Touring - Can I Tour with this? Need advice please.

Basically speaking, I have a little money I can invest in a bike or equipment. Part of me wants a dedicate touring bike but to be frank, we have a small apartment so it might be a long haul to get my wife on board with another bike (we have three already).

I have a mountain bike that I turned into a commuter. Here are two pictures:

269125269126

I like the bike for commuting but there are some issues, which probobly relate to bike fit:

1- The bike is heavy and thats without carrying much
2- My hands get numb sometimes
3- Upper back and neck hurt after a while.

It is perfect for my 22 mile RT commute but longer rides without a long break in the middle is rough on my with this bike.

So I basically have two options:

1) Use the money I have (which is around $1300) for a new touring bike or
2) Use the mountain bike commuter for touring

I would then use the money to invest in a tent, sleeping bag, etc (which is a whole topic in itself).

I guess I am asking what you all think about touring on the mountain bike. I envision my tours to be on the road, perhaps a rail trail sometime too. I am not sure.

I know little about touring and would appreciate your opinions and advice.

Thank you!

chefisaac, If you work on the fitment I don't see why you can't tour on that bike. The Europeans often use flat bar bikes, sometimes with butterfly handle bars, for touring. There are a variety of schemes to mount a front carrier to a fork unequipped with a mid mount.

Brad

Chef, no reason you couldn't tour on it. Check out this thread:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/334033-I-would-LOVE-to-see-photos-of-your-MTB-conversion
You might want to replace the fork with something lighter, and perhaps swap out the stem and handlebars with something lighter and of a better geometry. Trekking bars are popular.
For the hand numbness, there are a couple schools of thought. I'm of the "Get the body upright so the weight is on your butt" school. I did this by putting on a very high stem with very little reach. I also think that drop bars or trekking bars help, since you can have different wrist and elbow angles. Check this thread for more info:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/837866-Numb-hands-when-touring
As for weight, I've found on rail trails it doesn't matter much, since they're flat. Once you get up to speed you're fine. If you get into rolling hills it can be a problem.
Nice Bike, BTW.

Basic gear for camping doesn't have to cost anywhere near $1,300. You should have penty of $ left over for a fit and any modifications.

Personally, I think the whole weight thing is over-obsessed unless you are going very light to begin with or are cutting out a large amount of weight. Try this: Add together the weight of your body, bike and gear, including panniers and rack(s). Then imagine your bike is 5 lbs. less. What percentage change does that give you? 1%? 2%? Let's assume you weigh 225 lbs, your bike weighs 30 lbs. and all you gear weighs 40 lbs. 295 lbs. total. If you lose 5 lbs. of bike (or anything for that matter), you will still be carrying about 98% of your original total weight.

You could tour just fine on your current bike as long as your can fit your gear in the rear panniers and maintain proper weight distribution. That may or may not be an issue depending on the size of your load. I have a touring bike as well as two sport tourers used for commuting. When I first tried a loaded trip on my touring bike with rear panniers and a rack, it was unrideable because I had too much weight in the back and the weight distribution was thrown all off. I then bought a set of front panniers and rack so I was able to distribute the load more evenly, and the bike rode just fine.

The bike looks like it'll be tough to get the a correct fit for you as far as touring. The handle bars are in a very aggressive position which is probably the source of your hand numbness and neck pain. A touring bike should have the seat level with the bars. Why won't you consider getting your touring bike and selling this one? You can commute on the touring bike as just as well as on the MTB.

For you hands, have you looked at ergo grips, lots of different ones out there, and could resolve the issues you are having with numbness.

Yeah, you can actually kit yourself out with a decent camping setup for <$200 unless you plan on winter camping.
I've used a walmart hammock, hiker's tarp, sleeping mat, and sleeping bag (as an experiment), and it came to less than $100. Slept fine, and ultralight to boot. Only problem was that everything was electric blue. :)
You can hit up REI for better quality gear and still come out with a tough, lightweight setup for not a lot of cash.
I guess if you need panniers, tools, pump, etc, it'll cost you a bit more.

You can add to hand positions using bar ends, clip on aerobars or replacement trekking/butterfly style bars.
I cant tell the brand or model from the photo but it looks fine.
You can get cheap tents or tarp systems. You dont need titanium pots or anything special. Save your money for touring expenses.

If you decide to get a touring bike, you can also commute on that (as I do). The tires look like knobbies, which eat up energy. You can probably get away with that on a short-ish commute, but on a long tour, efficiency is a wonderful thing.

The tires look like knobbies
Looking closely I think I read "Gatorskin" on the front one so probably not.

...Personally, I think the whole weight thing is over-obsessed ... If you lose 5 lbs. of bike (or anything for that matter), you will still be carrying about 98% of your original total weight.


+1.

Basic gear for camping doesn't have to cost anywhere near $1,300. You should have penty of $ left over for a fit and any modifications.

Personally, I think the whole weight thing is over-obsessed unless you are going very light to begin with or are cutting out a large amount of weight. Try this: Add together the weight of your body, bike and gear, including panniers and rack(s). Then imagine your bike is 5 lbs. less. What percentage change does that give you? 1%? 2%? Let's assume you weigh 225 lbs, your bike weighs 30 lbs. and all you gear weighs 40 lbs. 295 lbs. total. If you lose 5 lbs. of bike (or anything for that matter), you will still be carrying about 98% of your original total weight.

That way of looking at it neglects that fact that the bike is one of many things that all add up. If you apply that logic to each choice in bike, gear, clothing, tools, and spares it really adds up. So while 5 pounds of bike alone may not be all that significant, when you start talking 5 pounds here, a pound here, and five more there, and so on, pretty soon we are talking some real weight. I know that by picking and choosing what I carry and what bike I use I went from ~80 pounds of bike and gear to 33 pounds of bike and gear. So close to 50 pounds was shed, I think most folks would acknowledge that 50 pounds makes a big difference.

I always figured that gear was the first place to cut weight but when my gear got to 22 pounds, then 14, then 10 it definitely started to seem like a lighter bike would make more sense. I have to say I have found that riding on a bike with all my gear that totals 33 pounds is a lot more fun than riding one that weighs 80 pounds.

I talked with the head mechanic at my fav bike shop. Looks like we might try to modify things. Two things right off will be the bars (going to drops) and the possibility of changing out the front forks. I do not use the suspension anyway so if there is no way to put a front rack on, then I will go to the idea of changing the forks.

The frame is aluminum. I know the majority of touring bikes are steel. Is aluminum bad for touring?

I talked with the head mechanic at my fav bike shop. Looks like we might try to modify things. Two things right off will be the bars (going to drops) and the possibility of changing out the front forks. I do not use the suspension anyway so if there is no way to put a front rack on, then I will go to the idea of changing the forks.

The frame is aluminum. I know the majority of touring bikes are steel. Is aluminum bad for touring?

Aluminum is good enough for rims it's good enough for frames.

Basically speaking, I have a little money I can invest in a bike or equipment. Part of me wants a dedicate touring bike but to be frank, we have a small apartment so it might be a long haul to get my wife on board with another bike (we have three already).

I have a mountain bike that I turned into a commuter. Here are two pictures:

269125269126

I like the bike for commuting but there are some issues, which probobly relate to bike fit:

1- The bike is heavy and thats without carrying much
2- My hands get numb sometimes
3- Upper back and neck hurt after a while.

It is perfect for my 22 mile RT commute but longer rides without a long break in the middle is rough on my with this bike.

So I basically have two options:

1) Use the money I have (which is around $1300) for a new touring bike or
2) Use the mountain bike commuter for touring

I would then use the money to invest in a tent, sleeping bag, etc (which is a whole topic in itself).

I guess I am asking what you all think about touring on the mountain bike. I envision my tours to be on the road, perhaps a rail trail sometime too. I am not sure.

I know little about touring and would appreciate your opinions and advice.

Thank you!

Is this a Giant Roam 1 which is an Xroad class 700c on/off road adventure touring bike?!? Hands numbness is probably due to nerve pinching and an acute angle on the wrist to the forearm. Generally, the wrist is inline with the forearm when you grip the handlebar. The Ergon grips Gr 2 or 1 will help on this department substantially by tilting the pads on an angle to support your palms so the wrist will be inline with your forearm. The wide pad help spread out the pressure on the nerves of your hand. In regards to your upper back and neck hurting. It's probably set up with an aggressive low handlebar posture and if you don't have a strong core strength, you will tend to use your back muscles to support your upper body when you ride. There are fixes. Raise the handlebar up higher with a stem extender rise like thishttp://www.ebay.com/itm/Satori-Heads-Up4-Stem-Riser-Adaptor-1-1-8-Stem-Silver-/110611390584#ht_1454wt_1165. This will put you in a really high position and normally I wouldn't recommend this to some people, but I see that you have a Brooks saddle and it is designed for an upright riding position.

I know of a lot of people who had made modifications to X-road class adventure bikes (Ergon grips GR 2 and Satori riser extender) and have toured long distance successfully. As your core gets stronger when you ride longer, you can remove or lower the handlebar height by removing the stacking riser until you don't need the riser anymore.

Save your money.

Hope this helps.

I talked with the head mechanic at my fav bike shop. Looks like we might try to modify things. Two things right off will be the bars (going to drops) and the possibility of changing out the front forks. I do not use the suspension anyway so if there is no way to put a front rack on, then I will go to the idea of changing the forks.

The frame is aluminum. I know the majority of touring bikes are steel. Is aluminum bad for touring?

Sounds good! Keep us posted.

I talked with the head mechanic at my fav bike shop. Looks like we might try to modify things. Two things right off will be the bars (going to drops) and the possibility of changing out the front forks. I do not use the suspension anyway so if there is no way to put a front rack on, then I will go to the idea of changing the forks.

The frame is aluminum. I know the majority of touring bikes are steel. Is aluminum bad for touring?

Cannondale made some serious touring bikes that were made from aluminum, the "T" series. I am sure there have been plenty of others. My preference is steel, but that is because I am a curmudgeon. I do have one aluminum frame bike, happens to be my city bike.

Aaron :)

you could certainly tour on that. Depends on what type of touring as to what modifications you'd need.

You could consider a folding touring bike if space is an issue, but they're overpriced for what they are in my opinion.

You certainly can tour on that bike, you can tour on almost anything, but that bike looks good. However, what does concern me is your aches and pains. If your not comfortable physically with your bike, touring will be just that much harder and not as fun. I've found elite 8 curved handlebar extenders to be awesome to say the least and for around 30 bucks. And just looking at your picture, your handlebars might be too low considering how high the seat is. Raising the handlebars might help with your back aches and pains. If you can't extend it more, get a set of bar-end extenders which can raise the height by a few inches, and thus making a big difference. While I maintain the mental aspect of touring is the biggest concern, feeling comfortable on your bike day in and day out ranks 2nd. Experiment around, do some long trips with the setup, and tune and tweak the adjustments. After a few times of doing this, the OP will be ready to roll for countless amounts of fun.

The frame is aluminum. I know the majority of touring bikes are steel. Is aluminum bad for touring?

Aluminum frames when combined with skinny tires (ex: 700x23) have a reputation for delivering a harsh ride. My touring frame is aluminum. I use 700x32 or 700x35 tires inflated to 60-70psi depending on the load. That setup is darn near as comfortable as my carbon fiber road bike!

I talked with the head mechanic at my fav bike shop. Looks like we might try to modify things. Two things right off will be the bars (going to drops) and the possibility of changing out the front forks. I do not use the suspension anyway so if there is no way to put a front rack on, then I will go to the idea of changing the forks.

I'd think twice about converting to drop bars. I love drops, by the way, but switching to them from straight bars often causes a cascade of component replacements: the drop bar will require different shift/brake levers, new shift/brake levers might require different derailleurs, the new derailleurs might require a different crankset, etc.

When I built my first flat-bar bike, I found that my hands would go numb after about 20 minutes of riding. When I looked at the bend of the handlebar, I discovered that it put my wrists in a very unnatural position. I switched to a bar that had more "sweep" and the problem went away. Before committing to drop bars, you might try a different flat bar. Look for bars like the On One Fleegle or Mary, Misfit Psycles FUbar or FU2bar or NUbar, Bontrager Crivitz, Bontrager Race Lite "Big Sweep" or similar bars that sweep back more. A "riser" bar might help with neck/back problems.

Touring is an activity, If you can stand to ride it on a tour,
by that its a 'touring bike'.

parts not comfort enhancing? you got suggestions of options..

Ergon GR 5 are good ..

I'd think twice about converting to drop bars
...
When I built my first flat-bar bike, I found that my hands would go numb after about 20 minutes of riding. ...I switched to a bar that had more "sweep" and the problem went away.

My experience too.
I usually tour on drops. My last rebuild on a std touring bike was a compatibility challenge. Doing a conversion is just not worthwhile. Strongly consider butterfly/trekking bars and keep your MTB transmission and $$$.
My commuter bike came with MTB flats. I experienced discomfort so changed to On One Marys for more sweep.

I spent much of my early touring days on an MTB with suspension fork, with front rack included, along with flat handelbars and mudguards.

Your LBS is sizing you up as a money tree if they have suggested you go with drop bars. Unless they are suggesting bar-end shifters, the whole deal to change over will probably cost you about a third of your savings.

Here's a bit of a radical but cheap thought. I am a fan of bull horn bars. They provide the extension and round profile on the sweep that bar-ends don't -- they become almost like riding with hoods especially if you choose a narrower width than your current set-up -- yet you can stiil incorporate your current shifters and brake levers on the inwards part. They also can be wrapped in bar tape, which I find can be much more forgiving than grips on long rides.

You ask about aluminium. It is fine as a frame material. It is durable, but the only drawback is if you go to a fixed fork, you might be in for a harsher ride. My recommendation is that you keep the suspension fork for now, because on a long ride on less-than-smooth sealed surfaces, that fork may well be the difference between a comfortable ride and a hellish ride.

I am presuming that because you are a clyde, the wheels on this bike are already strong enough to sustain the extra rigours of loaded touring.

chefissac, I have a drop bar touring bike to appease my inner roadie. I used my mountain bike on my short tours and if I didn't like riding single track so much I probably would've mounted a set of trekking/butterfly handle bars.

Nashbar has an inexpensive trekking handle bar that I think is worth trialing.

Brad

It's starting to sound a little like your current bike may not be the right bike for you. You mentioned you don't use the front suspension, and it sounds like it's barely comfortable on your commute. Might you be better off with more of a commuting/touring bike, instead of the cross/MTB? I'm in the same spot you are, with room, funds, and spousal support for only one bike. As much as I enjoyed the idea of owning a MTB, it just wasn't practical for me and it was very easy to trade.

I used the MTB for a few winter commutes, and those were the most fatiguing rides I've ever had. Plenty of tourists use them, but it's not for me.

I now ride occasional dirt two-tracks with wider tires (28 mm) on my touring bike and that feeds my rat. Where I live, there are rough mountain roads connecting pavement on some excellent loop rides, so I get to cycle a few dozen miles from my home into the hills, ride some easy routes with incredulous MTBers who had to drive up there, and return via a different pass or valley. The steel touring bike is a nice fit to my style.

I was surprised on my X-C tour this summer to see virtually nothing but steel bikes out there.

Good luck finding something comfortable.

I'd think twice about converting to drop bars. I love drops, by the way, but switching to them from straight bars often causes a cascade of component replacements: the drop bar will require different shift/brake levers, new shift/brake levers might require different derailleurs, the new derailleurs might require a different crankset, etc.

It can, but doesn't have to be that big of an issue. In most cases you could just swap bars, brake levers, and shifters. I can't think of a combination where you have to change derailleurs or crank because of drop bar conversion swap as long as you pick the levers and shifters with that in mind. Personally I'd probably not want to spring ($$$) for brifters and would likely go with down tube shifters. That is what I am running on my two lightweight touring bikes and the setup worked out well on my fairly recent southern tier ride.

It can, but doesn't have to be that big of an issue. In most cases you could just swap bars, brake levers, and shifters. I can't think of a combination where you have to change derailleurs or crank because of drop bar conversion swap as long as you pick the levers and shifters with that in mind. Personally I'd probably not want to spring ($$$) for brifters and would likely go with down tube shifters. That is what I am running on my two lightweight touring bikes and the setup worked out well on my fairly recent southern tier ride.

True enough! If you're willing to use friction shifters and pick your brake levers carefully, you can get away without needing to worry about derailleurs, cranks, brakes, etc. That's not a compromise I'd be willing to make, but if you're on a budget and not wedded to indexed shifting, it could definitely work.

You ask about aluminium. It is fine as a frame material. It is durable, but the only drawback is if you go to a fixed fork, you might be in for a harsher ride. My recommendation is that you keep the suspension fork for now, because on a long ride on less-than-smooth sealed surfaces, that fork may well be the difference between a comfortable ride and a hellish ride.

Riding a bike with an inexpensive suspension fork, especially one that doesn't have lock-out, is often like riding a pogo stick. The amount of energy wasted bouncing the fork up and down, especially when climbing out of the saddle, can be significant. Not to mention the difficulty of mounting front panniers. If the OP is concerned about this, a rigid steel fork can be an inexpensive ($40-80) solution... assuming you can find one with a similar axle to crown race length.

Why not.

True enough! If you're willing to use friction shifters and pick your brake levers carefully, you can get away without needing to worry about derailleurs, cranks, brakes, etc. That's not a compromise I'd be willing to make, but if you're on a budget and not wedded to indexed shifting, it could definitely work.

I'd say you can generally get indexed shifting to work as well. I know that I have never had a problem mixing MTB and road shifters and derailleurs.

Chef, no reason you couldn't tour on it. Check out this thread:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/334033-I-would-LOVE-to-see-photos-of-your-MTB-conversion
You might want to replace the fork with something lighter, and perhaps swap out the stem and handlebars with something lighter and of a better geometry. Trekking bars are popular.
For the hand numbness, there are a couple schools of thought. I'm of the "Get the body upright so the weight is on your butt" school. I did this by putting on a very high stem with very little reach. I also think that drop bars or trekking bars help, since you can have different wrist and elbow angles. Check this thread for more info:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/837866-Numb-hands-when-touring
As for weight, I've found on rail trails it doesn't matter much, since they're flat. Once you get up to speed you're fine. If you get into rolling hills it can be a problem.
Nice Bike, BTW.

I have to agree about getting the handlebars up higher. I had to do that with my tandem and it makes a world of difference. I tried different glove, hand positions, and saddle adjustment, but none were all that effective. Raise the bar.

You might want to try a swept back bar. It might not be a straight up swap because of the cabling though.

I might try and restore the bike back to the way it was when you got it, sell it on craigslist, and buy a dedicated touring bike which will work great as a commuter bike as well.

I like the bike for commuting but there are some issues, which probobly relate to bike fit:

1- The bike is heavy and thats without carrying much
2- My hands get numb sometimes
3- Upper back and neck hurt after a while.
1. Less weight is nice, but if money's an issue, you're WAY better off just building up your strength so you can handle it. The best investment to make here may be in your gears, though. Smaller/a third chainring can make a lot of difference in your ability to crank up hills.
2. Ergon Grips - http://www.ergon-bike.com/us/en/home# sorted hand numbness out for me and a lot of other people. I have the GR2s because I like the barends for climbing/a change of position.
3. Probably a fit issue. Hopefully, the bike frame is a good size/geometry for you and this can be sorted out by adjusting stuff and possibly switching out a few parts. Talk to a reputable bike store person about this.



So I basically have two options:

1) Use the money I have (which is around $1300) for a new touring bike or
2) Use the mountain bike commuter for touring

I would then use the money to invest in a tent, sleeping bag, etc (which is a whole topic in itself).



Option 2. With the tweaks I mentioned above your existing bike is just fine for touring. Spend the money on the essentials of camp equipment instead. While you're at it, buy lightweight things and buy quality (read reviews). This will save money in the long run.

That way of looking at it neglects that fact that the bike is one of many things that all add up. If you apply that logic to each choice in bike, gear, clothing, tools, and spares it really adds up. So while 5 pounds of bike alone may not be all that significant, when you start talking 5 pounds here, a pound here, and five more there, and so on, pretty soon we are talking some real weight. I know that by picking and choosing what I carry and what bike I use I went from ~80 pounds of bike and gear to 33 pounds of bike and gear. So close to 50 pounds was shed, I think most folks would acknowledge that 50 pounds makes a big difference.

I always figured that gear was the first place to cut weight but when my gear got to 22 pounds, then 14, then 10 it definitely started to seem like a lighter bike would make more sense. I have to say I have found that riding on a bike with all my gear that totals 33 pounds is a lot more fun than riding one that weighs 80 pounds.
Also - this guy knows what he's talking about. When buying equipment, keep his advice in mind. I've drastically reduced the weight of my camping setup by paying attention to ounces here and there, and it's made backpacking much more enjoyable. Same goes for bike touring.

+1 on Rowan's money tree fears. Work on fit. Run fatter tires at lower pressure -- going from 95psi on 28c to 70psi on 32c (same tire make/model) up front made a huge difference for me.