Classic & Vintage - De Rosa Titanio, 1st draft

The bike is, more or less, built up and should be ready for riding and subsequent showing off soon. I've been talking to a lot of folks and doing a lot of research and I think this is likely one of the Team Gewiss Ballan Titanios. Ugo De Rosa did make early Titanios and Ugo and Doriano learned from some of the folks at Litespeed over a period of about 3 years. The year (94) matches up, the single bottle boss set matches up and it would make sense for it being a repaint had it been an abused Team bike with scratched paint. I'm also not showing any indication that the Titanios were offered regularly in 94'.

I'm now heavily considering having it painted in Gewiss Ballan livery at some point.

It still needs some work...the cassette is ridiculous for me...I'll be looking for something far gentler. It also has a lock ring compatibility issue. I don't like the TA yellow cage...I'm in the process of locating something more appropriate.

I bought the tires on a whim, and because they were inexpensive, and I guess I didn't really know what I was getting. They're like rim thongs! They don't even extend all the way to the edge of the rim. One press of the pump and pressure goes up about 50 PSI. They were surprisingly OK over city streets at speeds under 20, but once I got it cranking, and while climbing, it was SCARY. A tire change is likely in my future as these are too much tire for me.

BIG thanks to Robbie for locating me a record ti seatpost. That really ties the room together.

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Very cool bike. I'm not an expert on welding, but it looks to my lug-trained eye like those are very nicely done and finished.

It's sort of hard to tell with the paint, but it looks pretty good. I'd say less clean than my Merlin (from what I can see through the paint) and maybe a little less neat than my two Litespeed builts, but close. It's hard to say. It's light as heck...genius fork, 6-4 DOs and BB shell. It was sort of hard to judge the ride with the rim thongs.

That really ties the room together.
Nice quote ;) even nicer ride! Those tires sound a bit frightening!!

It's sort of hard to tell with the paint, but it looks pretty good. I'd say less clean than my Merlin (from what I can see through the paint) and maybe a little less neat than my two Litespeed builts, but close. It's hard to say. It's light as heck...genius fork, 6-4 DOs and BB shell. It was sort of hard to judge the ride with the rim thongs.

I want to say I've seen some less-than-compelling welds on some of the early De Rosa Ti bikes, if my memory is correct. It's still a neat bike from an interesting era, when haematocrits climbed as high as the Dolomites themselves, withe Gewiss leading the way ...

Young man, I cannot abide that cage.

Black Elite Cuisse, with the buttons. Do not hesitate.

If the tires make you scream, let me know. I could use some Tufo spares.

I'll take up a collection for some matching chainring bolts for you...

It would look good on a ride with my Grandis, too, come spring.

Young man, I cannot abide that cage.

Black Elite Cuisse, with the buttons. Do not hesitate.

If the tires make you scream, let me know. I could use some Tufo spares.

Or maybe the red cages for contrast? That's what my yellow Grandis is sporting.

I've never seen a Titanio before...and my understanding is that none of the early ones got over here. One thing I read is that Litespeed did make some De Rosas with Ugo's on site supervision prior to the real Titanio release and, IME, Litespeeds VARY. You might be talking about them. This was shipped over from Matzumaster and factory confirmed Ugo built. I'd wager dollars to donuts it was a Gewiss, but there's no way to prove it.

This was sold about 3 years ago on Serotta forums and the seller claimed it was about a 2000...not according to the factory/serial number.

I'm planning on going with a 90s ti avenir cage that looks metalic. Very style neutral.

Ebay seller is sllllowwwwwww.


Or maybe the red cages for contrast? That's what my yellow Grandis is sporting.


I know you're not one to show off, but would you mind sharing a photo? Besides...I LOVE that Grandis (as you well know). I remember the first time I saw it and it was instant lust.

Sweet Aaron.

Picchio had an entire thread for his pretty Grandis:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/779932-New-Bike-Grandis-Light-Concept?highlight=grandis

I have a couple sets of Black Elite Cuisse cages if you want some. Can ship tomorrow if you'd like.

Might have an extra cap for the Grammo as well.

I just bought a couple from a fellow locally and I ended up with a fairly large box of various Cinelli stems and extra wedges.

Bunch of other odds and ends in the bottom of the box as well.

You're right though, the Tufos are fantastic tires in the upper price range. Yours are fairly narrow, so I would hold on tight till you get used to them.

I've never seen a Titanio before...and my understanding is that none of the early ones got over here. One thing I read is that Litespeed did make some De Rosas with Ugo's on site supervision prior to the real Titanio release and, IME, Litespeeds VARY. You might be talking about them.

I distinctly recall a De Rosa Ti frame - an older one - from ebay that looked a bit rough. No idea of the precise model or year. For me, the character and cool factor are the overriding factors, anyway.

When am I going to learn? When in need, call gomango and Ofg. I would kill for a grammo plug if you can spare one! I love the cuissis, but I really like ti for this one.

Nice quote ;) even nicer ride! Those tires sound a bit frightening!!

I just quoted that this morning which is probably why he had it on his mind. Just sayin'.

It was a way to drag you in. You said it on the moto thread ;)

It worked. That and your yellow Italian thing above. Looks great!

It's ashame GP doesn't make a ti bike...

(trying to pull string)

When am I going to learn? When in need, call gomango and Ofg. I would kill for a grammo plug if you can spare one! I love the cuissis, but I really like ti for this one.

I'll find you one buddy.

Don't pay for one.

As expensive as these stems are getting, god only knows what you'd have to pay.

Our swap meet comes up in a week in a half and there will be four or five vendors there that have Cinelli parts coming out their wazoos.

I'll look in the box when I get home from the kid's soccer game tonight.

...and no problem on the cages. I pulled a set off the Giro D' Italia I picked up.

How about King ti cages?

http://www.kingcage.com/assets/img/Cage2sm.jpg

That would be my second choice (king), but they're SPENDY and the avenir was inexpensive. It's also the right year/feel.

I will kiss you for one of those plugs! The grammo prices actually dropped this year, but still too high.

The yellow is great! how does it ride?

Where are the lugs?! Is that thing safe?! :eek:

;)

The yellow is great! how does it ride?

With those tires...SCARY!!! Once I was mid 20s, it felt twitchy on uneven surfaces. Maybe I can get used to it, but it was scary. I also can't get past what a blowout would be like with these.



Where are the lugs?! Is that thing safe?! :eek:

;)

The lugs are under the welds ;)

Once I was mid 20s, it felt twitchy on uneven surfaces. Maybe I can get used to it, but it was scary.

I was pretty twitchy in my mid-20's, too - I wouldn't read too much into it.

:roflmao:

Well played.

Or maybe the red cages for contrast? That's what my yellow Grandis is sporting.
Not a bad idea, as there is just enough red on the bike to give the eye a ride if you run red cages. Probably more so if you can accent red somewhere else, too. Pedals, wedge bag, bar end plugs, cable housing, to name a few....

That would be my second choice (king), but they're SPENDY and the avenir was inexpensive. It's also the right year/feel.

I will kiss you for one of those plugs! The grammo prices actually dropped this year, but still too high.

Ah yes, the first date.

I'll ask Julia for permission. :)

Seriously though, I answered a CL ad of all things for my Grammos.

I'm using one on my Croll and one on my Colnago Elegant.

The guy lived three blocks away, so I stopped on the way at our ATM.

Nothing like a Franklin for a box of vintage Cinelli goodness.

record titanium 9 is my favorite group and that is the perfect stem and post to complement it. i think you have got to round it out with king ti cages.

With those tires...SCARY!!! Once I was mid 20s, it felt twitchy on uneven surfaces. Maybe I can get used to it, but it was scary. I also can't get past what a blowout would be like with these. ;)
I highly recommend the S33 Pro. Not much heavier, about 30g per tire, but 16% wider and very civilized.
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Ah yes, the first date.

I'll ask Julia for permission. :)

Seriously though, I answered a CL ad of all things for my Grammos.

I'm using one on my Croll and one on my Colnago Elegant.

The guy lived three blocks away, so I stopped on the way at our ATM.

Nothing like a Franklin for a box of vintage Cinelli goodness.

Lucky bugger.

If it wasn't so expensive...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/90mm-CINELLI-GRAMMO-ART-STEM-TITANIUM-26-0-road-track-/260947730506?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cc1b2604a

Robbie - I'd probably go back to gp4000s...I know I like those.

Thirdgen - I really thought about it, but spending that much for a bottle cage...I don't know. I want to give the Avenir a try...I think it'll work out well.

This bike looks amazing for a 1st draft, I don't see anything that I'd change. Ok, maybe the rear derailleur housing length :)

Lucky bugger.

If it wasn't so expensive...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/90mm-CINELLI-GRAMMO-ART-STEM-TITANIUM-26-0-road-track-/260947730506?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cc1b2604a

Robbie - I'd probably go back to gp4000s...I know I like those.

Thirdgen - I really thought about it, but spending that much for a bottle cage...I don't know. I want to give the Avenir a try...I think it'll work out well.

I've never seen one at that price.

Time to hit the backwater bike shops this summer, along with every flea market, and swap meet in the Midwest.

I've got two boys that will be off to college soon.

This bike looks amazing for a 1st draft, I don't see anything that I'd change. Ok, maybe the rear derailleur housing length :)

Touch long? You might be right. Take my word for it, the cassette is geared too high for my lazy butt. I'm also unable to use the top gear because the lockring is for a 12t. I'll give these tires a shot, but I was seriously nervous on them. They feel good at mild speeds, but this isn't a bike I want to keep to mild speeds.

Gomango - one sold the week before at near $600. It's one of those parts that is cool, but once you had it, you'd probably never use it. I've been down that road before...like with the Vans Brooks saddle.

Whats up with the cassette ring?

And I have Grammo plug.....its $125 and comes with a free stem.

So...the lockring that came with the cassette wasn't compatible with the record 10sp hubs (I always thought 9-10-11 were cross compatible). I used one I had that fit the hub, but its size is off and it makes the top gear dicey. I took it to my LBS and they told me I needed a different diameter. It's en route courtesy of Branford bikes.

I think I'll pass on the plug, even with the free stem :)

I'm gonna stick my neck out a bit about the awesome bike.
I've had Ti, and it was one of the finest frames I ever had, but too big.
It did, however, react very differently to different wheelsets.

I discussed it at length with BF member mrmw, aka Steve. He gave me some tips.
Once I had the right wheelset, I didn't ride the bike, I wore it while running.
It was that different from the "worst" wheels I tried.

I may well be wrong, but I'm of the opinion that your rims are less than agile, not a feathery type,
and not suited to those tires.

If you had some of the truly light and nimble tubular rims out there, combined with the right tires, I think you'll run out of exclamation marks. Likewise with some clincher rims and the afore-mentioned GP4000's (or Attack/Force).

You will simply be at a loss for words to describe the different feel.

This I believe.

PS:
I think I'll pass on the plug, even with the free stem :)
I've got a spare 3TTT plug and you can use a piece of gum to fill in the hole.

I'm pretty new to tubulars...my first (modern) pair were GP4000s on Mavic GP4s. It was revelation...they almost danced on the road. I knew clinchers had come a long way, but I didn't realize tubulars had too. I've always used Mavics as a go to rim...they're neutral and pretty tough. I tend to like a stout wheel. I'm sure you're probably right...the rim's size looks like a bad match for this tire. I'm a less skilled, heavier, rider than you are and I think I'd feel more stable on some GP4000s.

Very cool Aaron...

I agree you should use a King Ti though...and...anodize it black.

The 9s lockring is smaller diameter and there are two sizes (OD) for 11s or 12s first cogs.

Very cool Aaron...

I agree you should use a King Ti though...and...anodize it black.

The 9s lockring is smaller diameter and there are two sizes (OD) for 11s or 12s first cogs.

Exactly...my cassette on there is 11 and the lockring is for 12. I ordered an 11 27.0 9/10sp lockring from Branford which should fix it. I'm saving the lockring currently on the bike in case I do change to a 12 (which is probable).

I really want to go with a more metallic looking cage, and the Avenir I ordered should be a good fit. If I don't like it, I'll break down and order a King ti (elite cycles has them at $44, which is cheap for those!).

Umm...Do you have an early or late 9s hub? If the lock-ring says '9 speed' on it than you most likely need a 26mm. 27mm is the current lockring size (as well as late 9s).

You could also go cheaper and use King alloy and still anodize it black!


Exactly...my cassette on there is 11 and the lockring is for 12. I ordered an 11 27.0 9/10sp lockring from Branford which should fix it. I'm saving the lockring currently on the bike in case I do change to a 12 (which is probable).

I really want to go with a more metallic looking cage, and the Avenir I ordered should be a good fit. If I don't like it, I'll break down and order a King ti (elite cycles has them at $44, which is cheap for those!).

Touch long? You might be right. Take my word for it, the cassette is geared too high for my lazy butt. I'm also unable to use the top gear because the lockring is for a 12t. I'll give these tires a shot, but I was seriously nervous on them. They feel good at mild speeds, but this isn't a bike I want to keep to mild speeds.

Gomango - one sold the week before at near $600. It's one of those parts that is cool, but once you had it, you'd probably never use it. I've been down that road before...like with the Vans Brooks saddle.


At $600, I'll buy another frameset or a gruppo.

I am a notorious cheapskate on some things, yet I won't bat an eyelash taking my wife out for a nice meal.

Makes me feel good though, about getting these for a good price.

I rode my Colnago 4-5 times a week after picking it up in June, so the stem will see big use this summer.

So will the Croll if I ever finish the project.

Umm...Do you have an early or late 9s hub? If the lock-ring says '9 speed' on it than you most likely need a 26mm. 27mm is the current lockring size (as well as late 9s).

You could also go cheaper and use King alloy and still anodize it black!

That's the original problem...it's a 10sp hub and I have an early 9sp cassette. The lockring didn't fit. I used a lockring I had in the house that did fit the hub, but it's for a 12t. I have the right ring on order.

At $600, I'll buy another frameset or a gruppo.

I am a notorious cheapskate on some things, yet I won't bat an eyelash taking my wife out for a nice meal.

Makes me feel good though, about getting these for a good price.

I rode my Colnago 4-5 times a week after picking it up in June, so the stem will see big use this summer.

So will the Croll if I ever finish the project.

I didn't realize you had one of those stems! They're apparently white gold.

I'm like that too...I'll spend the money on the frame, tires, gruppo...but on a bottle cage? It's just silly. I don't really like spending money on seatposts either...they all do the same thing. I'm able to rationalize it to myself when they're aesthetically awesome. I'm cheap as heck with certain things...clothes, shoes, toys...when I drove, I ALWAYS bought JUNK. I'll spend $300 on a special dinner and not bat an eye. I have odd priorities I suppose.

I didn't realize you had one of those stems! They're apparently white gold.

I'm like that too...I'll spend the money on the frame, tires, gruppo...but on a bottle cage? It's just silly. I'm cheap as heck with certain things...clothes, shoes, toys...when I drove, I ALWAYS bought JUNK. I'll spend $300 on a special dinner and not bat an eye. I have odd priorities I suppose.

I kid you not Aaron, there was a guy at our swap two years ago that had three of those in original Cinelli packaging for $50 a pop, and I passed.

Not so bright.

But the good news is I lucked into a 110 and a 120 for apparently dirt cheap pricing.

The plug for you will give me something to search for at our swap.

Khatfull and I will probably have to wrestle over this one. :)

Two out of three falls for Cinelli goodies.

...and who knows what's in that box at home, other than M5 bolts rolling in the box.

:lol:...if you pull this off, I'm going to have to send you a local artist's representation of bacon. It's hard to explain.

Another De Rosa! Titanium and in a great looking yellow.
The King titanium water bottle cages are very light and great. However, I think they are too "thick" looking. More in the style for a mountain bike than a fine Italian road bike. The Nitto "R" cage would look much better.

I do love De Rosa! The bikes I most loved when I was impressionable and fast enough for it to matter were De Rosa and Merlin.

I have a nice period appropriate ti cage I picked up cheaply coming...the seller thinks Avenir. It's just a cage...it'll hold the bottle and I'll call it a day.

Another De Rosa! Titanium and in a great looking yellow.
The King titanium water bottle cages are very light and great. However, I think they are too "thick" looking. More in the style for a mountain bike than a fine Italian road bike. The Nitto "R" cage would look much better.

Nittos are nice as well.

Disagree about the mtb bit, as a friend has a set on his Terraplane. Hardly a mtb.

In fact, I just picked up a set at the shop for my Extreme Power. Again, no mtb in sight.

Good you have a ti water bottle cage coming. 'Nough said.

I do love De Rosa's myself. I still have two, one of which is my favorite riding bike, the Replica '57. It rides great and fits me well enough to ride centuries and up to 5,000 miles a year.

I do have a '79 RS coming. Joe Bell has it now. But that's another thread.

I'm looking forward to the thread! If I ever get this painted in Dewiss, it'll be by Joe Bell. OFG had a really good point...I'd just scratch it up again.