Training & Nutrition - Joint care without supplements

I was curious as to what foods are best to help maintain joint health without taking Gluc/Chond supplements.

My guess would be foods like Jell-O, or others with gelatin etc. Any other recommendations?

Are you alergic or something? Club/Chond has actually been shown to help.

Anyway, I don't know any particular foods. A well balanced diet with plenty of phytonutrients (frozen veggies!) and protein certainly won't hurt. Carb loading post ride will help too.

How does carb loading help smooth and lube joints?

I was just looking for ways to adjust my diet a little without having to spend $30/month or more for pills. I try to simply eat right, instead of having a steady diet of pills, pills, pills. Kind of reminds me of an article I read once about a guy who was a health nut, and had a whole cabinet full of bottles of supplement pills. He died at 63yo from all the stuff he was taking. LOL

Patriot,

I too have joint problems. I have arthritis in my hips, knees, and shoulders. I didn't want to take too many supplements, and definitely didn't want to take any of the prescription arthritis meds that are out there, so I asked my chiropractor what I could do. She recommended flax seed oil twice a day. It is just an oil, so technically, not a supplement, and I just take a swig of it in the morning and another at night. I also use some on toast if I am eating it, or put it on whatever else I happen to be making. The taste is nutty, similar to peanut butter, and so far, I think it is helping. I have done some research, and so far have found that it is supposed to help with not only joints, but eyes, heart, and skin as well. Just don't cook with it, heat kills the benefits of the oil. Also, only buy in small amounts and store in the refrigerator as it goes rancid quickly.

Hope this helps!

Kat

Hi,
my Doc got me taking Glucosamine Sulfate. You can get it cheap
from Walmart, in the 200 count size. Just take one 1,000 mg pill with breakfast.
If you do that it's just a few cents a day. There is no substitute, and the stuff does work for most people.

flax oil as mentioned and fish oil are the two I see mentioned the most <-- basically anything high in Omega 3. Making sure you drink enough water always seems to help ease the pain a bit as well. I think I also recall seeing Ginger being mentioned as having some anti-inflammatory effects.

I will also add that the only time I actually got my knee pain to go away, was when I was taking a gluc/chon supplement.

flax oil as mentioned and fish oil are the two I see mentioned the most <-- basically anything high in Omega 3.

If you eat salmon sashimi once a week, you'll have plenty of omega-3 fats... ;)

actually. if you don't already have joint pain i would only take one pill a day of the supplement. that's what i do. i had terrible joint pain at one point. but now i only take one pill aday.

just start off at the high does and then ease off it.

i think the study i saw with arthritis patients only used 50 mg a day and the OLD people still noticed improvement. so a few hundred should be just great.

well, I've been having knee pain, and I'm only 18. would glucoseamine help me? or is it just arthritus related pain? sorry for the awful spelling there guys.

Carb loading after riding helps take care of joints by preventing a surge in corticosteroids post ride. In short: if you don't eat to accomodate exercise, your body eats itself to recover.

Phatman,
probably not. Your body slows down, and production of glucosamine is one of the things that slows. At your age, it's prob going full blast. Knee pain might come from the saddle being in the wrong place. If you can't can't figure it out (feel free to start a thread on it) then see a Doc, and soon. You don't want the pain to become permanent damage.

The jury is still out on whether or not glucosamine and/or chondroitin are effective in arthritis pain. Most of the studies showing a positive benefit were either funded by companies which manufacture the supplements or did not make clear where their funding came from. Of note, three decent trials which did not take funding from supplement manufacturers showed no difference between glucosamine and placebo. Chondroitin has even less evidence to support its use.

My take on the situation is that it's either of small benefit or none. The good news is that it seems to be fairly safe, so the only thing you'll likely to harm by trying it is lightening your wallet a bit.

no benefit in placebo controlled trial (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15501201)

While I take vitamins, I am not religous about it.
So when I run out of something it may be a month before
I refill. But not glucosamine. When that runs out, a week later
the old abrasiveness comes back. I went a couple weeks the first time that happened, and found myself cutting back on exercise as the discomfort grew. My 2 cents is this.... there is a problem with that study. I was talking with a guy who was about to start taking glucosamine recently. His vet had prescribed it for his dog. The dog started running again. Sure, it could be a coincidence. But I doubt it.

Phatman,
probably not. Your body slows down, and production of glucosamine is one of the things that slows. At your age, it's prob going full blast. Knee pain might come from the saddle being in the wrong place. If you can't can't figure it out (feel free to start a thread on it) then see a Doc, and soon. You don't want the pain to become permanent damage.

well, already did. http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=78407&highlight=knee+pain+inside

I was just wondering if the glucosamine would help any at my age.

No,
avoid the glucosamine. Do your shoes wear more on one side then the other? Have you measured the length of each leg? (Have someone do so, if you haven't yet. Hold a ruler or book rammed up into your crotch to give the person something to measure against)Have you had knee injury in the past? Do your hamstrings ever bother you, or to be more speicific.... are they nearly as strong as your quads?

Two things:
1)
The trial that showed no benefit by glucosamine was falacious. The effects of glucosamine in many of the trials that showed benefit did not begin until AFTER 12 weeks so the clinical trial was conducted over too short a time. Besides, most of the compelling evidence has been with glucosamine sulfate and other salt derivatives may not be as good (chonddroitin etc.) We do need more independant trials, however since a majority of the studies were funded in part or in whole by these supplement manufacturers as already stated.


2) If you are 18 you don't need glucosamine, you may have other issues such as seat adjustment, Osgood Schlatter disease etc. etc. If it doesn't get better, see someone about it.

I am beginning to think part of mym problem may also be bike fit. I noticed my knee is right over the pedal spindle. But, on my new bike which I tested on my trainer last night, my knee is about 1/2-1" behind the spindle, and after 30min test ride, I did not feel the same knee irritation I felt with my other bike.
Also, i think I may try the flax seed oil too. I here it helps prevent gout. Not that I have that problem, but it breaks up some sort of acids in your blood that apparently causes it.

Why not try the glucosamine? I get about 3 months' supply for about $20. My dog didn't know if he was taking a placebo or the real stuff, went from hobbling around the house back to his old cat chasing self in about a month or so. I've been taking it steadily since July, my knees no longer creak loudly when going up and down the stairs and are basically pain free. I play ice hockey and ball hockey as well as lots of cycling, thought I would have to give something up due to wonky knees. I'm playing ice hockey twice a week now and ball hockey twice a week - with the glucosamine sulphate, no knee problems at all!

Knee pain is sometimes said to be caused by unequal strength in the back leg muscles compared to the front leg muscles. Most of us hate to take time away from the bike--BUT, weight-bearing exercize is important to bone and joint health.

Walking and running are activities which strengthen the muscles in the front of the leg. This will balance the cycling, which emphasizes the back of the leg. Weight exercizes like squats and lunges will also strengthen leg muscles more evenly.

I have an uncle who is 70+ and doesnt look a day over 55. He takes gelatin and a bunch of stuff, like jim fixx who people said he ran all the time and died of a heart attack. If he didnt run he would have died sooner.

By all means, yes, get your bike fit right. Too much or too little leg extension are common causes. Pedals, even with float, are another common problem. Even with float, your foot needs to be able to move into the positions that's right for you. And the "right position" can vary with different terrains and efforts. Finally, at least with me, a position that puts your knee much behind the pedal axle is conducive to power, and can lead to excessive mashing, even at a relatively high cadence.

I think gelatin as a help for joint pain has been debunked. My understanding is that Glucosamine works by encouraging the growth of cartiledge, which acts as a buffer between the bones. I'd Google for other nutrients that do the same. Vitamin C comes to mind, which strengthens all connective tissues. Eat oranges! The pulpy stuff contains other nutrients (again, I'm vague on specifics... bioflavinoids?) that help the vitamin C strengthen connective tissues.

Good luck!