General Cycling Discussion - Cycling in the Flatlands

It has been purported that both Florida and Louisiana are the two flatest states of the United States. If this is true, why aren't any cities of these two states ever nominated as one of the most bicycle-friendly cities, within the USA?

You would think that if the topography and the geography of a city facilitates cycling, then there would quite naturally be more cycling, taking place within that city, by default.

What am I missing here?

Heat, Winds, Humidity, Fog, Hot Sun, Torrential down pours, Hurricanes, Elderly drivers.

In theory, places with flat terrain and "good" (ie hot) climates should be ideal for cycling. In practice these are where you find the least amount of cycling. You find the most cycling in places with hilly terrain and "bad" (ie damp, temperate) climates.
Seattle, Portland, San Francisco, and many NW European cities all have a strong, indigenous cycling culture. Flat, Mediterranean cities have no cycling culture unless it has been recently imported to places such as Seville and Tel Aviv.

Why , Tampa , St. Pete actually are leaders..... in pedestrian / bicycle fatalities

It has been purported that both Florida and Louisianna are the two flatest states of the United States. If this is true, why aren't any cities of these two states ever nominated as one of the most bicycle-friendly cities, within the USA?

You would think that if the topography and the geography of a city facilitates cycling, then there would quite naturally be more cycling, taking place within that city, by default.

What am I missing here?

Quite obviously, you've never spent a lot of time cycling in a flat part of the world. Flat isn't necessarily good for cycling.

Manitoba, and specifically the Red River Valley, is very, very flat ... I spent 13 years cycling there. While it has its appeal in some ways, the constant wind and field after field after field start to wear on you after a bit. And I had to do my hill training on overpasses. If I wanted to take on some real hills, I had to drive 150 km.

When I lived in Colorado, one of my bosses went to visit one of our shops in Alabama. He reported, "I went out for a run. By the time I got to the end of the block, I was totally soaked in sweat. No wonder everyone there is fat! It's too hot to exercise!" And there's a lot of truth in that. Here in the Dallas area, we'll ride year round, but that can be challenging in the summer, and involves a LOT of sweat.

Florida has double the per capita bicyclist fatality rate of other warm weather states like California

In the case of FL I would say it was the rapid growth in the 80's - 90's (with very little planning) led to difficult roads for bikes and pedestrians. I’ve watched quiet roads that I used to ride in the middle of nowhere go from two to eight lanes lined with never ending strip centers and gated communities. There are safer places to ride but I find I have to do a good deal of route planning ahead of time.

Oh… the summers are nasty hot too.

It has been purported that both Florida and Louisianna are the two flatest states of the United States. If this is true, why aren't any cities of these two states ever nominated as one of the most bicycle-friendly cities, within the USA?

Drivers and roads.

Best place I've ever found to combine warm weather, flat topography, good drivers and roads is La Quinta, California.

Here in FL, it's a combination of roads that simply aren't designed with bicycles and pedestrians in mind, and a driving culture that's aggresively anti-cycling. This leads to:


Florida has double the per capita bicyclist fatality rate of other warm weather states like California

Florida drivers. Those two words alone are a cure for constipation in normal people....

In both Florida and Louisiana, the climate is another factor.

Since lighter bikes are better climbers, steel bikes are more common in these flat states. Unfortunately, most of the riders in these states are at home with broken steel bikes. :D

And of the riders that ARE out there, I'd bet most are on carbon, maybe some aluminum....see, there ya go!:p

Since lighter bikes are better climbers, steel bikes are more common in these flat states. Unfortunately, most of the riders in these states are at home with broken steel bikes. :D

And of the riders that ARE out there, I'd bet most are on carbon, maybe some aluminum....see, there ya go!:p


Mr. Beanz!

One of these days, the Gods of steel are going to suddenly collapse your carbon when you could least afford it!

Only upon that blessed day, will my faith in a supreme being be renewed! :p

Mr. Beanz!

One of these days, the Gods of steel are going to suddenly collapse your carbon when you could least afford it!

Only upon that blessed day, will my faith in a supreme being be renewed! :p



Sorry man! I still got aluminum and steel as backups. I will never be without. :D

But serioulsy, climbs add so much more to the cycling experience. I don't mind our long flat trail cause I'm always meeting new people and friends for my videos and pictures. If I had to ride all flat land while meeting less than 5 riders per ride, I'd get bored.:p

Florida and Louisiana are both culturally "anti." In general they are hostile to cyclists.

colorado is the flatest state in the union. it's just a little.....horizontally challenged here and there.
as for the south- put a beer in the bottle cage, a confederate flag on a bicycle mast, have a shotgun in a scabbard mounted, those big bicycle tires from bike choppers, and knock out several teeth where the loss can easily be seen. you'll fit right in, maybe.

colorado is the flatest state in the union. it's just a little.....horizontally challenged here and there.
as for the south- put a beer in the bottle cage, a confederate flag on a bicycle mast, have a shotgun in a scabbard mounted, those big bicycle tires from bike choppers, and knock out several teeth where the loss can easily be seen. you'll fit right in, maybe.


:lol::roflmao2::lol::wtf::lol::roflmao2::lol:

I hate riding in the flat lands. Hate it. Hate it. Hate it.

Florida and Louisiana are both culturally "anti." In general they are hostile to cyclists.
After living in Tampa for the last 2+ years I can attest to this but also add they are "anti" anything that is not car related. The public transportation is virtually non-existant and any attempts to fund new or upgrade the existing public systems is voted down. And yes, the drivers can be very aggressive towards cyclists.

What am I missing here?

Fun.

While it has its appeal in some ways, the constant wind and field after field after field start to wear on you after a bit. And I had to do my hill training on overpasses. If I wanted to take on some real hills, I had to drive 150 km.

East central Illinois is also like that. I lived and rode there for 5 years and it was like being on a billiard table. Dull, dull, dull.

I live in a gated 55+ community in So Florida. Most of the Florida remarks are true.
It's fun to see new retired people move in and then go and buy bicycles. For the most part most of them haven't ridden since they were kids and don't have a clue.
They buy his and her matching bikes without getting measured or having the bike set up/ adjusted for them. Never learned how to shift them. They ride them with no leg extention looking like contortionists and wonder why this ain't so much fun and I'm in pain.
Before you know it, a couple more bikes in the garage collecting dust and in the way.
And no, I wouldn't buy one of those poorly thought out things at a tag sale. I wouldn't take some of them for free.
It's a shame because a bike down here can really be an asset because of the proximity of all the recreation areas close by.
People leave the bike inthe garage to drive a couple of blocks to the tennis courts, pool etc.

I grew up riding in the Tampa Bay area. People in Arkansas are amazed at my fearlessness in traffic.

I've spent most of my life cycling in the rural/suburban northeast USA and recently spent a month cycling in Sarasota FL. I would rate Sarasota and Manatee counties as very good for cycling in general, and the flatness is not as boring as I thought it would be. You just ride faster overall on the flats than in the hills. You don't get the scenic views and the nice descents that you get in the mountains, but no place is perfect. For interesting cycling I think visual variety, smooth road surfaces, and lack of traffic are more important than flatness per se.

I hate riding in the flat lands. Hate it. Hate it. Hate it.

So..ah...Jim,

How do you feel about riding in the flat lands? :lol::roflmao2::lol:

The nice thing about hilly terrain is the variety and obtaining shelter from the wind. As vertically challenged as I am, there have been rides where I crave a good hill because it will get me out of a gail-force (or so it felt) headwind.

It has been purported that both Florida and Louisiana are the two flatest states of the United States. If this is true, why aren't any cities of these two states ever nominated as one of the most bicycle-friendly cities, within the USA?

You would think that if the topography and the geography of a city facilitates cycling, then there would quite naturally be more cycling, taking place within that city, by default.

What am I missing here?
I'll find out next month. I'll be down there riding in the warm sun --- as opposed to the cool temps, wind, and sun/clouds/rain mix we're having in ATL.

The LAB seems to give high ratings to cities with lots of bike paths, even if the rest of their infrastructure is atrocious for cycling. My ideal city wouldn't need bike paths.

I'll find out next month. I'll be down there riding in the warm sun --- as opposed to the cool temps, wind, and sun/clouds/rain mix we're having in ATL.

Alright!

Have fun, Ron! :thumb:

- Slim :)

And steel doesn't have chance in those warm, humid coastal states;)

And steel doesn't have chance in those warm, humid coastal states;)

There's more chromoly bikes in the Bay Area than you can shake a stick at!

Just Say'N...

- Slim :)

I've noticed a strong cycling based community in northeast Florida since I've lived here. I used to live in Naples Fl., but I hated cycling down there because, just as others have mentioned, there only appear to be strip malls, gated communities and golf courses, one after the other. Such a layout isn't conducive to cycling. Northeast Florida on the other hand, especially St. Johns county, seems in my opinion to be much more cyclist friendly. Don't get me wrong, we have our idiot drivers out here too and the occassional bicyclist hit and killed, but in general, I've noticed a more respectful group of drivers in the area. The more northern region of Florida tends to have less retirees, hence less elderly drivers on the road and less clueless senior citizens on the cycling and Rail Trail paths. I don't recall there ever being much of a cycling lane or path in New England, specifically MA. and NH., and the roads always seemed so extremely narrow that it was uncomfortable to ride up there. As for the flatness, heat, etc. Florida is flat, but it's still scenic in it's own rite. It doesn't sport the amazing mountain overlooks like other parts of the country, but hey, that's why people vacation, right? On the down side, (no pun intended), I have very little confidence riding down the backside of a mountain, even the small foothills of Skyline Dr. VA. As for the heat? You get use to it after awhile.

There's more chromoly bikes in the Bay Area than you can shake a stick at!

Just Say'N...

- Slim :)

And they aint goin' away lol

It has been purported that both Florida and Louisiana are the two flatest states of the United States. If this is true, why aren't any cities of these two states ever nominated as one of the most bicycle-friendly cities, within the USA?

You would think that if the topography and the geography of a city facilitates cycling, then there would quite naturally be more cycling, taking place within that city, by default.

What am I missing here?

I seek out hills. The challenge of going up a steep hill and then the payback are vital to me.

Don in Austin

colorado is the flatest state in the union. it's just a little.....horizontally challenged here and there.
as for the south- put a beer in the bottle cage, a confederate flag on a bicycle mast, have a shotgun in a scabbard mounted, those big bicycle tires from bike choppers, and knock out several teeth where the loss can easily be seen. you'll fit right in, maybe.

Riiight. NW New Mexico is quite the same. If you start from home, and return home, the whole trip is perfectly flat. On average.

Drivers and roads.
and the culture .. CPH and AMS developed the infrastructure.

US has Concealed (and Open) Firearms Carry even when on bikes, instead.
:trainwreck:

After a while flat gets boring. I'm ill suited to climbing, but rollers are a lot less boring than flat everywhere.

I can go for a ride where it is darn near dead flat, or I can do a training ride I used to do that was about 26 miles with less than 1/4 mile flat. Flat I can do riding out my front door. Id have to ride abotu 5 miles to that training ride. Or I can ride in the mountians and have a few thousand continous verticle feet of climbing over several miles.

MY choice. That is a lot more fun that flat and nothing but flat no matter what I feel like riding.

Well Florida is not totally flat. We do have our overpasses!

East central Illinois is also like that. I lived and rode there for 5 years and it was like being on a billiard table. Dull, dull, dull.

East of the Illinois river and west of it are flat along with the entire Chicago area. Then after Peoria it is flat, but that narrow section in between from I80 to Peoria along the river is pretty nice for central Illinois. Being stuck here for now isn't so bad and I have a lot of short 1/4 + mile hills that can go from 7-12%

Bike friendly cities have more to do with the attitudes of the local government, business community, and population in general. Fargo, North Dakota is a Bike Friendly City that has developed many miles of bike trails and MUPs, designated bike lanes and passed city ordinances favoring bicycle commuting. It doesn't take long to figure it out driving downtown as every bike rack is full, even in the winter, the lanes are marked "Bicycles May Use Full Lane" and there are bike signs everywhere. Many businesses and housing units provide amentities for cyclists and the city has installed countless aestheticly pleasing but very secure bike racks. It is a very cool city in which to be a cyclist.

Well Florida is not totally flat. We do have our overpasses!

:lol::roflmao2::lol:

Bike friendly cities have more to do with the attitudes of the local government, business community, and population in general. Fargo, North Dakota is a Bike Friendly City that has developed many miles of bike trails and MUPs, designated bike lanes and passed city ordinances favoring bicycle commuting. It doesn't take long to figure it out driving downtown as every bike rack is full, even in the winter, the lanes are marked "Bicycles May Use Full Lane" and there are bike signs everywhere. Many businesses and housing units provide amentities for cyclists and the city has installed countless aestheticly pleasing but very secure bike racks. It is a very cool city in which to be a cyclist.

I do believe that I've heard of this once before...

Only southern Louisiana is flat. As you head north, it gets somewhat hilly, but not very high.
Louisiana is far from bike friendly. Perhaps it has to do with the education level, the level of conservatism, or the inability to accept alternate ways of doing things. It is not uncommon to get yelled at, "get on the sidewalk where you belong," or to have the yahoos see how close they can come to you as they speed by.

When I think of Louisiana drivers and bicyclists, I think of "Deliverance."

Only southern Louisiana is flat. As you head north, it gets somewhat hilly, but not very high.
Louisiana is far from bike friendly. Perhaps it has to do with the education level, the level of conservatism, or the inability to accept alternate ways of doing things. It is not uncommon to get yelled at, "get on the sidewalk where you belong," or to have the yahoos see how close they can come to you as they speed by.

When I think of Louisiana drivers and bicyclists, I think of "Deliverance."

Damn! That's BAD!

- Slim :eek: