Touring - Safety for females touring alone?

Hi Everyone

I'm getting ready to leave on a cross country tour in June (coast to coast)... and I'm a female going by myself. I'll have a friend traveling with me here and there, but for 3000 miles out of the 4000 miles I will be all by my lonesome. Unfortunately, the reality is that there is a difference in the degree of safety inherently possessed by a man versus a woman when traveling solo. I'm curious to hear about the experiences of women who have toured significant distances alone and the safety precautions that they took.

I've been asked by several friends and family members if I'm carrying a firearm. After much last minute debate I've decided that carrying a gun is out of the question. I'm far too inexperienced with firearms to feel comfortable using a handgun, universe forbid, in a time of necessity. And there really isn't enough time to act on such training now (classes, permits, etc.). I'm considering other self defense options, i.e. taser or mace or both. ???

Had this crossed my mind six months ago, I would have gone through the necessary training to confidently carry a hand gun on tour, but that didn't happen so I need to find an alternative form of self defense.

Any advise is greatly appreciated!

Cheers
L.

It's been 30 years since I bike-toured more than overnight alone, but I have traveled extensively alone, including a 3-month solo (car) camping trip in the US and multiple solo multi-week foriegn trips. Most people, most places, will go out of their way to protect solo women travelers. Yes, there's the very, very rare exception, but they're exceptions.

I've planned a major bike tour for this summer, and now my companion might not be able to travel with me, and it never occurred to me to be scared of anything for which a weapon might help!
Dogs--now THEY scare me.
Distracted drivers -- they scare me.
Mountain passes, weak knees, mechanical failures, bad food, bad water -- they scare me.
Weapons won't help against any of those.

We've been taught to be afraid of strangers, of the other, but really, they're why I travel. And if you are on one of the ACA routes, you'll probably find other riders to hook up with from time to time, so you might not have to travel as solo as you're planning.

I'm not a female, but I've carried the CS Gas/Pepper defense spray (http://www.sabrered.com/servlet/the-SABRE-Advanced-3-dsh-in-dsh-1-Defense-Sprays-cln-Magnum-Super-CS-Tear-Gas/Categories), it's good for stopping humans or animals such as wild dogs. Simple to use, but I've never used it. In bear country I've carried Bear Spray that shoots pepper spray 35 feet, never used it either. Spray is not necessarily good if you're accosted inside your tent though.

Last year I met a solo female bike tourist that was on her way to finishing her around-the-world tour. She told me that she felt safe virtually the entire trip. She said she had a couple of "caution alerts" but never any actual "situations". She said people were extra nice at looking out for her well being.

Hi Everyone

I'm getting ready to leave on a cross country tour in June (coast to coast)... and I'm a female going by myself. I'll have a friend traveling with me here and there, but for 3000 miles out of the 4000 miles I will be all by my lonesome. Unfortunately, the reality is that there is a difference in the degree of safety inherently possessed by a man versus a woman when traveling solo. I'm curious to hear about the experiences of women who have toured significant distances alone and the safety precautions that they took.

I've been asked by several friends and family members if I'm carrying a firearm. After much last minute debate I've decided that carrying a gun is out of the question. I'm far too inexperienced with firearms to feel comfortable using a handgun, universe forbid, in a time of necessity. And there really isn't enough time to act on such training now (classes, permits, etc.). I'm considering other self defense options, i.e. taser or mace or both. ???

Had this crossed my mind six months ago, I would have gone through the necessary training to confidently carry a hand gun on tour, but that didn't happen so I need to find an alternative form of self defense.

Any advise is greatly appreciated!

Cheers
L.

Josie Dew's books might be of interest.

It seems to me that a key element is not getting yourself into certain sorts of situations. Part of that is not getting into desperate situations where you are forced (or something close to it) to accept additional situations that you otherwise would not accept. That's what happened to Josie Dew at one point. She was so thirsty that she accepted a ride and an offer that she would not otherwise have accepted. I've done similar things, but fortunately nothing terribly severe has happened. If you read a journal on CGOAB by McShane (as I recall, Marcus McShane), he got himself into a similar situation to Josie Dew's. And he later saw that it was impaired judgment, as a result of exhaustion, that played a key roll in his accepting or getting into the situation in the first place.

I don't think that self-defense devices or techniques are as effective or as important as situational avoidance. Not that they can't contribute to your safety -- they can, at times. But they can also (sometimes in subtle ways) encourage you to accept situations that you otherwise would avoid. It is better, for the most part, to avoid getting into them in the first place, even if you have the weapons or devices or techniques.

Even if you know karate well, and even if you can win (not always the case, as Josie found out), it's often no fun to go through the fight. It can be traumatic in itself, and there can be serious aftermaths as well (emotionally, mentally, physically, legally, financially, and in other ways). The same can be said for using a gun or other weapon.

I almost shot someone once on a tour, and I'm very glad I didn't, even if I was right or mostly right. I stopped carrying a gun after that.

Wearing baggy shorts can be helpful. Not riding in certain areas can be helpful. Most areas in this country are not particularly bad, and as a previous poster mentioned, there are a number of other dangers that are more likely or more real (assuming you don't get yourself into the high-risk situations).

Another book comes to mind, in which a woman bike tourist accepted an overnight offer. She had doubts when she saw the neighborhood and the trailer the guy was living in, but accepted the offer anyway, in part because she was so tired and wanted the shower, food, good sleeping accommodations, etc. Very similar to what happened to me, Josie Dew, Marcus McShane, others.

The best I can offer is to keep your judgment in tact, don't get too desperate or exhausted, stay away from such situations, and don't compromise when you have doubts, even if it means more spartan accommodations, extra exertion, lack of comfortable physical circumstances or appealing offers, etc. When you can be chummed with offers, you set yourself up.

Even people that carry guns and are experienced in their use will tell you that awareness and listening to your gut is the #1 defensive tool and that physical defense is dead last. If it is time to put three 9mm rounds in someone's cardiothoracic vault or break someone's elbow, then you have badly failed using awareness to avoid the problem.

Secondly, in many backward and dangerous places (Mexico, England, California), weapons like firearms, pepper spray, tasers, and knives are illegal for mere civilians to be trusted with carrying, and even unarmed self-defense is largely illegal. In those places, awareness and flight are your only tools. The US in particular you can cross an unmarked state/county border and have something that was perfectly legal 100 yards back now will result in the police beating, arresting, and/or shooting you.

If you carry a weapon, the police will now generally be more dangerous to you than the criminals were. Across the US, things like size of the pepper spray container, pepper spray vs. CS vs. Mace, length of knives, opening systems of knives, capacities of firearms, calibers of firearms, operation type of firearms, magazine type of firearms, etc. can make the difference between "perfectly legal" and "felony". Unless you are intimately familiar with all of these laws, I do not recommend carrying anything that could be construed as a weapon, especially if you are entering any major cities as the police tend to generally see the populace as the enemy.

Read this guy's site (http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/pyramid.html). Unlike a lot of gun posers and testosterone-fueled martial arts companies, he actually talks extensively about the non-physical aspects to crime and defense.

Also read The Gift of Fear (http://www.amazon.com/Other-Survival-Signals-Protect-Violence/dp/product-description/0440508835).

I'm a man so I can only offer from my perspective that I was exposed to sexually aggressive older men while hitchiking by bike, which in a way supports NilesH. comments that I allowed myself to need a ride from exhaustion and emotionally tired of riding. Situational awareness and having reserves seems like a baseline.
When my daughter and a friend went off on a bike trip I put a yellow vest on her rack bundle and a PBSuperFlash on her friends once I realized how camouflaged they were in regular clothes. It's funny how at 21yrs one doesn't realize how driving blind some middle aged folks are until one gets there. I was riding all over the place when I was younger in regular dark street clothes.

breezybikes & teacherlady,
Perhaps y'all should compare notes on your planned summer trips. Maybe riding together for part of the time would be a win-win. :)

Diana Johnson (CGOAB) had a couple of uncomfortable encounters that didn't feel right to her and from time to time she talks about safety issues for solo female cyclists. It's a great read, BTW.... Here's a link to one of the incidents but the whole journal is worth checking out...

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/page/?o=1&page_id=247379&v=39

Thanks for all of the responses! Much of my argument against carrying a gun with my family and friends has been reinforced! Fore the past few weeks, I've been flipping back and forth, back and forth, whether or not carrying a weapon is a good idea. Many times I would beat myself up over the fact that I didn't consider this aspect of tour sooner, thinking things like "if only I learned how to shoot guns 8 months ago." I feel like all the pressure from loved ones to carry a weapon has really clouded my original stance on the situation.

I've intended to carry pepper spray all along primarily in case of aggressive dogs, but the idea of a gun or a taser never once crossed my mind until about a month ago. (My mother's husband is a police officer, so we've had many a "what it" discussions.) For me, cycling is such a huge part of my every day life (commuting, exercising, etc) that all of the safety precautions is second nature and I just do it: super bright lights, helmet, light/reflective clothing, safe routes... Like teacherlady said, it's about meeting new people and that's one of the reasons that makes touring so attractive to me. I think my biggest fears are the headwinds and dogs! In addition to that, I really do pay attention to the routes that I cycle on and maintain an awareness of my surroundings.

Part of what I've been struggling to communicate to family and friends is that I don't intend on putting myself in bad situations. If I have to choose between a sketchy camp site and a hotel... well of course I'll pick the hotel. It's worth the extra money to me to ensure a safe evening. However, I didn't consider the fact that impaired judgement can occur due to exhaustion. I can look back on previous (much shorter) tours when I could have been pretty vulnerable because I was bonking at the end of a day. So, thanks for bringing that up!

When also made a good point about the legality of carrying weapons across state lines - which was the first thing that I researched and found out that over half the states that I will be riding through do not honor my home state's carry permits. The same goes for tasers as well.

I think I'm going to "stick to my guns" (hehe) and go with my original plan: just pepper spray in case of aggressive dogs.

Thanks again for all your opinions! I can't wait to see what others think about the issue, especially from other ladies out there!

Hi Everyone

I'm getting ready to leave on a cross country tour in June (coast to coast)... and I'm a female going by myself. I'll have a friend traveling with me here and there, but for 3000 miles out of the 4000 miles I will be all by my lonesome. Unfortunately, the reality is that there is a difference in the degree of safety inherently possessed by a man versus a woman when traveling solo. I'm curious to hear about the experiences of women who have toured significant distances alone and the safety precautions that they took.

I've been asked by several friends and family members if I'm carrying a firearm. After much last minute debate I've decided that carrying a gun is out of the question. I'm far too inexperienced with firearms to feel comfortable using a handgun, universe forbid, in a time of necessity. And there really isn't enough time to act on such training now (classes, permits, etc.). I'm considering other self defense options, i.e. taser or mace or both. ???

Had this crossed my mind six months ago, I would have gone through the necessary training to confidently carry a hand gun on tour, but that didn't happen so I need to find an alternative form of self defense.

Any advise is greatly appreciated!

Cheers
L.

First of all, I'm not a female, just giving some thoughts.

The first part of self defence is not getting into tricky situations in the first place.

Seriously, I used to study karate under a female instructor. She was a 2nd dan black belt and when I was about a green belt she used me as an example when talking to a couple of the ladies in the class. She said in no uncertain terms that for all she was trained to a much higher standard than I was, if I jumped her in a dimly lit alley she'd have very little chance against me. In a street fight all her training would be worthless if I landed a single blow on her (I'm 6'4 and at the time weighed about 260).

If you carry a weapon you have to know how to use the weapon and you have to be willing to use the weapon. If you get unlucky an assailant takes your weapon and uses it against you. If you couldn't pull the trigger and drop someone with your first shot (and by that I mean kill them) you're probably better off not having a gun with you.

With a taser, mace, anything like that, unless it's readily to hand it's all but useless. If someone does jump you the chances are they're not going to hang around while you rummage in your saddle bag to find your can of mace.

The questions I consider when thinking about anything security related are pretty simple. First of all identify the threat. Then consider what you might do to avoid it, or to minimise its impact on you. At the same time consider how likely it is you will face the threat.

The high-impact threats you're probably thinking of first are being assaulted, on the basis a female is more likely to be assaulted in more ways than a male. Here your first line of defence is basic awareness of your surroundings. I'm constantly bemused by the number of women I see walking alone, after dark, in dimly lit areas, with hoods up and headphones on. Put another way they are in places with few if any people around to help them, unable to hear a potential assailant approaching from behind, and unable to see a potential assailant approaching from behind or the side. Simply dropping the hood and losing the headphones would give them so much more awareness.

Another line of defence, if you're not in a position to fight, is to figure potential escape routes. This is where practicality and glamour can clash - to take a simple example a woman wearing high heels and a tight tube skirt is unlikely to be able to move at any speed, whereas wearing running shoes and jeans would at least give her the option of running. I'll assume you won't be cycling in a tight skirt and heels, but I'm sure you get the idea. In a cycling context if you're using a narrow alleyway you're more vulnerable to ambush than if you're on a road that doesn't have walls either side.

For all it's important to think of threats that relate to your personal safety if I had to think of the threats that are most likely to affect you I'd list theft first. If someone steals your bike (or a crucial component, such as a wheel) you've got problems. If someone steals panniers you may find yourself left without crucial supplies. If someone steals clothes you can probably get by, even if you do end up smelling pretty bad by the time you find new clothes. If someone steals your maps or your GPS you could find yourself struggling to navigate.

The US in particular you can cross an unmarked state/county border and have something that was perfectly legal 100 yards back now will result in the police beating, arresting, and/or shooting you.


The reality in the USA is that this is *always* a risk now. The number one thing to avoid in all situations is the police. And if you've tried to defend yourself against an attacker, don't tell the police that.

(This is from the perspective of being a woman, and being a woman who has done a lot of solo cycling, and some solo sections of cycling tours ...)

First of all, it seems like there are several people doing a cross-US cycling trip this year ... maybe you could start a thread and see who's planning to do what and then arrange to ride with some of them at some points in your trip.

Another idea I would have would be to contact cycletouring clubs and randonneuring clubs along your route and see if they have any rides that would roughly correspond with your direction of travel when you're in that area, or if any of their members might be interested in riding a day or two with you as you pass through their area. In both Canada and Australia, most provinces/states have at least one cycletouring club who do anything from day trips to week-long trips, and then their members often get together casually to do tours together too. Most also have a randonneuring club whose members do long distance riding, but will often be out cycling at other times as well.

Some of these clubs have discussion boards and email lists etc. For example, if I were to cycle across Canada, I'd post something on the BC Randonneur discussion board, and there would be a reasonable chance some of the BC Randonneurs might want to ride with me or meet for lunch or whatever (it helps that I know some of the BC Randonneur members). Then I might post on the Firewheels email list out of Edmonton ... there are often posts like "I'm doing a long ride on Saturday from here to here, is anyone interested in joining me". You might end up with a small group of riders interested in doing that sort of ride that day.

It can be good to get to know the cycling community across a country, and around the world. :)


I have to dash to work now, but may have more suggestions later.

>Secondly, in many backward and dangerous places (Mexico, England, California), weapons like firearms, >pepper spray, and knives are illegal for mere civilians to be trusted with carrying, and even unarmed self-?>defense is largely illegal.

>If you carry a weapon, the police will now generally be more dangerous to you than the criminals were.

Oh grow up!

This book has some good tips:

http://www.amazon.com/Ride-New-Life-Michelle-Sicard/dp/1879854570/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1336694994&sr=8-1

The cover photograph tells part of it. She consciously chose not to look too appealing. She didn't want to attract that kind of attention, or be appealing in that way.

Add some baggy shorts, and it looks pretty effective to me.

Speaking as a male, I have to say that when a fit woman is dressed in lycra, it definitely attracts a certain degree of attention. It's almost like body paint. I'm sure there are many other males of whom it can be said that the attraction is substantial at times. It is a shame in a way, but it's the way it is. It has been that way for many thousands of years. It's even that way for many other species. I'm sure you already know this -- but maybe some of the concrete measures that can be taken, and are taken by cyclists like Michelle Sicard, are worth mentioning.

She also cut her hair for the trip.

And she was able to pass as a boy or young man at times.

I had a girlfriend who did the same thing because she was sick of being hit on every time she walked down the street (no, I didn't hit on her like that; I met her in a different way).

Another point, one that came up well in a link in another post, is simply being clear with someone if you want to be left alone. Apparently (this comes out in that link, and police told me the same thing once when someone was harassing me), if you tell someone clearly that you want to be left alone, or that you need to be alone right now (or today, or this week, or on this trip), and the person does not leave you alone, the person is in violation of the law, and can be arrested.

It is interesting to realize that one has this right, and that there are laws in support of it.

Every time I have said something along these lines to someone (usually with words like "I don't mean to be unfriendly, but I really need to be alone right now"), they have respected it and left me alone. Almost like magic.

You don't have to be nasty or rude or impolite or even firm, just clear.

[It would be very interesting to see the actual laws (on this sort of harassment). If anyone knows more, or has any links on this topic, I would love to see them. I don't have time to dig into it right now; but if anyone finds anything, please feel free to post it.]

Secondly, in many backward and dangerous places (Mexico, England, California), weapons like firearms, pepper spray, and knives are illegal for mere civilians to be trusted with carrying, and even unarmed self-defense is largely illegal.


Which England? England in the UK? If so have you ever wondered why we have a minute fraction of gun incidents that the USA has?

Simple because they are very difficult to get hold of. So less guns, less violence all round.

Now is that really backward?

Logic and common sense says no.
And how can England be dangerous? We have areas that are bad like other countries in the world. The trick is to avoid them. Not hard just look for the usual signs.

I'll admit in England it is not perfect, but definitely not backward or dangerous.

I'm not female, but I have been the victim of random street violence that left me hospitalized with amnesia. That happened to me not on tour, but when I was in a busy middle class university neighborhood with two of my friends.

With regard to safety while touring I think it's more important to worry about traffic. If you feel vulnerable to violence I'd say just carry mace or a knife if it makes you more comfortable (a knife is a useful tool to have anyway). As a female you may be at higher risk of sexual violence, but on the flip side people are more likely to trust you and help you out along your tour.

I did once wake up to a family of bears within arms reach of me while on tour. That was kind of terrifying, but they just sniffed at me and walked away. A can of mace might have made me a little more at ease in case the mother bear had become aggressive though.

Recommendations? That's easy...

Use your common sense.

Be mindful of your surroundings, all the time. Don't put yourself in a situation or environment that might be sketchy. Keep to yourself on the road; just have a watchful eye.

On the other hand, one of the pleasures to be had while touring is the hospitality of others; even though there are bad eggs out there, most people you meet will be friendly
and glad to lend a hand when needed.

When all else fails, pull into town, head for the nearest constabulary and explain the situation. Most often they'll keep an extra eye out for ruffians.

This book has some good tips:

http://www.amazon.com/Ride-New-Life-Michelle-Sicard/dp/1879854570/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1336694994&sr=8-1

The cover photograph tells part of it. She consciously chose not to look too appealing. She didn't want to attract that kind of attention, or be appealing in that way.

Add some baggy shorts, and it looks pretty effective to me.

Speaking as a male, I have to say that when a fit woman is dressed in lycra, it definitely attracts a certain degree of attention. It's almost like body paint. I'm sure there are many other males of whom it can be said that the attraction is substantial at times. It is a shame in a way, but it's the way it is. It has been that way for many thousands of years. It's even that way for many other species. I'm sure you already know this -- but maybe some of the concrete measures that can be taken, and are taken by cyclists like Michelle Sicard, are worth mentioning.

She also cut her hair for the trip.

And she was able to pass as a boy or young man at times.

I had a girlfriend who did the same thing because she was sick of being hit on every time she walked down the street (no, I didn't hit on her like that; I met her in a different way).

Another point, one that came up well in a link in another post, is simply being clear with someone if you want to be left alone. Apparently (this comes out in that link, and police told me the same thing once when someone was harassing me), if you tell someone clearly that you want to be left alone, or that you need to be alone right now (or today, or this week, or on this trip), and the person does not leave you alone, the person is in violation of the law, and can be arrested.

It is interesting to realize that one has this right, and that there are laws in support of it.

Every time I have said something along these lines to someone (usually with words like "I don't mean to be unfriendly, but I really need to be alone right now"), they have respected it and left me alone. Almost like magic.

You don't have to be nasty or rude or impolite or even firm, just clear.

[It would be very interesting to see the actual laws (on this sort of harassment). If anyone knows more, or has any links on this topic, I would love to see them. I don't have time to dig into it right now; but if anyone finds anything, please feel free to post it.]


Even though I understand your point, Niles... Holy ****! What's next? Riding in a burka? :(

I haven't toured by myself, but agree with advice of not putting yourself in a potentially dangerous situation. Always know your route, always have a way out, and if something feels off it probably is. Listen to your gut, don't worry about offending somebody if you have a bad feeleing aout them.

I think Machka gave you excellent suggestions, I would definitely contact some cycling clubs. They will probably give you some tips on accommodation and places to eat.

Enjoy your trip and please let us about how it's going, if you get a chance. :)

This has been (with a few exceptions) one of the most mature discussions about self defense while touring that I've seen.
I think the original poster shows uncommon good sense in recognizing the limits of her ability with firearms.
I also agree that awareness and avoidance are key. Learning to recognize sketchy people and situations will go a long way.
I believe in a defense in depth, in which you put as many layers of defense between you and danger as possible. The vast majority of these are simply behaviors. Where your ride, how you ride, where you camp, who you talk to or don't, projecting strength, etc. As stated previously, if you do have to use a weapon, it's because all those other layers went south.
I think some OC spray in your jersey and whatever camp knife or hatchet you bring should suffice. I bring a stout camp knife that is used for camp chores and occasionally splitting wood. I no longer bring a pistol unless I'm going to be pretty deep in the woods.
"Meditations on Violence" by Rory Miller is a very interesting book that addresses a lot of the self defense myths out there.

Definitely some good advice here. Plan your route very carefully would be my best advice besides what has been said. For instance, if you're going through IL, stay completely away from st. louis. Indiana, stay away from Gary, and so on and so on. That being said, going through a semi-shady populated place will often be safer than riding through a nice "middle of nowhere" type of place. I bought my sister a 600,000 volt stun gun when she moved to the city. She once had a creepy guy get a little too close, so she dry fired it and the guy immediately ran away. Those things are surprisingly loud and painful. If you're going that route obviously check the laws of the places you'll be going through. Telescopic batons are also a good, easy to use self defense weapon, but again, are illegal in some places.

You are smart to not want a pistol if you are not comfortable with it, and I applaud you knowing that. There are too many people out there who own firearms but are not comfortable with them, and that's where the "killed with their own gun" statistics come from.

Lastly, you may want to consider a satellite phone. Even the best networks have tons of areas where there is zero coverage.

You'll be fine, just trust your gut, if a situation seems bad it probably is so get out of it.

I would definitely NOT try to hook up with other tourists, nothing will ruin a tour quite as fast as having to put up with someone else's agenda. (Not the same thing as touring with a friend.)

I would definitely NOT try to hook up with other tourists, nothing will ruin a tour quite as fast as having to put up with someone else's agenda. (Not the same thing as touring with a friend.)

Thats interesting, it chimes with my (male) perspective. I really wouldn't want to commit myself to riding with people I don't know when on a solo tour.

OP, good for you, and good decision about the weapon.

Even though I understand your point, Niles... Holy ****! What's next? Riding in a burka? :(


The main issue with the Burka is that it is society telling women they must be so dressed (though in reality our society is virtually as normative). The next layer down is the objection that one should not have to wear something like that to be safe. "She was asking for it" is never the right frame of mind.

Fine and good, so you want to start a movement, or pass under the radar? One doesn't have to change one's behaviour, but if one wants to explore safety, one should at least honestly face whatever it's components may be, and not just react like a campus poster.

Of course the assumption is that some kind of sex motivated attack is the big danger. I've never been at risk of that, and there are still risks out there for me, so any one thing only takes you so far. I'd b interested as to whether one is more likely to be sexually attacked while riding across the US, than just spending an equal amount of time in one's own normal routine. No idea. If you don't ride a bike 4000 miles you reduce your chance of being hit by a car while riding a bike. But one the sex violence deciding not to hit the road does not eliminate the risk.

There is a big difference between fear and danger. And even "danger" is for the most part largely subjective. Bad stuff either happens or it doesn't. I went on one trip of about 1000 miles and was greated back by friends who wanted to hear the story. I was shocked to find out, that as a stocky 73" tall male, they regarded the idea of camping across a few provinces as insanely dangerous. Oddly they didn't even think far enough to imagine the horror of riding in proximity to huge vehicles. I was shocked. I occasionally hear noises or think thoughts when camping, but for the most part I feel at least as safe as in my house.

My point is people who are scared for a tourist are probably for the most part completely irrational about the whole thing. Cops can be among the worst because they see so much tragedy though I would imagine little of it is related to bike touring. The main thing about bike touring is the adventure. It isn't large scale like being the first person to climb Everest, or something worth while, but it is quite a varied life. It isn't luxurious, or "extreme". There is a lot of grind. But you aren't getting your money's worth if it doesn't make you a little uncomfortable. For newbies it is largely interesting as a trip outside of their comfort zone, and a lot of that is to do with people, because most BT does not take place in the wilderness. So you will be out of your comfort zone, and around different people who could, among other things, kill you with their cars at any moment. That's the fun part.

Which England? England in the UK? If so have you ever wondered why we have a minute fraction of gun incidents that the USA has?

Simple because they are very difficult to get hold of. So less guns, less violence all round.

Not really Canada and Switzerland have very high levels of gun access, and do not have US levels of violence. It isn't guns. Gun violence and violence in general have gone up in the UK since handguns were banned. And the UK does have it's wild west, Belfast. High levels of legal and illegal handgun ownership, the guns are the response not the cause.


Now is that really backward?

Logic and common sense says no.
And how can England be dangerous? We have areas that are bad like other countries in the world. The trick is to avoid them. Not hard just look for the usual signs.

I'm sure that is a great consolation to the people actually live in those areas and aren't just passing through. You are basically just saying you feel safe, which sounds like a good start...

Thanks for all of the responses! Much of my argument against carrying a gun with my family and friends has been reinforced! Fore the past few weeks, I've been flipping back and forth, back and forth, whether or not carrying a weapon is a good idea. Many times I would beat myself up over the fact that I didn't consider this aspect of tour sooner, thinking things like "if only I learned how to shoot guns 8 months ago." I feel like all the pressure from loved ones to carry a weapon has really clouded my original stance on the situation.


I'm all for guns, and carry, but... There is a whole segment feeding the thing, who now believe they must always carry. There is an industry behind this, and also some sad real world experience out there, and it is breeding a whole new generation of people who must always be carrying a gun. This is a continuum that exist independent of the risk level. There is no situation so mild that they would not carry. And that is OK, but you can't therefore use them as an indicator. They are like an old person in a cardigan during July - doesn't mean it's cold.

Two other things. You are always potentially armed. Many weapons are at hand, or could be. Again, the handgun fetish makes people believe they are only armed when they are packing a handgun. And, don't believe anyone who says you need extensive training to use a handgun. You need focused simple training, potentially only a few hours, if it was actually the right stuff. Women are, according to instructors, more likely to take instruction, and to concentrate on fundamentals. Handguns are incredibly difficult to master, but the basics are not so tough. Hard to ride as well as Lance Armstrong, but 50% of it is just having a bike. Not that difficult to outrun someone on foot when you have a bike.

Use your awareness, but don't let paranoia ruin your tour.

I bet you are at more risk of harm when commuting and exercising on your bike than on a tour like this, yet you haven't even considered taking a self-defence course much less than carrying a weapon for those everyday activities.

Not really Canada and Switzerland have very high levels of gun access, and do not have US levels of violence. It isn't guns. Gun violence and violence in general have gone up in the UK since handguns were banned. And the UK does have it's wild west, Belfast. High levels of legal and illegal handgun ownership, the guns are the response not the cause.

Belfast isn't on the UK mainland.

Without turning the thread into a discussion on the merits or otherwise of gun ownership, you're right to say that the problem is the people and not the guns. If possession of guns made a society safe then South Africa would be safe. If it made a society dangerous then Switzerland would be dangerous.

I don't see England as being an overly violent place. I've cycled through some of the notorious sink estates in London (albeit not intentionally) and aside from the sense of uneasiness of realising where I was (about 18 months previously I'd been the jury foreman in a court case relating to GBH with intent on the same estate) the area didn't seem overly threatening.


I'm sure that is a great consolation to the people actually live in those areas and aren't just passing through. You are basically just saying you feel safe, which sounds like a good start...

Saying England is dangerous because of a few bad areas makes no more sense than looking at the worst parts of Philadelphia and Baltimore and concluding the US is "backward and dangerous".

You'll be fine, just trust your gut, if a situation seems bad it probably is so get out of it.

I would definitely NOT try to hook up with other tourists, nothing will ruin a tour quite as fast as having to put up with someone else's agenda. (Not the same thing as touring with a friend.)


That's the best part of contacting cycletouring or randonneuring clubs. Chances are you won't be commiting yourself to riding with someone for thousands of kilometres ... it might just be a few hours, or a day or two. And it might be one other person, or a small group. A good chance to meet like-minded people. :)

We were able to meet up with a few people from the BC Randonneurs on our tour on Vancouver Island last August. That made a good tour even better.

Both Rowan and I have met up with people we've met through bikeforums, cycling clubs, etc. on our various tours. In fact, that's how we got to know each other. Careful ... you might find a life partner!! :D


One of the additional benefits of getting in touch with clubs along the way is that other cyclists can give some good information about routes and places. We contacted the BC Randonneurs about the Vancouver Island tour and got some good suggestions of where to ride. And when we were looking for a place to cycle at Christmas we contacted Audax Australia to ask about our proposed areas. We ended up in quite a nice area.

Use your awareness, but don't let paranoia ruin your tour.

I bet you are at more risk of harm when commuting and exercising on your bike than on a tour like this, yet you haven't even considered taking a self-defence course much less than carrying a weapon for those everyday activities.

That is a big +1. I couldn't agree more.

Another suggestion I would have is communication ....

1) Do you have any family or friends along the way? If so, I'd be inclined to stop in and visit ... even just for coffee for an hour. It can be comforting to visit and talk with people you know when you're on a long trip away from family and friends. But they also provide a check-in point. You'll have someone expecting you, and then they'll have seen you, and can confirm that you're looking well, etc. etc.

2) Make use of telephone, email, facebook, etc. to inform family and friends where you are and how it's going. These messages can be reassuring to friends and family, and they can allow friends and family to tour vicariously with you.

3) Provide close friends and family with your itinerary. You might initially provide them with a general one if you're not much of a planner, but as you go along you can fill in the details (tomorrow I'm heading for this town and the next day I hope to make it to that town).

These points also do something else ... if, heaven forbid, you suddenly disappeared, checking in with friends and family in person or by another method of communication, and providing people with your itinerary, will give police a place to start looking for you.


4) Make sure you've got travel insurance. If something goes wrong medically, you don't want to have the additional worry of paying for help.

5) I've recently discovered that both Rowan and I can register with our governments to be alerted about any travel advisories as we travel. You might see if your government offers a similar service. I think it's mainly for travel to various countries, but I suppose it could be used for travel within one country.

6) Along with that, bring a radio, bring a computer, and follow the news. Pay attention to weather and other environmental situations. A bushfire, for example, could be extremely dangerous. Blizzards, hurricanes, etc. etc. can also be very dangerous. Media can help keep you aware of these things so you can alter your plans to avoid them.


BTW - which country are you crossing? I initially assumed the US because that seems to be a popular country to cross for some reason, but you're probably crossing Canada, Australia, or doing an end-to-end in the UK. :)

To add to several others recommendations wrt trusting your instincts- don't talk yourself out of your first impression/instinct/gut feel. If your first reaction is "something ain't right" or "this is kinda creepy", it is. Don't talk yourself out of it for convenience.

I'm guessing you'll be posting back here this fall about all the wonderful folks you met and how outgoing/nice everyone was to you on tour.

I wouldn't worry about avoiding St. Louis. We have some cool stuff. You definitely need to check out City Museum.
EAST St. Louis is a little different, but even then, if you stay on the highways you'll be fine. Most of the violence that occurs there is late night drug related BS.
Hell, if you want to bypass STL altogether, you can catch the Metrolink in Brentwood and ride it all the way out to Scott Airforce base for $4. :)

Even though I understand your point, Niles... Holy ****! What's next? Riding in a burka? :(

Thought he was going to suggest sex reassignment surgery.

Just a reminder: This forum is about touring. If you want to discuss religious or political reasons for women's attire, you need to start a thread in P&R.

CbadRider
Forum Moderator

Thanks Machka! Your advise has been great!

I am traveling across the US (west bound on primarily the TransAmerica ACA route) and visiting a lot of family and friends a long the way. I have a blog set up so that family, friends, and new friends can follow my progress when I actually get pedaling. I've also been in touch with a lot of WarmShowers folks and they have been very friendly and offered great advise as well. My itinerary has a lot of wiggle room, but I have set specific dates to be in certain cities because I have friends meeting up with me - which I'm pretty excited about. I won't be taking a computer just because I think the smart phone and public library computers will suffice.

I didn't think of travel insurance. I'm glad you brought that up because it would be beneficial in case of injury or theft. A side note - a guy passed through my town a couple of years ago and had his bike and whole tour set up stolen (he wasn't locked up, which is quite foolish in any city). I believed he had some sort of travel or renter's insurance that replaced nearly all of his gear! Unfortunately, the same thing happened to him in Colorado. Not sure if that was part of plot to scam the nice local folks or if he was just kind of spacy! :0 He was a nice fellow, I think it was more because of his spacy-ness.

In regards to receiving travel alerts from the government, I'll definitely have to look into that. Another poster suggested the idea of a satellite phone because service is not always available in the more rural states. It's funny, my grandmotheractually brought that up recently. Not that grandmothers can't be technologically hip - she knows WAY more about tech stuff than I do - I was just surprised that she knew that much and that satellite phones existed.

Based on what a lot of people have suggested and discussed I feel like I've been planning and preparing for the trip in the best way possible. I've arranged to take some self defense classes over the next few weeks as a step of good measure. I'm not opposed to carrying guns, I just don't think that at this point in the game they are appropriate for me and my skill level with firearms.

Keep the discussion going! It's super interesting!

PS



She also cut her hair for the trip.

And she was able to pass as a boy or young man at times.


I just got my hair done last week. I'm absolutely not cutting it short. I've been growing it out from a pixie/boyish cut for four years now.... and no one mistook me for a boy. Everyone was able to recognize that I'm a female.

Use your awareness, but don't let paranoia ruin your tour.

I bet you are at more risk of harm when commuting and exercising on your bike than on a tour like this, yet you haven't even considered taking a self-defence course much less than carrying a weapon for those everyday activities.
I think this is great advise. I also think it is great you recognize being inexperienced with a firearm would cause more harm than good. You could consider carrying a Spot tracker, that way your family/friends can follow your adventure and it even has an emergency button that will send help to your location if needed.

Which England? England in the UK? If so have you ever wondered why we have a minute fraction of gun incidents that the USA has?

The rate of "gun incidents" doesn't matter when the UK has more than quadruple (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1196941/The-violent-country-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html) the violent crime rate of the US. I therefore objectively consider the UK a more dangerous place than the US.

The population 400,000 US city I live in has a lower violent crime rate than Japan, and we're armed to the teeth.



>Secondly, in many backward and dangerous places (Mexico, England, California), weapons like firearms, >pepper spray, and knives are illegal for mere civilians to be trusted with carrying, and even unarmed self-?>defense is largely illegal.

>If you carry a weapon, the police will now generally be more dangerous to you than the criminals were.

Oh grow up!

I'll just leave this here: Botched Police Raid Map (http://www.cato.org/raidmap/) and Don't Talk to the Police (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CE4QtwIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fvideo.google.com%2Fvideoplay%3Fdocid%3D-4097602514885833865&ei=bjGtT-3ZMYOo8ATEvfSPDQ&usg=AFQjCNEpVmS5L7fOaQNmq7R5jTND1O-YvQ). The police are not your friends.

Also, google "duty to retreat" laws and "castle doctrine". In a lot of backward places you are guilty of a crime if you defend yourself without satisfying the prosecutor's whims as to how much running away is "enough" and how much injury is "enough" for you to be allowed to defend yourself.

To keep this on-topic, good on the OP for realizing that varying state laws across her journey will mean that she has a near 100% certainty of being guilty of a serious crime at some point just by carrying a weapon and that awareness is going to be her best tool.

Quoting from that article

" South Africans suffer more than 20,000 murders each year -
compared with Britain's 921 in 2007."

USA in 2007 is 16,929 from http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.htm

You have 5 times more people than we, yet nearly 4 times more murders per population.

"Experts say there are a number of reasons why violence is soaring in the UK.
These include Labour's decision to relax the licensing laws to allow
round-the-clock opening, which has led to a rise in the number of serious
assaults taking place in the early hours of the morning. "

The Brits do love their booze and does lead to increased violence. A lot of it is caused by drink. This one is easy, don't go into pubs or those areas late on a night. common sense

"But Police Minister David Hanson said: 'These figures are misleading.

Levels of police recorded crime statistics from different countries are
simply not comparable since they are affected by many factors, for example the
recording of violent crime in other countries may not include behaviour that we
would categorise as violent crime."

"Violent crime in England and Wales has fallen by almost a half a peak in
1995 but we are not complacent and know there is still work to do. That is why
last year we published 'Saving lives. Reducing harm. Protecting the public. An
Action Plan for Tackling Violence 2008-11'"

We don't believe the papers too much over here, they print anything to get published and more sales. Look up the Leveson enquiry.

Figures can be manipulated for any purpose. As Churchill said, theres lies, damn lies and statistics.

The UK is not more violent in terms of gun crime than the US.

Comparing other forms of crime is like comparing apples and oranges. Crime can be found anywhere if you go looking for it.

With a smart head on ones shoulders it can be avoided mostly in any country.


I have experienced in my travels and heard it said by others when in other countries by the natives, don't go to that neighbouring country it is bad. You get there and find it is ok. Admitedly there are some exceptions but you just have to keep an open mind particularly with what the press say.

I've been asked by several friends and family members if I'm carrying a firearm. After much last minute debate I've decided that carrying a gun is out of the question. I'm far too inexperienced with firearms to feel comfortable using a handgun, universe forbid, in a time of necessity. And there really isn't enough time to act on such training now (classes, permits, etc.).
Oye!

The legality of carrying a fire arm isn't the same in all states and things get complicated when you go across state lines. I don't think your friends and family have any real understanding about them.


I'm considering other self defense options, i.e. taser or mace or both. ???
Tasers might not be any/much simpler legally.

I am not sure why folks seem to assume it is more dangerous to be on the road in rural and small town America than in most of their hometowns. Take the same precautions you take in everyday life. You will meet mostly kind and generous people on the Trans America. Depending on where you live it is very likely that when it comes to the concerns that are being raised you will be safer than when you are riding in your home town.

Have a great trip!

Some really good suggestions here and some that had me rolling my eyes. I live in Mexico and often travel on my own. I was also stationed in Turkey and often went for walks in town when most women were told to travel in pairs. Common sense is the key here. I think one of the best things you can do is to look confident. Never look timid or scared. I don´t mean to be arrogant or rude, but look like you know how to handle yourself. You´ll find that most strangers will astonish you with their kindnesses. Obviously, take care on the roads and follow the normal safety precautions. And always, always trust your gut. Better to be a bit embarrassed than dead.

Making people fear each other , and seeing them as being an Opponent ,
and competitor, or a crop, or resource, to be harvested, may have its roots
in the Enclosure Acts, of Old, that drove people off the common lands..

Making people fear each other , and seeing them as being an Opponent ,
and competitor, or a crop, or resource, to be harvested, may have its roots
in the Enclosure Acts, of Old, that drove people off the common lands..Probably so, and now it's from watching TV . . .

Some really good suggestions here and some that had me rolling my eyes. I live in Mexico and often travel on my own. I was also stationed in Turkey and often went for walks in town when most women were told to travel in pairs. Common sense is the key here. I think one of the best things you can do is to look confident. Never look timid or scared. I don´t mean to be arrogant or rude, but look like you know how to handle yourself. You´ll find that most strangers will astonish you with their kindnesses. Obviously, take care on the roads and follow the normal safety precautions. And always, always trust your gut. Better to be a bit embarrassed than dead.

Makes a lot of sense.

In my university days I was in a town where men were advised not to walk alone after dark. When I needed to get back from the station to my hall of residence I walked, usually at some silly hour of the night, along a dimly lit path beside the canal. I figured if all else failed my escape option was to dive into the canal.

That said given I'm 6'4 and from all accounts at the time looked very sinister and imposing in the half-light when dressed all in black.

I wish that our feelings of safety had a stronger correlation with our actual safety.

Hi Everyone

I'm getting ready to leave on a cross country tour in June (coast to coast)... and I'm a female going by myself. I'll have a friend traveling with me here and there, but for 3000 miles out of the 4000 miles I will be all by my lonesome. Unfortunately, the reality is that there is a difference in the degree of safety inherently possessed by a man versus a woman when traveling solo. I'm curious to hear about the experiences of women who have toured significant distances alone and the safety precautions that they took.

I've been asked by several friends and family members if I'm carrying a firearm. After much last minute debate I've decided that carrying a gun is out of the question. I'm far too inexperienced with firearms to feel comfortable using a handgun, universe forbid, in a time of necessity. And there really isn't enough time to act on such training now (classes, permits, etc.). I'm considering other self defense options, i.e. taser or mace or both. ???

Had this crossed my mind six months ago, I would have gone through the necessary training to confidently carry a hand gun on tour, but that didn't happen so I need to find an alternative form of self defense.

Any advise is greatly appreciated!

Cheers
L.

"Unfortunately, the reality is that there is a difference in the degree of safety inherently possessed by a man versus a woman when traveling solo."

At first, this looks like a given. After thinking it over, I'm not at all sure it is accurate; and the underlying implications can fuel paranoia and fear.

Statistically, the danger to males may actually be higher than to females, and I suspect that it is.

Also, I wanted to correct some possibly misleading points:

(1) Josie Dew was assaulted while on tour. True enough. But it should also be added that this happened only after years of bicycle travel, much of it alone as a single young (and diminutive, and attractive) female, through a wide variety of countries. And she admits that she used poor judgment in accepting a ride and an offer of dinner from a stranger she had doubts about, alone with him in his apartment.

So it wouldn't be accurate to focus on that incident, and overemphasize it to the point of implying that going on one bike tour as a single (and reasonably cautious) female is likely to lead to such an encounter.

There are more accurate ways of putting it in the proper perspective.

(2) The other woman mentioned, who was assaulted in a sketchy trailer park after accepting a very sketchy offer while unusually road weary, had traveled around the world by bike (alone as I recall) before that one incident occurred.

Again, this is the sort of incident that can fuel unreasonable perspectives and fears.

(3) Michelle Sicard's approach (cutting her hair, looking less attractive, passing as a boy or young man at times) worked for her, and she even had some fun with it, as did an ex-girlfriend (who also happened to be an unusually attractive woman who made her living as a model). It worked for them, and it has worked for others; but it obviously isn't for everyone. It's just a possibility, one among many others, and one that works on a case by case basis.

(4) There are cases of women using mace, and having it backfire. In one case, a woman in a store asked another woman to leave the store. When the latter ignored her, the former maced her. She (the former) was prosecuted and convicted of some serious offenses, fined, and required to attend classes for a lengthy period of time.

The laws are often different, complex, and even convoluted, and vary significantly from place to place.

Someone can jump you, and begin hitting you; and if you shoot the person you can still be convicted of some serious felonies, and spend years in prison. You have to exhaust other means (in many cases), and meet a variety of other strict criteria before you can do such things to other people. Not only different states, but different counties, and even different individual prosecutors can vary greatly in how they respond to such incidents.

(5) Whoever said not to let fear and paranoia ruin your trip said it pretty well.

(6) I know women personally who are afraid to go out on rides or even walks alone. This is in a very scenic, low crime, forested area with a variety of quiet back roads and wonderful, beautiful, world class trails. I have toured and ridden and hiked these for years, and know the area like the back of my hand. And I just want to say that some of these women are just so wildly off base it isn't funny. They are in virtually NO danger. Yet you would think that they were venturing out into some extraordinary danger. What is extraordinary is how they have arrived at this condition, or simply that they have arrived at this condition.

(7) I may have inadvertently fueled the image of males as dangerous or unable to control themselves. There are *many times more* males who are no danger at all, and would even help or protect if necessary. The vast majority are fine, and it is a shame that so much paranoia has been propagated, to a large extent through fear-mongering media.

It seems so much better not to let this sort of stuff darken or take over too much of your trip. If you can keep it light, see and focus more on the good, and keep a sense of humor, it seems much closer to living well, or a life/win.

One thing that needs to be reinforced is to be cautious about telegraphing your plans. breezybikes intends to blog. Be careful if it is open to all to see, and be selective about who you tell along the way. This is not being paranoid, but it certainly is a primary protection to ensure that unwanted people won't track your intended movements and be waiting for you.

If someone approaches you and asks where you are headed (usually without expressing any other interest in what you are doing), you will have to use your judgment and give the "right" answer. Machka is very good at this. I think she uses very nebulous answers, and in some cases indicates a route out of town in the completely opposite direction.

staehpj1 and several others have put their fingers on a very important element here -- why regard people in country locations as being shadier than city counterparts? We live in a country town, and while some youngsters get a bit boisterous at weekends, for all intents and purposes, the crime rate is zero. Most people get into trouble through alcohol use...

Be sociable. Pick your crowd (generally mature rather than young) and be near them when it comes to campgrounds; setting up camp away from the mainstream can carry its risks. Use a good torch at night. Go to information or visitor centres to find out what is happening and if there are shady areas to avoid.

The rate of "gun incidents" doesn't matter when the UK has more than quadruple (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1196941/The-violent-country-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html) the violent crime rate of the US. I therefore objectively consider the UK a more dangerous place than the US.

LOL. You "objectively consider" based on statistics compiled by the Conservative Party and reported in the Daily Mail.

Forgive my mirth, but the Daily Mail is pretty much the equivalent of Fox News when it comes to impartiality and reliability.

Diana Johnson (CGOAB) had a couple of uncomfortable encounters that didn't feel right to her and from time to time she talks about safety issues for solo female cyclists. It's a great read, BTW.... Here's a link to one of the incidents but the whole journal is worth checking out...

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/page/?o=1&page_id=247379&v=39

I agree. This is a great journal of a young female riding by herself.

I'd recommend reading "The Gift of Fear," by Gavin DeBecker - the title made me skeptical at first, but it's one of the most empowering books I've ever read. It's about trusting your gut.

Also, remember that being assaulted by strangers is incredibly rare. The vast majority of sexual assaults are committed by people known to the victim. I'm nowhere near going on a tour yet, but the dudes at my work were horrified that I go on *gasp* 10 MILE SOLO RIDES SOMETIMES OH NOEZ WHO WILL DEFEND MY HONOR????

Reminding them that statistically, they as my coworkers were much more likely to **** me than any random person I meet on a ride shut them up.

ETA: wtf kind of bovine pocky is this that the forum censors r-a-p-e