed me to spin for 15 minutes after the class for a warm-down. I feel really good now.



Interesting. I tell my students not to use the aero bars on the Keiser bikes because:

1) we're indoors and don't need to be aerodynamic, and
2) the people who use them are generally not cyclists so they use them to lean on and rest when they're tired. They don't adjust their saddle for using the bars so they are all stretched out; or worse, they use them while standing up.

I ride my bike to the club, so I have on commuter bike clothes: sometimes knickers or tights, sometimes cargo shorts, a T-shirt and regular tennis shoes... seems kind of silly to me to wear full kit although the instructors usually do. Usually I follow the program, but I do a lot more standing than they call for. We got these new bikes and they are quite a bit better than anything else I've ever used as far as adjustability and fit:

http://img.iconcdn.com/Freemotion/images/catalog/FMEX82910.jpg

And they have a power module with USB port to save spreadsheets so I can make cool graphs like this:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-qvX2S36Fby0/TwjDVmoq_3I/AAAAAAAAMEk/G3c325ejuQ8/s800/Janet%2527s%2520Class%25202012-04-04.JPG

And my favorite instructor is "Trish the Dish".

Does that mean the screen goes blank or you go blank and can't see it?

Yes.

Interesting. I tell my students not to use the aero bars on the Keiser bikes because:

1) we're indoors and don't need to be aerodynamic, and
2) the people who use them are generally not cyclists so they use them to lean on and rest when they're tired. They don't adjust their saddle for using the bars so they are all stretched out; or worse, they use them while standing up.

I've found there's no practical utility in using spin bike aero bars.

StanSeven:Since I went clipless 100 rpm is a normal/recovery cadence. I'm blanking it out only during a sprint interval. I'll try holding it back to the high 130's and up the "gear".



Congtarulations. You are doing one hard workout then! Actually more than I am doing this time of year. The only advice I can add is pace yourself so you don't burn out. Three of these or so a week are enough until you can get out on the road in the spring. Mix this up like you are doing with weights and treadmill

I've found there's no practical utility in using spin bike aero bars.
I use the aero position on the Keiser when I'm doing TT sessions. I do 3x10 and 2x20 @FTP, but then I'm very flexible. I have the bars set @1.5 even then it's high, but that's lowest I can go without hitting my knees when standing. Also I don't do much of the standing climbs, I told my instructors I don't climb that way on a real bike!

I use the aero position on the Keiser when I'm doing TT sessions. I do 3x10 and 2x20 @FTP, but then I'm very flexible. I have the bars set @1.5 even then it's high, but that's lowest I can go without hitting my knees when standing. Also I don't do much of the standing climbs, I told my instructors I don't climb that way on a real bike!

If you're comfortable in the aero bars on the Keiser, I can understand. I'm also quite flexible, but for me, I wasn't comfortable, nor did I think that position was anywhere close to what I would be on a real bike.

On the standing climb thing, I view it as more of a non-biking aerobic exercise. I enjoyed it occasionally, but didn't think it had much to do with climbing conditioning per se or body/bike movement replication.

I have my seat set at almost L and handlebars at 1.5. That's pretty level. Everyone else has the handlebars at least 6 inches higher than the seat, most more than that. I don't understand why. My clunky hybrid is more aero than that. Another odd thing is how deep the "hoods" are. The bikes are well made but why not be able to adjust the height and top tube length separately?

I have my seat set at almost L and handlebars at 1.5. That's pretty level. Everyone else has the handlebars at least 6 inches higher than the seat, most more than that. I don't understand why. My clunky hybrid is more aero than that. Another odd thing is how deep the "hoods" are. The bikes are well made but why not be able to adjust the height and top tube length separately?

I could write a long rant on all the things wrong with those Keiser spin bikes.

So far, the only spin bike I've used that can really be dialed in to replicate your position on a road bike is the Lemond. I currently spin on the Schwinns they have my new the gym, not so bad for fit-position, but they are hardly smooth spinning. Using a Lemond at a former gym really helped my flexability to get aero, rotated, ...I am grateful for having that experience. Over a period of 3 months I was able to change my riding position pretty dramatically, ... sweet.

This year I have been teaching spinning for the first time. So far I have had great feed back from my class. I use a video like from http://www.bike-o-vision.com/ . I use my own music and do a lot of intervals and tempos. I ride the video about 30% of the time. Here is a typical spin class heart rate for me. I did have quadruple bypass in Dec 2009 and I am on a low dose bata blocker http://connect.garmin.com/activity/142895862

What do you all like about spin class?

I could write a long rant on all the things wrong with those Keiser spin bikes.

So far, the only spin bike I've used that can really be dialed in to replicate your position on a road bike is the Lemond. I currently spin on the Schwinns they have my new the gym, not so bad for fit-position, but they are hardly smooth spinning. Using a Lemond at a former gym really helped my flexability to get aero, rotated, ...I am grateful for having that experience. Over a period of 3 months I was able to change my riding position pretty dramatically, ... sweet.

I haven't used the Lemond, but between Keiser and Schwinn, I far prefer the smoothness of the Keiser over the Schwinn, but that's just me. I may purchase a spin bike for home use, but still don't know what i'd get. I'd like the adjustability and power measurement of the Cycleops, but the magnetic resistance control of the Keiser would be hard to give up.

What do you all like about spin class?

I seem to be able to push myself harder in the class than at home. I'm beginning to appreciate the fact that you have to sign up well into advance of class. Knowing that I'll go really hard Mondays and Thursdays forces me to be more disciplined about the rest of the week. I really like working out and do something 6 days a week. The spin classes forces me out of the middle-ground "junk miles" that I enjoy too well. Now I must do easier recovery stuff Tuesday and push a harder on Saturday. Monday is a really big day though with spin class and weight training all in one day. Except for my quads I'm as strong as I think I need to be.

I came across the following article while researching the Real Ryder spin bike. Unlike other spin bikes that have fixed frames (static position), the Real Ryder has an articulated frame that, theoretically, more accurately mimics the movement of a real bike. Of particular note is the author's observation of the potentially harmful effects to the spine of the rider while using aerobars on most spin bikes:

http://www.indoorcyclingassociation.com/public/Review_of_the_Real_Ryder_bikes.cfm

Aero Postion

One of the primary reasons why an aero position is contraindicated on a static bike such as a Spinner® is the fact that the upper body becomes an anchor, locked down to the handlebars so it does not move. The hips are forced to rock to compensate for the locked down position of the upper body. That alone creates a potential shearing action in the vertebrae when riding aero. On a Real Ryder, that problem is minimized because of the movement of the bike. This is one of the reasons they promote the aero position heavily on the Real Ryders. It just feels much better.

Aero Postion

One of the primary reasons why an aero position is contraindicated on a static bike such as a Spinner® is the fact that the upper body becomes an anchor, locked down to the handlebars so it does not move. The hips are forced to rock to compensate for the locked down position of the upper body. That alone creates a potential shearing action in the vertebrae when riding aero. On a Real Ryder, that problem is minimized because of the movement of the bike. This is one of the reasons they promote the aero position heavily on the Real Ryders. It just feels much better.

Looks like an interesting idea. That said, the gym spin classes that I attend are fitness classes. They don't portray them as race training. The class follows the instructor and no one locks down in aero position. PLUS --> I've definitely never heard anyone shear any vertebrae :)