Masters Racing (All Disciplines) - Masters Misc Race Report Thread

Feel free to start a new thread for any particular race. If the race might not be thread worthy, feel free to put it here- The Mod


Hi,

Don't we need one of these? If not, I know a mod who can delete it. ;)

I'll contribute to this thread later today if people think it's a good idea.

My suggestion was the race reports each get a new thread to keep critique comments together with race reports and add media there - pictures suffering in a race or video. If you suck or the race was inconsequential, you can bury it in the twitter style thread. One of my observations of the 33 is that it lacks head line punch. One has to open a thread such as race reports to see what is happening and peruse it backwards. I am less likely to comment on a race that occurred two pages back. That is my 2 cents.

Since we may need "2 pages of back fodder". I'll add my own fodder for the good of mankind. I missed our Tue Worlds due to a work meeting. I did have enough time to make the opening night of a 7 week MTB TT series. I made the 7 pm registration deadline by 11 minutes, got the bike ready, warmed up, hit the john and was at the start line at 7:05.

I started out hard but not stupid, which came later. I got through the first third of the race very clean and smooth. They added a half mile of new trail which went well even though I didn't have a clue what was ahead. On the fast flats of the middle third I locked out the front fork and went break-a-way crit mode redlining it and going OTS after turns. The last third is technical and I felt strong. I even rode up the plank and across the killer footbridge with the pipe railing that broke my rib last year. (I was plotting my revenge the past 10 months!) I did have to dismount twice due to pedal strikes that stopped the bike but no crashes. With 1/4 mile of flat open path to go I reached to lock the front fork out and discovered that I never released it for for technical part. (probably Z4-5 cognisense)

Finished up a few spots from the top of the Sport Division. Im happy with the finish since the division is open aged and I don't race or train on MTB much.

Color me confused.

Do I post my TT practice results here, or in the TT thread?

I had a PR in the local TT practice -- where does that go?

Here (http://app.strava.com/rides/13161511) are those stats, altho the official time is 25:48.

Where should I post that so I get maximum feedback?

Color me confused.

Color me confused.

Do I post my TT practice results here, or in the TT thread?

I had a PR in the local TT practice -- where does that go?

Here (http://app.strava.com/rides/13161511) are those stats, altho the official time is 25:48.

Where should I post that so I get maximum feedback?

Color me confused.

You could start your own thread, if you like. That was Hermes suggestion for maximum visibility. I'd sort of assumed the TT thread was principally for discussing training, preparation, equipment and all that stuff that novices like me need to understand. What I intend to do when I'm back on the bike is use the race report thread for brief factual "raced this, did that" stuff and start new threads for races where I have more to say or want to generate some specific feedback. we can make up this forum as we go along, there are no penalties for trial and error.

And congrats on the PR.

RR, I think we should go with Hermes suggestion and see how that works out, so please start a new thread. I've found that ignoring a Hermes suggestions isn't usually indicative of intelligence.

RR, I think we should go with Hermes suggestion and see how that works out, so please start a new thread. I've found that ignoring a Hermes suggestions isn't usually indicative of intelligence.

RR, Post here, start a new thread or bury it in the BS section. If you are going to take the time to do a more detailed writeup or have pics and etc. then IMO a new thread is great. If you are so humble or it was so bad you want to bury it somewhere. then bury it.:D

Congrats on the PR. If this software had a like button, I would use it.

AZT, I am always right but I have not quite figured out how to make money off that so it is of little value. My wife ignores me and then says later you are always right but that does not stop her from ignoring me in the future.:D

My wife ignores me and then says later you are always right but that does not stop her from ignoring me in the future.:D

I think they all learned that in those "girls only classes" that are not allowed any more.

Hi,

Good, some discussion on this topic. :D Hermes, I hadn't seen you suggestion for individual race report threads before I started this thread. We can let this thread die if the others are good with individual threads. I can go either way but the 33 "approach" of both an enduring thread and individual threads has me missing things because I don't look carefully in both places.

I guess I should have titled this thread, "Should We Have a Race Report Thread?"

I can have our 50+ mod delete this thread if others are OK with that to eliminate future confusion.

I won't have that many separate threads because most of my results are meh (as the cool internet kids say). :o

I'll take it out if that's the consensus...

I'm comfortable with that, as long as it doesn't discourage anyone from posting reports.

I'm okay either way, but this describes me:


I'm comfortable with that, as long as it doesn't discourage anyone from posting reports.

I'd post in an ongoing thread, but I wouldn't start a whole new thread just to mention any of my races. Like, for instance, the omnium I did last night at the Encino velodrome. Which was super fun... and I won (the "B"s). :P

I'm okay either way, but this describes me:



I'd post in an ongoing thread, but I wouldn't start a whole new thread just to mention any of my races. Like, for instance, the omnium I did last night at the Encino velodrome. Which was super fun... and I won (the "B"s). :P

Thats a pity. Plenty of material in an omnium for a thread...

Hi VanceMac and chasm54,

I think the idea is that if you think a race is worth a separate thread then create one. If it is not put your race comment in the shooting the bull thread or maybe the training thread. At least that's what I think we're trying to get some consensus (meaning can you live with that) feedback.

Hi VanceMac and chasm54,

I think the idea is that if you think a race is worth a separate thread then create one. If it is not put your race comment in the shooting the bull thread or maybe the training thread. At least that's what I think we're trying to get some consensus (meaning can you live with that) feedback.

Suits me...

I am fine any method / format. Today, we only have a few participants so anything will work. And some of our participants such as Cleave do 60+ races per year with potentially 4 on the weekend. ShovelHD is similar doing a lot of racing. And they may or may not need / want comments although I think we all like recognition of some kind.

So maybe the way to organize is to leave this thread in tact and remove our discussion. We use this for race reports and let the racers decide if they want a separate thread. From my perspective, I like the more elaborate write-ups with pictures and it would be great if we got some separate threads. I like creative stuff and racers in this forum should not fear being told that they put something in the wrong place.

And one can always bury a race report in training or the BS section.

Photo from Wednesday's omnium.


http://vmac.smugmug.com/Cycling/Encino-Velodrome-various/i-rwnhJDn/0/L/encino-4-L.jpg

Omnium consisted of Point-a-lap, Win-n-Out, and Scratch races. There was a match sprint tournament, as well, which I passed on.

Congrats VM on winning the Bs and nice pic!

Sara's Race Report, Watsonville Crit, Cat 4 women (Open Women) - today.

The short of it. I finished. A bullet point - those young women sure have a kick, and they are very aggressive. The pack was about twenty riders, give or take a couple. I recognized most of the gals from the other races I've been in. I was EASILY three times the age of the majority of them.

We had to wait 40 minutes for our start, which was delayed by a previous race. That did wonders for my warmup. I didn't loose it completely, though. It was windy. There was a 15 MPH wind blowing down California street, and the wind was to be a factor on most of the other sections of the course, as well.

We were given a one lap warm up, which I used as an opportunity to move to and stay at the front (outside front row). The start was neutral, motor paced for one lap and then released. Two gals were very aggressive in grabbing the bumper of the pace van, and then others moved up there and pushed me further to the outside. When the race started, the pace came right up, and I was ready for that. I wasn't ready for shoves I was given to the outside, and I found myself riding in the gutter at 22 MPH. I dropped off a bit to the middle of the pack, and then sat up for the first turn, a right hander. I was immediately pushed off my line by a gal who dove in on me, and I had to back off even further, or I'd have been into the curb. I matched the acceleration of the pack off that corner, but I was very aware I'd have to find a way to rest, and soon. I held my line through the next turn, that 130 degree left hander. I was still mid pack all the way around on that first lap, but I was red lined and suffering. The hill moved me to the back of the pack, but I stayed in contact. I even moved up a couple of places after that rise, mainly because I was willing to hold my speed through the corners where as others were slowing for the drainage culverts (they were not an issue, I discovered very quickly). However, when we got to the hill/rise on the second lap, I blew and went OTB. I tried to bridge back up after collecting myself, but - no way.

In the end, I was lapped FOUR times. Four. It's tough to stay out in the wind on your own for an hour like that. I did realize on a couple of occasions that I had some wheel suckers with me, once for three whole laps. One said to me when she'd finally recovered and passed me "you have good lines through the corners". Gee. Thanks.

I did 32 of 34 laps, only because the race ended for me there. I was given a finish. I don't think I was DFL, only because (I think, I'm not sure) two or three riders didn't finish.

I came away WANTING MORE. Yes, I am outclassed, outgunned, and out skilled. So what. I'll come around.

Here's (http://app.strava.com/activities/13411371) the Lie Detector.

Here's (http://www.usacycling.org/results/?year=2012&id=2541&info_id=51523) the results.

Well done, Sara. I'm glad you aren't discouraged, because looking at that field, with so many Cat1 and Cat2 racers in it, it would have been astonishing if you weren't outgunned. Lots of experience there as well as speed, which is why you'll have found yourself being pushed around. Speaking for myself, I would not be throwing myself to the Cat 1 and 2 wolves, they'd eat me alive. So congratulations on your effort.

So, you were lapped four times. Yes, that's a big margin. But looked at another way, it means that you were riding a bit more than 10% slower, solo and in the wind, than a Cat 1 winner who was with and in the pack through the race. Plenty of reason for encouragement, right there.

Well done, Sara. I'm glad you aren't discouraged, because looking at that field, with so many Cat1 and Cat2 racers in it, it would have been astonishing if you weren't outgunned. Lots of experience there as well as speed, which is why you'll have found yourself being pushed around. Speaking for myself, I would not be throwing myself to the Cat 1 and 2 wolves, they'd eat me alive. So congratulations on your effort.

So, you were lapped four times. Yes, that's a big margin. But looked at another way, it means that you were riding a bit more than 10% slower, solo and in the wind, than a Cat 1 winner who was with and in the pack through the race. Plenty of reason for encouragement, right there.

Chasm, thank you! I see this race as "fuel for the fire". As I said - I want more!

Nice shot, and nice win, VanceMac.

Way to go, Sara. That's a great start, and I'm really proud of you!

Nice shot, and nice win, VanceMac.


+1 :thumb:

Way to go, Sara. That's a great start, and I'm really proud of you!

Thank you, thank you!!! That means a lot, AzT!!!

Sara. I don't know what your expectations were, but Open Women's racing is a crap shoot. If the big guns show up, it's going to be a long day. Vanderkitten, Tibco, Exergy, development squad or not, those are big guns. You also cannot discount your age versus the kittens. You got a finish, that's actually step #2. So you did well considering this is your first criterium.

Aggressiveness in criteriums is normal at all levels. You don't have to be an animal, but you will want to learn how to take a wheel at will in the field and defend it. It won't always work. I'm a little guy, so sometimes I'd rather let the big monsters have my wheel and find another. It is a skill you will want to work on, and it's best done in a practice race. Are there any weekly practice crits in your area?

I think you found out what it means to start up front. You have to be able to at least dictate the pace if you start up there. If your intention is to sit in and let the race unfold, then start a few rows back in the middle next time, or at the back. The back can actually be safer and better as you can easily move your way to the middle around the riders who are slow to clip in. Make sure that you practice your clip-ins regularly so that you can take advantage of others.

All in all you did just fine, better than I would have expected in your first criterium. Don't be discouraged, just keep at it. Try and find a Women's Cat 3/4 race next. The difference is significant. Once you get to the point where you're finishing in the field, then we can talk about the finer points like cornering, tactics, breaks, etc.

I'm Like, for instance, the omnium I did last night at the Encino velodrome. Which was super fun... and I won (the "B"s). :P

Woohoo! Way to go!

The short of it. I finished.

In the end, I was lapped FOUR times. Four. It's tough to stay out in the wind on your own for an hour like that. I did realize on a couple of occasions that I had some wheel suckers with me, once for three whole laps. One said to me when she'd finally recovered and passed me "you have good lines through the corners". Gee. Thanks.

I did 32 of 34 laps, only because the race ended for me there. I was given a finish. I don't think I was DFL, only because (I think, I'm not sure) two or three riders didn't finish.

I came away WANTING MORE. Yes, I am outclassed, outgunned, and out skilled. So what. I'll come around.


Great job, Sara. And kudos for sticking in there after getting lapped. My wife did a few crits this year. She's a complete beginner (far less experienced than you) and only did them to join her friends. She surprised herself with a pack finish in one, but the next one required a bit more cornering skills and she found herself yo-yo-ing at the back of the pack on the very first lap. As you know, that can't last long, and sure enough she was lapped 3-4 times. Similar fields, very different results. I say this only to echo what everyone else's sentiments -- that it can be very subtle improvements that mean the difference between hanging on to a strong pack and drifting off. And as Chasm said, with Cat 1s in there? Incredible job.

I'm amazed that your results were posted so quickly to USAC. Here in socal, it usually takes at least a week, sometimes two. No idea why.

VanceMac, you need to stop beating up on those poor "B" racers on the track. ;) You obviously have some affinity for the track.

Sara, you did exactly what I tell anyone who is getting started in the sport. Stay out there as long as you can or as long as the officials will let you. I'm sure you've seen the logic before: DFL>DNF>DNS. At least that's the logic by which I live. :D The only way to get better at racing is to race. As VancMac mentioned, the quality of the field and the type of course will affect beginning racers a lot. I encourage you to find a weekly training series race and to go as much as you can. There probably won't be a women's race but race with the Masters men and you will learn a lot about racing and about yourself.

The other thing about racing a lot is that you learn that not every race has to be an "A" race. Many of the races I do are more for training. I race them as hard as I can but I don't focus on the result. I focus on the efforts and the training benefits. Another old-time saying is, racing is the best training. That's not always true but it is generally hard to beat the training effect of a race.

Can't remember where I wrote this before but I'll write it again. This guy in SoCal is about my age. A few years ago he started racing. He was pretty heavy and pretty slow. But he kept showing up for the weekday twilight races and weekend races. He would invariably get dropped within one or two laps but he stayed out there and at least one promoter arranged it so that the officials wouldn't pull him. He did this for 2-3 years. Last year he looked thinner -- not skinny mind you -- and he started hanging in longer but would still get dropped. This year he's been able to stay in the pack at several races. I think the morale of the story is clear. If you really want to race and get better, race as much as you can and persevere.

BTW, I get dropped as a matter of course at road races with big hills. This is especially grating for me since I used to be a good (not great) hill climber. Anyway, I still do road races and I get dropped and I stay out there and finish. Sometimes people are still around when I get to the finish. :D

BTW, Amy Russo used to live in SoCal and she was in my club for a number of years. She didn't start racing until she was almost 40 and now she does pretty well in NorCal. If you know her or get to meet her, tell her I say, "Hi."

VanceMac, you need to stop beating up on those poor "B" racers on the track. ;) You obviously have some affinity for the track. "

Ha. I would be pack fodder in the Bs at Carson. I will race the As next time at Encino, where I will be pack fodder as well.

Congrats Sara for the start and finish. A question... did you try to rejoin the pack when the lapped you? The Exergy 2012 is a pro team lead by Kristen Armstrong. It was formerly Peanut Butter and Company 2012. The 2012 derived from the next Olympic year with several of the women trying for the Olympics. The other women were the usual suspects in a P/1/2 field. The promoter opened it up for all categories but did not do the Cat 3/4 any favors - technical challenging course, pro field, fast pace. Beginners will not learn much in a race like this.

In this type of field the racers know and mark each other. If you were on a wheel, that one of the stronger women thought was hers, you were going to get shoved off. You have no track record racing with this group. So this would compound your problems of holding wheels and position. There was no way they would allow you at the front.

Learning and strength increases occur when you mix it up in the pack for long periods of time. Since you like crit racing, you need to find races for cat4 women only with mentors on a simple four cornered course with no grades or local practice crits. In this type of race, the women are going to play nice and you can learn to corner and get exposed to the accelerations which will improve your fitness. Riding a course by yourself even motivated by a field lapping you is not great for fitness per se. I have done it. Sometimes I thought I should be on my TT bike so at least I can get a good TT workout in.:D

I am glad you are not discouraged. You were in a cat fight with a bunch of cougars and you were a kitten.:D

Ha. I would be pack fodder in the Bs at Carson. I will race the As next time at Encino, where I will be pack fodder as well.

That may be true but never sell yourself short when getting results. Good results are too hard to get no matter where you race. You cannot control who shows up to race.

Fellas, I am overwhelmed, really I am, by the kind words and encouragement! Truthfully, I had no idea who I was racing against. To me, at the moment, it didn't matter. I had goals for the race, and by golly, I hit most of them. To find out afterwards that I was a "kitten among cougars" lends a glow of satisfaction to that race that makes it even more special. But, then again, it was a race, and if you guys have taught me anything, it's focus. This year is the learning year, and I could go out there and race a field populated by the likes of Evie Stevens and Sarah Hammer, and it would still be a race to me. I'd come away from it happy that I finished and that much wiser.

Hermes, I now understand why I got the "who do you think you are???" looks from some of those riders when I was at the front. Ride and learn, oops.

Seriously, my appetite is now whetted. I do want more. I feel a little different about myself, too, funny to say. But, I do. Training races? I don't know who what or where, but I know who to talk to about them. We have an active club locally, MBRT, and I will join them. There is some real talent in that group, along with structure and a training program. I need that and want it.

I'm up at Clear Lake at the moment writing this on my iPhone. I know I've misspelled, left out words, whatever - still, I want to thank all of you fellas and ladies for getting me to this point - yes you did.

Oh - I survived a recovery ride up here today in 95 degree heat! Tomorrow - who knows!

~~Sara!

Welcome to the world of crit racing Sara. You did well for your first attempt.

State crit today. Rode the 45 and 50+ races.

No break was going to stay out, and I proved that several times. We had a really good lead out train going in the 50+ race, but inexperience showed and we got swamped on the last lap; our guys learned that you don't wait for the guy on the front to pull off if he starts to slow, you gotta take charge.

I had to come from way back in the field to try to launch our sprinter, got to third wheel in the train and dropped in front of him but just didn't have the gas to go and pulled out early, probably did more harm than good. He did get a close 2nd though.

45+ I launched him really well into the last corner only to find he had been knocked off my wheel and was nowhere to be seen. I tried to gather thing back up and sprint but at that point I was pedaling squares.

Pretty sore and cooked tonight. Recovery day tomorrow and then I start my countdown to salvage something out of Road Nats.

Sounds pretty good, Ex, even if it didn't all go to plan.


We had a really good lead out train going in the 50+ race, but inexperience showed and we got swamped on the last lap; our guys learned that you don't wait for the guy on the front to pull off if he starts to slow, you gotta take charge.


Quoted for emphasis. Doesn't just apply in a finish, either. I've lost a lot of ground, and cost myself a lot of energy, by failing to jump past the wheel ahead as soon as it started to drop off the pace...

Ex, nice work.

Ex, Good luck prepping for road nationals!

Sounds pretty good, Ex, even if it didn't all go to plan.

Quoted for emphasis. Doesn't just apply in a finish, either. I've lost a lot of ground, and cost myself a lot of energy, by failing to jump past the wheel ahead as soon as it started to drop off the pace...

This is where knowing the competition going into a race is important. Do not get on a bad wheel in the first place. This is easier said than done and why certain wheels are hotly contested by other racers.

Ex, great work!!!

This is where knowing the competition going into a race is important. Do not get on a bad wheel in the first place. This is easier said than done and why certain wheels are hotly contested by other racers.

Amen, Brother Hermes!

Ex, nice work.

+1 Your team is lucky to have you working for them.

+1 Your team is lucky to have you working for them.

I am happy he is not in my age group. Yet.

I am happy he is not in my age group. Yet.

I hear you. We need to collect all the medals and jerseys we can as that clock ticks.

I never got close enough to the front of the 50+ district crit championships to see this display of power:
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/581944_10151036979912179_852758661_n.jpg

I'd recognize the Catlike helmet and Fuji SST bike anywhere. :D

My miscellaneous report:

I wanted to and thought I could do well in 55+ race. I was a bit surprised at the large turnout as the 55+ fields have been getting smaller as the season has progressed. Two favorites went from the gun and after a bit of chasing and bridging and dropping, three guys including the overwhelming favorite were gone for the day. My problem is that since my crash, my pack and physical confidence have taken a dive.

The race was relatively fast for 55+ but no faster than the dozens of crits that I've done so far this year. I just couldn't muster up the courage to get to and stay at the front like I wanted. I screwed up my courage between turns 3 and 4 as we were going to get the bell. I actually got on the wheel on the Manhattan Beach GP winner and he was on a teammates wheel. Just before we got to turn 4 there was a surge on the right and as we went through the corner I started getting swamped. Next thing I knew I was fighting for a mid-pack position and I lost my enthusiasm for getting a result. :mad:

The 50+ race was faster (thank you Racer Ex, among others) and the pack was bigger. Most of the year I've been able to get myself where I wanted in the pack. On Sunday I kept finding myself at the back and it was a struggle to move up. I couldn't get near either of my teammates to do anything. Sat up halfway around the last lap and rolled across the line. Sad.

Hopefully a couple of weekends away from racing will help. Will be doing some fun riding in Vegas (baby) this weekend. Next week starts the pre-nationals training block.

I'd recognize the Catlike helmet and Fuji SST bike anywhere. :D

Not to mention the sleeve and the ever-present IAB position.

Cleave, Nice work in two tough races. I am sure you will be ready for nationals.

I Hopefully a couple of weekends away from racing will help. Will be doing some fun riding in Vegas (baby) this weekend. Next week starts the pre-nationals training block.

I'm sure you'll get your crit-mojo back, Cleave.

Now that's some dishin' out the lactic.

Sara - Just in case you need more evidence that your first crit experience is normal:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/833170-My-first-Crit-Is-this-normal?p=14496730#post14496730

I do not think that Watsonville was a good test for Sara. There was only one women's race offered and it had the Exergy (UCI pro team) and Vanderkitten women as well as other Cat 1 women. It would be similar if I raced in an elite 1,2 race and a couple of UCI domestique pros showed up and lit up the pace and there was a small climb. I would get spit out the back in a similar manner. If she enters a Cat 4 women's flat crit, she will do much better.

Also, we have the early bird series of practice races with mentors that his held in the early part of the season. They offer skills and racing where the goal is learning to race.