Hybrid Bicycles - Shimano's Parts Hierarchy

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xoxoxoxoLive
02-10-12, 05:46 AM
This information is for those people who are looking to buy a new bicycle or are wanting to upgrade their old one. Understanding these gradings will give you greater knowledge of what makes a bike the price and style that it is.
MOUNTAIN BIKE PARTS
LEVEL 1 (entry level)
SIS-5 speed/6 speed/7 speed.
ALTUS-7 speed.
ACERA-7 speed/8 speed.
The above (3) are mainly used on bikes that are used on weekends,bike path riding and some commuting bikes.
LEVEL 2
ALIVO-7 speed/8 speed.
DEORE-9 speed.
These (2) are used a lot by people who commute most days as well as for bikes which are ridden on weekends. This componentry is suitable for off road use and is generally a good starting point for racing components.
LEVEL 3
DEORE LX-9 speed.
LX is a very good quality component which is well weighted and designed. LX is mainly used for serious recreation and racing. As well as for those people who want a very stable and strong commuting bike.
LEVEL 4
DEORE XT-9 speed.
XT is once again a very smooth and reliable group set, used on many racebikes as well as top end town bikes. XT is remarkably strong and very durable as well as being a delight to use.2004 saw a big change in LX when the hollow tech 2 crank set was introduced, as well as the introduction of the rapid shift levers
LEVEL 5
DEORE XTR-9 speed.
XTR is predominately used on top end race bikes. It is very light and smooth, however it does require some maintenance as it is such a precision made component.XTR also has the Hollow tech 2 crank set with an awesome disc brake and wheel set being available.
The above groupsets are how the bicycle industry group the qualities of parts, meaning the parts on the bike such as gears, brakes, hubs, cranks etc., to a bike. For example a bicycle with an Alloy frame and ALIVO components will vary in price from $500-$700 depending on the other components such as rims, handle bars, seats and forks.
ROAD BIKE PARTS.
LEVEL 1 (entry level)
SIS.
SORA.
SIS is not found on many road bikes now. However Sora is extremely popular. Many general commuting and entry level road bikes will be Sora equipped. Sora has STI levers and a very reliable gear and braking system, without being too pricey. Sora is a 8 speed group set and will come on bicyles ranged between $700-$1200.
LEVEL 2
Tiagra.
Tiagra is the first road group set that is 9 speed. Tiagra is used a lot by road cyclists that want the reliablity and smoothness of 9 speed without the price tag.
LEVEL 3
105.
This is a very commonly used component set a lot of top road bikes and training bikes will be equipped with 105 as it is exceptionally smooth in its changes and a very durable and reliable group set. 105 is also a 9 speed group set and its body predominantly made of alloy, thus making it very light. People who want good stuff that will last this is it.
LEVEL 4
ULTEGRA.
Once again used a lot for top end racing. Not often used for training bikes, however it is durable enough to do so. Very smooth and very light on its actions. This means changes with little effort.
LEVEL 5
DURA ACE.
The top of the line. Fairly expensive for the general rider.Dura Ace has been converted into a 10 speed system, with massive changes to the levers and crank sets, both so much smoother and lighter to use.
Just for those wondering. :)
giantcfr1
02-10-12, 07:01 AM
Actually there is also a road level priced between Tiagra and 105. I have ordered some brake calipers from this particular series and they will arrive next Tuesday. The reason I can't tell you the model is because they are from Shimano's "model-less" line, so they only have a code number. I'm assuming you have access to these models in the USA.
Also below Sora there is 2300 http://cycle.shimano.co.jp/publish/content/global_cycle/ja/jp/index/products/road/2300series.html
There is also 2200 available in the USA.
Jimbo47
02-10-12, 08:02 AM
One thing I've noticed when I was bike shopping and comparing components on some popular models, is how, as an example, a lot of manufacturers combine level 1 and level 2 components only changing one out such as leaving an Acera FD and only change out the RD with an Alivio calling it an upgrade.
I bought my bike based on this practice and chose one that all the components were of the same grade, and that included the FD, the RD, and the crank set.
Did it make that much of a difference?.....I don't know that it made that much, but what I do know is if I'm paying for an upgrade, I want to at least feel like I'm getting one.
giantcfr1
02-10-12, 08:33 AM
Yeah, I've seen that. The bike has a level above RD, as many customers think that is the main component for changing gears, but the rear deraileur is basically a spring with two screws. The shifters (IMO) would be the choice of the upgrade as I believe they actually contribute greater. I'm not a mechanic as you probably guessed, but that's my observation.
badger1
02-10-12, 08:37 AM
On the mtb side, the 'hierarchy' is about right, but the listings descriptions are waaaaay out of date!
XTR: 10 spd.
XT: 10 spd.
SLX Dynasys: 10 spd.
SLX (Trekking): 9 spd.
Deore: 10 spd.
Alivio: 9 spd.
badger1
02-10-12, 08:41 AM
One thing I've noticed when I was bike shopping and comparing components on some popular models, is how, as an example, a lot of manufacturers combine level 1 and level 2 components only changing one out such as leaving an Acera FD and only change out the RD with an Alivio calling it an upgrade.
I bought my bike based on this practice and chose one that all the components were of the same grade, and that included the FD, the RD, and the crank set.
Did it make that much of a difference?.....I don't know that it made that much, but what I do know is if I'm paying for an upgrade, I want to at least feel like I'm getting one.
Pretty common marketing practice: the r/d is the one bit 'hanging out there in plain sight', so throw a Tiagra group on a bike, but switch the r/d to 105, and mfg. can claim that bike X has a "105/Tiagra mix". Not going to do it with the shifters, brifters or rapidfire, 'cos they're expensive (cost) relative to a r/d!
AdelaaR
02-10-12, 09:49 AM
Pretty common marketing practice: the r/d is the one bit 'hanging out there in plain sight', so throw a Tiagra group on a bike, but switch the r/d to 105, and mfg. can claim that bike X has a "105/Tiagra mix". Not going to do it with the shifters, brifters or rapidfire, 'cos they're expensive (cost) relative to a r/d!
Exactly. The Rear derailleur is what people look at and bike salesmen know this and take advantage of it.
The crank, which is the most important component weight-wise and the most expensive one ... is often 2 or more steps lower than the RD.
In Belgium and Holland we have a few local brands that sell bikes with full groupsets by default ... those are the brands I trust and respect.
Sora is now 9speed. Tiagra, 105, Ultegra, Dura-Ace are all 10speed. Shimano is supposed to come out with 11speed some time this year i think. Nice post though. Can someone list the SRAM hierarchy too please.
ChowChow
02-10-12, 12:05 PM
You forgot Tourney and 2200.
Mountain Bike Components:
XTR
Saint
DXR
XT
LX
Hone
Deore
Alivio
Acera
Altus
Tourney
Road Bike Components:
Dura-Ace
Ultegra
105
Tiagra
Sora
2200
jsdavis
02-10-12, 12:26 PM
Pretty common marketing practice: the r/d is the one bit 'hanging out there in plain sight', so throw a Tiagra group on a bike, but switch the r/d to 105, and mfg. can claim that bike X has a "105/Tiagra mix". Not going to do it with the shifters, brifters or rapidfire, 'cos they're expensive (cost) relative to a r/d!
That and the name is prominently stamped on the RD. Before I knew better, I almost bought a bike with all almost all Sora and Ultrega RD thinking it was pretty high end.
jsdavis
02-10-12, 12:28 PM
I don't think I'd lump Deore and Alivio into the same category though. Deore is where stuff starts getting good.
badger1
02-10-12, 12:45 PM
I don't think I'd lump Deore and Alivio into the same category though. Deore is where stuff starts getting good.
Yep! Deore (roughly) Tiagra; SLX roughly 105, and on up.
Raleigh GP 08
02-10-12, 12:50 PM
... Can someone list the SRAM hierarchy too please.
Here you go:
Mtn:
XX (10 sp)
X0 (10 sp)
X9 (10 sp)
X7 (10 sp)
X5 (9/10 sp)
X4 (8/9 sp)
X3 (7 sp)
Road:
Red (10 sp)
Force (10 sp)
Rival (10 sp)
Apex (10 sp)
Jimbo47
02-10-12, 12:52 PM
I don't think I'd lump Deore and Alivio into the same category though. Deore is where stuff starts getting good.
This ^^^ Mixing the components, which makes my point exactly, and they call it an upgrade, and up the price of the bike!
SurlyLaika
02-10-12, 01:00 PM
awesome post, OP. Can I suggest you use some spacing and bolding to make the information easier to read? Thanks. An SRAM hierarchy would be useful. I got Shimano more or less down. Used the wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shimano#Road_groupsets) to find that out.
One more thing: this thread applies to all bikes, not only hybrids. Maybe it would be more useful in the General Cycling subforum as a sticky.
jsdavis
02-10-12, 01:04 PM
Well when moving to Deore, you get strong and lighter crank with external BB. The Alivio shifters are quirky IMO, unlike the Rapidfire shifters I'm accustomed to, the lever for going to smaller gear is on top rather than the bottom side of the shifter pod.
As far as price goes, I almost bought a bike with Alivo cranks, Deore FD, RD, shifters, Shimano 4xx hydraulic brakes (Alivio grade?) for $600. Pretty good deal IMO, but I didn't like the ride so for me it would have been a bad deal.
EdgewaterDude
02-10-12, 01:18 PM
Are components on flat bar hybrids as much of a big deal as they on STI road bikes? The biggest thing people complain about on STI bikes is the 2300 and Sora shifters. With Tiagra and up, you don't have to use your thumb to shift up, hence the popularity among people who ride on the drops a lot. I would think that people using a flat bar bike wouldn't have any sort of problem with this.
Shimano specifically documents what end-use each mtb group is suitable for on page 25 of their dealer catalogues. For example Saint is the ONLY group suitable for DH use.
The choice of a rear derailleur is most critical when a mtb styed bike is used off-road. Tourney, Altus and Acera are intended for city bikes which explains why so many people with mtb styled bikes end up with scrapped deralleurs when they start to use them off-road. Component use is about more than just a hierarchy.
I've gone out of my way to post the details in the MTB forums twice and most people apparently simply don't want to know.
EdgewaterDude
02-10-12, 01:54 PM
Shimano specifically documents what end-use each mtb group is suitable for on page 25 of their dealer catalogues. For example Saint is the ONLY group suitable for DH use.
The choice of a rear derailleur is most critical when a mtb styed bike is used off-road. Tourney, Altus and Acera are intended for city bikes which explains why so many people with mtb styled bikes end up with scrapped deralleurs when they start to use them off-road. Component use is about more than just a hierarchy.
I've gone out of my way to post the details in the MTB forums twice and most people apparently simply don't want to know.
Good information. I think mixing and matching road and MTB components creates a lot of confusion.
Are components on flat bar hybrids as much of a big deal as they on STI road bikes?
I was just about to make the same point. With trigger shifters I don't think it makes nearly as much of a difference as the much more complicated road bike style integrated brake/shifters. I don't notice a big difference in shift quality with lower end trigger shifter setups but they require much more frequent tuning. So a higher level rear derailleur on a hybrid does make a difference. IME the front derailleur makes almost no difference in real world shift quality. Don't forget the crankshaft quality either, it's often a part manufacturers skimp on that I've heard makes a difference in shift quality.
badger1
02-10-12, 04:25 PM
I was just about to make the same point. With trigger shifters I don't think it makes nearly as much of a difference as the much more complicated road bike style integrated brake/shifters. I don't notice a big difference in shift quality with lower end trigger shifter setups but they require much more frequent tuning. So a higher level rear derailleur on a hybrid does make a difference. IME the front derailleur makes almost no difference in real world shift quality. Don't forget the crankshaft quality either, it's often a part manufacturers skimp on that I've heard makes a difference in shift quality.
I'll disagree a little here.
IMO, there is a noticeable difference in shifting quality/'lightness' of action/stability as one moves up the levels.
I've used road-based triggers from both Shimano and SRAM. There is a distinctly better 'feel' with Shimano's 770/780 series shifters, as compared to their 440 series. The former use ball-bearing pivots, the latter bushings. The same holds true for XTR/XT versus SLX and lower on the mtb side.
Quality matters.
Similarly, I now use SRAM's 'double tap' 10 spd flatbar shifters (Force/Rival level); I was able to compare these to their SL700 series ones before purchasing. The difference again was noticeable: lighter action/ease of use (along with the double-tap system, of course, which I like).
In both cases (SRAM and Shimano), I would expect the better materials/construction to result also in greater durability.
YMMV.
EdgewaterDude
02-10-12, 08:07 PM
I just had a look at the double tap stuff by SRAM - VERY cool. I like how they were able to carry it over on to flat bar stuff too. That is some technology I can't wait to see trickle down.
It's an interesting point in regards to the 770/780 series. I figured shift action would be similar to the 440 series or lower. I guess I'd have to go test ride a 7.7 FX to find out how it really feels, though I've never even felt like my cheapy shifters are all that sloppy.
xoxoxoxoLive
02-10-12, 08:54 PM
awesome post, OP. Can I suggest you use some spacing and bolding to make the information easier to read? Thanks. An SRAM hierarchy would be useful. I got Shimano more or less down. Used the wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shimano#Road_groupsets) to find that out.
One more thing: this thread applies to all bikes, not only hybrids. Maybe it would be more useful in the General Cycling subforum as a sticky.
Thanks, I thought it might be a helpful starting guide for new cyclist. Was going to list the Scram next to the Shimano for comparison. But got lazy, and did not realize the response it would get. Wished I had now, tried to keep it basic information only. And everyone is so right about Bike Manufactures throwing on a nice rear DR, (cause people tend to look there first). I do think it would make a useful sticky in the General Cycling Forum with both the Scram, and Shimano together. Maybe some one with better computer, and grammar skills will make a nice one for them. ( Good Ideal ) Richard
xoxoxoxoLive
02-10-12, 09:09 PM
Shimano specifically documents what end-use each mtb group is suitable for on page 25 of their dealer catalogues. For example Saint is the ONLY group suitable for DH use.
The choice of a rear derailleur is most critical when a mtb styed bike is used off-road. Tourney, Altus and Acera are intended for city bikes which explains why so many people with mtb styled bikes end up with scrapped deralleurs when they start to use them off-road. Component use is about more than just a hierarchy.
I've gone out of my way to post the details in the MTB forums twice and most people apparently simply don't want to know.
Good information on the MTB rear DR's .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYKvCLC23ww
I found this video on Youtube a few years ago, when I was using Scram X7 stuff. (Interesting)
jsdavis
02-10-12, 10:51 PM
So what am I supposed to take away from that video? Since the video is posted by SRAM, I wouldn't believe that it is unbiased. Click on the link for the user who posted it, and it says SRAM at the top.
Is the Shimano part moving because it's supposed to?
grindr82
02-11-12, 12:25 AM
I am interested in learning more about this hierarchy. I am currently looking at a bike with these specs:
FD SHIMANO M191, 34.9 CLAMP
RD SHIMANO ACERA
CRANK SHIMANO M171 48/38/28
SHIFTERS SHIMANO ALTUS
The price point on this bike is $725.....are the components on the same level?
Where do hybrid bikes fall into in reference to parts? Do they use road or mtb parts usually? I'm asking cause I am about to receive my new bike and will be upgrading parts eventually. thanks
jsdavis
02-11-12, 01:59 AM
Where do hybrid bikes fall into in reference to parts? Do they use road or mtb parts usually? I'm asking cause I am about to receive my new bike and will be upgrading parts eventually. thanks
What bike specifically? A hybrid is anything that's not quite a road bike and not quite a mountain bike. It can fall anywhere in between those two extremes. Bikes closer to road bikes user road components like flat bar road bikes, although some use mountain bike components. Those closer to mountain bikes will use mountain bike components. I think some are even a mix of the two.
jsdavis
02-11-12, 02:02 AM
I am interested in learning more about this hierarchy. I am currently looking at a bike with these specs:
FD SHIMANO M191, 34.9 CLAMP
RD SHIMANO ACERA
CRANK SHIMANO M171 48/38/28
SHIFTERS SHIMANO ALTUS
The price point on this bike is $725.....are the components on the same level?
What bike is that? It looks over priced.
What about the other parts? Sealed or unsealed hubs, rims, brakes? Frame material? Is it butted? Is there carbon fiber fork?
On second thought, maybe it's not too far off, though it still seems like a bit much. I have a Tourney FD, Deore RD, crank is probably equiv to Acera, Alivio shifters, and Acera cassette on my bike. SRP is around $650 but I got it for around $420 on clearance so that's why I thought the bike you are describing seemed overpriced. I also have Hayes disc brakes and FSA double sealed hubs.
jsdavis
02-11-12, 02:19 AM
Looks closer to a road bike but most drive stuff is mountain type components.
ChowChow
02-11-12, 07:22 AM
I am interested in learning more about this hierarchy. I am currently looking at a bike with these specs:
FD SHIMANO M191, 34.9 CLAMP
RD SHIMANO ACERA
CRANK SHIMANO M171 48/38/28
SHIFTERS SHIMANO ALTUS
The price point on this bike is $725.....are the components on the same level?
Really?
Not worth it at all.
ChowChow
02-11-12, 07:27 AM
Fuji Absolute 3.0
How much did you paid for this bike and what year is it?
ChowChow
02-11-12, 07:32 AM
I am interested in learning more about this hierarchy. I am currently looking at a bike with these specs:
FD SHIMANO M191, 34.9 CLAMP
RD SHIMANO ACERA
CRANK SHIMANO M171 48/38/28
SHIFTERS SHIMANO ALTUS
The price point on this bike is $725.....are the components on the same level?
The only brand that I've seen with low end parts and with high prices is Specialized. All though I did seen one on the Trek line also. I wouldn't spend more than $400 on a bike that has Shimano Altus RD and more than $500 for Shimano Acera RD.
jsdavis
02-11-12, 08:56 AM
Fuji Absolute 3.0
Are you sure you have the price right? The website says $589 which is more in line for the components you've listed.
xoxoxoxoLive
02-11-12, 09:08 AM
Are you sure you have the price right? The website says $589 which is more in line for the components you've listed.
Performance Bike's has the 2011 model Fuji Absolute 3.0 in stock, for 399.00 dollars by my house.
xoxoxoxoLive
02-11-12, 09:32 AM
So what am I supposed to take away from that video? Since the video is posted by SRAM, I wouldn't believe that it is unbiased. Click on the link for the user who posted it, and it says SRAM at the top.
Is the Shimano part moving because it's supposed to?
Nothing really, I just found the X7 Scram worked, and shifted off road very smooth. It was just a video I seen, maybe your comment is the best. (that Scram made it) LOL
grindr82
02-11-12, 09:45 AM
Its the 2012 Cannondale Quick CX 4, I didnt want to list them all but its available online at their website......
xoxoxoxoLive
02-11-12, 09:52 AM
Fuji Absolute 3.0
Those do not match the 2011 model Specs :
FD SHIMANO M191 31.8mm
RD SHIMANO ALTUS
CRANK Fuji Alloy Forged 28/38/48T
SHIFTERS SHIMANO ACERA
Performance Bike's by my house, has a white 21" in stock for 399.00 dollars, and several Blacks in different sizes for 449.00 dollars. Why the price difference ? They really could not tell me ethier, but the components were the same. And the bike weighs 26.5 pounds. (Test Rode One Also) Richard
AdelaaR
02-11-12, 12:04 PM
Good information. I think mixing and matching road and MTB components creates a lot of confusion.
Confusion to the newbies for sure, but not for the more experienced.
My hybrid is a mix of LX, SLX, XT, 105 and SRAM :)
EdgewaterDude
02-11-12, 02:55 PM
Where do hybrid bikes fall into in reference to parts? Do they use road or mtb parts usually? I'm asking cause I am about to receive my new bike and will be upgrading parts eventually. thanks
Seems like lower end hybrids usually use mountain bike components. For instance, Treks bikes use Deore/Altus/Alivio/Tourney on their basic stuff, and the gearing is usually a 48/38/38 triple with a 11-32 cassette.
The high end stuff usually has some sort of compact double with road gearing (50/34, 53/39) and an 11 or 12/26. Road gearing is a heck of a lot less leisurely, in my opinion.
grindr82
02-11-12, 03:41 PM
Its the Cannondale Quick CX4 heres the rest of the info from the website:
Frame
Quick CX Rigid, Optimized 6061 alloy, SAVE, 1-1/8" head tube
Fork
Fatty Rigid Disc
Crank
Shimano M171 48/38/28
Bottom Bracket
Tange Cartridge
Shifters
Shimano Altus
Cog Set
Sunrace CSG66 11-32, 8 spd
Chain
KMC Z82, 8-speed
Front Derailleur
Shimano M191, 34.9 clamp
Rear Derailleur
Shimano Acera
Rims
Maddux DC3.0, double wall w/eyelet, 32 hole
Hubs
Cannondale C4
Tires
Continental Double Fighter II, 700x37c
Pedals
Quick Reinforced Composite w/ Kraton inserts
Brake
Tektro Novela mechanical disc, 160/160 mm
Handlebar
Cannondale C4, 6061, 25mm rise, 620mm
Stem
Cannondale C4, 1-1/8", 31.8, 12 deg
Headset
Tange 1-1/8"
Spokes
Stainless Steel XD Black, 15g
Grips
Cannondale Urban Ergo
Saddle
Cannondale Quick CX Ergo
Seat Post
Cannondale C4, alloy, 31.6 x 350 mm
Shifters
Shimano Altus
Is it truly over priced? I get so lost with all of this.
ChowChow
02-11-12, 06:01 PM
Its the Cannondale Quick CX4 heres the rest of the info from the website:
Frame
Quick CX Rigid, Optimized 6061 alloy, SAVE, 1-1/8" head tube
Fork
Fatty Rigid Disc
Crank
Shimano M171 48/38/28
Bottom Bracket
Tange Cartridge
Shifters
Shimano Altus
Cog Set
Sunrace CSG66 11-32, 8 spd
Chain
KMC Z82, 8-speed
Front Derailleur
Shimano M191, 34.9 clamp
Rear Derailleur
Shimano Acera
Rims
Maddux DC3.0, double wall w/eyelet, 32 hole
Hubs
Cannondale C4
Tires
Continental Double Fighter II, 700x37c
Pedals
Quick Reinforced Composite w/ Kraton inserts
Brake
Tektro Novela mechanical disc, 160/160 mm
Handlebar
Cannondale C4, 6061, 25mm rise, 620mm
Stem
Cannondale C4, 1-1/8", 31.8, 12 deg
Headset
Tange 1-1/8"
Spokes
Stainless Steel XD Black, 15g
Grips
Cannondale Urban Ergo
Saddle
Cannondale Quick CX Ergo
Seat Post
Cannondale C4, alloy, 31.6 x 350 mm
Shifters
Shimano Altus
Is it truly over priced? I get so lost with all of this.
Yes, it's over price IMO. It should not be more than $500 IMO.
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