To the guy riding on Country Club road, W-S, yesterday

[SecretSatellite]

holicow-you say you have a better understanding of why cagers hate cyclists. all you've proved is that being a cager makes you angry and stupid. you got angry cause the bike came so close to your car? would you be so angry if a pedestrian had bumped up against your car or jaywalked? running red lights is a no brainer, if there are no cars coming and it can be done safely then do it. same if i'm walking. so what if its against the law. laws dont create order, they create criminals.

[holicow]

holicow-you say you have a better understanding of why cagers hate cyclists. all you've proved is that being a cager makes you angry and stupid..

I know you are, but what am I? Is that better?



you got angry cause the bike came so close to your car? would you be so angry if a pedestrian had bumped up against your car or jaywalked? running red lights is a no brainer, if there are no cars coming and it can be done safely then do it. same if i'm walking. so what if its against the law. laws dont create order, they create criminals.

Read my description of the intersection and incident again, please. This is a busy intersection, and there were probably 30-50 cars/drivers that witnessed it.

And to you, that guy that started it all, and everybody else:

Happy New Year!!!

And be careful out there...take it from a casualty of the bicycle-car interface.

[randya]

running red lights is a no brainer, if there are no cars coming and it can be done safely then do it. same if i'm walking. so what if its against the law. laws dont create order, they create criminals.
If you've got 'right turn on red' in your area, it's already *legal* for a motorist to proceed on a red light if they check and no one's coming. As a pedestrian I will do the same thing - check and if no one's coming, I will cross the street against the light. Supposedly that's against the law; but if in the eyes of the law a motorist is capable of making a determination that it's safe to turn right on red, I think that pedestrians (and cyclists) should be able and allowed to make the same type of judgement determination - motorists don't have any special powers that make them better at this than non-motorists. The fact that it's legal for motorists but not for peds and cyclists is completely arbitrary and is a good example of how our traffic laws favor motorists and discriminate against other road users. Public streets are for people, not for cars. :)

[Daily Commute]

The main reason cyclists run red lights when cars won't: because we can. Car drivers will break traffic laws to the extent they think they can get away with it. That's why so many drivers go 68-72 mph (but not 80) in a 65 mph zone. They know they won't get ticketed. Drivers will do rolling stops at stop signs and for right turns on red whenever they think they can get away with it.

Cyclists do the same thing, but, since cops generally give cyclists more leeway, cyclists get away with more.

I'm not saying it's right (I think the cyclist in holicow's story was wrong to run the red). I'm just saying that's the way it is.

[SecretSatellite]

I know you are, but what am I? Is that better?
Read my description of the intersection and incident again, please. This is a busy intersection, and there were probably 30-50 cars/drivers that witnessed it.

And to you, that guy that started it all, and everybody else:

Happy New Year!!!

And be careful out there...take it from a casualty of the bicycle-car interface.
sorry, i didnt mean to come off so mean. i meant to say being a cager makes the individual driving angry and stupid. along the lines of a previous post that said most drivers are angry while driving. so, rather than now knowing what it is that cyclists do to anger motorists you have a better understanding of what it means to be a driver and made angry by a cyclist(for wahtever reason). i'm biased though, i'll always side with the bikers.

[SD Fixed]

If I (who rides in spirit, if not in body) ....(snip) People like you ruin it for the rest of us.

Sincerely,

Mike


Mike,

Does he ruin it for you in spirit, or in body?

[SD Fixed]

In that case, here's a suggestion. How about taking the complaint to the police? That's likely to be far more productive than whining about it here, where the perpetrator is unlikely to even see it.

Oh, sorry. Wrong forum for positive suggestions.

Beautifully said Chris. Whining, er, posting here doesn't do much for this case...

How about the poster get out on his bike and find the guy?

[SD Fixed]

ONe more question:

While you were yelling out the window, were you watching what was going on in traffic?

[holicow]

William, I will try to respond to your multiple (condescending) posts:

I was stopped at the light, read my post again.

I can't ride anymore after being hit by a car this summer. After years of riding, you will understand that I still carry an interest, I am sure.

Sorry for "whining". Have a great New Year.

[SD Fixed]

William, I will try to respond to your multiple (condescending) posts:

I was stopped at the light, read my post again.

I can't ride anymore after being hit by a car this summer. After years of riding, you will understand that I still carry an interest, I am sure.

Sorry for "whining". Have a great New Year.

From what I’ve read, he broke only one law. However, it seems to me you believe he violated some social contract the you feel he’s obligated to. This constitutes a severe double standard no matter how you look at it. Because for you to stand here and cry wolf, to yell foul, we would have to all have an agreed upon norm that when violated we could hold as standard. His splitting lanes really, only pissed you off. And I evidence this by your admission that you were yelling at him about his actions. I won’t say that you have no right to yell, or no place. But I will say that you lack any authority or justification to do so.

I’ll hopefully have a good new year. Thank you for the well wishes, and the same to you.

[qmsdc15]

Bikes should stay off country club road. I have an early tee time tomorrow and would appreciate no delays. If you work in the club's kitchen please complete your commute by 8:30. Thank you.

[holicow]

From what I’ve read, he broke only one law. .
How many is too many?


However, it seems to me you believe he violated some social contract the you feel he’s obligated to. This constitutes a severe double standard no matter how you look at it. Because for you to stand here and cry wolf, to yell foul, we would have to all have an agreed upon norm that when violated we could hold as standard. His splitting lanes really, only pissed you off. .

He "pissed me off" because I KNOW he "pissed" other people there off. That is what I am trying (and failing) to communicate. One cyclist's misdeeds DO reflect on all others by being witnessed by a large group of car drivers, many of whom would rather bikes disappear, or worse.

You, William, typify the type of self-important, priviledged, pompous attitude displayed by my example. I hope no one runs over you, like they did me.

Signing off. Be safe.

[SD Fixed]

How many is too many?

How soon is now? Do you enforce all violations of the law that you see or do you selectively only yell at the ones you think you can get a cowardly yell in from your car seat? It's not a matter of if he broke the law, but a matter of how you think it's ok for you to enforce a law that you think is ok? Ever chase down a car that makes an illegal left turn? Tell some ******* to stop making racist jokes? Get your face smashed in because you grabbed the shoulder of some drunk **** who grabs a girls ass? Do you do that? Or do you simply post here that you got mad at some guy who ran a light on his bike because it violates YOUR ethic.




He "pissed me off" because I KNOW he "pissed" other people there off.
So, you're now working in defense of other people? HOW NOBLE!!!!


That is what I am trying (and failing) to communicate. One cyclist's misdeeds DO reflect on all others by being witnessed by a large group of car drivers, many of whom would rather bikes disappear, or worse.

And your actions of yelling out of a car window typify why a lot of people won't ride. People yell at you, scream at you, take the law into thier own judgement....

You, William, typify the type of self-important, priviledged, pompous attitude displayed by my example.

You're pretty ****ing pompous yourself. High and mighty yelling out of a car window. I bet you slapped a person on the back of the head and then ran behind the playground teacher when you were in grade school. Not much changes, really.


I hope no one runs over you, like they did me. Signing off. Be safe. I sincerely believe that you (aside from having issues) could give a **** if I got run over. In fact, I believe that if I did get hit again, you'd cheer in your car if you saw it. Sure, you'd act concerned, but deep inside, where people don't see much because of the convulted idea of self you have, you'd be cheering.


Have a great new year.

[powers2b]

How did all this get in the advocacy and safety forum?
Isn't there a hate monger forum on this site??

[mirona]

I sincerely believe that you (aside from having issues) could give a **** if I got run over. In fact, I believe that if I did get hit again, you'd cheer in your car if you saw it. Sure, you'd act concerned, but deep inside, where people don't see much because of the convulted idea of self you have, you'd be cheering.

I'd cheer out loud.

[Daily Commute]

The insults are not going to persuade anybody.

[SD Fixed]

I'd cheer out loud.
At least your honest about it!

[Noif666]

While this cyclist was certainly wrong to run the red light, I personally would not generalize the behavior of one or even most cyclist to all cyclists. If a motorist is frustrated by a cyclist who rides irresponsibly, and decides to take that frustration out on me, I will blame the motorist only and not the cyclist. The same goes for motorist. If one motorist is aggressive and reckless, I will not take out my frustration with the aggressive motorist on motorist who drive responsibly. Any motorist who decides to generalize on all cyclists because of one or most bicycle riders and further decides to drive dangerously around all cyclists because of this generalization has some problmes of his/her own unrelated to the irresponsible bike rider.

An excellent attitude. I wish there were more road users like you :)