Electric Bikes - My test rides of several e-bikes in San Francisco--illuminating and some surprises!

Today I spent 3 hrs test-riding ebikes in SF, having done tons of research on this board and elsewhere. The store is new (in this location), friendly, and knowledgeable, selling ONLY ebikes.

Here are reviews based on an admittedly short test ride in each case, i.e. 15 min or so, but the ride included a 3-block-long steep SF hill, up and down of course:

1. Kettler Twin: I love the comfy upright stable ride and had high expectations for the Panasonic in-line motor, but was disappointed. The gear shifting was not good on the steep uphill. The first time up the hill I had put the bike into first gear after starting the ascent but absolutely could not accomplish the ride after 2 blocks and gave up--and it turned out the bike was actually still in 3rd gear although it showed first gear. If we put it into proper gear before beginning the ascent, we could be sure it was really in first gear. But it seemed pretty weird that we couldn't be sure the bike was really in first gear when it said it was! Then when it was truly in first gear it was much more assistance, but not enough for me. It was still simply too much work for me to pedal up the hill. Because I have some medical restrictions I can't just treat this as a problem to be solved by sweat and time--I have to have a not-too-laborious ride. I guess these bikes are not made for really steep hills like we have here (someone on this board already warned me about this!). It's a really heavy bike, which gives it the stability I like, but just made it too hard to get up that steep hill. I did like the internal gears (is that what one calls it when you twist the handlebar to change gears and you don't have to be pedaling?) and the nicely covered chain. It only has 3 levels of assist which felt a little primitive.

2. Kalkhoff Tasman: Very similar to Kettler, a little sportier. Same problems with shifting while riding uphill, and just not strong enough for 'our' hills and my reconstructed hips. Required even a bit more pedaling than the Kettler. I was really surprised by this, I had thought I'd be taking home a Kalkhoff for sure. My husband felt like you had to actually turn the whole front wheel of the Kalkhoff briefly to the side to get the gear shifting to work on the hill. All of this was totally not what I expected given what I had read on this board about Kalkhoffs.

3. BH Emotion Volt (folding electric): After the lumbering Kettler, this was a peppy little thing that zipped off as soon as I started pedaling and made it up the hill much more easily, but not without some good effort on my part. I was surprised at how much I did like this bike. I was more nervous going downhill with those small wheels and I felt like I would not feel as secure riding the bike on the crappy street surfaces where I live. I liked this bike but felt like I'm more of a standard-wheel person. It's fun, about 42 lbs, pretty powerful, but not stable enough for me.

4. Ohm Urban: This was great. It just breezed up the steep hill while I pedaled lightly along. It is not a light bike but felt like one when I rode it. Before trying it I didn't think I'd want a bike with a throttle, because I imagined it making the bike into something like a Porsche scooter, but the throttle was great--a subtle but definite boost up that steep hill. Also I LOVE the way the regenerative brakes totally slow you down when going downhill--I didn't have to touch the brakes while going down the very steep hill if I set the regen to highest power. This was a perfectly smooth ride, no problems shifting, no problems modifying assist level. I will still need to pedal to get uphill but it is totally doable.

I have some small complaints about the Ohm, or at least things I preferred about the other bikes:

a. Kettler's step-through was more comfortable for me; Ohm's big bulky battery in the step-through area (whatever you call the area between the seat and the handlebar post) makes me swing my leg around the back of the bike to get on and off. I have a slightly restricted hip mobility so this is a real thing, but I can manage the Ohm well enough. I wish the battery were just a tad lower somehow.

b. The way to change gears is annoying--there are three gears to control on the left, 7 on the right, and you use thumb on one side to increase, finger on the other side to increase, it is just not intuitive to me. Clearly I just don't understand gears, but I figure this is just a matter of habit to learn. I also like the twisting/internal gears better, where you don't have to be peddling to change gears. But the gear-shifting is not at all intuitive and I like the simple twist model where you can see easily what gear you are in.

c. Related point: on the Ohm you can't see what gear you are in very easily because the screen blocks the view of the right-hand gear indicator, and the bell on the left does that too. So I found myself pressing on right side and left and not sure what I was increasing or decreasing or how those are related to each other. And in fact, how ARE they related to each other?? Any tips on this are welcome!!

d. The buttons for increasing and decreasing the motor's assistance level and for using the throttle are all small and too close together. Ohm should in my opinion make them bigger and more spread out for a more ergonomic and comfortable interface.

Nonetheless we left with the Ohm, and I'm psyched to ride it around! I'll post a lengthier review in a few days if people are interested. I think the biggest learning-curve issue is figuring out how to use each of the three aspects of managing the power--the assistance level, the gears, and the throttle--and how to use them together for the right feel and most efficient power. Again, tips welcome on that.

Congrats on getting the Urban. I'm getting an Urban in May when the 2012's come out. It's hard to wait.

You will adjust to the shifting. For me, it's like my regular commuter shifts, so that is a plus. The step over on the Ohm is less than a normal diamond frame bike.

You don't have to shift into the lowest gear going up a hill when using the 300% boost. You'll find the gear that works best for your strength.

Dammit, i couldn't get up the hill to get home. Pushed the bike for a few short, very steep stretches and then called my husband for a pickup. He was able to pedal it home the last steep stretch.

So how likely is it that i can get strong enough to do this hill without ruining my Steel-reinforced hip? Do i give up and take it back? There is a less steep way i can try tomorrow but it is 5 Miles longer.

Dammit, i couldn't get up the hill to get home. Pushed the bike for a few short, very steep stretches and then called my husband for a pickup. He was able to pedal it home the last steep stretch.

So how likely is it that i can get strong enough to do this hill without ruining my Steel-reinforced hip? Do i give up and take it back? There is a less steep way i can try tomorrow but it is 5 Miles longer.

My neck is titanium. I bought my ebike to build myself back up after a spinal injury. It takes time but it is doable. If I may sugest, joining a spin class at the local Y or other gym can help a lot in the beginning. One of the advantages of spin class is one never gets stranded when you wear out.

The Ohm is a BionX hub system and doesn't surprise me that it didn't make it up your hill as you described it several posts ago. While you will gain some power in your body the more you ride if the bike won't get you home now, when you need it to be as easy as possible, along with getting to know the gearing and nuances of riding a bike I am afraid it won't be a good fit for you.

I tried to tell you before that you will need to have a bike that meets the upper limit of wattage allowed in CA. (750w). If you can return that bike I would and do this instead:

Go to a bike shop in your neighborhood and find a bike that suits your needs such as ease of mounting, disc brakes and even an internally geared hub, get a good one. If you get it close by they can help you maintain it also.

Take it to the ebike shop I mentioned earlier tell them your requirements and have them outfit it with an appropriate hub motor, controller, throttle and battery. They are very knowledgable about doing this and will not steer you wrong and you already have found out that a hub motor and throttle will suffice for you, albeit a more powerful system.

This option will probably cost you less than the Ohm did and will get you to the top of your street no problem. Work on your strength from there instead of trying to build it up on a bike that doesn't perform how you need it to and risk stressing your injuries further. If it doesn't do what you want it to you will not ride it.

The bikes you rode with an inline motor are both 250 watts. I have experience riding a recumbent with a Cyclone 500 watt. It has taken be up any hill in the Denver area I could throw at it. There is a bicycle shop in San Franciso that sells a cyclone powered Day 6 bike. Very confortble. I doubt you would have a problem going up your hill however if you did you could change the back gearing for an easy fix. Here is a link.

http://www.ecomallbiz.com/treasurebiz/electricbicycles/

If money were not an option you could go with Opti-Bike. I test rode one of those. I believe it will climb a telephone pole. Another high dollar option would be Eco-Speed. Lightfoot cycles sells a recumbent with a Eco-Speed. Really nice option.

I agree with Mabman. A nice torquey geared freewheeling hub motor perhaps - at least 750 watts nominal, spiking to over 1000 watts. Running on 48 volts. On the bike that is already perfect for you. Avoid cyclone. They are not good in the rain, and have plenty of problems with chain wear, overheating, moisture problems. Go with a hub motor. Most premade commercial ebikes are lame and overpriced, and have proprietary aspects, running on only 36 volts or even 24, with too small batteries. With a cheap conversion kit you will get much better value, and you will be able to fix problems with non-proprietary disposable parts like 35 dollar controllers, or 15 dollar throttles. The motors are very robust. You can spend the savings on the best battery you can find, like a Ping battery from China.

Ecospeed will put their system on any bike you want.
Thanks for the great review. I have found in my research that most ebikes are made for flat areas which is strange because not many people need electric on the flats. I agree with Mabman and 15rms, bring the bike back because if it doesn't work to go up that hill, it is useless to you. That is the whole reason you needed an electric bike in the first place. There are bikes out there that can do this but probably not specially made ebikes. Instead look at add on units.
By the way, internal gears don't like trying to shift while under load like going up a hill. You need to shift before you lose too much power to coast for a second while you shift.

Thanks everyone. And Mabman, yes you did tell me, and I appreciate your persistence, truly. I'll hit you up for more advice at the next stages.

I'm going to give it another try today with the different, much longer route home that is supposedly less steep. I am even willing to push the bike for a few short stretches if the rest is doable. Unfortunately the route I took yesterday mapped on the gradient map as the least steep direct way home. The ride into work today was so fun, and it was amazing how the regen brakes really gave me 3 extra bars on the battery by the time I got to the bottom of the hill. If it doesn't work with the other route, and I'm not entirely optimistic, then I'll start studying the options with the 750 watt motors. I'm totally not a mechanical person so I was really hoping for an all-in-one setup. I'll write later today with the results of the 'other' route home.

Wow, you must have some awesome hills there. Seattle is bad enough, but your town sounds tougher. Is the push-button unable to power you over the steepest parts?

If the Urban doesn't work out, take a look at a couple of iZip bikes. The Ultra has a 500W motor and is pretty fast. It is spartan compared to the Urban, and about the same weight (without fenders/rack/lights/etc.).

Profstack, yes our hill is relentless. Long and steep. No wonder I never see anyone else on bikes on it, not even ebikes.

I emailed the store and they phoned me back, concerned, and had some ideas. They think that the hub motor got overheated and shut off some of the energy, which is why it felt like the throttle made absolutely no difference to me. This makes sense because when my husband came to rescue me, I had waited around for about 15 min and then he rode the bike up a very steep last stretch with good effort but it was not impossible--and so perhaps the motor had then cooled off after the 15 min and worked for him.

The store says that last year's model does not overheat as quickly and they want to bring it to me (about 18 mi from their store to my house)! Very nice service. They also recommended a new bike that is coming in, the Focus, which they say has the Panasonic motor but is much stronger. The owner suggested she bring BOTH bikes, and was very happy to accommodate my request that SHE test ride them on my hill before I try it myself. So they are quite committed to investigating my situation, I'm highly impressed.

Then I did try the much longer, less steep, way home, and it was ok, I was worried about overheating the motor so I only used assistance levels 2-3 most of the time although I would have preferred to use 4. But it was a nice ride and I made it home. It was just too long, 70 min and 10 miles, most of it a slow, gradual uphill climb, whereas really my house is only 3 miles from my work.

I see all these good points, as Mabman and others indicated, about starting with buying my ideal bike and then adding a higher-wattage motor, but I'm just so UN-interested in dealing with all the decisions, mechanics, things I don't know about and don't want to bother learning. How much do I have to know or think about to get a system that will work together, be easily maintained, and do what I want it to do?

That is why I suggested Ecospeed. They will equip your bike and it will be the same as if you bought it with the motor on it. The reason I recommend Ecospeed is it is the one motor that is powerful enough and no hassle that I have personally tried. They have been in business for quite a while so probably won't disappear if you need help someday.
There may be other places that have a strong enough motor and no hassle but I never found them. I don't like hub motors because of our steep hills and controllers were always shutting down (like yours) or were flimsy wiring that could be broken easily, etc. Fine for someone who wants to fool around with stuff but I wanted to just ride it.

But Ecospeed is $3K! I phoned with them, very helpful, but is there really no less expensive motor that will work? I like the regen brakes as a way to slow myself down, too, so I'm not oppose to hub motors if they are strong enough to get up the hill and not overheat.

And then I'd have to decide what bike to get, a whole new range of decisions, oy. On the phone he recommended a Rans (never heard of it and don't want recumbent) and a Breezer (also never heard of it, but what do I know?). But then we're getting up toward a $5K bike. I'm ok with $3,500 but FIVE K is too much. Or isn't it??

What hub motor with regen brakes would work for me, and on what bike? I'm still hoping my SF store can bring me something that works.

Contact ebikes.ca (Grin Technologies).

www.ebikes.ca

Sell ebike parts. Excellent ethical supplier of ebike hub motors, controllers (regen), and home of the world famous "CycleAnalyst".

Yeah, I looked at that ebikes.ca website a lot. I am daunted by that simulator--I don't even know what I'm simulating and what the various choices mean.

From what I can tell, eZee wouldn't be strong enough, it's only 400W. You can get a 48V battery. but it's not really made for that. I think it is throttle only, but I like pedal-assist for the half of my commute that is mostly flattish. I don't understand what a geared hub is vs. direct drive, but I think I like the latter better because it has regen, which I like for STOPPING ability, I realize there are controversies on this board concerning battery issues, but I like how it slows me down. Then again, I'm beyond the limit of my competence in even trying to talk about these things, so I might not know what all this means.

ebikes.ca sells the 9 continents but seems to rate all of it pretty badly, I don't get it. It sounds like you need to fiddle with them to make them work, which is definitely not for me.

Crystalite rear 750, as shown by ebikes.ca, is heavy. Seems to have good power. No idea what caliper distance is. I can't figure out what a Hall signal is, seems to be a wire that doesn't work when wet. No idea how I would know what controller I need, or if I even need one.

Is LiFePo the same as LiPo, which people say catches fire?

All of this, plus the question of BMC (geared hub, no regen, that's all I can figure out) or the very expensive ecospeed makes me wish for an integrated system that just works and doesn't require so much knowledge on my part.

shouldbeworking try some possibility thinking.

That's why Ecospeed is so expensive but reliable. I think factory built ebikes are just maybe finally starting to get to be useful for more people. I think they were being built by people who thought they could make money by selling junk as novelty bikes. The kits put on regular bikes have been far better for power, speed and distance but also take more knowledge to understand. LiFePo (lithium iron phosphate) batteries don't blow up or catch fire.
So if none of the ebikes you try work, then spend more time learning about add on kits.
Rans make a crank forward bike that allows you to touch the ground with your feet while seated and is considered a semi-recumbent. He was probably thinking about your hip issue. Go check out Rans bikes. I have one of their recumbents -sweet bike. They make airplanes so they know what they are doing.

So today I wanted to test out the theory that the problem with my direct, very steep route home the other day was that the motor overheated and so cut power, which was why the throttle seemed to give me no help. I mapped about 6 variations on how I can get home going up my hill without the 5-mile detour (which is in fact doable and a pretty ride but adds 45 min to my trip home). I was optimistic, because I felt like I have learned to manage the power in the bike better and understand even how to keep the motor as cool as possible by using less assist and more gear help. And I am a little stronger.

I decided to try a way home that has two medium-short, very steep stretches but a rather long stretch of flat/slope in between so that the motor wouldn't overheat. So I would just need to throttle my way up for short spurts. I even stopped for a few minutes at the bottom of the first big ascent to be sure motor was cool.

No go. Throttle seemed to be nonexistent. 4th level assist was not enough. Called husband for another pickup. He has indicated he doesn't want to do the pickup anymore, so no more experiments for me.

I'm looking forward to seeing what the bike shop brings me next week to try but am not optimistic. I guess the next step is to consider ecospeed (as Crackerdog suggests) or BMC or Crystalite. If I even want to pursue this. I didn't own a bike here for 10 yrs, so I guess I can go back to bikelessness, or go to plan B and get a folder for errands in the flats and get picked up in a car for the big hill home.

But it has been a few great days of biking. I just can't see keeping a very expensive bike that can't be used for errands and easy commuting because my only way home (normally 3.5 mi) requires a 5-mile slow climb detour.

I hate to say that you are asking at the wrong place; but, the experts in this hobby are at endless sphere (http://endless-sphere.com/forums/). It sounds like the issue is the final hill. To meet your needs you may need a custom build. The good news is that a custom build is within your price range.

There are two directions that a custom build may go. The first is the simple application of more power. The factory built e-bikes are limited by the lowest, permissible, legal power and top, unassisted, speed restrictions. A custom build may exceed the power and limit the top speed through a governing device like the cycle-analyst (http://www.ebikes.ca/drainbrain.shtml). Another dirrectoin a custom build may go is to use two hub motors (this is because you have ruled out the eco-speed mid-drive due to cost). One of the primary reasons for two hub motor solution is to control, and spread, the heat buildup on long hills; exactly the situation you are facing. There are also other, lower-cost, mid drive solutions that a custom builder may be able to discuss with you.

I know you have expressed that you want an "off the rack" solution; but, those solutions may not meet your needs. Many custom builders can also provide you with a high quality solution that will provide years trouble free transportation. The simple facts are that e-bikes are the cutting edge of local transportation devices; however, the operative word here is edge. You may need to work with a builder to find the best solution for you. Again, I recommend that you ask these questions at endless sphere (http://endless-sphere.com/forums/). You have an expert level problem, go to the experts.

RobertC
Not ALL factory ebikes are limited by the lowest permissable power and speed.
MADE IN USA Eplus 1000W which has seperate thread on this forum can be bought as a kit or complete ebike.
It can achive 85Nm /Newtonmeter/ of torque max and it is massive torque , most remarkabele on 36V system.
I regularly achive 30mph on flat, no wind, 66kg myself/sorry Canada/ with some peddaling and climb any hill I want.
Eplus is display of efficiency /this what ebike should be about/ and I've never seen more than 1080W drawn by Eplus system from battery, anytime.
Design and built in USA /electrical part of it of course, somebicycle brand name components are China-made of course but no China-brand parts on this ebike
I doubt China-brand electrical components can provide years of troublefree..., no way, they are quality nightmares.
And yes if you are electrical person you can build and ride China parts ebike for years because you know how to patch up system and rebuid it.

Powell, could you post some links to that bike? I also can't find the thread about these bikes. Thanks.

I think Powell is talking about e+ bikes, but the website seems to be broken and electriccyclery.com doesn't have them anymore, so maybe they are out of business? Looks like a great bike, 1000w.

I'm getting some recommendations on another forum for Mac motors and 9C 2180. Insights welcome.

I have a new last resort in mind: I've been riding the long detour to get home up a slow, gradual grade, at about assist level 2 or so, but a friend who rides pointed out that he does that ride pretty easily with his light 17-lb bike. So if no e-bike works, I can get a nice light road bike and do that ride sometimes to get home, when I'm not in a rush and want the exercise. Not ideal, but it would be a lot cheaper.

That 17-lb bike will likely cost more than the e-bike, and you will be the only motor it has. :)

Is your Urban a 2011 or 2012 model. The new ones are lighter and with greater range, and I don't think they are available yet in the USA. The motor hub on the new ones has a different pattern on the surface. I was told the new ones have better battery management, which might mean less chance of overheating, but I could be blowing (electrical) smoke all over it...

The Urban I bought is the 2012. It is a tad lighter than the 2011, but my bike store says the 2011 has a bigger coil in it (?) so overheating is less of a problem than with the 2012.

Again, my hills are exceptional. The least-steep direct way home has a lot of 12-17% grade and one spot with 23%. If we were talking about a 7% grade the Urban would likely have worked.

Here is the link on this forum
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/714452-My-E-review

Here is the link on this forum
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/714452-My-E-review

It appears that the biggest value if the E+ kit is that it is visually balanced by having placed the batteries in a shell that looks like a front bub motor. There is definitely nothing wrong with this. However, it makes for a rather unimpressive kit when the price is also taken into account; unless, the visual balance is important. In that case it is a great kit.

However, this is taking us away from the point that the OP (sorry to be speaking of you in the third person) wants a turn-key, medium cost, high-performance solution.

I paid $3500 for my E+ plus 1000W kit, that's medium cost I would say if you consider high end ebikes like Optibike which starts at$6500 to $12000.
E+ is worth every dollar I paid-
-no loose connectors, whining motor, hesitating, stuttering motor, loose spokes, etc.

Thanks for the link, Powell.

The Urban I bought is the 2012. It is a tad lighter than the 2011, but my bike store says the 2011 has a bigger coil in it (?) so overheating is less of a problem than with the 2012.

Again, my hills are exceptional. The least-steep direct way home has a lot of 12-17% grade and one spot with 23%. If we were talking about a 7% grade the Urban would likely have worked.

Need a really low gear.

A kit like this is the new stuff. Allows you to change gears.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/48V-450W-ELECTRIC-MOTORIZED-E-BIKE-CONVERSION-KIT-/200737981630?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2ebcea84be

Check out the video ! :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=j28r3yo7Oqg#!

Ecospeed will put their system on any bike you want.
Thanks for the great review. I have found in my research that most ebikes are made for flat areas which is strange because not many people need electric on the flats. I agree with Mabman and 15rms, bring the bike back because if it doesn't work to go up that hill, it is useless to you. That is the whole reason you needed an electric bike in the first place.

I agree. I don't need a motor on level ground and sure don't need one to go down hill.

I gave up on hub motors. They are stuck in one gear !
You can read every thread on ES, put a brushless motor with a Magic controller and Cycle Analyst on it and study the hub motor and ebike simulator all day and it will still be stuck in one gear.

I have an electric fixie trike but my bikes are about the gears ! :)

Ok, some big updates to make here.

The very helpful SF ebike store young lady BROUGHT me, to my house, several other bikes to try. Very good service. We rode together up the hill a few times, switching off bikes.

SO it turns out that the Ohm battery that I had been using on the bike they sold me seems to have a problem. It cut down power at certain points while she was using it. When that happened to me, it was the first time of me trying ebike on my hill, so I thought it meant the motor wasn't strong enough. She had ridden the other Ohm up the hill with a different battery the first time, and did not have that problem, so it really was an anomalous flaw in the system they sold me.

But she also brought me a Focus Jarifa Speed to try, with a Bosch middrive 350W 36V motor. This thing was really great. It was very energetic and nicer than the Ohm's hub motor. And I was, with some effort, able to make it up my hill! The style is a little sportier than I prefer but I guess I could get the handlebars switched to a more upright style.

http://www.focus-bikes.com/us/en_us/bikes/bikes-2011/category/e-bike-pedelec-6/model/jarifa-speed-6.html

Now I'm wondering whether my grade-measuring all along was off, otherwise how did I make these grades I've been complaining about with just 350W? Or is it that you all in advising me were assuming that I wouldn't pedal, which in fact I want to do for exercise?

My hill on this bike is still a workout, a tad more than I might want, but then again I rode up that hill TWICE in one hour and feel pretty good. No hip irritation at all, which the Ohm did irritate it slightly. The other question is whether it would be worth it, with this research, to go back to the idea of having one built for me with a similar or slightly higher-power setup. This bike is not cheap, but it is ready to go and works for me. I'm not a techie--picking out a bike to begin with, picking out all the options (likely NOT middrive but BMC geared hub), getting Ilia or someone to build it for me, if they are willing, this is all a little daunting.

Also the Focus is so LIGHT, like 20 lbs lighter than the Ohm, I guess because it's middrive and the bike is just lighter. I think this is why my hip (which is cranky and has steel) feels GREAT now, whereas after the Ohm it was a little irritated.

I know you are the DIY people here, but insights are welcome!

Actually studying the bike and the website, I realize this is a 2011 Focus with a Panasonic 300W.

how did I make these grades I've been complaining about with just 350W? Or is it that you all in advising me were assuming that I wouldn't pedal, which in fact I want to do for exercise?


Also the Focus is so LIGHT, like 20 lbs lighter than the Ohm, I guess because it's middrive and the bike is just lighter. I think this is why my hip (which is cranky and has steel) feels GREAT now, whereas after the Ohm it was a little irritated.

I know you are the DIY people here, but insights are welcome!

The smaller motor is able to give better performance because it is a mid drive. The mid drive design has the advantage of being able to use the bikes gears. In hill climbing , this is a significant advantage.

As far as the weight, while both bikes appear to have 8 Amp batteries (Bosch 8, Ohm 8.8), the Focus has a 36V battery and the Ohm has a 48V battery. Significant weight savings are to be found right there. Further, and I admit that this is just based on looking at the pictures, it looks like the Focus is based on a normal bicycle frame; while the Ohm looks like it has a heavier, e-bike specific- frame.

The problem you are facing is an interesting one. Further, I have been interested in watching the evolution of e-bikes from hobbyists projects into viable consumer products.

Ok, here a more detailed review of the Focus Jarifa Speed now that I have 10 min free:

It is zippy, almost like that little folding electric BH Volt I tried, again because the weight is good I guess. It has three levels of assist (Ohm had 4) in addition to non-assist mode. Ohm's levels 1 and 2 were not so impressive, but the Jarifa's lowest assist level (called 'eco') gave me an excellent push. And high assist was great. There is no throttle like Ohm had, so pedaling is always required. I'm fine with this, the highest level of assist felt stronger than the Ohm's WOT.

It has, as I said, lower handlebars but weirdly the posture didn't bother me at all, even less than the Ohm's slightly more upright posture had, the latter had made my shoulders sore.

The battery can only be charged off-bike, which I don't see as a problem. The brakes are hydraulic disk. I did like the regen better on the Ohm, because it slows me down so well on descent.

I like it that the motor is more discreetly behind the seat post. The Ohm's huge battery in the step-through was a bit conspicuous for my taste. There was a little humming while I rode but I think that was just the sound of me pedaling, not the motor? Definitely acceptable.

Here are the slight annoyances:
The handlebar grips aren't as good as the Ohm's. After the 3-mi ride down the hill the heel of my hand (is that what it is called?) was a little sore. Perhaps the thing I most wish were redesigned is the gear-changing mechanism. You press once with your right thumb to increase gears, and twice to decrease, but really the "twice" is more just like a bigger, harder press. I like those twisty gear changers instead. There is a stepover instead of step-through, but it is not as awkward for me as the Ohm was.

I may have posted the wrong link earlier, it's this one:
http://www.focus-bikes.com/us/en_us/bikes/bikes-2011/category/e-bike-pedelec-6/model/jarifa-speed-6.html

The Ohm Urban has weight less than 50#. How much lighter is the Focus? It can't be 20#, I'm sure. The Focus is similar (but with 26" tires) to the Kalkhoff Connect Pro Sport 300. Is the price of the Focus over $4k? If so, the Kalkhoff might be cheaper.

The 2012 Ohm Urban you had did not have the new 48V battery. They are not available until late May, or so I was told by the SF and Seattle stores.

No, the Ohm did not have the new battery, as you say. But if it did, it would be even heavier.

I'm having trouble finding a weight specs for the Jarifa Speed (Focus) and the Ohm Urban. I just picked them up and stood on my cheap Ikea scale, clearly not a great method, then subtracted my own supposed weight with the same scale. It showed 58 lbs for the Ohm, which could easily be off, and 43 lbs for the Focus, likewise not reliable.

The Kalkhoff pro connect does look very similar.

Here's the link to the Focus 2011:
http://www.newwheel.net/Store/Focus%20Jarifa%20Speed/index.html

The 2012 Ohm Urban is listed at 49#. The Kalkhoff e-bikes are as low as 46# (newer ProConnect) or up to 56# (Tasman). I imagine the Focus is on the lower side. The new (upcoming 2013) Focus models are apparently going with the Bionx system.

So, was the battery defective on the Urban you had?

I am still in the hunt for an e-bike and recently tried out a Kalkhoff and an Ohm Urban. Still undecided and looking for other options.

Yes, the battery was apparently defective. No wonder the throttle felt like no help at all, and level 4 assist also wasn't much help.

The Kalkhoff Pro Connect does look like the Focus, maybe that's why SarahLou was so happy with it--I was surprised when I tried the Kalkhoff Tasman at how unimpressive it was.

I rode my Focus home up my hill yesterday and had fun. Good exercise for my legs, but I was not red and sweaty at arrival. I was only 7 minutes behind my husband and kids in the minivan.

Ok, I spent some great time with the Focus this weekend and I officially LOVE it. It is FUN to ride, which is exactly what I wanted. It's like it reads my mind and knows JUST how fast I want to go and how much assist it needs to give me. I tried a really really long steep hill in my neighborhood, a 3-mile slog, and it was a good workout but not too much! I can't wait to leave work, because then I get to RIDE HOME on it!

Yes, the battery was apparently defective. No wonder the throttle felt like no help at all, and level 4 assist also wasn't much help.

The Kalkhoff Pro Connect does look like the Focus, maybe that's why SarahLou was so happy with it--I was surprised when I tried the Kalkhoff Tasman at how unimpressive it was.

I rode my Focus home up my hill yesterday and had fun. Good exercise for my legs, but I was not red and sweaty at arrival. I was only 7 minutes behind my husband and kids in the minivan.

They both have identical drive units to the one I have on my bike. I wonder why there is such a difference in their performance. The only difference I see between them is the Focus uses a derailer and the Tasman has an internal hub.
Glad you found one you like. Test driving does make the difference.

I do love Panasonic's pressure sensitive crank throttle.

Oh, whoops -- I posted on your old thread before I saw this one. Great that you found a bike! How much did the Focus cost?

So how likely is it that i can get strong enough to do this hill without ruining my Steel-reinforced hip? Do i give up and take it back? There is a less steep way i can try tomorrow but it is 5 Miles longer.

Have you tried zig zagging up the worst hills kinda like a snow skier going up hill? Assuming, of course, that you will not get run over by an automobile. This has the effect of leveling out the hill to where you might be able to make it.

Richard, thanks. But then of course I"m in the opposite lane and risk running into a car coming around a blind curve.

Meanwhile I've gotten a Focus Jarifa Speed that works well on the hill--I still have to pedal but it's a fun workout and gets me home.

Shouldbeworking, thank you so much for posting your experience with the various electric bikes you've tried - I'm just starting researching bikes and the Ohm and the Focus are on my list. And thanks for posting the weight difference between the two - I have also had no luck finding the weight specs for the Focus on-line.

I'm in the SF area too - would you be willing to share the name of the store from which you purchased your bike? They sound so very supportive and customer success/satisfaction oriented. If not on this thread, then shoot me an email - my profile is set to accept emails (new to this forum, but I think that's what the check box I checked means).

- Tyler

Tylergeek, the store in SF is "The New Wheel", in Bernal. As I described, they had several bikes that didn't work for me, and that surprised me because they are in SF and so should know about what works on 'our' hills. But they were reasonable and helpful, and did drive several other bikes 15 mi away to my house and work with me. And they ultimately did get me the Focus Jarifa Speed that I'm enjoying. I hope you get what you want and what works for you. As I said above, perhaps the Kalkhoff Pro Connect would be similar to the Focus.

Glad my posts could be of help to someone else--I myself got started on all this with SarahLou's thread from awhile back, so I know how it is to have someone else's research to build on.

Tylergeek, the store in SF is "The New Wheel", in Bernal. As I described, they had several bikes that didn't work for me, and that surprised me because they are in SF and so should know about what works on 'our' hills. But they were reasonable and helpful, and did drive several other bikes 15 mi away to my house and work with me. And they ultimately did get me the Focus Jarifa Speed that I'm enjoying. I hope you get what you want and what works for you. As I said above, perhaps the Kalkhoff Pro Connect would be similar to the Focus.


That's the store I found on-line - so glad it was the one you had such a positive experience with! I didn't know they carried the Kettler and the Kalkhoff - can't wait to go to the store now and try out bikes I haven't thought of yet!


Glad my posts could be of help to someone else--I myself got started on all this with SarahLou's thread from awhile back, so I know how it is to have someone else's research to build on.

I'll have to go look up SarahLou's thread now! Thanks again for the help.

Let us know how your own research pans out. If you end up wanting something that they don't offer at New Wheel, check out ebikessf.com. That would be for turning a regular bike into an ebike, but the guy there is very knowledgeable.

I'm reporting back after a couple of rounds of test rides. I haven't chosen a bike yet, but I'm getting closer.

Two weekends ago I went to New Wheel in SF and tried out the Ohm Urban, Ohm Urban SE, Focus Jarifa Sport, and BH Emotion Folding Volt.

1. Ohm Urban. This was my first experience with an electric bike, and my first experience with click shifting, so I asked the nice woman to go with me on the test ride. She and the guy who work there were both very nice and helpful, and had differing perspectives on things, which was interesting and useful. We headed out of the shop on the 3rd level of assist. I started pedaling, and almost immediately felt the assist. We went down a small incline for a ways, then up a fairly steep hill. I didn't get quite far enough down shifted for the hill, but made it up with moderate effort. We tooled around for a while, up and down various hills. I had never ridden a bike with suspension before, so that felt weird, and I've never had disc breaks before, they were kind of noisy (the bike lady said it probably needed to be adjusted). I was definitely grinning by the time we got back to the shop, but I didn't feel over-the-top impressed.

2. Ohm Urban SE. This time I took the test ride alone. I did mostly the same route we took the previous run. I didn't notice any improvement over the non-SE model really, but I think I was mostly just getting used to everything. On the hills, the motor seemed to be inconsistent in putting out power - I brought it back to the shop, and they hypothesized that it could be the battery, so we swapped it with the battery from the first bike. I still got the inconsistent power application up the hills. Not sure what was wrong. Not sure why I'd want the SE over the non-SE, just based on the test ride.

3. Focus Jarifa Sport. This bike has no suspension. It also only has 10 gears (the Ohms have 24), so I was pretty skeptical about the bike. I took similar routes to the Ohms, and damn if the bike didn't eat up the same hills! I really like the ride better too - perhaps it's just that the fix suspension was more familiar to me, or the angle of the seat to handlebars was more similar to my current bike's angle, but I felt more jazzed about the Focus than the Ohm. And, it has a top speed of 25-27, whereas the Ohm has a top speed of 20. More on that later. My only complaint about the bike was that the seat was super uncomfortable - I would immediately put a new seat on if I get this bike, as well as more ergonomically shaped grips. The Ohms had a really nice seat and really great grips - kudos to them.

4. Folding Volt. This bike looked ridiculous to me with its 20-inch wheels, but I wanted to try everything, so I took it for a spin. When I first started pedaling, I popped a wheelie, it had so much torque! Feeling a little like a clown, I headed up a hill. I actually made it up the moderately sloped bottom half of the hill just fine, but when I was on the hill, each time I pedaled the handle bars flexed towards me as I pulled to gain more power. Then when I hit the steeper part of the hill, I really had to expend a lot of energy to make it up. This was not a bike that was going to save me from showing up at work a sweaty mess, but it was more capable than I thought it would be - if you had a mostly flat commute with a few moderate hills, it would probably get the job done.

All in all, I had been riding for the good portion of 90 minutes at this point, and I only had a moderate sheen of sweat on top of my head. This electric bike idea seems to have legs!

Last weekend, I went to Suburban Bikes in Redwood City, CA to try the Stromer. This was actually one of the first electric bikes I saw on the net, so I was excited to give it a try.

5. Stromer. This bike is definitely heavy - ~64 pounds. I could tell when I was turning it 180 degrees when I got out of the shop. It only has 8 speeds, which also had me a little nervous. The handlebars are very high - this was the most upright electric bike I've tried. I used to live in Redwood City, so I knew some awesome hills to try the bike out on. The first two miles were pretty flat - the Stromer ate it up. Then I hit a very, very slight incline - one of those seemingly flat roads that you curse on a regular bike because you never get your rhythm going. The Stromer ate it up and burped. I then turned up into the hills. There's a 2-mile stretch with a pretty decent grade - I would definitely have worked up a sweat on my regular bike. The Stromer ate it up. I didn't get below 6th gear. The Stromer was very consistent with the power as well - no pooping out after being on the hill for a couple of miles. I felt like I had to throw something harder at it, so I headed up some even steeper inclines - the Stromer ate it up as I grinned from ear to ear. I still hadn't gotten below 4th gear, so I looked for some really gnarly hills to go up. I went down one hill, about 150 yards, and then back up. On my mountain bike, I may or may not have made it all the way up in first gear. The Stromer gave me bionic powers - I made it up in 3rd gear. At this point I was laughing. On my way back down to the flats, I took a wrong turn and went down a really, really steep hill into a cul de sac. I made the u-turn and headed back up - the Stromer again made the hill almost effortless on my part. I made it back to the bike shop 40 minutes later, having eaten 70% of the battery. I probably went 10 or 12 miles.

My overall impression of the Stromer is that it is an incredible bike - I literally didn't want to get off it when I got back to the bike shop. My concerns with the Stromer:
1. Like the Focus, it had a terrible seat - so terrible, that immediately upon sitting on it, my butt hurt, and 3 days later I still had residual soreness. Obviously another candidate for a new seat. Not a big deal.
2. The range - I went through 70% of the battery in 10 or 12 miles - granted, I was doing some intense hills, but that seems like pretty sucky range to me. My commute is only 6 miles, but if I had a longer commute ever, I'm not sure if this bike could handle it. There is a Deluxe model, and an Elite model, but they both seem to have the same batteries as the baseline model.
3. The 20 mph top speed. On the way back to the bike shop, I was on a flat part that was slightly downhill, so I put it in high gear and pedaled earnestly. Things went great until I hit 21-ish mph - then the motor cut out and I was suddenly pedaling a very heavy bike, until my speed went back under 20 when the motor kicked back in. Not so fun. I have an M1 motorcycle license, so I'm actually legal to ride an electric bike that goes over 20 mph, so I was going to research if you can turn off the restrictor. This gave me food for thought for the Ohm - I hadn't gotten going that fast during my test ride two weeks ago, so I'm not sure if I'll have the same "woah, this bike just got really heavy" moment with it.

This weekend, I'm heading back to New Wheel to try out the Ohm and the Focus again. I feel like I got a full test ride with the Stromer, whereas with the Ohm and the Focus I was still figuring out how the electric bike thing worked, and I also didn't take an extended ride over varied terrain. I'll report back my findings next week.

- Tyler

Tyler, this is a great review. Thanks. My Ohm experience was similar. Heavy but good. I bought the Focus and am very happy with it. Yes, there is no suspension, the seat is painful and the grips not quite right. I'm getting a new seat for MOther's Day. The Stromer sounds interesting. I wouldn't want it that heavy, and I'm surprised the hub motor gave you that good a boost. But it has a great reputation. Please do report back, this is all great research and future readers will definitely benefit.