Long Distance Competition/Ultracycling, Randonneuring and Endurance Cycling - Chargers?

For the riders that use GPS bike computers or carry an Iphone on long 600k plus rides. Do you use a bike mounted charger that connects to your generator hub? or how exactly do you keep your phone and batteries charged on these longer rides.

Let me know all the options.

there are a number of charger systems that hook up to generator hubs. You can also buy an external battery. There are a lot more people that use external batteries than the generator chargers because the generator chargers are a relatively recent product. The generator chargers are quite a bit more expensive too. There have been a couple of threads in the electronics forum here about chargers

My friends have cooked a number of devices using hub converters/chargers. To keep my Garmin 800 charged, I've set up a 4 battery pack using Maha Imedion AA 2400mAh rechargeable batteries. BH-4AA-USB from BatterySpace.com. This gives a 5v output. One set of batteries should produce ~50 hour life for an 800. An iPhone uses, or can use, a lot more juice. You'd have to experiment, since the iPhone is really fussy about input voltage. Fortunately, it's a relatively cheap experiment.

USB batteries. Simple, cheap, no fussing, and works well.

I bought a Garmin GPS that uses AA batteries. Each pair lasts forever, and I can carry spares - or get them at any gas station / convenience store.

I bought a Garmin GPS that uses AA batteries. Each pair lasts forever, and I can carry spares - or get them at any gas station / convenience store.

My Garmin uses a Non-removable battery. I would like to find some kind of setup that plugs into the Garmin's USB and then holds a bunch of AAA batteries. This would charge it after its battery gets low, and I could replace the AAA's as needed.

Anyone want to point me to the right website or product? Thanks

Got a AA battery charger from these guys for my Garmin Edge 500... http://www.gomadic.com/

I am happy with it. The price was good too.

I can kill my Droid battery in about 3 hours if I run Strava and Pandora. I've heard about turning off some services, like dropping Data, and choosing "Use only 2G" (I have a 3g phone), but haven't tried those techniques yet.

For longer rides where I don't mind wearing a backpack I bring my laptop and keep my phone plugged into it. My laptop has one USB port that stays powered up even when laptop is sleeping.

My Garmin uses a Non-removable battery. I would like to find some kind of setup that plugs into the Garmin's USB and then holds a bunch of AAA batteries. This would charge it after its battery gets low, and I could replace the AAA's as needed.

Anyone want to point me to the right website or product? ThanksBattery holder:
http://www.batteryspace.com/batteryholderaax4withusbinterfaceconnectorandbeltcliponoffpowerswitch-rohscompliant.aspx
Batteries:
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/16-Pack-Maha-Imedion-2400-AA-Low-Discharge-Batteries_p_2449.html?frontpage=1
Battery charger:
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/Maha-MH-C401FS-DC-Battery-Charger--White-Model_p_381.html

You can't use 1.5v cells, because that adds up to 6v and you only want 5. The rechargeables are 1.25v, so that works.

Got a AA battery charger from these guys for my Garmin Edge 500... http://www.gomadic.com/

I am happy with it. The price was good too.

I got one. Its ok, the plug had to be trimmed down to fit in the 500 and it won't hold firm enough to charge while riding.

Note the edge 500 won't run while charging unless you get the right connector, so you end up splitting rides if you just use a generic 5V supply (thats the only reason to go with gomadic).

I got one. Its ok, the plug had to be trimmed down to fit in the 500 and it won't hold firm enough to charge while riding.

Note the edge 500 won't run while charging unless you get the right connector, so you end up splitting rides of you just use a generic 5V supply (thats the only reason to go with gomadic).

I haven't had either of those problems.

Yeah, the main reason I got one from them is because of what you said - that the right connector is needed for simultaneous charging and operation of the unit. I heard a rumor that the next firmware update will fix this and won't require any work-arounds with the USB connector.

Got a AA battery charger from these guys for my Garmin Edge 500... http://www.gomadic.com/

I am happy with it. The price was good too.

+ 1. Simple, inexpensive.

I have a dynohub, the plug II+, and a Motorola P893 as a buffer battery (it can charge and recharge at the same time). The P893 is really only needed if you have smart phones that are picky about the current and unfortunately mine is.

Together, these things allow me to never run out of power.

Battery holder:
http://www.batteryspace.com/batteryholderaax4withusbinterfaceconnectorandbeltcliponoffpowerswitch-rohscompliant.aspx
Batteries:
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/16-Pack-Maha-Imedion-2400-AA-Low-Discharge-Batteries_p_2449.html?frontpage=1
Battery charger:
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/Maha-MH-C401FS-DC-Battery-Charger--White-Model_p_381.html

You can't use 1.5v cells, because that adds up to 6v and you only want 5. The rechargeables are 1.25v, so that works.


First thanks for the help. I think this is what I'm looking for.

So, I need to keep the voltage of the external battery pack below<6.. Is that correct? If so that means I cannot use standard over the counter batteries? I have a free unlimited source of batteries.:)

I have the Garmin Edge 705. Will this external battery pack run the gps unit after the original batteries dies? In other words does it only recharge the unit or will it keep working. I would like to immediately plug in the extra pack and keep on going without loosing any information.

How many packs of batteries do you think I would need to keep the gps running for 90 hrs?

I have a dynohub, the plug II+, and a Motorola P893 as a buffer battery (it can charge and recharge at the same time). The P893 is really only needed if you have smart phones that are picky about the current and unfortunately mine is.

Together, these things allow me to never run out of power.


Several of the guys here said that these hub chargers are frying certain electrical items. Have you had any of these problems or know of anyone that has? Also which hub are you using? The son 28 or the son 20r?

First thanks for the help. I think this is what I'm looking for.

So, I need to keep the voltage of the external battery pack below<6.. Is that correct? If so that means I cannot use standard over the counter batteries? I have a free unlimited source of batteries.:)

I have the Garmin Edge 705. Will this external battery pack run the gps unit after the original batteries dies? In other words does it only recharge the unit or will it keep working. I would like to immediately plug in the extra pack and keep on going without loosing any information.

How many packs of batteries do you think I would need to keep the gps running for 90 hrs?Won't work with the 705 exactly as described. The 705 and earlier need a special mini-USB plug with a resistor in it, tip #73. The Gomadic units have that tip as an accessory. I don't know of another place to get them, other than you can cut the tip off a Garmin car plug, the kind that's meant to be used with an automotive Garmin while navigating, and connect it to a battery pack. The special tip with the resistor is so that the unit won't go into charge mode when connected, but will stay in navigation mode. They fixed that with the 800.

The 4 battery pack is supposed to keep the thing running for 40-50 hours, so 3 sets of batteries should mean no recharge, or you can charge while hot-bunking at a control.

Several of the guys here said that these hub chargers are frying certain electrical items. Have you had any of these problems or know of anyone that has? Also which hub are you using? The son 28 or the son 20r?One buddy of mine fried a Garmin with an eWerk, another did his in with an early PedalPower. The latest units may be better?

I have a Shimano hub dynamo plus The Plug USB converter that I use to give a boost to my Garmin 800 if I'm going for a ride lasting over 10 hours. It's working very well for me and has certainly not fried the Garmin or affected its charging or capacity in any adverse way as far as I can tell.

I've also charged a few USB-chargeable blinking bike lights with The Plug, and last December I powered a set of battery-operated Christmas lights that I taped along the frame tubes - I just cut the battery compartment off of the lights and put a USB plug in it's place.

Several of the guys here said that these hub chargers are frying certain electrical items. Have you had any of these problems or know of anyone that has? Also which hub are you using? The son 28 or the son 20r?

I think there's little chance of it with a voltage regulator like the plug. If you go straight from the hub then I can see it happening. The plug puts out a very constant voltage but the hub ranges from 3v to as much as 12 v. Either way make sure to use a buffer battery just to be safe. I'm working on a new one right now that will fit inside the steerer tube but it's mostly for my gps project

It should be noted that the ewerks has an adjustable output and as such IS capable of frying electronics if set to the wrong output settings. This is exactly the reason that I did not get an ewerks (that can the cost). If you fry your stuff with an ewerks it's really user error but it's unfortunately a very tough lesson to learn.

The "Plug II" is really cool. I have never heard of it, but I have heard of the Ewerks. The Plug II installs onto the top of your fork tube and it looks really clean. What does it cost? I only found a german site that had it and I could not figure out how much it cost.

all of the regulators seem to cost about $200.

Just in case someone was confused by some of this, the battery pack with 4 X AA NiMH 2400mAh cells works fine with a Garmin 800 in navigation mode, using the standard cable that comes with the Garmin. The internal battery in the 800 is only 1100mAh, so this will vastly extend running time.

It should be noted that The Plug does not fit inside all steerer tubes. In my 1 1/8" carbon steerer, it didn't quite fit because the internal diameter is a bit small. I was able to shave off some material from the expanding clamping wedges, and it then just slid in. The upper section of The Plug didn't slide in as far as it might, functionally it is fine, but it does protrude by one or two cms more than it should above the top of the stem. Also, you need to have a steering column that has a hole in the bottom so that the wire can pass out (that part wasn't a problem for me). It should be no problem to mount it in most metal 1 1/8" steering columns, it is only carbon steerers with thicker walls that will cause problems.

over the years I've gone round and round with this.

at the moment I use a Duracell Instant Charger (LiIon USB battery) http://www.duracell.com/en-US/product/instant-usb-charger.jspx
and a USB charger like this: http://www.amazon.com/Coby-CA81BLK-Adapter-Charger-Players/dp/B003X26VA0/ref=sr_1_11?ie=UTF8&qid=1337630614&sr=8-11

I have a Garmin 705 and a cheapie LG (slider/communicator type) cell phone.

the 705 will run for about 15hrs which is usually more than enough for a double century.

in the past I've done a few "tours" Banff to Butte in the dirt along the Continental Divide, a trip down from Eureka, Ca, thru the Kings Range and Sinkyone, then onto HWY 1 and down the coast...

I also like to "bikepack" where I end up at least 1 day away from any pavement...

so I also use 2 Brunton Freedom solar (Freedom and Restore) chargers that I attach to my bike front and rear

combined with a Brunton Inspire battery pack: http://store.bruntonoutdoor.com/portable-power/storage/inspire-trade-black/

for me this is a huge amount of electricity for my Garmin 705, Cell phone (if it gets reception), and maybe my iPod... thats a huge maybe, bcz I typically don't carry it.

but really for a vast majority of my paved rides, the DuraCell Instant Charger has yet to be completely drained. that will probably change once I go to an iPhone.

You can't use 1.5v cells, because that adds up to 6v and you only want 5. The rechargeables are 1.25v, so that works.

A simple set of four AA cells, whether alkaline or NiMH, does not meet the USB spec (4.8-5.2 V). The reason is that voltage of single NiMH cells actually varies between 1.4 V (fully charged) and about 1.0 V (close to empty), so 4 in series will range from 5.6 to 4.0 V. However they will be around 1.25 V each = 5.0 V total for about the middle 80% of the discharge cycle, so most of the time it will really be OK. Some electronics won't mind the slight over-voltage of fully charged cells, with others you may not be so lucky. It's best to have a USB battery with a DC-DC converter or regulator to ensure the proper output voltage.



Either way make sure to use a buffer battery just to be safe. I'm working on a new one right now that will fit inside the steerer tube but it's mostly for my gps project

It should be noted that the ewerks has an adjustable output and as such IS capable of frying electronics if set to the wrong output settings. This is exactly the reason that I did not get an ewerks (that can the cost). If you fry your stuff with an ewerks it's really user error but it's unfortunately a very tough lesson to learn.

I agree with this comment about the eWerk. In theory the flexible output voltage is a bonus, but in a world of USB-powered and -charged device, who really needs that feature? 5 V DC is increasingly becoming the standard for mobile power. In my opinion, that voltage output selector is just a bad mistake waiting to happen. If it's available at all, it should be pre-set to 5 V at factory and then be covered up with a sticker, never to be touched by the average Joe, only by those who know what they are doing.

I am curious about your steerer tube project. Are you planning on using NiMH cells or Li-ion 18650 or something similar?



The "Plug II" is really cool. I have never heard of it, but I have heard of the Ewerks. The Plug II installs onto the top of your fork tube and it looks really clean. What does it cost? I only found a german site that had it and I could not figure out how much it cost.

What worries me about the Plug II is the exposed location of the connector. I would prefer a USB socket on a short cable that you could point down, away from rain. With a USB battery it doesn't matter so much because if it rains, you can always put it in your pocket or back pack or handle bar bag. Being built into the steerer, the Plug II has to tough it out. A friend of friend of mine used one during a fully loaded bike tour of Japan and it died on him within a couple of weeks, not sure why.

I currently use a USB battery case (search eBay for "5V 1.5A Mobile Power Supply USB 18650 Battery Charger", about $13) with up to 4 cylindrical 18650 cells (blue TrustFire 2500 mAh protected, $8 for a pair from DX.com). That's over 8000 mAh for under $30. I used it at a 300 km brevet ride to power my Android (Google Nexus S) with Strava for GPS logging and Google Maps for navigation (following a KML trail on the map). I left the phone plugged in to the battery USB socket for about 22 hours. I came home with a fully charged phone after 300 km through the mountains. The shape and diameter of these 18650 cells would make them suitable for installation inside a seat or steerer tube, but currently I don't know of any such product. The PedalPower Super-i-Cable uses a single 18650 cell as a buffer battery.

Here is the Li-ion battery pack with 4 cells installed:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-R2qJTIPebZ4/T6TCzUxvQdI/AAAAAAAA9vE/fQsAUg4WIqE/s640/IMG_2421.JPG

The DIY battery holder I made from a milk carton (stapled and taped) and some zip ties:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-91lOfNCAa2k/T6qLXdYXu6I/AAAAAAAA-Qo/5PtPgM7P4c0/s640/IMG_2455.JPG

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-08LxbflI4fs/T6qLXyqBxkI/AAAAAAAA-Qs/7nTfVm6o6jU/s640/IMG_2456.JPG

Attached to the stem and steering tube:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-RYd8VEq4iiQ/T6qLYkrIuqI/AAAAAAAA-Q0/ZsRVyACE_Cs/s640/IMG_2457.JPG

I now have a new dynamo hub USB adapter on order from another supplier in Germany which looks very promising. A friend of mine has tested it and it supplied power for him anywhere from 5 km/h to 45 km/h. Here is a picture:

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-EQoVWJPvtrI/T6yurjF_POI/AAAAAAAA-Yg/M08kis1MtFE/s640/IMG_2460.JPG

approx $20 delivered to the door.
1150mah, about 45hrs for a Garmin 705.

Fine for a Garmin, but an iPhone or Android will need something more beefy than that. 1150 mAh is only about 3/4 the capacity of their internal battery.

i would just get something like this and be done with it. 5200mah:
http://www.amazon.com/PowerGen-External-Blackberry-Sensation-Thunderbolt/dp/B005VBNYDS/ref=sr_1_1?s=wireless&ie=UTF8&qid=1338080713&sr=1-1

Has anyone given a try to Dahon Reecharge?? I've been using one for quite a few years, it has all the loop holes covered pretty well!!! It has an internal Li-on battery which can be charged from a wall unit before the ride. Can be charged & deliver charge to your device at the same time, has 3 leds to show the charge state as well. Come with a whole host of connectors even Iphone. It simply straps on your Steerer tube/Head tube anywhere!!! And can easily be taken off with you when off the bike - so it can charge you device even off the bike when you're taking a bite! It's also waterproof (have used it extensively in the heavy Indian rains) & havent had any issues at all. Have been using it on Garmin 305, 800 & mobiles like Nokia 5800 I have all those devices with me to date :). Yes it is a little expensive but looking at the features it's quite fairly priced when compared to other such devices, believe me this device has everything covered.

I'm going to add the Dahon to my list, never heard of it by the way Thanks. So far my list has the Pedal Power +, E Works, and the Plug II. Keep the suggestions and thoughts coming!

i have a similar li-ion 18650 pack except i use adifferent cell. i use NCR 2900mah made by panasonic. those ultra fire batts are usually ony 50-70% of their rated mah.

i do have other li-ion polymer that is rated and test by me. rated 5v@20,000 but only 19,250mah accordng to my battery analyser. i use this li-ion and connect to my gps tracker on my bike. the gps tracker is so that i know where my bike is if it gets stolen.

the extended battery last for around 90 days.

that 4x18650 cell pack, i had mine modded, that usb port does 2a, capable of charging even ipad from empty to full 3x. (i only tried 3x)
it even has a variable pot tuner allows me to control the voltage. i use that same pack to power my gerbing heated jacket.

I use a Dahon Biologic Reecharge, wich I plug into a jack which I wired into my hub dynamo's wiring:

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5143/5701865747_2a11b436b9_o.jpg

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5226/5702435648_42b5e14d54_o.jpg

I'm watching this thread with great interest. I found the ReeCharge for about $105, and the E-Werk for $205. Does the e-Werk have that much of an advantage over the ReeCharge?

Someone said the ReeCharge couldn't be connected without charging a device, but I didn't see that in the manual. Overall, the ReeCharge seems simler to use, which is a plus in my book.

I don't see any reason why a charger should cost $200. Of course, I don't see any reason why an iPod charger costs $20, so maybe I need to be recalibrated on what things should cost.

I'm watching this thread with great interest. I found the ReeCharge for about $105, and the E-Werk for $205. Does the e-Werk have that much of an advantage over the ReeCharge?

Someone said the ReeCharge couldn't be connected without charging a device, but I didn't see that in the manual. Overall, the ReeCharge seems simler to use, which is a plus in my book.

I'm definitely no expert here, but so far it appears the the E-Werk has to be set specifically for what you happen to be charging at the time (screw that up and things fry), also it does not appear to be water proof (nothing in the literature about it), and it still would require purchasing a buffer battery if you are trying to charge an Iphone. The Dahon states up front that the unit is Waterproof and the buffer battery is included inside the unit.

So far, I am looking at the Dahon, Plug II, and Pedalpower+. Still undecided.

Like I said before the Dahon wins hands down when it comes in almost all aspects. For me none of the other units offered it's features & I didn't see a reason to buy any other unit.

A German bike magazine tested a number of chargers including the Dahon. The unit they tested fried itself (capacitor overheating). Also, it seems to use a simple regulator instead of a step-down converter to convert DC to DC, which saves a few pennies but means more heat at higher speeds and slightly more drag on the dynamo hub.

those ultra fire batts are usually ony 50-70% of their rated mah.

I think you're the first one to mention UltraFire cells. Mine are TrustFire, not Ultrafire. But in any case, you're right, Ultrafire fall far short of claimed capacity. Many cells out of China sold as UltraFire are actually from recycled laptop battery packs, which could already have years of use on them.

A German bike magazine tested a number of chargers including the Dahon. The unit they tested fried itself (capacitor overheating). Also, it seems to use a simple regulator instead of a step-down converter to convert DC to DC, which saves a few pennies but means more heat at higher speeds and slightly more drag on the dynamo hub.
they really must be laughing at us for paying $100 if that's what the circuit is like. A circuit board that size costs pennies. Since the volumes are low, the case is probably their biggest investment.

not sure about trustfire. currently i'm based in shanghai, so the access to 18650 batteries is easy. having tried quite a few, I opted for NCR 2900mah panasonic batteries. they charge slow thou but they are rated quite near what they claim to me.. I used a LED circuit to test and see how long before the LED turns itself off.
so far i have build quite a few battery pack for a couple of friends. the pack can full charge a dead ipad 3 times and dead i4s almost 6-7 times with the same charging time as a wall socket.
but I dont use a iphone, i use a HTC HD7 with mugen 3900mah battery. i usually charge it once a week.

as for the external battery pack i use, the 4x18650. i use it to power my gerbing heated jacket during winter. and i have another always in my backpack to charge my BT earpiece and garmin 800.

how to tell if your batt needs to be changed.
charge the 18650 for 12 hours and use a multimeter. it should be 4.20v and above. then leave it on the table for 24 hours. if it drops more than 0.03v I usually reject them.

most of the time, i aim for 4.25v. anything less than 4.22 i would reject them.

1) if the max voltage after charging is less than 4.20 means it's a used cell.
2) if the voltage drops after 24hrs means it's an old cell. prolly more than 1 yr old.
I lost count how many 18650 i have bought in my life time. it's prolly around 60 by now.

The previous iPad had a 6700 mAh battery. Four 2900 mAh cells would give you 11600 mAh, which is 1.7 times the iPad capacity. Even at 100% efficiency you would not get 2 charges, let alone three as you claim. In reality, DC-DC converters tend to be about 80-90% efficient, so 1.5 full iPad charges sounds more realistic.

The iPhone 4 and 4S have battery capacities in the 1400 mAh range, so your 6-7 charges do sound plausible.

I don't mind if my TrustFires are only about 2/3 the capacity of your Panasonic 2900 cells considering they're probably only about 1/3 the price.

well, to be honest, i have never owned an apple device before. so i have no idea. the ipad is a friend's, and that's what he told me.

Hey. I found good idea for charge our telephones or GPS on polish website. This is simple system based on LM317. I'm going to make one in few next days. Electronic elements cost only few dollars. So, I think this way of charge is very cheap in comparison to Dahon Reecharge. You have to only connect it to dynamo. http://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/topic1187228-0.html What do you think about it?

So far, I am looking at the Dahon, Plug II, and Pedalpower+. Still undecided.

Please post back when you make a decision. I'm strongly considering the Pedal Power+ Universal iCable with the v4i battery pack. I like the idea of having an external battery back instead of one built into it like the v4i SuperCable. The cable will still charge if the battery pack goes bad, but I don't know about the integrated one.

Granted, I'm also considering waiting a year for when I'm really going to be working on my distance riding to see if things are a little cheaper and more refined.

Hey. I found good idea for charge our telephones or GPS on polish website. This is simple system based on LM317. I'm going to make one in few next days. Electronic elements cost only few dollars. So, I think this way of charge is very cheap in comparison to Dahon Reecharge. You have to only connect it to dynamo. http://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/topic1187228-0.html What do you think about it?
link was dead, but I looked at a cached copy. It looks like a very simple power supply. It doesn't have any obvious protection against high voltages, which seems like it could be a problem. Although if you are careful to start it up when you are stopped it should be ok.

257237

Looks like the max input voltage for an LM317 is 37 V. The problem is that if nothing is plugged into the USB end or the phone battery is fully charged the voltage on the rectifier end can go way beyond that limit. Most designs use zener diodes to limit input voltage to the DC-DC converter chip or regulator. Without that, chances are you'll fry something on the first decent downhill. If you're lucky it's the charger. If you're unlucky, it's your new iPhone 4. This is probably not designed for speed.

I was really surprised the other day that backing my commuter out of the bike rack lit up my taillight and headlight. I'm guessing that unloaded voltage is a problem even at fairly low speeds.

LEDs don't have that much of a problem with voltages from the dynamo because if there's voltage they'll draw a specified current, which prevents excessive voltage buildup.

Regulators or DC-DC converters by contrast don't draw power unless they have something to feed, so voltage across the input capacitors can rise to dangerous levels. With zero load you can have spikes of as much as 80 V and more going into the regulator. So you either need zener diodes or highly voltage resistant switching chips or some more complex protection circuit.

It's not difficult to build a USB adapter that works at 20 km/h. It's not that easy to build something that produces usable amounts of power at lower speeds (climbing hills) and at the same time not creates too much drag or heat or fries itself or the connected appliances at high speeds.