Mountain Biking - Going Tubeless: Any tips to help get the bead to stay against the rim?

I spent an hour last night trying to get any into my front tire after converting to tubeless. I eventually just put the tube back in for a ride today, but I got a flat (and had already used my spare a few days ago, lol), so now I really want to try to get it working Tubeless.

Does anyone have any advice for getting the tire to seat well enough against the rim to inflate? I tried soapy water and everything. Even with my garage compressor at 125 PSI, and just wooshes out everywhere. In a lot of places, there is barely even a tight enough seal to get bubbles!

Please help! I don't want to have to go buy more tubes when I just spent $30 on sealant, heh. Plus I want all the advantages of tubeless :).

Thanks.

Some tire and rim combinations won't work.

Arg! Hmm. The tires have very little wear so I'd hate to have to replace them already :( . But yeah the beads don't seem to want to press outward against the rim like they would when inflated.

You have to set the bead. In my experience if you have UST/TNT tires and UST wheels, you can use a hand pump. I have set the bead with a hand pump using a Stan's strip on a non-tubeless rim, it is a UST tire though.

If you have a compressor, you may need to use that to get a high enough pressure to pop the tire on the bead. I have found that I have to push down on the tire a bit, buy the valve stem, in order to set it with the hand pump..

Good luck!!

I am just using a "ghetto' conversion and the standard tire that came with my bike. I didn't even try inflating it with my hand pump, especially after my compressor (with tank) failed, heh.

Applying some pressure to the tire while inflating seemed to slightly reduce the amount of air that leaked past the bead, but a whole lot still escape (obviously, since it wouldn't ever inflate).

Same thing happened to me. Stan's says it supposed to work with any tires, but it didn't work for me, or the guys at REI!

Dangit :( . I am going to probably try one more time with these tires and then maybe look into getting some new ones.

Do UST tires help even without UST rims?

i have a trick i use for stubborn tires. Go to the hardware store and buy a squeeze bottle of slime tire sealant. Squeeze a liberal amount all the way around the bead/rim on both sides, let set a few mins and put the air to it. It's messy, go outside the garage to air the tire. One big bottle of slime will set up to 6 sets of tires so it love you long time.

Also try this:

1. put the tire on with a tube and air it up. Tada! both beads seat.

2. carefully remove the tube by breaking the seal on only one side.

3. now add your sealant, sponge some really sudsy water onto the bead & rim, and have your list of cuss words ready.

4. add air with your compressor and see if it can get the one unseated bead to seat.

Wrap the circumference with a rope. Cinch it down as you put air in with the compressor.

Aah, you guys are brilliant! I will try those tricks next time I get a chance!

Thanks, guys!

Here is another trick that I have used when a tire is being difficult.

After you get the sealant into the tire, and both beads inside the dish of the rim, start with the stem down, and use your thumbs to push the middle of the tire down as your use your fingers to pull both sides of tire out towards the rim. Rotate the tire about 4 inches, repeat. Rotate, repeat. Continue that process until your stem has made one entire revolution. My tires have all aired up after trying this process of pulling the bead towards the rim.

Good luck!

Aaaahhhh, the advantages of tubeless:lol:

I am just using a "ghetto' conversion and the standard tire that came with my bike.

and this is why it won't work. if you really really want tubeless setup, then spend the money and do it right.

i'm sorry, it's a weird philisophical point for me...

<rant>
i want something, but i can't afford it, i don't want to spend the money it takes to get what i want, i don't want to do what i'm supposed to for it, but i want it so i deserve it so give it to me anyway and make it work.

you don't *need* tubeless, people have been cycling for many many years with tubes. people want it, but they don't want to go about it the right way, then they complain tubeless sucks, or they come into a bike shop and make a huge mess spraying stans and soapy water everywhere cause they just want to "borrow your air compressor while i put my tube on" and we are all watching them knowing it aint gonna work.

</rant>

You do not want get bukkaked at 40psi by your Stans! lol :)

and this is why it won't work. if you really really want tubeless setup, then spend the money and do it right.

i'm sorry, it's a weird philisophical point for me...

<rant>
i want something, but i can't afford it, i don't want to spend the money it takes to get what i want, i don't want to do what i'm supposed to for it, but i want it so i deserve it so give it to me anyway and make it work.

you don't *need* tubeless, people have been cycling for many many years with tubes. people want it, but they don't want to go about it the right way, then they complain tubeless sucks, or they come into a bike shop and make a huge mess spraying stans and soapy water everywhere cause they just want to "borrow your air compressor while i put my tube on" and we are all watching them knowing it aint gonna work.

</rant>

From what I've heard, tubeless has a super application in thorn-infested areas.

You do not want get bukkaked at 40psi by your Stans! lol :)

So let me get this straight. On BF, you can say "bukkake" without getting censored, but not "**** sapiens".

Really.

You do not want get bukkaked at 40psi by your Stans! lol :)

HAHAHAHAHAH...excellent

From what I've heard, tubeless has a super application in thorn-infested areas.

it does, i have tubeless on my main bike, and wow it saved me from many many flats...but you don't need it

Pablo:
I don't need to mountain bike, but I wanted to. However, while a $2000 bike is better in many ways than my $600 bike, I also didn't need to spend the money on one when a $600 bike would at least get me started enjoying the benefits of MTBing without a huge initial investment, especially knowing there are hundreds of others satisfied with this level of bike performance.

If the analogy wasn't clear, I understand the benefits of a purpose-built tubeless setup. But not everyone wants to spend hundreds of dollars for perfection, just like not everyone wants to spend $2000 on a bike just because some guy on the internet might look down on me. Further, there are at least hundreds of riders out there who are completely happy with their various "ghetto" conversions, or I wouldn't have attempted in the first place (just like I wouldn't buy a $600 bike if everyone said they were junk). Finally, do intend to buy a second set of wheels down the road so I can have two mounted sets of tires, but I didn't want to spend hundreds now on a set of wheels and tires just to try something different, especially when, as you yourself acknowledge, I don't even need it.

But, thanks to everyone else for the suggestions. I probably won't get to them until this weekend, but I'll post my results.

Any one tried this method?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60lFj9SZ8JA

Pablo:
I don't need to mountain bike, but I wanted to. However, while a $2000 bike is better in many ways than my $600 bike, I also didn't need to spend the money on one when a $600 bike would at least get me started enjoying the benefits of MTBing without a huge initial investment, especially knowing there are hundreds of others satisfied with this level of bike performance.

OK, that's completely cool. But then why are you so bent on having tubeless tires of all things, when tubes work perfectly fine?

FWIW, my bike cost a hell of a lot more than $2K, and I run tubes.

tubes work perfectly fine?.
Two flats inside a week is far from perfection for me :) . Not sure what killed the second one, but I pulled a. 5" thorn out of the first flat a few days ago though, Heh.

Of course, I am looking at only like 7% failure rate as far as flats per ride since I got the bike, but as I start taking longer trips I would like the confidence of a tubeless setup.

Of course, I am looking at only like 7% failure rate as far as flats per ride since I got the bike, but as I start taking longer trips I would like the confidence of a tubeless setup.

All-righty then. Good luck with the sense of confidence you'll get from the Stans.

(Hint: pablosnazzy is giving you very good advice.)

This would be the first review I've seen stating or even implying that tubeless setup with a good sealer is just as prone to ride-stopping flats as a standard tubed setup. So are you saying I wouldn't get any fewer flats by going tubeless?

Larger diameter hose and hole. From what I read the biggest mistake is not having enough VOLUME of air going in.....not to be confused with higher pressure.
Have you watched the Stan's videos?

Larger diameter hose and hole. From what I read the biggest mistake is not having enough VOLUME of air going in.....not to be confused with higher pressure.
Have you watched the Stan's videos?

Right and the answer is removable valve cores.

Have you watched the Stan's videos?

I have - watching Stan himself struggle with the install is what convinced me to stick with tubes on mtb.


So let me get this straight. On BF, you can say "bukkake" without getting censored, but not "**** sapiens".

Really.

+rep

This would be the first review I've seen stating or even implying that tubeless setup with a good sealer is just as prone to ride-stopping flats as a standard tubed setup. So are you saying I wouldn't get any fewer flats by going tubeless?

Dunno. I'm not sure what a "ride stopping flat" is.

In any case, I think what pablo was trying to get across is that it doesn't make much sense spend money to trade in a perfectly functional tubed wheelset for a crappy tubeless wheelset. If you want tubeless, cool. Do it right.

My only question then is what makes it crappy other than not being purpose-built to run tubeless? Being more difficult to initially air up won't affect how it works on the trails. Other than being judged for it being "ghetto," and facing a potentially more difficult install, what would be the drawback of running tubeless?

All the other help in the world won't mean crap if you don't have the rim bed built up enough with tape.

I'm running 50/50 on ghetto setup vs. UST rims on my bikes at the moment. Whenever a ghetto setup rim blows apart, it'll get replaced with a UST/Stan's or something tubeless specific rim.

My ghetto setups ARE running UST tires though. Less muss, less fuss. Barely any sealant in them - just enough to lubricate the install. IMO, way better than doing it with regular tires, and worth the weight penalty.

It's not a thorn issue around here, but pinch flats. Running smaller tires with less pressure than I was before, and having way, way fewer "unwanted air loss from tires while riding" moments.

I never got it to seal, and ended up just adding a few oz of sealant (a Slime / Latex / Antifreeze home brew) to my tubes by cutting a ~pencil-sized hole in the tube itself and simply patching them. I cut the holes along the outside center so the patches are pressed most directly into the inside of the tire.

So far they seem to be holding air (I haven't taken it for an actual ride though), and this might be the best of both worlds (for me): The simple install of a tubed setup, with the flat-resistance of a sealant-filled tubeless setup. Since the latter was really my whole motivation, I have high hopes this will work out.

I did find the thorn hole that gave me my second flat, though. The hole was tiny so having sealant in there should have allowed me to easily keep riding without worry.

Thanks for all the advice!

I never got it to seal, and ended up just adding a few oz of sealant (a Slime / Latex / Antifreeze home brew) to my tubes by cutting a ~pencil-sized hole in the tube itself and simply patching them. I cut the holes along the outside center so the patches are pressed most directly into the inside of the tire.

So far they seem to be holding air (I haven't taken it for an actual ride though), and this might be the best of both worlds (for me): The simple install of a tubed setup, with the flat-resistance of a sealant-filled tubeless setup. Since the latter was really my whole motivation, I have high hopes this will work out.

I did find the thorn hole that gave me my second flat, though. The hole was tiny so having sealant in there should have allowed me to easily keep riding without worry.

Thanks for all the advice!

Next time, just pull the valve stem and pour the stuff in. There's no reason to compromise your tube by puncturing it.

My tubes don't have removable valve cores, which is actually the whole reason I decided to go tubeless in the first place. I later read about injecting sealant directly through a hole in the tube and decided to try that instead.

Right and the answer is removable valve cores.

this